I want to buy new speakers for 50,000 and see it used for 30,000, what should I do?
two issues here, would it be smarter to buy the used speakers not knowing where they’ve been or how hard they’ve been played or maybe there’s something wrong with them. And the other issue is what happens to the value of my speakers immediately after the box comes to my house. And I guess the third issue is, amI insane for buying $50,000 speakers.
It seems like I’ll be losing $20,000 immediately and of course probably a little more since if I ever sell they will need to be reduced further so used price can be 30,000 if a dealer is involved which they probably will be.
This raises a serious concern that very nice speakers are just too expensive.
Fortunately (and luckily) I’m not married so that makes this process a lot easier
Personally, I think all the hype and excess funds held by older souls, and highly technically expert people who frequent this forum, as well as all the audio dealers on this forum, are what drives this market even higher. The point I was trying to make was the difficulty of purchasing extremely expensive equipment which should be priced a lot less. The only reason why it’s so high is to support lavish marketing and profit motivated executives to exploit all those excess dollars available to support all this.
Truth is, very few people understand all that goes on with a speaker. It’s complicated. Those companies selling these products take advantage of this and when you look into things really closely the people selling the products have no clue what they’re selling. Why should they? Those people with money to spend on the product are not really pushing for a better understanding of what they’re buying Beyond just a few quick questions and maybe a listening session that’s helpful and breaking out a credit card and taking delivery and being treated rather well while they do it. There are really nice people selling audio products.
And for those people with excess funds to spend, they feel better spending more money even though same experience could be achieved for considerably less but for some reason spending more money gives people comfort. if Something seems really good and it’s not being sold for very much i wonder why. And I even say to people selling the product you should charge more and people would feel more comfortable about what they’re buying, including me. And I am rather frugal.
The threads on cables imho have no basis in reality. Yet there are hundreds of them that go on and on.
There have been some humorous responses here at the very least, plus the melodrama of my being called disgusting, an accusation that I make zero effort to refute, and which I have been known to embellish upon from time to time, depending on my perception of the algorithmic structure of the narrative. So at least there’s entertainment.
- preamp and tuner (no receivers), I bought them used from a dealer in Manhattan who sells lots of used gear and stands behind everything he sells
- amps, bought from the same dealer. They were a little unstable in the early years, in spite of taking them to an audio engineer who has won 5 Grammys. Then I came across George Kay and Jon Specter. Jon has recently rebuilt them from top to bottom, converted them to triode, replaced/upgraded all the caps, new NOS GE 6LF6s, and re-etched the corroded sections of the circuit board. He’s been working on Futtermans for decades, he started out by working with George Kaye who he still consults with. I have complete 100% confidence in Jon and George.
You should be able to get a nice discount on $50K speakers. at least 20-25% which makes the decision easier. If I were going to spend that kind of dough (which I wouldn't) I would buy from a dealer for peace of mind. If I couldn't get any discount, I would find a different speaker. You can very often get close outs of 40% or even more because a company changed the speaker and has to unload the old ones, or more likely get the 25% off a demo pair from a dealer that will give you full warranty and support.
- notwithstanding my completely, utterly disgusting political orientation, I’m conservative about a lot of things. In particular, spending my money. I don’t want to loose it.
- I always kick the tires.
- I will buy something that’s a wreck on purpose, IF I know I can have it fixed, or in some cases fix it myself. The purchase price will be greatly discounted, and once I add to the repair cost, I will be ahead, sometimes way ahead. For example, I bought two backup Altec 604s that were damaged. Plus repair, the cost was $650 each. In good condition, they are going for $2,400 a pair.
You are always taking a chance on used equipment, more so on amps anx receivers....I have bought used equipment and it will last sometime a month and then problems start...and I'm taking about Mac Intosh .Went they say oh It has been checked out ,yeah by Who ?
I can think of a lot of worse problems to have than having to decide between used 30k speakers and new 50k speakers. Personally, I would go used if they are in mint condition.
It depends on how much $20,000 means to you.... if it is nothing then buy new. If it is something then go look at and listen to them before you buy used. I've bought several used speakers and always worked out but not at the price range you are looking at.
What I’m surprised at is the number of people still treating this as though it’s a serious thread. I admit it was entertaining for a while, but even that’s running thin at this point.
As an engineer I've purchased many speakers and helped many clients purchase speakers.
step 1. What are you looking for ? Size. Sound. Etc.
A budget number is a terrible idea as your basis. There are $15,000 speakers that better 60,000 speakers yet only when you know what you're looking for
step 2. Synergy is more important than any one speaker or amp etc.
step 3. Buy something you think you can use forever. It will likely not happen that way but it's your goal.
And we wonder why so many dealers have gone out of business in the last decade.
"I demand 20% off or I’m walking!"
"Buh-bye."
One of the single-store dealers in my region does quite well despite regularly offering 20-30% discounts on nearly every product he sells. The exceptions are the handful of lifestyle products he offers, like Sonos. He said there are simply too low of margins on those products to offer anything better than 10% off. Meanwhile, he’ll offer to sell you a McIntosh stack for >30% off, just so long as you agree to not go tattling on him to Mac. Even though the guy’s customer service is mediocre at best, he seems to do pretty well. I surmise that’s because what he gives up in profit margin he makes up for in sales volume. The guy won’t even load the gear in your vehicle for you because he suffered a stroke a few years ago. But is that a big issue when you’re getting the warrantied product you want for 35% off?
It’s surprising how many here are seemingly unaware of the deals that can be had on brand-new hifi. I figured the primary demographic of this forum would be accustomed to being offered such discounts.
It has been my experience that in most cases, with most dealers, one needn’t even ask, the salesperson/owner is eager to offer a sizable discount.
Makes me wonder if they spot some of you pulling up to their storefront in your exotic sports car, with a trophy wife riding shotgun.
1. What you expect from 50K speaker may also available in other low priced speaker, explore more.
2. Go to sellers Place, have audition and audit before buying expensive product.If happens to buy check how safely it will be packed and delivered to you. take experts assistance for the both evaluations.
No reply from this OP after numerous suggestions here.
I bought $25k PMC MB2SE from a doctor in Canada who had obviously looked after his system based on the many photos he shared. I paid less than half as he was looking for a quick sale. I’ve owned PMC before and these arrived well packed in original packaging. Shipping is another issue and ensuring palletising if necessary will give you peace of mind.
Going to see the used one’s will provide you with a look at a home site versus a shop experience with burned in mature sound, while considering the room situation as a factor.
Like others have said, make that visit and share your discovery with us here.
@tannoy56”…Do you realize that most of the opinions you’ve got is from members whose entire system cost less than that, and they should be asking you for an advise instead.”
Oh, I think you would be surprised how many folks here have good systems. You might take a walk through the virtual systems section of the forum.
@phusis Only rich and dumb cowboy will spend $50,000.00 on a pair of speakers without any knowledge and experience, not to mention that he is asking total strangers for an advise.
Do you really asking this forum for an advise of how to spend $50,000.00 on pair of speakers?
Do you realize that most of the opinions you’ve got is from members whose entire system cost less than that, and they should be asking you for an advise instead.
Anyway, it’s your money - do as you wish. However, at this level of pricy equipment, you should be knowledgable enough to decide for yourself.
My therapist tells me I have trouble making decisions.
You’re making it way too hard and overthinking this. Seems like you’re going to have regrets whichever choice you make. Pick a lane, don’t look back and enjoy your speakers.
The business of new vs used is difficult. 2 yrs in a speaker life is NOTHING.
Speakers sound better with use. Short of abuse, no worries.
But i would insist on hearing them in person, inspect for physical damage, make sure the mfr crates are in PERFECT condition, and either transport them myself if practical or ship with insurance.
1st flip on most anything in a 3rd party sale is 50% off plus maybe a little wiggle room. Is the MSRP 50K? Is the person the original owner? Warranty transferrable? Original purchase receipt available?
Do your diligence on such a large purchase. Nothing sells for the full MSRP these days, and if you bite, your problem becomes his ex problem.
Are the $30K used speakers in the condition you would want? For that money, I would travel to see them and listen to them. If they were what I wanted and were in acceptable condition, I would buy used. The value, assuming they still worked should be more stable and less likely to depreciate as significantly as from new once already "used." What matters is whether the speakers still have manufacturer's support or absent that, whether key parts can still be sourced. I have bought new and used, and usually prefer the latter for the money savings. $20K is nothing to sneeze at, or at least it shouldn't be, and there are many things one could do with those funds. As for projecting how long you would keep them and rationalizing the new vs used costs, buying used affords you the option of selling them off with less loss if you should change your mind about them. IMO this same rationalization applies to many purchases.
I guess the overriding concern that I have is that I think everyone knows speakers can be very overpriced and that’s really absurd.
Manufacturers create subpar speakers at lower price levels and tempt you to buy higher priced speakers that sound better. It’s a con game. They are taking advantage of the seductive nature of listening to things that sound really good to us. It’s affecting the part of the brain that lacks the good judgment when it comes to spending money.
Think about it, why are we being encouraged to spend $50,000 for the type of speakers we all should be listening to
Get the flagship product of a brand that typically produces affordable product. A lot of aptitude, care and devotion will typically go into such a product.
You get the bottom end (deliberately gimped end) of a thieving brand and what you’ve mentioned could be true. There are some exceptions where good things can trickle down, but, that’s relatively rare.
Assuming both have return privilege, buy both at the same time. Audition them in your home side by side. If you can't hear any difference, return the new pair. If you hear anything bad from the used pair that you don't hear from the new, return the used pair.
This should result in COMPLETE confidence that you made the appropriate decision.
It may have an actual grain of reality, but his threads always have that feigned Bambi innocence that asks the obvious and provokes controversy. It happens every time.
I truly think that it is the exact opposite. I think that the manufacturers are strongly competing to put as much of their best technology as possible into their mid and lower priced products.
I guess the overriding concern that I have is that I think everyone knows speakers can be very overpriced and that’s really absurd.
Manufacturers create subpar speakers at lower price levels and tempt you to buy higher priced speakers that sound better. It’s a con game. They are taking advantage of the seductive nature of listening to things that sound really good to us. It’s affecting the part of the brain that lacks the good judgment when it comes to spending money.
Think about it, why are we being encouraged to spend $50,000 for the type of speakers we all should be listening to.
The OP needs help making a decision; but, he'd be a fool to reveal the speaker that he's considering because someone more decisive could swoop in and buy the one that is currently on the used market. So, a tough mess to untangle.
Yeah right ...No such thing in the high end...it is always a buyers market and a desperate seller or dealer
The OP needs help making a decision; but, he'd be a fool to reveal the speaker that he's considering because someone more decisive could swoop in and buy the one that is currently on the used market. So, a tough mess to untangle.
@emergingsoul, have you seen the ad on The Music Room website for a pair of Rockport Technologies "Cygnus?" This model & finish lists for $70,000; and, it is for sale for $44,999 (+ 1599 shipping). The last sentence of the Soundstage Network review is: "You can buy these and never look back."
Like I thought you haven’t made a deal. And go look at the discoun5s offered on demos and discontinued lines versus blathering it's 20-30 %. Look at the Sound by Singer demo sales page as an example. Seeing an add at a discounted price isn’t walking into a dealer and face to face working on a deal on new speakers. so save the chest puff commentary
The amount of markdown you can secure when buying used audio gear, like in other markets, depends on various factors including competition and current market conditions. For example, before COVID-19, it was easier to get a 20%-25% markdown below MSRP when buying a car in a buyer's market. However, the situation has changed significantly now.
When it comes to audio gear, in my area of West Palm Beach, there's only one dealer carrying high-end gear, and his prices for new items are fairly firm. However, he's more generous with discounts on used gear, which helps on his cash flow. Negotiating more than a 10% discount on new items is difficult, and it largely depends on the brands.
You keep acting like you’ve made this 25% off deal in store so give the facts on your deal - brand, model, dealer. Post your system with pictures while you’re act it so we have the proof. Dealers make 20-30% deals on lines they are moving out of and on demos. Reading adds isn’t making chest puff deals.
BTW those Acora's aren’t $50K speakers - $37K
Actually the MSRP on those Acoras is currently $48K depending on finish, close enough. They just happened to be the first example that came to mind since it was relatively recent.
I’m not going to potentially throw the dealer under the bus by exposing him, even though he’s resorting to the same sort of deal making I’ve encountered throughout my time in this hobby. I won’t risk him losing the line since it might create animosity with Acora dealers an adjacent regions.
And you’re wrong on the margins— dealers usually make more than 20-30% on demos because in most cases they acquired their inventory for half or little over half of MSRP. If they were to sell them for MSRP, that would be 100%. That’s common consumer pricing structure BTW. The reason outlets like Crutchfield don’t offer similar deals is because they have a generally ignorant and loyal customer base. Any independent, single-store, brick & mortar dealer would be out of business in no time if they were only offering discounts between 10 and 15%, especially dealers in the high end market.
Again, don’t take my word for it, call around to some of them and ask what kind of deal they might be willing to make you on that Magico/Wilson/YG etc. Just because you didn’t get as good a deal doesn’t mean there are not good deals to be had. And yeah, early on in my time I was just as ignorant and bought more than one pair of speakers for full retail. Some dealers will only give good price breaks to repeat customers. But many if not most are willing to do so if you merely ask. Again, call around and ask. If they refuse to budge over 10-20% it’s because they likely think you’re flush and/or already smitten with the product.
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