Moderation/Censorship Poll and surely more...

I have seen numerous examples of totally innocuous posts being taken down with the assertion that were in breach of a set of forum rules of which they clearly were not.

It would appear that the mods move in mysterious ways and have an ancillary set of rules or guidelines that are concealed from members.

My first knee jerk response would be to say decrease the number of posts that are removed, but on further consideration, I think the problem is a little more nuanced than just numbers of posts removed, but the reasons why they were removed.

Like many others, I have seen very abusive posts addressed to me and others that were left untouched, but then others that myself and other members have posted that mention, even in polite and sober terms subjects that the moderators apparently have a biased opinion about are often removed. A good example would be any mention of preventive health care measures.

Tha said, this is a privately owned site, and they can do what they like, and I accept that.

good example would be any mention of preventive health care measures.

it goes well beyond politically tinged posts, and is quite bizarre at times

“ I have seen very abusive posts addressed to me “

I don’t recall anything left published of the nature that you allude to! Could you provide examples ? 

Remember, you can remove your own posts at anytime. No one knows who removed the post but the author.

"Post removed Feb 13, 2022"

“ I have seen very abusive posts addressed to me “

I don’t recall anything left published of the nature that you allude to! Could you provide examples ? 

Now that's funny.

I'm sad that someone once said that my gears isn't as good as I think it is.  

@noske that is sad.

One mans garbage is another mans gold.

You make do with what you can and aspire to bigger and better things. Belittling ones means is very lowbrow.

What is even more important is that you are happy with your gear.

I for one never came here for affirmation after all it is about the music not the gear.

@jerryg123 Thankyou, but what I didn’t say was that I don’t make into some knife fight or appeal to the mods etc. Who cares - I don't, I am aware of these things called feelings.  I have detailed files..

Good for you!

Political and shill posts should be removed - period.

I fear that Tammy (if she is the moderator) has blisters on her fingers @ this point.

DeKay

@dekay : Agreed! This is forum for Audio. Not QAnon and other crazies 

Political fine to be removed, but Ebm stupid one-liners not fine.

Political fine. Ebm stupid one-liners not fine.

Hmmm…. I disagree. EBM is not malicious. Things he says all the time like “jump on it ASAP” are harmless. Even funny at times 😂

I meant same and corrected it.

Ah… I am with you now

An unintended consequence of the internet is to make people accept censorship.  To keep it musical, we are on the Road to Hell.

I think its horrible how this site censors the forums, we live in a country where FREE SPEECH is allowed! Who cares what people are talking about on the audio forum....really audiogon get over yourselves!

Matt M

"Free speech" does not imply that anybody is obligated to publish or post it. 

As much as I disagree with many lines of thinking,or behavior, censorship is almost always bad.  It promotes the agenda of those censoring.  If you don’t get an opinion,I’m right. Period. Does that sound fair? 

Or the Squad @thyname …..hunter.

Matt,

You've been here long enough to know that this is a privately owned site, and therefore unimpeded "free speech" doesn't apply. What were you thinking?

roxy54 is correct. The site can have whatever rules that they want and insist they be followed. The couple of mods here are volunteers and sometimes they delete large groups of posts and accidentally delete a few that are perfectly fine when they get in a hurry. They don't have time to babysit and remind people to act like adults. They also take care of issues with the sales too.What a fun job🙄

A dedication to Tammy, who toils over our excesses and decides who to axe when, when the psyc cats get hissy.

Thanks, actually..... ;)

...@ 4:24....

asv, interesting choice for a dedication-yet it fits the bill.

Be careful not to say anything negative about the advertisers that pay the bills!🙃

+1 ebm is fine. 

DEFINITELY C. This place is puritanical. 

They also take care of issues with the sales too.

which is quite apparent when reviewing some of their censorship history..

More. Keep it between the lines. Plenty of opportunities elsewhere for free speech. Like a tatoo on your forehead.

So far most picked up option C.

To me that doesn't mean that there are no moderation or any guidelines should be, but I'd probably leave 2 main ones: Empathy and Respect.

C of course.

I think the rules here are fine. As I've noted before, those that protest most loudly against moderation usually have the least to contribute.

Also, moderation ≠ censorship. They are two different things.

The one thing I do not like about the posting removals is that not the whole posting is bad. For example, there was a recent post re Vandersteen vs. Sonus Faber speakers. There was a chain of almost 180 responses! There was a lot of valuable info there. Yet, the whole chain was removed.

i think if there is a part of the chain that is inappropriate then that portion should be deleted if necessary.  Same with the OP, why should he be able to determine if the information in the post should be wiped away….that info could prove valuable to future searches.

thanks for reading this post…..before I delete it, in one, two

there was a very informative non controversial thread about a Supratek preamp that disappeared for no apparent reason. Makes one wonder if advertising competitors are able to get threads pulled..

@cleeds I might partially agree that moderation and censorship is different, but to put it in correct way, years back there wasn't any censorship, but now there is here and it technically shouldn't be.

I've been here since 1998, and back then this was a much more courteous site, and there was rarely anything openly hostile happening, and political commentary was pretty much non existent. 

Quoting fiesta75  "Be careful not to say anything negative about the advertisers that pay the bills!🙃"

If we're discussing personal experience and customer service it's usually fine. But avoiding actual defamation is in the user agreement we all agreed to when becoming a member.It's very likely manufactures ask to get threads pulled.

It might be a good idea to create a sub forum to discuss current events where it's " no holds barred".

@roxy54 :

I've been here since 1998, and back then this was a much more courteous site, and there was rarely anything openly hostile happening, and political commentary was pretty much non existent. 

I agree with your sentiment. I have been reading Audiogon forums since early 2000 (member since 2004), and things have deteriorated significantly over the past few years. Away from audio. Some of the deranged individuals posting here, have nothing to do with audio, as can be seen by their Audiogon feedback (or lack thereof), and are here just to wreck havoc. Nothing more. Typical troll behavior 

It’s bad when an entire thread with over 12,000 views in a week gets removed because some of the posters set out to destroy it with never ending arguments like: Prove it to me, prove it to me. Nah, nah etc. Some of those very same posters are on this thread. What a bunch of ja’s that are now posting on audiogon.

It is difficult to post an opinion about a product you like and want to share it with others and not be called a shill.

I’ve started posting more to the "What’s Best" forum these days they seem to have less radicals there.

ozzy

That’s why it would be wonderful to be able to ignore certain members. So that I don’t see their posts and they don’t see mine. Probably wishful thinking.

“ I’ve started posting more to the "What’s Best" forum these days they seem to have less radicals there.

ozzy

”

 Curious indeed . i am not a member there however I am acquaintance with a couple of long standing members there that have expressed concerns to me at the number of vociferous rats that have jumped ship only to bring disharmony and conflict to their calm in the eye of a storm forum.

Then it is probably best you don't join?

ozzy

Oh My !!!

Just take a look at the recidivist fundamentalists posting on this newly created thread over on What’s Best Forum:

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/new-synergistic-research-carbon-tuning-discs.34386/

Then it is probably best you don't join?

ozzy

You realize that’s the reason such characters exist? Nothing to worry though. He will be kicked out pronto. And they block IPs too

ego stroking his way into favour..

I'd like to raise another form of interference that sits poorly, at least with me.

Audiogon prohibits sharing personal contact info.  I find this pretty intrusive: the only possible reason i can think of is to avoid them losing commissions on sales.  Yet most discussion here is non commercial.

It can lead to the absurd as well:  I recently received a PM asking for a schematic or help on making a LPS.  I replied, and along the way added "and you can buy generic circuit boards on <<that auction site>> that are easily modified and make the task easier".  Mistake.  It was blocked and is awaiting moderation. Really?

thyname.

+1

ozzy

itsjust me,

Very good point. I get lots of messages from audiogon members and many times return messages are blocked.

I do think it is because audiogon does not want direct communication with members for fear it would hurt sales.

But their best approach would be to lower the advertising costs for individuals not raise them! It would increase sales! Afterall how much effort is it to post an ad? There are other sites that charge nothing for individuals to list an item. I’m not saying audiogon should not make a profit, but they really should make it easier for individuals to communicate. Perhaps charge more for commerce paid advertising.

ozzy