The last interesting speaker thread was about vintage speakers and speaker technology advances, or as some thought the lack of them. Different impressions, different angles, different points of view. Most old guard members stopped posting here or appear very rarely. They have a lot to say but lost interest. |
Mikey nailed it best-if I am not mistaken in his review of the ARC Ref 6-that at the end of the day a good sound reproduction system either draws you in or pushes you away. I am of the belief that far too many electronics and speakers on the market today ultimately push you away. Not immediately-I say "ultimately" for a reason-it happens slowly over time. There is a very easy test-after six months of stasis-no change-are you listening or are you doing other things with your time spent sitting around? I said it earlier in this thread, but with speakers-like no other component-there must be a match with the room. So, you have to audition and if at all possible, audition in your own listening room. So to the point-is the speaker forum boring? Yep, it is. Why? Because most posts are about whatever speaker is hot on the forums or hot in recent reviews and are relatively affordable. The KEF LS50, the Tektons, and Harbeths seem to account for over 75% of the posts right now. Interestingly, each is quite different. The KEF is arguably a technological advance (even though KEF introduced it more than 10 years ago), the Tekton to my biased mind is just a new iteration of the much-raked-over Legacy line, and Harbeth represents the best of traditional British bespoke speaker design. There was a time when B&W was the hot speaker, and Acoustic Zen, and Legacy and before that Martin-Logan and SoundLab and if you go back far enough, Advent, KLH, and the Bose 901. And fast forward to today and to my mind there are too main camps of exotica at opposite extremes. One is what I call "space ship" with machined metal run berserk-drivers, enclosure, and chambers milled from solid billets of aluminum, titanium, berylium, and that elusive magical element, unobtanium, and the other well represented by the Burwell and Sons Mother of Burl semi-reviewed in the latest edition of Stereophile. Obviously, Magico and YG Acoustics seem to dominate the "space ship" camp at the moment. There's a guy who is very knowledgeable about turntable alignment and a regular on Audio Asylum who recently posted that he will not consider a loudspeaker for purchase unless it utilizes high-tech drivers and a curved enclosure. If I am not mistaken, despite his advanced engineering knowledge his idea of a great turntable is a vintage KAB modded Technics SL1200, not that there is anything wrong with that. The same guy insists on using el-cheapo cables as anything else is a waste of money. My point is that I think the folks that have insightful things to say about loudspeaker choice don't tend to post over and over again on audio boards. I guess it up to us to bring up little known or less-talked about speakers that are interesting. The fact that any such speaker is probably satisfying for reasons that are unique to room and taste makes such posts relatively uncommon. |
One should not judge other people " fi " whether or not you think it is " high " or " mid " . How often have you heard someones system and think it is terrific only to have them tell you they are going to purchase new speakers. It sometimes goes the other direction, they love their system and you leave thinking you could best it for a K. |
I am sure I could try so many fine speakers. This is a general topic thread. And yes, one of the traits of fine speakers is that they are not boring. To be a little poetic - speakers must have 'soul' not just particular sound signature. They are not only devices, they are 'instruments' designed to reproduce the sound of all other instruments. This is a monumental task to accoplish. Building fine amp or turntable etc. looks like elementary school project compared to this. |
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OI5Gqx8jE4 3:34 in they play them and I can tell by listening to them thru my Klipsch 2.1 Promedia speakers that they are the best ever..or at least as good as my Tektons |
Have Tektons,luv em,BUT if I had the coin[come on Lottery lol] I read about a speaker awhile back that I would absolutely buy.
Bang & Olufsen BeoLab 90 ..8200 watts,comes with DACs,Power Amps and controls,has 18 drivers,Adjusts for any room and has off axis listening that makes it almost a 360 degree speaker.They weigh 300lbs each and Costs only $90,000 a pair.Plus they look really kool.Nope,I have never heard them. |
Here's what you do. Try a component and if it's not so good, sell it and try something else. Read reviews with a grain of salt, try to distinguish between blowhard or delusional posters who are adamant about some minor tweak with imagined benefits and those with actual practical knowledge not tied to mysticism, remember you're part of a tiny minority of active listeners among people who have no idea what a vacuum tube is, and never ride bicycles as they're dangerous…wear a helmet while riding a motorcycle instead, like me. It's faster and more fun. Please get back to me when you've done these things, and get off the couch and see some live music. |
Just curious, why do you think Klipsch is so HARSHLY criticized on most forums. I've had 2 sets of speakers from Klipsch always happy with them. I've soften them some but still like vocals to be dominate, but acoustic guitars sound great. Sure wish I could hear their Pladium series but don't know of any places that carry them? Can't wait to see the RP 7 111s, anybody know when for sale to the public? This, happy sound |
I think this thread is making a good turn - despite many hobbies and interests - there is not much that beats riding your bicycle... https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=olDLxq6quOw The video was shot just a few blocks from my old home |
Corelli, As I said, absolutely no disrespect. And I am by no means, telling anyone to "Get a life." Just was wondering how much could actually be talked about regarding a single product. That's great that you have plenty of time for other things! I would guess the others probably feel the same. I merely asked as being inquisitive. By the way, I put over 2000 miles on my motorcycle in one month, and that was short trips... ;) Cheers, Tim |
mr m Love my DI's. Have ridden my bike 2100 miles so far this summer. Working on landscaping all this summer. Have kept fish for 50 years. Have two other hobbies. You should see my orchids. Several other guys on the DI thread with similar backgrounds. Did I mention I work full time? No, we don't need to "get a life". We have one. |
I believe, as one poster responded, that this particular thread was probably aimed at Tekton. I can understand the enthusiasm to a point about these speakers but really, the posts have added up to just about 2800 and that is in only 6 months! No disrespect to these guys, but don't they have some sort of life outside their hobby and these speakers??? Like, ride a bike or motorcycle, read a book, time with a wife (if they have one.) a job??? Just wondering...... |
Just because you didn’t like something that somebody gave a review on and liked it doesn’t mean the equipment is bad. What you are expecting a system to sound like is going to be different from other people and every system is different starting with equipment to room acoustics.Couldn’t agree more. This hobby is a tough one to crack-most of us rely on reviews and buy blindly. Speakers are more "polluted" by overt marketing than any other component. Speaker manufacturers, in order to survive, resort to exotic materials or configurations that will grab consumers who shop with their eyeballs. At the end of the day there are three practical and not-so-practical solutions; establish a relationship with a reputable dealer, travel as necessary to demo the gear in a similarly sized room with similar ancillary gear, or be prepared to buy and sell many speakers (or other component) until you find the bowl of porridge that is just right. On that last method-over at "amps/preamps" there is a thread started by "Whitecamaross" in which he went through 50 or so power amps (!) at an expense of over $500,000 according to his report! I think the current speaker threads are boring too-primarily because too many people chase after the speakers that get talked about the most, substituting group-think for their own personal taste. I also imagine that this forum, unlike the "whatsbest" forum, is a better reflection of the economy and consumer confidence. When 95% of the posts are about speakers under $2,000, I think consumer confidence is not very high. And lastly, A-gon does have it’s own demographic of regular posters and it’s just a mystery how these things vary from board to board. |
@erik_squires "What makes me passionate about hating equipment is when a reviewer loves it and I hear it and go WTH?? That sucks. Not necessarily the price point. The opposite is also true. When really good gear gets trashed in the press I can be pretty angry about it. " Just because you didn't like something that somebody gave a review on and liked it doesn't mean the equipment is bad. What you are expecting a system to sound like is going to be different from other people and every system is different starting with equipment to room acoustics. |
Inna Yes, Focal belongs on the list, as does Von Schweikert, Martin Logan, Vandersteen and plenty of others: household names (among audiophiles!) that sell uber-expensive models meant to be regarded as "statement" products. Significantly, the lower priced models in the these manufacturers' lines are often pretty good values. "Giant-killer," I think, refers to the children's story "Jack and the Beanstalk". Though plenty of fairy tales have a dark and violent subtext, I don't think this term is offensive when used as it is in this discussion, to indicate an "underdog" that's performing well against formidable opponents. Andrew |
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I like this forum even though I'm a playwright in a small country so, poor as they come. Nevertheless there's a wealth of knowledge here that you don't get on other forums once you know who to listen to. Almarg, for instance: I've learnt tons off that guy. When I first got into this lunacy about ten years ago I realised how on to it Al was and read everything that he'd posted. Schubert, Mapman, and Atmasphere (among others) have also helped a great deal. Thanks to their knowledge, and despite my relative poverty, I've been able to put together a vintage system (for next to nothing, maybe $2,000) that in the late eighties would have cost me the inflation-adjusted sum of $10,000+. It sounds fantastic, and I couldn't be happier, despite having OCD. My lack of money has actually helped in this: You have to read broadly and understand how music reproduction works before you make your decisions, rather than plonking down tons of money, endlessly changing components and getting frustrated because you missed the chapter on speaker-room interface and treatments. I have no problem with people discussing $50,000 speakers but I think this forum is (and hopefully continues to be) much more than that. |
I'll make what I guess is an obvious point. If you're going to have "giant-killers," you've got to have giants. We should be grateful for the Wilsons, Magicos, YGs, MBLs, and Rockports of the world, companies that have cultivated a customer base (well-heeled, and willing to spend large sums for all the right reasons and sometimes the wrong ones) that can support their efforts to develop the best loudspeakers they can—even if a great deal of expensive engineering/manufacturing is applied to deriving only a small incremental improvement. I've spent a fair amount of time with some of the designers of these speakers. They don't build pricy products to cynically gouge rich people. They build them because they're driven to fulfill an engineering concept, whatever it takes. That said, I (and many of my fellow audio writers, a despised bunch on many forums like this) truly love nothing better than a relatively low-priced product that achieves 95% (or 100%!) of what the famous expensive brands achieve. I don't think it's necessary to bitterly dismiss stuff that non-oligarchs can't afford just because it's not a good value for most of us—reviewers included. Andrew Quint TAS |
