@sqitis,
I know because I was the one playing the piano! Luke, I am your father!
No, you’re right, in all seriousness. I’m actually probably an ARC fanboy as that’s what I have (lower end) but I thought the Lux just sounded better to me, granted on my imperfect (to say least) playback options and the 5 minutes I spent listening, haha.
But that’s what this is about - WC gotta keep churning and comparing - it’s what he was born to do. Full burnin be damned - show gotta go on.
I always figured my next system would be ARC and Wilson based on my trajectory (it’ll be awhile, sigh, a long while), but now I’ll for sure give Lux consideration as well. |
It occurs to me that given the recording/reproduction chain that we are hearing these A/B comparisons through--the microphone and recorder, YouTube, our desktop speakers, etc., that in real life (i.e. actually in the room) the Wilsons might be a little too much of a good thing. |
I don't say it just because I own it, but in case anyone may have missed it, this is the 5th time I own luxman and it never ever disappoints. |
@ kren0006
I agree about the pedal grip on the piano on the Luxman. However do we know how firm the original grip is on the person playing the piano to know which one is more natural? Now, I will say this the Luxman has more decay in the voice and notes fade away longer. Both pre-amps sound damn good! However the Ref6SE could totally open way up after another 300hrs.
Luxman is my dream setup!
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I like the Audio Research better than the Luxman preamps. I hear the Luxman as being midrange-centric at the expense of the HF, The ARC shows more details/enunciation in her voice with more sibilants but nothing excessive. The ARC sounds more lifelike with less coloration than the Luxman.
I like the recording of the voice which is a good demo piece for your comparisons. Even though some music may tempt you to crank the volume, on this meditative recording, the voice at live, natural levels is about 75 dB or so. If you push the volume, she will sound bloated and lose focus, out of character for this music. If a solo voice is natural at 75 dB, a chorus of 10 voices with be at 85 dB. In a more impassioned piece, a solo singer could reach 90-100 dB on peaks, so the right SPL depends on the character of the music and the number of performers involved.
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Are you using an iPhone to record these videos or a professional video recorder?
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New Parasound JC1+ amps are mono blocks.....that is $8500 each....$17K for the pair. |
Parasound just came out with their New Top of the line power Amp....$8,500... |
Coming soon:
i will be releasing a video focusing on the worst amplifiers i have ever owned. I will not be talking about anything else other than amplifiers. i am putting a list together as we speak and please remember, this is MY PERSONAL opinion based on comparisons that i have done against other amplifiers i have owned. |
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To me it sounds like the piano pedal is 10% partially pressed with the ARC as compared to the Luxman; just sounds a little heavy |
Wow whitecamaross, I must chime in on your accomplishment to achieve, I believe, the most responded to thread on AG. And your articulate, intelligent and committed manner of participation.
No one has ever kept such a thread going for years.
I have only read the first and last pages and know that this is so.
The complex and thoughtful evaluation of SS amps that launched all this is also to be praised. By the manner in which you write, it is clear that you know of which you speak. Certainly, a challenge for any amp are the ML speakers although not as much as other planar speakers as your ML is a hybrid. But generally speaking, tube amps are not the best match with planars although I once heard a great match of an older pair of ML hybrids with a Dynaco ST 70!In my experience, it is quite obvious that an amplifier can only be judged by the speaker it “pushes”. One can say these are the two hands clapping in any system. I will enjoy going back and reading more of the 10,000+ posts and your 1000+ responses!
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Luxman C900U all the way. More there there, more rounded voice, more air and atmosphere, more microdetail. |
WCSS prueba Purist LE DIAMOND EDITION, mucho más barato que Odin 2 y estoy casi convencido de que ganará
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whitecamaross... The Acoustic Zen Maestro loudspeaker would be on my short list also for anything near a reasonable price to work with. Robert Lee is a genius! You can thank me later...8) |
For me it was Audio Research night and day great dynamics and details |
Luxman C-900U all the way. |
I told you all... Full luxman combo is no joke. If you have a different preamp and it is not at the level of the audio research 6se, all you gotta do is watch the video to realize that if the luxman sounds better than the ref6se (with 900u amp) then imagine how it would sound in your set up if you have a preamp of a lesser caliber than the ref6se... |
Yep that Lux combo is damn good |
It's too bad you're just looking at current stuff, since you want to try taller speakers. It would be interesting to get your impression on how Dunlavy speakers (ie SC IV, or SC V, or SC VI) compare to what's available today. |
And we already have people voting on the luxman 900u preamp on YouTube lol..
Man I wish I could post music from Fleetwood Mac... It's so easy to pick out the differences for me when I listen to their music.
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Sweet spot 10 feet from speakers.
High 60’s with peaks low 70’s-75 listening volume. |
@whitecamaross
I understand you wanting to stay away from the expensive stuff. But a tall speaker that sounds very good is the Alexx. Very high resolution but in a totally different league than DAW or Alexia 2. Also, I've heard the Alexandria XLF a number of times (taller like the Alexx) and it isn't anywhere close to the Alexx.
I replaced my entire system (minus power cords) around a year and a half ago. As I've replaced power cords, added a EtherREGEN, etc, the resolution is so good that I can listen at levels significantly lower than I used to and am equally happy; really just much more happy. @jetter - it is pretty amazing that this is happening but I really enjoy listening a lot lower than I did with my last system. Maybe my last system just needed a lot of volume to be satisfying. I can say now that I can listen as long as I'm allowed and I never get fatigued. In the past few months I've had many 4+ hours sessions with at least one at 6+ hours. I just get up to eat or hit the restroom cause things just sound so good. Listening in the 50-60s db range with peaks probably low mid 70s. WC, I know you have a highly resolving system. I'm just adding observations of my experiences with my gear in my room.
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Funny you ask about the ref6SE. I actually had people make comments on youtube about wanting a shootout of the ref6se vs luxman 900u with the luxman 900u amp. People want to see these two preamps go toe to toe using the 900u amp. I plan to do that video at some point this week and let them go to war. The ref6se has about 120 hours i think? Not sure if it is indeed a fair comparison, but what the heck, why not do it? it is part of the fun to see how things stack up even though in some cases it might not be in the best situation. As far as electronics are concerned, i think i am set for now. I was thinking of bringing the vivaldi transport which is a boat load of money, but i just can’t get myself to spend that kind of money to play the 50 cds i might have? So, i am starting to shift gears (mentally) and want to bring a taller speaker in my room. I am not there yet, i don’t even know what it will be or if i will even materialize this thought. So far, all i have really contemplated over the last 24 hours has been: Sonus Faber Aida Martin Logan 15a Magnepan 20.7s Dynaudio Confidence 50 Vivid Audio G1 S2 Tidal (not sure which one) Granted, this list changes daily so some of those models might not be relevant in a few days. i also wanted to stay away from the ultra expensive offerings because that is stuff that i can't get rid of later on. There is stuff out there that i want to try, but i have to stay on track and remember that all of this stuff eventually has to be gone so i can try something else. I WISH i could bring the big von schierkert, but i have to remain grounded and know that some stuff isn't really to play with. Yes, that is EXACTLY the word i was looking for: "play". Some stuff out there isn't for you to "play" with. |
WC, how the ARC Ref6 SE preamplifier compares to the Luxman C-900u. Is the Lux up to the challenge ? |
I've got the triangle set-up with my speakers. 10'2" from voice coil center to voice coil center and 10'2" to my ear. Towed in.
I'm not sophisticated enough to measure scientifically. I do like my music very loud. I turn it up when guests are over. When the walls start to crack I know that's the right spot. The broken window must have been too loud.
I tell my guests not to pay attention to the spot lights coming through the window or the police at the front door. |
I have a pretty resolving system. I am around 8 feets from the speakers ( Dynaudio Special 40 with a subwoofer), so it’s kind of near field listening. I don’t need to crank it up too much to get detail. The Special 40 are crazy resolute speakers, as their crossover is first order and the drivers have very powerful neodymium magnets. Add to that the fact my system is pretty simple with the dac module inside my preamplifier. Using Shunyata noise reduction powercords, Ztron xlrs, and Nordost Leif Series speaker cables contribute to the high resolution I’ m getting.. |
The better and more resolving the system, the easier it is to listen to it at low levels. Without having ever really made a comparison, I would have guessed that a more resolving system would sound somewhat thin at low listening levels. |
whitecamaross I am slowly trying to get used to lower listening levels but it will
take me some work to not want to crank it up. The better and more resolving the system, the easier it is to listen to it at low levels.
My issue is when I like
something, I want more of it and that is in life in general ... Understood. And of course, there's nothing like cranking it up!
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@dpac996
Nice. I am slowly trying to get used to lower listening levels but it will take me some work to not want to crank it up. My issue is when I like something, I want more of it and that is in life in general so that’s why I end up with louder sessions. I need to slowly go away from that though. Not sure i could ever do 70db though... |
Been learning/striving to listen at lower volumes. It's a struggle b/c when it sounds so great the ears and heart naturally crave more of it. Listening to favorite music at a benign ~75 dB just does not cut it for me oftentimes. I might as well listen to headphones.
That being said I have been noticing with my recent round of adjustments, I'm really enjoying the life at these lower levels. I read somewhere if you listen lower day by day the ear/brain adapts...so here's to that!
Yesterday I measured ~80 dB C-weight slow, with peaks around 85; this was fairly loud and represents my new "happy place"; This was with my latest obsession: bluegrass-ish music.
If I play high dynamic range classical it's hard to get accurate readings as the "at the chair" range is about 20dB--meaning 80 avg 100 peaks- meter on c, fast/max to catch the transient. I am pretty sure no lasting ear damage is being done in these low duty cycle relatively loud passages.
Prior to this it was easy to do 85-87 dB C-weight slow, with peaks 95 dB for rock music.
Speakers are about 9.5 feet apart firing mostly at my ears (toe in) and my head is about the same distance to the plane of the speakers.
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WCSS, Congrats on your thread surpassing 10,000 posts. Viber6, congrats on contributing a full 10% of these with over a 1000 posts to this thread and NONE to any other. We appreciate your untrammeled and single-minded obsession |
Audio Research Ref 6 can now be had for half the price of the 6SE and is astonishingly good. I recall you having one so that’s my guess. |
So you all know my pick on the best amp for the money but have you wondered what has been my personal best preamp for the money ? I will make a video about it soon. |
Best class d I have ever heard ? I gotta say this is the Merrill audio amps... Merill audio element 118s just mauled my rowland 925s. Each person who sat in my room was unanimously choosing the merill. Unfortunately there is this stigma with class d amps that doesn't allow manufacturers to make more of these designs. I even heard the new rowland 925 replacement will be class full ab instead of what they did before. I support class D but I'm a small fish in the pond and that hurts many others. |
Nothing is above anyone’s paygrade if you work hard at it and doing things right without hurting anyone along the way. People who "steal" their way through life eventually get their casket or inmate number along with the orange jumpsuit. Better to sleep good at night knowing the cops are not going to be knocking on your door one day. I could not live this way.
Hell, if I am being honest here, I have thought at one time or another throughout my life
" man I could take this and nobody would ever find out" but then my mind says " yea take it and youll pay for that ten fold" so I just say to myself nah im good and happy with what I’m blessed with.
Actually, here is a true story: I think I was 17 ?
I remember going to the atm to deposit money that my parents had given me and the guy in front of me withdrew money and forgot the card inside and the ATM was asking " do you want to do another transaction? So I withdrew 500 dollars (that was the limit) and I went home with the money that belonged to someone else. Fast forward 3 weeks and my car was broken into and someone stole my CD player (Clarion cd player with a remote control ) and so I ended up having to pay for a new cd player, and tbe deductible plus the glove compartment they damaged. I think it was like $1,500 dollars total?
After that day I realized what I had done and how life was showing me that what you do wrong will come back to you.
Just remember, You put your mind to it and things can happen. Life has mysterious ways of working for us all.
I started with an onkyo receiver and Polk audio lsi7 speakers and well the rest is history.
You can do it, remain positive. You just gotta want it and it can happen. |
Just wanted to be the 10,000 th post. Lol. Thanks for the journey although the level of amplifiers is now above my pay grade.
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It would be pretty difficult getting closer however I had them 9.5' wide for a long time but I felt the vocals and instruments within the soundstage where not defined enough so I moved them in to 8.5'. Everything sharpened up and became more clearly defined....I also point the speakers almost directly at the listener....so a big toe-in.
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Ron get one foot closer. Try it. Work on the toe in too |
Speakers 8.5' wide and I sit 9.5' away from them. |
Isosceles or equilateral? I say isosceles : ) |
I only measured the db with iPhone free app so dunno how accurate- probably not very... seemed pretty loud so I expect I got a low reading |
My speaker are about 80 inches (6 feet 8 inches) center to center
I sit about 8 feet 6 inches away.
I tried my db meter and it seems that I usually listen critically about 85 db with peaks close to 100. When i really turn it up it is closer to 90 with peaks to about 104- 107.
If I casually listen it might be closer to 80db with peaks around 87-90 |
All-
IF POSSIBLE, try creating an equilateral triangle with your speakers and just listen...you'd be impressed how much better things get when doing so. If you have the space , get closer to your speaker until you form the perfect triangle. Let me know your findings |
My Joseph Audio Perspective 2 speakers are 7’ -4” apart and 9’ - 10” away from my listening position.
Listening to Frank Morgan’s - Listen To The Dawn at 65db, according to the Decibel X Pro iPhone app.
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Hello @whitecamaross, little is known about the Rowland M735 mono as yet, except that it does in fact run in class A/B.
I will post here links to features and specs as soon as I receive them from the factory.
Saluti, Guido
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