Klipsch Cornwall IV

Of course. Most understand all of that. So far we have one response of someone placing them 3 ft from corners. Just wondering what others are doing. I don’t have the speakers so I can’t experiment with them. I have a friend who may be interested in the speakers and would benefit in advance from knowing how others place theirs so that he can decide whether his room/placement constraints might work or whether there is little chance.  Interested in feedback from actual owners, not marketing spiel from mfg

in general, speaker placement (and subwoofer placement, as appropriate) relative to room boundaries and the listening area is a key variable that each owner can play with ad infinitum... different positionings are one of the best offers in our pursuit -- cost free endless trials in the sanctuary of your own home  :)

some speakers need room to breathe, others can use some boundary reinforcement for bass frequencies, some are best heard near field, others need some distance for driver integration... and so on

it just takes commitment, effort, fortitude, patience (and is some cases, a strong back and a willing accomplice!)... but getting it right is its own, substantial reward -- you finally get what you paid for when you shelled out the long green to buy all the gear !!!

I think placing them too close to a wall or a corner diminishes their potential. NEAR a wall or corner is good. I have mine approx. 3 ft from the corner and this works very well.

As for the question on soundstage and imaging, they are very good at this, better than you would think a horn would be. They don't image like a monitor or some big name tower speakers, but they have a very 3 dimensional quality, not flat at all.

Oz

Nobody said they HAD to be placed near a corner/wall. It does apply just like AUDIO NOTE speakers will always work near a Corner/Wall. They are designed to do so. Go to the Klipsch site and see where they are placed OR look at any of their advertisements/brochures. ALSO watch ZERO FIDELITY’s review on Youtube. His Room is only 9 x 12 so guess what....they arent very far from the wall at all.

Well that name was assigned 50 years and 4 models ago. Doesn’t mean it still applies. Look at Khorn - latest model doesn’t need to be in corner. 
Just wondering how far from wall owners have seen best results?

i would be very appreciative if a reader here can describe to me their opinion of the stereophonic imaging/depth qualities of the latest cornwall IV speakers, how they compare to something like a thiel tower, for example. 

@jbhiller

I don’t think music is authored on inexpensive amps and gear. In fact, the studios I’ve been to all had hundreds of thousands of dollars of gear. Not a cheap amp to be found.
Certainly live venues might be using Crown and inexpensive amps for playback.

you are absolutely correct in my experience

people conflate equipment used in recording and mastering (absolutely excellent gear) with gear used in conventional playback (heavy duty industrial stuff like crown amps giant p-a horns etc etc) in mass audience venues

an example is in 2006 i bought an audio research v70 tube amp, with high grade foil capacitors and rca/mullard old stock tubes handwound output transformers etc etc - this was the amp that for years powered the recording/playback monitors in david chesky’s nyc (formerly rca radio city) recording studio from when he launched the grammy winning boutique label... all those lovely recordings on lp and cd we bought by sara k, paquito d-rivera, ana caram, and remasterings of phil woods clark terry badi assad etc etc... this amp was used to for mixing and final voicing!!!... it is lovely amp, utterly pure and grainless, full of air and timbral accuracy - if anything it is too accurate, midrange sounds maybe just a touch lean for my tastes - but i still have that amp as a keepsake

I happen to agree with the guy who designed these CW4's as to what is important. He does not use that fancy stuff to develop gear for a major speaker maker known as Klipsch.  We will have to agree to disagree on the validity of dropping gobs of cash on amps and cords.

 

How far do CW4 need to be from front wall?

@jbhiller Yes, live venues use Crown because they're powerful and bombproof. They will work amidst cigarette smoke and spilled beer and whatnot.

Assuming something is only as good as the weakest link in the chain, if the pro gear used to make recordings is in fact inherently inferior, then it follows that we are all screwed. Any attempt to make things better during playback is pure folly. At best, you can’t make it any better during playback than it is when recorded. So we all might as well just buy all pro gear and put lipstick on it to make it look nice at home.

So a lot of what audiophiles fret about is in fact pure nonsense. It’s all in the mind and each will dress up the pig as they see fit.

Cheers!

PS I would love to have a pair of Cornwalls in case anyone wants to just throw in the towel and give their’s away. 😉

I don’t think music is authored on inexpensive amps and gear. In fact, the studios I’ve been to all had hundreds of thousands of dollars of gear. Not a cheap amp to be found. 
Certainly live venues might be using Crown and inexpensive amps for playback. 

For those with CW IV, how far from the speakers are you sitting? 

 My speakers are 9'8" from my ears. 

The Cornwall IV’s are tremendous speakers which can give you a palpable, organic 3 Dimensional representation of your music.  I’ve owned a ton of speakers and gear...see My Final Pair! post:)

I'm sure they are out there, but I don't know anyone who is using an iPad straight into an audio system.

But one thing's fer sure. You won't find a Crown amp of any flavor in my listening room. Nor will you find zip cord and throw away interconnects.

To each his own...........

i am with roxy on this

the better your source and your speakers, the more you hear the difference an amp makes

not subtle... leave aside good tube amps, even in the solid state world, guys like nelson pass john curl and bent holter have not been stealing deaf people’s money all these years with thousands of units sold

there may be some marketing going on, but that does not mean there is not real substance and quality differences underneath it

mahlman,
We will have to agree to disagree. I believe that amplifiers and sources make a huge difference in sound quality, and about 5 years ago, I actually bought one of the newer Crown amplifiers and it sounded very poor. I returned it quickly. 
We all see and hear things differently.

@ozzy62 second the good description you gave.

As I see it (or hear as it may be), there is so much great gear out there. All these manufacturers have smart people designing amazing stuff. The difference is in the flavor not the label. That said, someone starts a thread about Cornwall IV’s and people are surprised that others who own and like them are responding with positive feedback?

As always, if possible try before you buy, especially if you can home demo. Opinions and taste can only tell you so much.

" I share your affinity for Klipsch speakers, but it's a bit contradictory to hear you say that cheap amps and zipcord are fine, but that streaming through an ipad isn't. "
  I have a very good reason for my sentiment. I have bought fixed and sold hundreds of sets of Klipsch speakers over the last seven years or so. I insist buyers come here in person and listen to what they are interested in. I also advise them to bring a flash drive with their favorite music so they have a real reference point to go by. At times I can see disappointment on their face and the problem has centered around music file quality. Every iPad that has shown up here with their stored music has been bad. Most flash drive files are also not the best either.
  So I let them flounder for a bit and then I play the same songs, most of the time I have them in my library, on the same speakers and the only difference is the source file. The PC that is used as storage for my files goes to an amp and then to speakers if simple 2 channel or to my Xilica then the amps and then speakers for more complicated sets requiring DSP to sound really good. I plug their file into my PC and so the sound delivery is the same , except for the music file.
  I admonish the iPad users who are the only ones who call after getting their new speakers home and say they don't sound as good as they did at my place. OK, I say, are you using that iPad again just like I told you not too? You know what the answer is. They end up being happy when they break that bad habit. It may not be the inherent capability of the iPad in question perhaps but the files these guys come up with through them sound bad.

  Regarding cheap amps. Darned right, if I can buy 200 watts per channel of good clean high quality sound why in the world would I spend ten times as much for a name tag that is no better? I think wasting my money is silly. It's a funny world when live venues concert halls and recording studios use professional amps, Like Crowns just like I do, to produce sound for people. I want that sound so I use that type of equipment. I have yet to see racks of fancy homeowner gear at any of these places. How is it that only expensive amps can accurately reproduce what was  authored on cheapo pro gear hmmm? 

  My goal in audio is to get the best possible sound in an economical fashion and you are invited to stop in and see if my efforts are worthwhile over those who spend tons of money for far less. Southern Middle Tennessee is the locale.

I know someone who had the M3 and the Sapphire and the latter was a very big improvement. But ultimately he kept blowing tweeters in the Sapphire so he sent it back for a refund. He now owns Forte IIIs.

Oz

Not that I can tell - unless I stand against the back wall, of course.

OK- then the correct answer is 'yes'.

@atmasphere Not that I can tell - unless I stand against the back wall, of course. But it's something I can look into more. @jjss49 How much more of an improvement on this is the Sapphire over the Turbo?

i cannot speak for older/smaller/lesser models in the line, but in my experience, the spatial m3 sapphires deliver absolutely world class, full, powerful, tuneful, deep, airy bass -- it is the towering strength of the speaker -- if someone has these spatials and lacks bass, there is a serious problem with room/placement or some other significant implementation issue

Although I do wish a bit more bass than the Spatials can deliver.

@simao Do you have a standing wave in your room? If you listen to your system at placed other than the listening chair does the bass get better? If yes, look into a Distributed Bass Array. If bass is your only complaint of the Spatials, consider that if you are dealing with a standing wave it may not get any better with a different speaker. A DBA will solve that.

mahlman,
I share your affinity for Klipsch speakers, but it's a bit contradictory to hear you say that cheap amps and zipcord are fine, but that streaming through an ipad isn't. 

I have owned Klipsch Heresy 1's (which I updated with Crites crossovers) and then B&W CM9s and now Heresy 4's. I have demoed Fortes also. All Klipsch, I believe need a subwoofer (I use REL) because their horns take over but I even found that with my B&W's the Sub help the staging immensely 

For those of you asking about the Fru Fru high end joint in Huntsville. AVIQ is the name and they list Klipsch Heritage in their product list along with many others.

I have no idea where some of these bits of "common knowledge we all know this to be true" ideas come from. So here we go. Millercarbon can add to this I am sure.

 Too big for a small room. Nonsense as I know people with MCM-1900's in their living rooms and they sound stellar at any level. I have sold perhaps 15 sets of KPT-456's and KPT-904's that went to  peoples houses where they will stay until they die and they love them.

  Too revealing whatever that means. My interpretation of this is guess what, when the goal is accurate sound reproduction, the closer you get to good reproduction the more you are going to find many of your audio files are poor in quality.

 And my favorite AG bit of nonsense is "too lifelike". Exactly what I want and seek.
  Check my personal system out. These are maybe 16' center to center in a space roughly 22' x 14' front to back. It is a space in my shop as I have no speakers in the house. Sadly my wife likes Facebook and not fine audio so the gear stays out there where I wont be interfered with when I listen. You just simply can't substitute smaller speakers that may go down as low and expect the same result. Yes lets say the small box goes down to 35hz. The bigger one that goes that low, assuming we are talking about a well designed speaker like the CW4, will make you sit up and pay attention. The depth of sound quality, call it headroom if you may, is a key part of excellent sound. I have full output down to 27hz on a big single fold horn and it is fun to watch people when they hear them for the first time.

  When Roy did his demo of last years models and the new ones he played the Heresy 4, Forte 3, La Scala latest and greatest, and Cornwall 4.
  The real deal is all I can say about the CW4 and this is from a guy who despised them for being big boomy sounding boxes until now. The Heresy 4 is perhaps a bit better than the Super Heresy build many Klipsch head tinkerers have built and is another surprising box.

 He also had the latest Jubilee there but that is in another whole league over all the Klipsch Heritage stuff. But you know if you really like big rich sound go big.
 I want to hear the rasp of fingers and string noise just like I was there with Cellos. I want to sit down next to the 32' organ pipes. I want to sit in the middle of the band as they play. This was the goal when I built my system.
 I say that to say this. There are speakers I could live with if I had to give the Super MWM's up and the CW4 is one of them.
  By the way on all this fancy stuff people seem to think they need. Roy Delgado uses a QSC 4 channel Theater amp and an older DX38 EV for DSP if needed and zip cord speaker wires in his sound room at Klipsch. I figure he knows what he is doing and that's just about all I do to. Crown XLI800 amps work just fine for me and don't break the bank.

  OP there is one comment you made that kind of surprised me. I guess I need to go hear a set before buying, or words to that effect. NEVER buy until you hear and find someone who owns a set and go to their house to listen.  Now there is a word of waning here. I knew a guy who loved Macintosh and spent a small fortune on them. KHorn corners and CW centers and it was just awful. So I ask him what is his music source as he fiddles with that stupid iPad. Sure enough it was that iPad and some streaming thing. Make sure the person you pick to visit for speaker auditions knows what they are doing. Many have way more money then sense and if you want really good sound find the guys with common sense buying and playing practices.

@jjss49 fair enough. True but verify. I'll probably try out Triangles before Cornwalls unless I get a good deal on the latter. 

So...... It sounds like people are saying I should hear them before I buy them?

said that in the 2nd reply to your post... page 1 🤔

but hey... it’s only money... and it’s a journey... something to be said for living dangerously 😷

@sounds_real_audio Thanks for the jolt of reality - truly. You're right in that I should enjoy what I have and stop trying to reside in Xanadu.


Although I do wish a bit more bass than the Spatials can deliver.

simao
I understand you tastes. I have to say I can not recommend a speaker in the price range you are looking . You have the incredible 845 tube amp so make sure you don't miss the opportunity to bask in the glory of the midrange. You have a large room and i would advise against getting some horn speaker that might fill the space. Simply bring you listening sets close to your speakers and then close you eyes and enjoy. 

So...... It sounds like people are saying I should hear them before I buy them?

@kren0006 Yes it is a generalization. I can appreciate what other designs do and enjoy listening to them. My buddy has a pair of Focal Kanta 2s that I like every time I hear them. But I wouldn't trade him even for my cornwalls, and I'm sure he feels the same way.

Oz

ozzy i like that description of who may like cornwall 4 and who won't - generalization but still helpful.

@jjss49 I would love to try a pair of 0/96's or 93's; however, they rarely come up for sale on the used market for a price I can entertain.

Well I guess I'm one of the fan bois.

I have owned 1987 CW IIs and Bob Crites Cornscalas. The CW IV is very much improved on the earlier cornwalls and also head and shoulders above a stock cornscala.

That said, if you have an aversion to (good) horns, you still might not like it. What I'm saying is, if you value a speaker that never offends, but also never engages, you won't like the CW. If Sonus Faber and  Harbeth appeal to you, you won't like the CW.

But if you value fleshed out midrange detail, good instrument tone and of course, whip crack dynamics, then you might like the Cornwall IV.

Oz

i too wonder about comparison to o/96 or even o/93

i have heard earlier cornwalls not the iv version...to my ear, live-sounding for sure but highly colored, honky horn nature in the midrange and upper bass area, slight rasp/grit to treble leading edges... lil hard to believe the new speaker is a ’whole new deal’ as some proponents espouse... not to knock it as i just haven’t heard it, and am not motivated to try it in my own system but i just wonder when i read the posts

been burned and disappointed by so many purported solutions over the years to the full range dynamic speaker driven by sweetie pie flea watt amps

I’ve never understood why people that love a product get accosted. I do understand that some may be influenced by another’s love of a component. Maybe they buy it based on someone’s reaction and not like it, but that’s a risk audiophiles sometimes take for listening to people on forums.
Still no comparisons to the orangutan? I’m just kinda lingering here in no hurry. 

I LOVE the look of the Cornwalls, always have. I think the new series IV is the best looking ever.

Pair of CW4 for sale on vintage McIntosh Facebook page. No price listed.

Never listened to them but they must sound amazing because they are so pedestrian looking nobody would buy them based on aesthetics.

And if you buy speakers based purely on aesthetics, that's tells me all I  need to know about you. And I bet you are "that guy".

I've had better looking speakers in my room, but I've had some ugly ducklings too. Personally I think the Cornwall has an understated look that doesn't call attention to itself (other than the size). It's plenty good looking to me.

Oz

Simao,
Another Troll born on Audiogon...Just what we need  :)

I live in Huntsville.  Did a dealer search and Electronics Express came up as as Klipsch Cornwall/ Heritage dealer.  Never been to the store.

@cultan21.  Great first post, bruh. 

Never listened to them but they must sound amazing because they are so pedestrian looking nobody would buy them based on aesthetics. 

@riaa

Wouldn't need to escape - could just hide inside one of the enclosures until help arrives...

Sean at ZERO FIDELITY Reviewed the IV's on his Youtube channel. His room is only 9 x 12 and the Cornwall's did fine in that small environment..although I wouldnt want to try to escape a room that size with those speakers if there was ever a fire  :)

I’m one of those Klipsch fans from years ago because I loved the open live sound they produced. A friend and I visited the demo room in Hope, Arkansas in 1974.  I bought a pair of simple pair of raw birch e and eventually traded them in on a pair of LaScallas. Ultimately, Cornwall was my speaker of choice because of the bass response. With a little modification, they could be fantastic. But, I also learned that Klipsch can be room sensitive. The larger speakers sound far better in a larger room. My LaScallas needed a huge room to sound their best. Please remember, this is all pre -1984.

Where I’m disqualified is that I didn’t keep up with changes over the years. That being said, I first heard both the Heresy IV and the Cornwall IV at the RMAF last year. (That isn’t exactly true. I had heard the Heresy at Listen Up here in Denver earlier. It seemed that they were set up in such a way and to assure that they would never sell a pair to anyone but those who surely wanted them. It was also in the Listen Up room that I heard them again) I could hardly believe what I was hearing. The difference between the older Cornwall and the new IV was, to me, huge. The new speaker fits well in a small space, though the cabinet is big. The sound was not as overwhelming as the older model.
If I had space, that would be my choice because I like to listen at a lower volume and the sound of the music was not diminished by the lower volume. I’ll say it again, if one has the room, they are a worthy speaker for music lovers.