Why do no audio enthusiasts use McIntosh?

Damn seeing this made me realize how much I miss Tireguy :( Tim was/is a super cool dude.

Swl love Macs and it has nothing to do with the blue meters.

For many years I had one NAD setup after another, eventually their "Masters Series" components, really enjoyed their sound.  Many years ago I worked at some high end dealers who sold McIntosh, but never "lusted" over the equipment.

About a year ago I decided to see if I could find some speakers I liked better than the monitors I was using and as I auditioned one pair after another I was struck by how easy it was to listen to speakers powered by the McIntosh C50 pre-amp and MC452 power amp.  To me they just didn't seem to have their "own sound", and had not a trace of edginess (which was a good thing, having finally selected a pair of speakers with quite "capable" tweeters).

I know that, in some circles, McIntosh is a dirty word.  The great thing about our hobby is how there are so many products to enjoy.  I just happen to enjoy my solid state equipment from Binghamton.

On third set of amp(s) and preamp combo in 19 years. Only once anything needed service and it was done quickly.  In 25 years there will be a network and the parts needed for service.   Love em or hate em, the newer gen amps and preamps are neutral enough if that if it's not exactly your flavor it can be changed with ancillary components and cabling. 

Listening? Come on man...No…it's the blue meters. If more amps had blue meters the world would be a better place.

Not to say there aren't a lot of people who by McIntosh equipment for the blue meters/snob appeal. There are .But there are many who love the sound of the music played through McIntosh equipment. I have a pair of MC 60s. The tone and organic quality of the music I listen to is the reason I like the MC 60s. 
I think the reason many hold on to their vintage McIntosh is they don't get tired of listening to it. What's wrong with that? 

They are too busy enjoying their music and how cool their stuff looks. 👀

Because they know better.

Twb2, I wonder where that guy gets his money. I doubt he made that kind of money selling audio gear. And yes, they will ban you in a New York minute.

Bsimpson, you're talking about equipment that is at, or near 50 years old.

What would anybody expect from such? Who was around back then to compare, Levinson, Krell, ARC, Pass Labs, Accuphase, Burmester, etc etc.

It's like you are saying, I onwed a 40 year old Sansui 7 Reciever, and was not impressed with it driving my Wilson Grand Slamms.

Lot's of snobbsh "esoteric" BS being pedalled around here for over 12 straight years.

Go audition an MC-452, or a pair of MC-601's, MC-2301's then tell us what you think?

I keep coming back to this thread like getting stuck on a bad movie. I have been a longtime content owner of 501 monoblocks.

It is peculiar that some of the most vocal do not bother posting their systems on here for those who could learn more about their journey, matching components, cables, etc...especially us Mcintosh non enthusiast audio lovers.

Pictures tell a story, when you depend on prose, especially in an anonymous public forum it can be challenging weeding through the BS.

I am an audio enthusiast and use Mcintosh...I am not sure what percentage of audiophiles statistically speaking falls into the "don't like camp"; however, there are a substantial amount of people, including myself, that just happen to like the sound. Having gone through Mark Levinson, Krell, Bryston, and Octave, the current MC2301's amps are a keeper.

All I can say is that other people's opinions, impressions, or thoughts are not detractors to my own listening pleasure. I research, listen, and carefully tune all of my rooms to allow for optimal listening, no matter what the equipment. I guess I am not as fussy as other people and would rather listen to music instead of lambast other people's equipment.

Slmn3r, I worked at a large Mac dealer in Chicago.
Most of the sales were to doctors who really cared little about music and a lot about status symbols.

If this is true then Mcintosh wouldn't be in business. Their MSRP obviously only get support from audio enthusiasts. Just like a gun enthusiast that is willing to pay for 5k custom race gun. Non enthusias will be happy with a $400 Taurus revolver.

I cannot a agree more with Ebm's comment. I had owned the vintage MC30 monos, MC225, MC240, MC250, MC275, MA230, MC2105, and the modern MC2275. I kept getting suckered to buy McIntosh because of the look and 'pride of ownership'.

But my ears keep telling my head: Dump that thing now! Can't listen to music with that whisper in my head. The Mcs usually last no more than 2 months in my room.

Because it looks cool does not sound cool though!!

"But the guys on Audio Afcionardo can be snobby at times."

So true. When you own $1M audio systems, 3 homes in different parts of the country, a Ferrari, Porsche's, Rolex's, and drink only $350 Scotch, you tend to get a little snobby. It's $25/year to be a member, $100+ to have a higher status membership, and very easy to get banned.

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The original post was just stupid to begin with. How could anyone assume to know that no audio enthusiasts like??

McIntosh has gotten along rather nicely as a business over the years....critics be damned.
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But the guys on Audio Afcionardo can be snobby at times.

Check out AudioAficinado.org. Plenty of Mac fanboys there!

This enthusiast uses Mc gear and loves it.

I wonder why Mac equipment has to endure this type of question year after year. This thread is 13 years old and so for at least 13 years the question has been out there "Why do no audio enthusiasts use Mcintosh". Look at how the OP even asked the question to start the thread. The question itself assumes as a fact or as a truth that no "real audiophiles" would even consider Mac equip. New users and even experienced users who have never heard Mac gear, after reading this type of question (it's hardly been the first time this sort of question has been asked on these boards) year after year, assume that it is a true statement and start to have a bias against the gear and yet they have never even heard it in a properly set up room. I have been in this hobby for almost 40 years now and have seen the latest and greatest of the moment be the equipment you can't even give away some years later.

I own Mac amps (MC501, MC252, MC202) that I use in one of my systems along with a Mac preamp (C2200). It is just simply musical to me. In another system I have a MasterSound Reference 845 amp, which I love, but also which is as different to Mac gear as anything else. Is one better than the other? No, not necessarily. They both sound great to me in their respective setups. Over these years I have owned Audio Research, Conrad Johnson, Mark Levinson, Classe, Sonic Frontiers and a lot of others I don't recall right now. Each has had their own perceived strengths and weaknesses. But none of these other manufacturers has had to continually answer the question, year after year, whether they are "audiophile enough" to be respected.

I bought a McIntosh MC275 MK6 and it was awesome. I thought there won't be too much of a good thing and bought a McIntosh MC2500 tube preamplifier and it sucked. The phono stage is horrible. The line stage is OK. Midrange is weak. The built-in headphones amplifier is great! But it's a very expensive headphone amp, so I got rid of it. Waiting for an Audio Research reference tube pre. We'll see. Everyone's happy with their Audio Research tube gear. But I'm keeping the MC275 with a plan to upgrade to Genalex tubes though. If that doesn't help, the MC275 is a goner.

Macs were great back in the old days of the 275 and such. But then they started puting output transformers on transistor amps, crazy, and lost many (and me) who thought they knew what they were doing.
Maybe the number cruchers moved in when this happened and thought they could get the best of both worlds tube sound and SS sales, little did they know. They lost the hard core and hung onto those who don't know better and just love the looks of the stuff.

Must admit it does look pretty.

http://freshairphoto.com/portfolio/wp-content/uploads/soundroom.jpg

Cheers George

The simple answer to this post, if there is one, is that McIntosh equipment is a good hedge against inflation. Check out the Audiogon listings and count how many McIntosh pieces are selling at, near, or even more than new. The bonus is that for the many decades that you use it, it sounds really good. I am referring to their amps and preamps, as I feel that their digital players leave something to be desired in the area of reliability. Also, the blue meters really are a nice touch! Sorry, Mac haters, but that's just my opinion.

Audioquest4life, how does your Octave Jubilee preamp and McIntosh 2301 combo sound compared to the Jubilee preamp and Jubilee mono's combo that you heard in Germany?

Thanks!

In general it does seem many systems using mcintosh are all or nothing as in all mcintosh made components. I have heard them and they sound good.

Hey I just saw that show "Elementary" and Sherlock Holmes even has an all Mcintosh system even the turntable!

The so-called audio enthusiasts or audiophiles are those engineer want-to-be. They listen to systems that they piece together and not the music. Mcintosh sold a lot more high end equipment than any other manufacturer in the world for 60 years (Please correct me if I am wrong).
You also stated " the only people who like it, are those who sell it... an uncanny coincidence?"
People who love the sound of Mc, don't have to brag about their McIntosh system or the sound of their Ferrari. They know what they want to hear and just enjoying it.

"honestly never had the pleasure to listen to McIntosh. I would like to. Mc2301 @ 300 watts! I am currently listening to a pair of mono's @ 3 watts total."

Often times the virtue is listening to the music of the forest and not paying so much individual attention to the trees. Seems you've found that place Isochronism, Cheers!

Yes Onemug, I do recall through your postings of your general setup. You gave me confidence that I may attain success with my plans, as well.
Tho, I will have to wait until I move from my SMALL apartment to realize those.
Keep on enjoying :)

Small world sometimes.

I am bi-amping a pair custom 2 ways with an active x/o. I use a 300b SET on the mid/woofer and a 2a3 SET for the tweeter. It's the best sound I have been able to re-create in my room.

FWIW: A Wavelength Duetto was the first SET I ever heard. It's what sold me on SETs to begin with.

Wavelength 45's. Have Wavelength 300B's also. Some day I plan to bi-amp with my pair of JBL 4550's with original HF drivers on grey fiber horns.

Isochronism,

You have heard the light. :-)

45's.....2a3's.....or ????

This thread has been going for over eleven years.
I honestly never had the pleasure to listen to McIntosh. I would like to.
Mc2301 @ 300 watts! I am currently listening to a pair of mono's @ 3 watts total.
How's that Onemug? :)

"Enjoy what you own for right now. If you stay in this hobby long enough, you will roll through many pieces of audio equipment, sometimes as much as people roll tubes or swap out cables. The amps I replaced lasted 7 years before the swap to the macs. Some equipment I even thought was my last purchase, hmmm, should I say that about the new MC2301? "

Prophetic.

My crystal ball sees a SET amp in your not so near future. :-)

"Buy what YOU like and quite worrying about what others think. After all, you should be buying for your satisfaction, not to impress others. Who cares what others think about your system."

Great post! Currently, enjoying a brand new pair of MC2301's. Very enjoyable and effortless power driving a pair of B&W N800's.

Based on my experiences over the years, I believe the Mc's sound is in the same league as other well respected manufacturers, obviously, with their own sound, which is either appealing or not so appealing to others. Having owned other flavors of SS and tube amps over the years from pioneer, carver, adcom, mark levinson, soundscraftsman, Bryston, Octave, Crown, and Rotel, the macs certainly sound excellent to these ears.

Enjoy what you own for right now. If you stay in this hobby long enough, you will roll through many pieces of audio equipment, sometimes as much as people roll tubes or swap out cables. The amps I replaced lasted 7 years before the swap to the macs. Some equipment I even thought was my last purchase, hmmm, should I say that about the new MC2301?

Buy what YOU like and quite worrying about what others think. After all, you should be buying for your satisfaction, not to impress others. Who cares what others think about your system.

My McIntosh MC252 is unquestionably a better sounding unit than the NAD S200 Silverline series it replaced.

Is this question even serious? There is a world out there beyond Audiogon, believe or not. Through the years I met dozens of people who had great systems with McIntosh SS gear. Especially the newer generation 252, 352 and many still love their Mc500 stereo amp. They sound great, and I have heard them with many different types of speakers.

There are obviously many people buying the McIntosh gear sold here and elsewhere. McIntosh owners, especially the older ones do hang on for longer periods of time to their gear and dont keep looking for the next wonder gear down the pike.

I am not currently a McIntosh owner besides my trusty MCD-7009 CDP.

I am not so sure that is still true, certainly wont be for surround gear, thats no more immune to being worth a paper weight than any other offering.

You dont really own McIntosh but just watch it for future generations. It sounds good. Looks good. And holds its value

Wow

And the saga continues over the years. I was one who came up believing that Mac gear was just a pioneer of its day and that with CJ, Krell, Rolland, Threshold, et al anyone who bought Mac just did not know what "real" high end was. I have had them all and recently picked up an old Threshold S500 that I had Jon Soderber tweek out to the max hoping it would bring me back to when I owened an Sa4e that was probably my favorite amp of all time driving my B&W 801's UNTIL now. I picked up some B&W 802 N and the Threshold just did not let the speakers shine. I read on the blogs that a lot of people seemed to like the Mac power amps with them so I bought on a whim a like new MC 402 stereo amp. Wow, I could not believe how unbelievable it sounded. I was using a CJ Preimier 17 pre-amp and tried a friends SS MF 308CR that believe it or not bettered the CJ so I bought one. Now I had a chance to get a C2200 Mac tube pre for a great deal and it should be coming this week. I do not know what to expect but sure hope it will be as good as or better than my MF as I would love to have the matching set. It really is all about the sound but I do like the looks too especially when the lights are out. SOOOOO I must confess I am no longer a snob and realize this new Mac gear, (at least my amp) is killer. Now I will have to get advice on tube rolling but then again what sounds right for you may not be right for me.

10-14-11: Hakuchosan
i think that MC is like a Rolex in watch world - if you wear one, most of the people will recognize it as a expansive and best watch... i do have one and few other brands (Patek, Zenith, blancpain..) - i stopped wearing rolex - too many people made comments about it.. i do wear other ones and quite offten people comment on the other ones.... they suggest to me to buy rolex - " now this is a good watch, the best".... yes, i just nod my head.

Rolex with its history for making the first diving watch and the date complication, I think it would be just a natural response for most people to recognize it as an icon in the horological sense. Rolex watches are still affordable compared to Patek's astronomical pricing. Whatever it is I don't blame people who thinks they are the best. Perhaps best for value? iconic design? Usability? Fashion? Personally, I prefer JLC.

Macs has its own history too, you're right... an iconic brand as well. They are really good with some speakers, B&W, Totems, Paradigms....IME., Try it if it matches your system and let us know.

i dont have any MC components yet - looking for something good , so i can cmpare to Accuphase (have quite a few - seperates and integraded)...
but after reading this thread - i think that MC is like a Rolex in watch world - if you wear one, most of the people will recognize it as a expansive and best watch... i do have one and few other brands (Patek, Zenith, blancpain..) - i stopped wearing rolex - too many people made comments about it.. i do wear other ones and quite offten people comment on the other ones.... they suggest to me to buy rolex - " now this is a good watch, the best".... yes, i just nod my head.
that is why i want to try MC - just to see if it is what people say about it.
but if someone wants to show to people the money - buy a rolex, 90% will recognize the mark and price right a way....
maybe it is true with MC too..., will test once i get it.

What is an "audio enthusiast"? If you mean people who love listening to recorded music, then I suspect that many people with iPods and earbuds better meet the criteria, while many people who churn through audio equipment are not. I suspect the latter group actually exhibits some form of OCD, not "audio enthusiasm". The evidence is the number of people trying to sell mega-buck components because they need money. Makes me wonder what delusion they were under when they bought the component in the first place.

In any case, I used to own a Mac MC275 and upgraded to a VAC Phi 200, at more than double the price. The VAC is a better amp. However, it in no way embarrasses the MC275.

Since I was a wee little nipper ther was always music. A suitcase record player at 5, small tape player at 7, a boom box with detachable speakers at 11, hand me down 70's system from an uncle at 13, the family Harmon Kardon with Pioneer speakers at 14-15, then at 19 I got the "itis". Am now on my 3rd big system 2nd of which is Mc. 13 years ago I tried the others and preferred the Mc. Presently finishing up my curent rig and still prefer the Mc. I can't imagine not giving Mc a listen.

Owning a McIntosh integrated amp for a little over a year now, and loving it more each day. I have desired a Mc based system for nearly three decades. When finally deciding to purchase compared various brands some costing much more and some of course less. Definitely an audio enthusiast and have found that Mc gear hits the mark in many areas of satisfaction. This is a hobby where one picks their poison, too overlook McIntosh is to perhaps miss out on a truly wonderful world of reproduced music.

My brother just acquired the MC252 for his maggies, an up grade from Sunfire signature amp. The improvement is jaw dropping!!

Many do and most are probably content and have no desire to explore other horizons.

Since my last post on this thread (many moons ago) I added to my McIntosh experience by replacing my MBL 6010D preamp with the CT 1000. I thought that was a "ballsy" move on my part as the MBL continues to gain acceptance as a world class preamp - and rightly so. This is not about a comparison between the two but, after repalcing the stock tubes with Gold Lions the McIntosh clearly qualifies as world class that can hold its own with anything out there.

Now to the "house sound". As I listen to my amps there is no reason to support the notion that Mac gear is "warm" or "fuzzy" or lacking in detail. As a long time audiophile always looking for "the next best thing" Mac gear delivers consistency, product support, great sound and reliability. What is not to like? Oh, BTW it reminds me of a similar thread to this on this forum regarding Musical Fidelity gear. I have that stuff, have had it for over 20 years and the same applies .....

Having a reliable company around supplying world class gear to support our hobby should not be sneezed at. If it doesn't float your boat sound wise, that is fine, but let's support the venerable manufacturers such as Mac, such as ARC, such as MF, and so on that provide quality products, well branded, well supported and even if they segment their customer base to include main street consumers we should applaud their resilience to survive and prosper.