I suppose many of us are actively looking at downsizing options or will soon do so.
You have a fine system in place, and like all of us, you want your change to have as few compromises as possible.
You are lucky that your current speakers are relatively sensitive. This allows you more options that are likely to give you the satisfaction of your current system, or come very close.
The first option, mentioned by many, is to investigate a Mac SS integrated amp with an autoformer output stage. You will have the familiar Mac house sound, but loose a little of the lushness you probably enjoy from your tube based system.
2nd option would be Class A Luxman integrated amp. This will likely get you very close to the sound of your current system, and includes an excellent phono stage which may allow you to remove another box from your system.
3rd option may be an Accuphase integrated amp. I only know what I have read, but I think it would worth your time to investigate.
4th option would be a Tube Integrated amp; either a Leben 600 series or Aurorusound HFSA 1. BOTH would work well with your speakers, and provide the tube sound that you enjoy with your current system. However the system would not play as loud as you may be used to.
If it were me, I would choose either a Luxman or Leben integrated and be set for the next 10-20yrs.
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I too have downsized my system due to several factors including poor room setting and getting older and wanting something smaller. Due to the living room configuration, I am forced to be seated a mere 6’ from the speakers. My original system was a McIntosh MC252 amp and C2500 preamp, with Revel F208 speakers. The system had a lovely full-bodied sound to it, but I could not get the pieces to perform as they should in that open floor plan room. I traded the pieces in for a McIntosh MSA5500 integrated amp, Paradigm Founders 80 speakers, and picked up an Innuos Pulse streamer. The new system sounds pretty good, but not of the caliber of the old one, missing that tube sound. But I was aware of the trade off going in. I also wanted to have the dac in the amp capable of providing resolution up to DSD. While I was at it, I updated my old Linksys 1900 AC wireless router to a TP-Deco 6E Pro mesh system. This gives me the ability to plug in an ethernet cable to the Pulse since it doesn’t have wireless. Overall, I’m happy with the outcome. And while I was at it, I updated my power and USB cords. I hope this will be my last time rebuilding, but one never knows with this hobby!
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@pzero5 Not really. I was using Harbeth 40.3XDs which had a sensitivity of 85-86db if I remember correctly. My room is 18’x36’x8’ and they played as full and loud as I wanted. For shits and giggles I upgraded to an Accuphase C-2900 pre-amp and A-80 power amp, but it was overkill and I would have been absolutely content with the E-800. It is an amazing piece. And never underestimate the simplicity of a one box solution.
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@jastralfu
This is the official importer of McIntosh in my country, not just any dealer I could go around on.
I am an advocate of free trade, I resent protectionist policies which lead to monopolies, as such I am not spending one more Euro on said manufacturer.
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Sorry to hear you had such a rotten experience with your McIntosh dealer. I don’t think that’s the general experience but it was yours so I don’t blame you for wanting to look elsewhere.
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@glennewdick
I am sure you are right about the sound quality.
I am not spending one Euro on McIntosh again, due to the local distributor.
When a young nephew of mine broke the C2200 front glass fascia by mistake , the distributor would not fix it because I had bought it used from abroad instead from him.
He would not even sell me the parts.
I complained to McIntosh HQ in the USA, and they told me that I had to figure it all out with the local distributor.
I contacted McIntosh distributors in other European countries seeking help with the replacement part, and they refused to supply it due to the manufacturer’s policy not allowing them to sell into another distributor’s sales area.
A distributor outside Europe finally agreed to sell me the replacement part without letting McIntosh know.
It took me months to get my preamp fixed.
No more McIntosh for me, thank you.
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@lewl28
Good to hear that!
Do you find the relatively lower wattage of the Class A restricting your choice of speakers?
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I replaced my McIntosh C2700 and MC3500 MkIIs with an Accuphase E-800 integrated (with the AD-60 phono pre) and was extremely happy with the change.
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I think Luxman or Accuphase if you want to use well thought out treble or bass controls, as I understand it Luxman is a bit more neutral in its tonality and Accuphase a bit warmer.
Great hunting.
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I have the later C2700 tube preamp and used to have a MC275, I’ve recently moved to Mac SS mono SS amps. I found the SS amps to be better then the 275 in a couple areas, bass is much better, top end is just as smooth but a little more detailed in the SS amps. The midrange is close but probably the 275 is slightly a head, the sound stage actually better in the SS amps. I’ve also demoed one of the SS integrated amp and found it was just as satisfying as the separates. Especially if you get one with the autoformers. If your happy with your current set up I would highly recommend looking at one of macs SS integrated amps. I think it will give you most of what you already have and a bit more in the areas I mentioned. Potentially a Hybrid to keep some tubes in the preamp stage where they last for a very long time.
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I will second (or third) integrateds from Gryphon, Pass Labs but add Esoteric to the mix.
Good luck!
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OP
just my 02 cents for an integrated (SS)
1) if you got the budget, listen to Gryphon diablo 333 integrated
2) my second choice is the Pass Lab int-60 of if you need more, int-250
paired with the right speaker, they sound very good.
I think they run high bias class A and at higher powers switches into class ab
I heard the gryphon in a recent audio show a few months back and talk about control. although it was mated with Gryphon speakers, that synergy was so good, that I completely believe it was best of show
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@mattmiller
I am not selling my old gear, just sending it on a long sabbatical 😁
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@stereo5
A very close friend has an SS one, and also an Accuphase right next to it.
The Japanese perceived quality is stellar compared to the Mcintosh.
I am looking at the Mcintosh integrated models, but my experience with the local Mcintosh distributor has been pathetic and I don’t want to throw any more money their way.
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@dekay you are joking, but back in the early 80s this is exactly what we had on what we called stereo furniture in Greece!
When I discovered how they interfered with SQ I was baffled!
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Look into a McIntosh MA252 integrated. Solid state amp with built in tube preamp. If you like the Mac house sound, why not stay with the brand?
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You don't REPLACE a McIntosh C2200 and MC275 you acquire them! Dont even think about it. You will be disappointed at what it costs to get worse sound :-(
Matt M
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I have the latest McIntosh integrated = Ma12000...does everything well, most exceptional well. But you would not be downstaging...thing is huge, takes two people to move; more connectivity than you will ever use. On the analog side...the phone input is better than most separates...unless you spend as much on the phone stage as you did on the integrated. It will drive most speakers with ease. On the digital end...the DAC is good...and can be upgraded when newer DAC card comes out. Best of both worlds...tube preamp and s.s backend. Audio Excellence Canada did a great review:..https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUKz4gXJwKc
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I have a McIntosh SS amp and preamp and Decware Signature Monoblocks, matching CSP all upgraded to 25th Anniversary+ specs and a Mapletree tube phono stage. I listen to both depending on the music genre. Your McIntosh system is “Holy Grail” level. To second rivington66, I predict you may never be satisfied with an SS system. Your system has a signature “sound”. I do understand the desire to downsize (I’m U.S. Social Security age plus five). I’d miss the warmth and esthetics. However, that’s me.
As much as I love my Decware system, it sent me down the path of mods and a matching switch box, a matching “magic box” that actually allows midrange/bass adjustments, and a new Decware phono stage (still two years away, so that may change). They do make a few integrated amps (no phono stage); however, they have a myriad of different tubes to replace if necessary.
Another experience: A few years ago, I seriously considered a new turntable to replace my late 1970s Kenwood 500 (15kg) with Black Widow ToneArm (graphite) and Grado Sonata 3 cartridge. I asked for suggestions; one third of the replies were “Why?”. I had the wiring replaced with Cardas Litz and added new isolation feet. It sounds lovely. I spent the total turntable replacement cost on the phono stage and lots of albums.
Best wishes on whatever you decide. Enjoy the music.
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what about the Pathos Integrated Amps? Pathos InPol2 Mk II Tube Hybrid Integrated Amplifier?
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You have such a classic McIntosh system with a unique sound. You’re going to be heading into a very different wilderness and it can still be good, though I would prepare myself for the difference. (Not knowing your room size or the music you listen to) I would suggest checking out DecWare if you’re looking to streamline to an integrated with 93db speakers. They’re worth a look for sure and may be a great alternative to your current stunning setup. https://www.decwareproducts.com (Anyone on the waiting list for their products will blast for me for recommending them…lol.). Good Luck!
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Why do you need to reconnect cables after cleaning?
Just a thought…Perhaps invest in a plug-in hand-held air blower - I have one and it works great with very little effort.
Seems easier than changing systems especially as you like what you have now.
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Coda CSiB if you like the class A sound mixed with class A/B power. Maybe the McIntosh MA12000 with tube pre and SS amp since you already have McIntosh and like the sound.
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I’d look at Gryphon and Vitus that are both Class A and may give you a good bit of that tube fluidity and touch or warmth. Another idea would be a hybrid with a tube input stage and SS output like Unison Unico and Pathos. Best of luck.
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@soix
My budget is 15.000 Euros, no reason to extend all the way to that though…
I would prefer used.
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What’s your budget, and are you looking for new or used?
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I used to own a smaller Hegel integrated, never impressed me. At least with my setup back then.
I don’t wish to lose the functionalities I already have on my system, i.e. tone and balance controls, multiple balanced inputs , adjustable input levels etc.
That is why my first choice would be an Esoteric or Accuphase, vs the NAGRA
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Very happy with a Hegel h400 but no phono stage which is fine with me. It sounds sublime with Qobuz connect.
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The Audionet I don't know, but it's price is over my budget.
For DAC I am happy with my Aurender unit, it is staying together with my Luxman TT.
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What about one of the Mcintosh integrateds ? Especially if you are already satisfied with the brand.
2 amps that I tested in my current (Tube pre, class A/B amp) set up with 90 db sensitivity speakers where:
Hegel. (but not sure about phono stage in their integrateds)
Musical Fidelity M6 or M8 series.
They both out peformed my current setup and I surely will consider them when I uprade (also looking to Collapse).
And If you want to collapse even further consider getting an integrated that supports Tidal or Qobuz connect. Since I got my streaming setup dialed the TT is destined for the Time Capsule as well.
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If you are looking at Nagra and Burmester, you should look at the Audionet Humboldt. Probably the best integrated, but does not include a phono. It is LARGE. If you like your double tubed McIntosh sound, any of these SS integrateds will sound different.
For an awesome preamp with onboard phono and amazing DAC, consider a Mola Mola Makua and keep your tubed amp. Don't overlook the onboard DAC; you will end up using it!
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