I have been an avid user of the Duelund cabling for
over two years now and have used them exclusively in my system with great
results. I have built many for friends and have used a full loom of
interconnects, speaker cables, power cords and an extensive wiring modification
for a previously owned balanced power conditioner utilizing Duelund 600V PolyCast
wiring which was transformative. My cabling desires can be a little addictive
as I have owned and evaluated 40+ brands of cabling costing more than an entire
stereo system!
Over the past six months I stumbled upon a thread here
on Audiogon in regards to a Helix designed cabling and as you probably already
know, I just had to look a little deeper into this cable design…After a month
of studying and sourcing parts, I decided to reach out to the
designer/architect, Williewonka who gave more insights and philosophy on how
the cable came into existence.
That conversation got the ball rolling in converting
one of my KLE Duelund interconnects to Steve’s Helix designed which only entailed
replacing the neutral with a Mil-Spec 16 AWG silver-plated copper wire with the
neural wire being 3 times longer than the signal wire and of course the “Coiling”
of the neutral wire : )
After the modification was complete, I was not sure
what to expect from the Helix cabling but I was quite shocked with the results
with “ZERO” burn-in time…The sound stage became much wider/deeper with a much
tighter/focused image and clarity/transparency is like nothing I have ever
heard in any cabling regardless of cost. In fact, I just sold a full loom of a commercially
designed Helix Cable that’s renowned around the world and has more direct sale
than any cable manufacturer; these $200 DIY Helix Cables walked all over them…
I believe you will hear the same results as I have and
have heard back from friends who have already modified their Duelunds with the
same results; WOW! Remember the cables will need 200+ hours to burn-in and
settle into your system. My system is now 90% DIY Helix to include IC, SC, PC
and Coax with each cabling adding its beauty of an organic and natural
presentation that draws you into the fabric of the music.
You can tailor the sound of your cables using Duelund,
Mundorf silver/1% gold, the outstanding Vh Audio OCC Solid Copper or Silver with Airlok
Insulation or your favorite wiring and you can change it at any time…
I placed an order for the yesterday and it was promptly cancelled. I inquired as to why and I got the exact opposite story. They said the cannot export the wire to Canada as per US export laws. Yet Take Five Audio in Canada sells the wire. All very strange. Cheers.
I have a double run of 16AWG Duelund for the signal. I am planning 10AWG MIL Spec as the neutral. I ordered enough of the 10AWG to do a double run on the neutral.
Any thoughts on if that will improve performance vs. a single run neutral, or is it just overkill?
@duffyd - Any change will have an effect on sonic performance. Some might say "give it a whirl" since you already have the wire.-
But you have to consider how to connect the cable to the binding posts - the KLE Innovations bananas will no accept such a large wire - a double neutral might be too heavy for the KLE Banana and pull it out of the binding post - so a replacement connector must be used - which will impact performance
Also, the type of connector used may actually negate any benefit from the dual neutral wire
You could end up with a cable that is not as good sounding as the single 10 gauge.
If you think that you want to try it - take a look at Furez connectors - they offer many different sizes and come in plain copper or silver plated.
@duffyd, I’m using the ETI pure copper spades with heavy gauge speaker wires. This had been a recommendation from Nick at Hificollective.uk for the Duelund wire. I’m totally happy with these spades, best “sounding” connectors. Better than the hollowed types and better than Furutech spades.
A few posts ago I had mentioned I had tried Bare Wire inside a clear PVC tube on my speaker and power cables and the improvements were very positive.
I’ve also been monitoring the bare wire inside the PVC tube for signs of oxidation and as of today things are looking very promising. The bare wire is still very bright and by comparison the piece of bare wire on my audio stand is turning a much darker shade of copper.
I also warned in the post that I thought PVC was not the best tube to use because it gripped the wire when trying to insert it - I thought at that time that Teflon tube would be a better material.
Yesterday I received some Teflon tube I had ordered - approx 1/10" internal diameter.
So today I decided to try Bare Wire in one of my interconnects that used Neotech UP-OCC copper with Teflon insulation.
Removing the insulation was quite easy using a hobby knife and running it down the wire and pealing it back
I used
two strands of bare 18 gauge Neotech wire, twisted together
3-4 twists per inch
one piece of Teflon tube with Heat Shrink at each end
The improvements were far from subtle and heard immediately...
more high end details - vocals now had a definite whispery quality and venue acoustics were better defined
mid tones were fuller and more complete
bass was deeper with better texture
dynamics were noteicebly fast with more slam
image was little wider and better focussed
the whole presentation was more natural and full bodied
Crap! - now I had to do the IC for the digital side :-)
This time I used
2 strands of 18 gauge VH Audio solid UP-OCC copper wire - not the Neotech wire
3-4 twists per inch
and the same Teflon Tube build
Again the improvements were easily discernable and just as good as the Neotech wire.
I could not tell the difference between the Neotech and VH Audio wire - which was not that strange because they are both 18 gauge UP-OCC solid copper.
The twisted wires fit the tube nicely with adequate space such that the impacts of the Teflon tube is negligible - basically this approach has a Dielectric Constant very close to Air, which results in amazingly clear details and better image.
The improvements in dynamics was a surprise, because the conductivity of the copper had not changed - just the insulation
I’m hoping that sealing the ends of the teflon tube with the heat shrink that has the adhesive inside will halt the oxidation process as it appears to have done with the PVC tubing.
Now I am all out of ideas - this was the last change I had considered.
Should you rush out and change your cables?
That depends on your own person level of ANAL :-)
BTW - these cables have just started Burn-in, so I will post and update once they complete burn-in in a couple of weeks.
But right now they sound pretty amazing - on both digital and analogue music
the heat shrink seems to work, the adhesive inside the Heat Shrink sealed the end very nicely.
But hot glue does not make the tube any wider like the Heat Shrink did - better for inserting into the coil.
There is very little air inside the tube once the two twisted wires are inserted
I did wonder if I could somehow inject carbon dioxide or Nitrogen into the tube to stop oxidation - still working on that :-)
RE: A spiral ribbon - go for it :-)))
But I think we might be leaving the realm of your average DIYer.
But it is fun to consider this stuff - LOL
What is interesting is the wire seems to sound extremely good immediately - almost as though it is burned in - which makes me wonder - do you Burn-in the wire or the insulation???
Granted the neutral wire and the RCA’s are well and truly burned in, but I was expecting some indication that burn-in was required.
When either Neotech or VH Audio wires had the insulation on them, they required about 200 hours burn-in - before that there was some imaging issues and harshness. Not this time.
Hi Steve. Great thread and informations. You twist the 2 bare wires together and put them together in one teflon tube, instead of twisting 1 bare wire in a teflon tube, with 1 bare wire in a teflon tube?
Don’t use hotglue, because it doesn’t sound good. Seal the tube with epoxy glue in the heat shrink or use diagmagnetics materiale like these...put a little piece of wool in the tube ends and seal it with shell lack. Steen Duelund liked diagmagnetic materials a lot.
Are there anyone here there have tried to use this diy helix recipe as a dc cable from a psu to the source?
You twist the 2 bare wires together and put them together in one teflon tube
That is correct. Although I did consider using two tubes in my thought process, I decided to go with the single tube option for simplicity.
Personally, I will not try the Epoxy approach, since I am forever trying new wires and methods and I think that the epoxy would make that change process more difficult. But it does have it’s merits
The heat shrink I use has an adhesive applied to the inside, which turns liquid with the application of heat - it actually sealed around the wire and tube quite nicely and it is relatively easy to undo in the future.
UPDATE: After just 14 hours of playing, this new approach is paying some very nice dividends - it will be very interesting to see how they sound after 200 hours burn-in.
One observation I find interesting - to this point I have not observed any harshness as I did when using wire with a molded insulation.
Hot glue works well for damping/vibration control. I use it in some builds to good effect. I found no sonic negatives at all. USB cable builds. I agree it would be best to make a double helix with two independent Teflon tube conductors as a twisted pair. It provides more of the sonic benefits of a true double IC rather than what is closer to simple increased gauge.
I now have a pair of 3 1/2 ft and 5 ft helix interconnects, 4 ft speaker cables, and one 3 ft PC in my system. Yikes, I can’t believe how good these are. The interconnects have about 125 hours on them as does the PC. The speaker cables went in last night and I listened with only 30 minutes on them. The SCs made a huge difference in the bass and modest to very good difference in other areas like imaging, clarity, sense of space, etc. However, the SCs need burn in as there is a bit of harshness. All my cables are double double. Which brings me to a question.
Steve, why the single 10 awg instead of double 12 awg on your speaker cables?
Chris - when I first started building the cables I found that having a neutral wire that was thicker than the signal wire provided sonic improvements, so I adopted an approach to use a gauge that was twice the gauge of the signal wire across all cables.
Back then I only used s single conductor for signal and neutral wires
When I first built the speaker cables I used a 12 gauge SIGNAL wire
this meant I required a larger NEUTRAL wire that was approximately 2 times the gauge of the signal wire
so my choice was a 10 gauge wire - since I could not find a 9 gauge wire :-)
The power cables are a little different because I do use 2 x 12 for the neutral, mainly because
having a single 10 gauge NEUTRAL together with a 12 gauge ground would look odd.
Also the 1 x 12 gauge ground wire fills in the space between the windings, which keeps the two neutral wires together.
the windings are closer together so it looks neat and tidy
A 2 x 12 gauge can be used on the speaker cables without any sonic issues - I do know people that have used 2 x 12 gauge and they reported it worked very well.
However, the 10 gauge wire holds the helix shape very well and you can space the coils more evenly...
whereas the 2 x 12 gauge would not look as "nice" because you have no way in keeping the two coils together for the length of the cable - it just looks untidy
also, at the back of an audio rack where there could be many wires in place, having additional coils could get caught on those wires - so I kept it simple - ONE 10 Gauge coil on the speaker cable.
Steve, Thanks very much for the reply. I figured as much but because you’ve been at it much longer than I have, I wanted a clear answer. I like the single 10awg and will use it on the next pair of speaker cables I make.
@nwres - that's good for US customers. Unfortunately the do not export - not even to Canada - shame :-(
From their web site...
Exportation Policy
Sorry, no international sales. We are not an exporting company. We have no exporting license, and, because we often deal with govt./ military surplus, we do not want to give even the impression that we are selling abroad (including Canada and Mexico).
I built a usb cable with the VH Audio 18 gauge solid core copper conductors on the data conductors. The foamed Teflon insulation was stripped off. I placed the bare wire conductor into a cotton jacket. I twisted the individual cotton covered data conductors into a twisted pair. I used three of the VH Audio 18 gauge solid core copper conductors as the outer ground helix shield (triple) with the insulation on.
Steve’s comments are spot on! Best sounding usb cable I have made to date. Just beautiful sounding.
Will the copper oxidize under the cotton? Maybe yes. Maybe no. Maybe it will not impact the sound over time? Plenty of silk and cotton covered wire sold.
More listening to these nude VH Audio copper conductors in my usb cable has me shaking my head. My goodness this is sounding great! Darn....I have to strip my ICs and put the nude VH & Neotech positive conductors in silk, cotton or Teflon tubing. I am leaning towards silk. I would like to stay away from Teflon and keep all natural. Maybe buy the VH silver conductors and place in silk.
Grannyring Re: Always use silk or wool if possible, because these are horn substances(keratin) like our nails, hair etc. Cotton isn’t and I remember that Steen Duelund didn’t like it at his cables and he had a fantastic hearing ;0)
I have made my usb cable the same way as you with ohno silver and it sounds great, but I think I have to try John Swensons JSSG 2 screens just connected with each other in the ends, around the 2 data conducters.
So I do appreciate the penchant for "Natural Fibers" but here is why I chose Teflon tube...
if you took a cross section view of the wire inside the tube it appears as a small circle inside a large circle, so the point of contact is extremely small and only every a single point of contact, because if one side is touching, the other side is not
it does not collapse when bent gently- but even if the tube collapses at an "L" shape bend - the surface area of contact is still extremely small.
The degree of dielectric effect comes from the amount of insulation actually touching the wire, which in this case is about as low as you can "humanly" achieve.
so the bulk of the dielectric for this approach is actually AIR
The oxygen in the air is unable to permeate through the Teflon - good for limiting oxidation
Sealing the tube at both ends is an effective method to minimize oxidation of the bare wire
If you are concerned about vibration you could put a cotton/silk sleeve over the Teflon tube to minimize this effect
Also, thinking back to a few months ago, I had tried a twisted pair of Mundorf Silver/gold wire in cotton tube and eventually found the VH Audio wire with the insulation sounded better, which is another reason I shied away from the cotton insulation this time around.
I cannot say that the cotton was responsible, but we are all swayed by our previous success or failures.
It is a personal choice and either one will provide exceptional sound quality..
Right now I am experiencing the most open and detailed image with smooth highs, stunning clarity, extremely fast dynamics and a very articulate and deep bass response.
Also I have have not observed any anomalies normally associated with burn-in
which is making me think that burn-in is more about the insulation than the wire?
Nirvana? - perhaps, or it could be just another wire away :-)
I think silk may well sound even better than a Teflon tube. Don’t know for sure, but seems reasonable. I plan on making the exact same copper usb cable with a Teflon tube and also silk. Right now the nude VH Audio 18 gauge copper in cotton sounds just amazing in my usb cable.
.Hello everyone! I read the thread with great interest! This is one of the most interesting topics that I have been able to see lately! I join your research! I think the next step is to make a few dozen turns of thread (silk or cotton) around the wire and then insert it into the tube. There is still something to strive for :-)
I have not fully understood how you build the USB cable. Can you explain a bit in more detail please?
The 2 data lines (d+ and d-) habe been twisted together. But how did you do the +5V line? The 3 ground lines (18gauge) habe been helixed around what? The 2 data lines including 5V line or is the 5V line separated?
This is how I build my helix usb. Go to Steve’s site where he posted my pics and build instructions. Best to not have to make the cable with the 5v conductor if possible. Many dacs supply their own clean 5v internally for the usb input. Some do not. Here is the link.
You can use VH Audio 18 gauge silver or copper for the data conductors. Silver sounds better than copper. You can strip off the Teflon insulation and cover with silk for the best sound. Each data conductor much be placed in a 1.5-2.5mm internal dimension silk tube before making a twisted data pair.
You must be skilled at soldering the thicker gauge wires onto the tiny and closely spaced usb solder pads. Any solder bridges will ruin you dac’s usb input board!
So in my case I used s twisted pair, so I might take this approach...
I would apply this coating after the wires were twisted, because the twisting could remove the coating
keep the coats very thin by wiping off any excess between coats
apply 2 thin coats
Now ...
applying any type of coating will increase the Dielectric Constant when compared to the naked wire
but to what level would be he question
but the effect of a couple of thin coats should be negligible
Personally, from what I am observing, i.e. by comparing my "naked" wires inside the sealed tube to the piece of naked wire I have sitting on my audio rack - I’m not ready to add this step to my cables just yet
It might be easy to achieve for 1 - 2 meter cables, BUT for my 10 ft speaker cables, it would present significant challenges, especially in my cramped winter work space at present
One member had suggested wiping the naked wire with WD40.
easy to do in almost any space
readily available
and very affordable
I just don’t know how effective this is - just yet :-)
If you feel you want to coat the naked wire, then use a Sprayon product called red insulating varnish. This is what is used to spray transformer windings to prevent shorts. It is electrical grade.
I think it would most likely degrade the sound vs nude. How much? If at all? No need with silver as oxidation that deteriorates sound quality is not an issue with silver. I know some folks will argue oxidation and sound degradation happens with pure silver, but have owned and built many pure silver cables, I have yet to hear or see any deterioration after almost 15 years! My home is always temperature controlled and maintains a humidity level under 40 however.
This spray is for those who are concerned about copper. Jupiter and other companies make copper in cotton conductors and I have used these for years without any sound or serious oxidation problems. However, on paper it can sure happen.
so I am very interested to build a pair of 8ft speaker cables. Currently using Duelund DCA 12GA.
Has anyone done a full Duelund Helix configuration ? Can someone (grannyring or Steve) summarise what is the latest wires to use for the positive and neutral wires ?
@debjit_g - I tried a full Duelund Signal and Duelund neutral interconnect probablby last year and it was identical to the same cable with the Mil-spec neutral.
Others in Europe have tried some very good wires for the Neutral on speaker and interconnects and found it made no difference, hence why I still recommend the Mil-Spec for the neutral
As for the signal/live wire - my pref’s in descending order (for all cables)
Neotech Solid UP-OCC copper (Naked)
VH Audio Solid UP-OCC copper (Naked) no difference from #1
Neotech solid UP-OCC copper (Teflon)
VH Audio Solid UP-OCC copper (AirLok)
Mundorf solid silver/gold (in cotton sleeve)
Duelund stranded tinned copper in cotton/oil (interconnect and speaker cables only)
Duelund stranded tinned copper in Polycast insulation for live wire in power cables
The gauge and umber of wires used are as follows
for IC’s 2 x 18 gauge for Neotech, VH Audio, Mundorf and Duelund was 1 x 18 gauge cotton oil
For speaker cables using Neotech 1 x 14 gauge
For speaker cables using VH Audio, 2 x 18 gauge
For speaker cables using Duelund, 1 x 16 and 1 x 12 gauge
For power cables with Neotech 1 x 12 gauge
For power cables with VH Audio 4 x 18 gauge
For power cables with Duelund 1 x 12 gauge with Polycast insulation
What difference are there between these wires?
all are very good wires to use for the signal wires but as you apporach my #1 - the image gets bigger and more focussed, the dynamics are faster and the clarity and details improve.
Duelund is not as fast as the UP-OCC copper or the silver, so dynamics are a little slower, but that translates to being less aggressive and more "laid back", so it really depends on the ears of the listener and the music they listen too
Also, my system is all solid state, so there would very likely be a slight change in my order if I were to hear the wires on an all tube system.
But I stress these are MY PREFERENCES on MY SYSTEM in MY LISTENING SPACE.
The one thing I have come to appreciate about the Helix Deign is that it is very easy to change the signal wires, so you could start with Duelund and easily move to something else later
I would probably skip the Mundorf Solid Silver/gold because the VH Audio Solid Copper wire with the AirLok insulation was better and costs less
I have not included the VH Audio Solid Silver wire because on my system, the Solid Copper was almost as good as the Mundorf at 1/5th the price, but I know others have tried it and love the results on their system
Perhaps @wig and @grannyring - or anyone else - can provide their comments - because different opinions makes for a more informed choice.
BTW - My musical taste is pretty much anything that sounds amazing, so I have lots to choose from, but I can appreciate some genres might sound better with a more "relaxed sounding" wire.
@twoleftears. I have made and sold cables with the Duelund stranded and tinned copper wire in oil impregnated copper for years. I have built ICs, USBs, speaker cables, DC cables, jumpers etc... and I like that conductor. The Helix is just heads and heals better with either the VH Audio or Neotech copper wire with the Teflon insulation in place.
We are now talking about squeezing out even more performance from the very best many of us have ever heard or built. Don’t misunderstand the point of our latest posts. The double helix design as outgunned cables selling for up to $13,000! This is reality. Yes, these are that good. As much as I loved my Acoustic BBQ Double Smoked Duelund cables I have to admit these helix designs surpass them in every sonic attribute important to us Aphiles.
@williewonka Steve, thanks so much for the detail answer.
I know the Mundrof silver/gold very well and use both the 15.5awg and 18awg in my DIY server power supply and all DC cables. They are fantastic to say the least. Unfortunately, they bumped their prices couple of months ago and now I would tend to use them in critical areas if I had to cut down in price, with only Neotech PTFE solid core as the replacement. I haven’t used the Mundrof in other parts of the audio, mainly signal and speaker cables, so its refreshing to hear that a lower priced VH Audio cable is as suitable. Thank you.
When you say naked, you probably meant stripping the insulation off the wire ? Did you have any other jacket on it ? say a cotton shelving ? For the speaker cables, I see that you used double runs of VH Audio 18awg but used a single run of Neotech 14awg. Was there any need for double runs on the Neotech ?
On the Helix, what awg would be suitable for the Mil-Spec ? Any link where I can but it cheap ?
At the input of the amplifier I have a Duelund CAST-Cu. Copper twisted bare wires come out of it. I asked Duelund a question: do I need to cover this wire with something? The answer is no, it will degrade the sound! I dealt with OCC copper plated with gold, and on top with a thin layer of polyurethane varnish. Very good wire and I like it more than MUNDORF solid silver / gold. But I do not have enough air and it's all about this insulation. Now I have washed off this polyurethane and am assembling the cable. Let's see what the result will be(although this is understandable!). On the positive side, the gold plating remains and there is no need to worry about copper oxidationВведите свой текст ...
I inserted the naked wire into a larger diameter teflon tube and sealed the ends using adhesive lined heat shrink available from many places on the web
Two runs of 18 gauge eqauals 15 gauge, so the 14 gauge was thicker, hence the need for only a single strand
If you are outside the US then Take Five Audio, Parts Connexion, and HiFi Collective are stores I use for my wires
You can search on eBay as well
The problem with finding more affordable Mil-spec wires
their quality can vary and there are leterally dozens of spec’s they could conform too including
Quality of copper
thickness and quality of the silver plating
The thickness of the insulation
Most (if any) are not cryo-treated
The Take Five Audio wire is very good quality AND it is cryo-treated
so really - you do get what oyu pay for
I have only ever used the Mil-Spec wire from Take Five Audio - perhaps the highest quality and Cryo-treated
Jantzen stranded silver plated wire is another wire I have heard performs very well for the Neutral
For a more budget oriented cable that performs very well you could use a solid copper with Teflon sleeve
I used one when I started this design and it worked quite well -but not as good as the Mil-spec
however I was not using the same signal wires as I do today, so it could prove to be very good and much more affordable
Granted - the wires we are using today makes the Helix cables more expensive than most other DIY solutions to build, but as @grannyring has pointed out - they are outperforming commercial products that cost thousands of dollars
But the nice thing with DIY - you get to use the wires/connectors that suit YOUR budget
I just found this place - they have 10, 12 and 16 gauge and sell by the foot - it’s NOT mil-spec, but it is stranded silver plated copper that should hold the helix shape quite well
Is mil spec wire really that big of a deal? Everything I read about it is related to it's durability and temperature resistance, and stereo cables don't need to be durable or resistant to extreme temps at all. Is there more to it than that?
@ketchup - it is the best wire of the many wires I have tried over the past 6 years of Helix development, specifically for the neutral wire of the Helix Cables
Perhaps it's more the silver plating, but the thickness of the Teflon, thickness of the silver plating etc. etc. also plays a role.
As I have stated many times - the nice things about DIY is that the person building the cables get to choose the wire of their choice
I am simply conveying what I have found to work extremely well and the Mil-spec wire from Take Five Audio is my particular choice
@grannyring I don't doubt the superiority of the helix designs. What I meant was more that some people's concerns about oxidization led us back to the tinning of copper wire to prevent that.
Myself and others have tried many variations of cabling and Vh Audio and Neotech will give you very good sounding cabling at a fraction of the cost of a mediocre commercial cable.
Have fun with the build and remember you can always tweak it to suit your system needs.
@williewonka Steve, thanks again. Have you or @wig or @grannyring compared the VH/Neotech OCC Copper vs the VH OCC Silver ? The 18awg is pricey at $40/ft and if one has to make a double run, it would be very expensive. Any comparison would be helpful.
@debjit_g - I believe @grannyring prefers the Silver VH Audio over the VH Audio copper.
I tried the silver on power cables for source components and preferred it over the VH Audio copper
But if you are planning to use a "naked" signal wire in teflon tube / cotton tube / silk tube then for me the VH Audio Copper is extremely good.
Otherwise I found the Neotech solid copper with Teflon to sound better than the VH Audio copper with AirLok insulation
But again, others preferred the sound of the VH Audio Solid copper.
You hear some of us extol the virtues of the various wires but there really is not a great deal of difference between them, Personal preference plays a part and different systems plays a part, but in the end they all sound extremely good.
There is a $limit to my "insanity" so I'd go for the copper and use the savings to fund the next cable :-)
Aside from the variable wire type selections, the sonic attributes of the Helix design concept in general enabled me to actually re-discover my "older" (80’s) CD recordings in a very analogue, musical way, big surprise🙄
I’m a huge Frank Marino/Mahogany Rush fan, my rock recordings in the past Never, Ever sounded anything near to what they do now.
Everything is well separated, quiet, with ambience, subtle ques, additional details and a relaxed, easeful presentation (better than the LP counterparts) which is saying a lot for Digital.
My wire order finally arrived, thanks to the Post Office speedy one month service.
I’m moving up the food chain and building another Helix PC for my CEC transport this weekend.
@rx8man - I just took a look at the CEC lineup and they are very nice units - which one do you have?
You should hear significantly more details with improved clarity, better dynamics and more spacious imaging.
But sometimes the amount of improvement depends on how good the power supply in the component is.
Having said that - my Bryston B135 integrated, that has three independent power supplies for preamp and L/R channels, surprised me by improving significantly across the board.
Also, Bryston is a company that is known for its quality power supplies, so you can never predict the outcome - you have to listen
Keep an ear out for what I call "venue acoustics" those little reverberations and echoes of the instruments.
On one recording I have of a classical quartet recorded in a small concert room, you can clearly hear a bus drive by in the background - something I had not heard before these cables
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