Synergistic Red Fuse ...

Cleaning the fuse holder and fuse ends is a great idea. No doubt. Remember however,  no matter how well you clean a lower quality fuse it will never sound as good a a top quality fuse. You can clean that Radio Shack wire and connector for hours, but it still won't sound as good as Duelund wire with Furutech connectors. This is a great thread and in the end we will all learn more. 

Frankmlsstl656 posts03-14-2017 3:21amin the spirit of this thread, I thought I should warn people to NOT mark directionality on their fuses. The ink or sticker could confuse the electrons, drawing them off-center. The same is true of handling fuses with your bare fingers -- deposited oils from the skin could cause the same problems!jetter305 posts03-14-2017 3:49amIts also important to have the fuse installed by a virgin with no impure thoughts.

+1 To all.

"The fuse element must not be damaged by minor harmless surges of current, and must not oxidise or change its behaviour after possibly years of service."

On a serious note, what these guys are hearing is an old fuse changed for a new one as this fuse manufacturer stated, and you don’t have to spend $100, just get another new 10 cent one, and a good idea to clean the fuse clamps.

Cheers George

No I am not kidding. I do not want equipment that magnifies minute variations in the power supplied to the amplifier power supply which is supposed to filter and protect amplifier circuits from power variations. Why would I want to hear differences in fuses or the small effects of my neighbour down the street when they turn on an appliance and the small effect it has on the power my home receives. It makes no sense to build audio gear that magnifies such things - if you hear such things then either the equipment is faulty or the design of the power supply is atrocious.

Its also important to have the fuse installed by a virgin with no impure thoughts.

in the spirit of this thread, I thought I should warn people to NOT mark directionality on their fuses. The ink or sticker could confuse the electrons, drawing them off-center. The same is true of handling fuses with your bare fingers -- deposited oils from the skin could cause the same problems!

Shadrone sez:

"If a mere fuse makes a huge difference in sound then that should tell you the condition of your equipment is piss poor."

What??!! Are you kidding? Yes, you must be. The higher the resolution afforded by the electronics to begin with, the more the improvement made by the upgraded fuses will be evident. Just the opposite of your claim. 

Frank

shadorne   3/13/17

"  If a mere fuse makes a huge difference in sound then that should tell you the condition of your equipment is piss poor. 

The power supply is supposed to be designed to entirely isolate the interference of slight differences in power input from the audio signal. If a mere fuse makes a difference then pretty much anything will make your setup sound different. A system that can't handle such minute differences will never sound the same from minute to minute, day to day. Power is varying ALL the time - a fact of life given that stuff in your house and street go on and off all day long.

I would immediately get rid of any equipment that was so unstable and inaccurate that minute differences in power input have large effects on what I hear.

Surely it is self evident that we are trying to listen to the source music with the least interference or coloration from extraneous factors and it makes sense to buy equipment that achieves this"

THIS IS THE MOST UNINFORMED POST I HAVE SEEN ON AUDIOGON.  THIS IS ILLITERACY IN ITS MOST RAMPANT FORM. 
It is very disturbing to observe that is guy has made more than 5000 posts on Audiogon. VERY SAD.

Shadorne wrote,

"The power supply is supposed to be designed to entirely isolate the interference of slight differences in power input from the audio signal. If a mere fuse makes a difference then pretty much anything will make your setup sound different. A system that can’t handle such minute differences will never sound the same from minute to minute, day to day. Power is varying ALL the time - a fact of life given that stuff in your house and street go on and off all day long."

Whoa! What?! Hey, that’s the best Strawman argument I’ve seen all month. No one ever said aftermarket fuses sound better than stock fuses because they better handle varying differences in power input. Where did you ever come up with that? I hate to judge before all the facts are in but this is probably just a case of over-thinking. ALL fuses exhibit slight variation in power one direction to the other. They're ALL directional. Besides how would you explain that aftermarket fuses work in high end electronics as well as Mid Fi electronics? Surely high end power supplies are designed properly, no?

If a mere fuse makes a huge difference in sound then that should tell you the condition of your equipment is piss poor.

The power supply is supposed to be designed to entirely isolate the interference of slight differences in power input from the audio signal. If a mere fuse makes a difference then pretty much anything will make your setup sound different. A system that can't handle such minute differences will never sound the same from minute to minute, day to day. Power is varying ALL the time - a fact of life given that stuff in your house and street go on and off all day long.

I would immediately get rid of any equipment that was so unstable and inaccurate that minute differences in power input have large effects on what I hear.

Surely it is self evident that we are trying to listen to the source music with the least interference or coloration from extraneous factors and it makes sense to buy equipment that achieves this. 

Georgehifi

"Spelling correction just for you Geoff

A fuse can age with inrush currents ect, I believe the fuse mongers are prying on that."

George, thanks for the correction. That's makes a lot more sense. 🙄

uberwaltz wrote,

"It appears there are a few persistent offenders who skip from the same type of deeply personal point of view thread to another trotting out the same old trite as if constant repetition will make believers out of everybody!"

Pretty sure the word you’re looking for is tripe. 

😬

plutos ...

I changes the fuses one at a time just to be able to grade the improvement each one made. I started out with the amp thinking that it would affect the signal from everything that came before it. Second fuse went into the preamp ... third the phono stage. The CD player was last and took two rail fuses. Surprisingly, the Black fuses in the CD player was the biggest bang for the buck. After changing the fuses in the CD player, I remember commenting in this forum that I had no idea that red book CD
could sound so good. It continues to amaze. What was once a really good sounding CD player used mainly for convenience purposes has become my major listening source. Not that I don't like my vinyl rig better .... but digital in my system now is so close to sounding analog, its a joy to listen to. And then there's that remote control thingie ... :-)

Frank

Obviously anyone 'touting' theses Synergistic Red Quantum (or black) fuses has never taken a look at all the wiring 'after the fuse' - within the device. If they did they'd see all sorts of wire connecting various items. No reputable manufactures I'm aware of,promote their products for the "directionality of the wiring".. That moots the point about the "value" of the fuse directionality. So I remain aligned with the Healthy Skeptic-wolf_garcia - when he says
" the promotion of a nonsensical, inexplicable, expensive and utterly useless fuse "upgrade" will garner my ire as long as this thread continues".
Others have had similar comments; thanks to common sense.

"The fuse element is made of zinc, copper, silver, aluminium, or alloys to provide stable and predictable characteristics. The fuse ideally would carry its rated current indefinitely, and melt quickly on a small excess. The element must not be damaged by minor harmless surges of current, and must not oxidise or change its behaviour after possibly years of service."

Spelling correction just for you Geoff

Re-read that last sentence: 
A fuse can age with inrush currents ect, I believe the fuse mongers are prying on that.

Just change your old fuse for the same 10c new one, instead of paying >$100 for a voodoo fuse, that can be a danger if overrated .

Cheers George

Charles yes I do have a Black fuse installed in my preamp I mention it about 30 pages or  so back in this long thread lol. It was around a time I made a lot of quick changes to my system so I can't say any specific improvements from the fuse but my system started sounding better all around. A cumulative effect perhaps?

I came to the conclusion a VERY long time ago that in threads like this there can be no "winner"
I have found a lot of very good information here and a lot of sensible posts and answers
However as in most walks of life there will always be the doom and nay sayers, trolls and downright argumentative mentalities that tend to ruin the good intent of these forums for everybody.
It appears there are a few persistent offenders who skip from the same type of deeply personal point of view thread to another trotting out the same old trite as if constant repetition will make believers out of everybody!
And please...do not make the mistake of equating my low post count with a low IQ count......

Jond,
I notice we seem to agree with each other often on these forums .
Here we go once again 😊 As with you I have no problem with the anti upgrade fuse brigade. All opinions and experiences should be presented. At the end of the day it’s audio which means that you listen and make  a determination. Jond I’m not sure if you have tried the Black fuses or not. They are terrific in my system but don’the know how they may workout for you. Common sense dictates that not everyone will find them beneficial.
Charles

georgehifi

Someone wrote: "The fuse element is made of zinc, copper, silver, aluminium, or alloys to provide stable and predictable characteristics. The fuse ideally would carry its rated current indefinitely, and melt quickly on a small excess. The element must not be damaged by minor harmless surges of current, and must not oxidise or change its behaviour after possibly years of service."

to which George responded,

'Re-read that last sentence:
A fuse can age with inrush currents ect, I believe the fuse mongers are praying on that.

Nice Freudian slip. Let us pray.

Then George wrote,

Just change your old fuse for the same 10c new one, instead of paying >$100 for a voodoo fuse, that can be a danger if overrated .

Not bad advice but you forgot to mention trying the fuse both ways to see way sounds better.

"The fuse element is made of zinc, copper, silver, aluminium, or alloys to provide stable and predictable characteristics. The fuse ideally would carry its rated current indefinitely, and melt quickly on a small excess. The element must not be damaged by minor harmless surges of current, and must not oxidise or change its behaviour after possibly years of service."

Re-read that last sentence:
A fuse can age with inrush currents ect, I believe the fuse mongers are praying on that.

Just change your old fuse for the same 10c new one, instead of paying >$100 for a voodoo fuse, that can be a danger if overrated .

Cheers George

Thanks Jond!

Frank,

Thanks!
I`m in Europe so shipping and customs are bit too much for a fuse.
May I ask what fuses you suggest to change first? Amp, preamp or digital player?
Can you please explain briefly the theory behind the aftermarket fuses and their benefits?

Thanks in advance and Happy listening!

@uberwaltz fantastic post thank you! @plutos skepticism is always healthy when paired with an open mind so kudos to you! @wolf_garcia why do you keep picking on OregonPapa don't you actually work for Jolida?  Ok now wolf you know I am teasing you and generally speaking dude just relax a bit it's just a fuse. Perhaps go after the $5K record weight folks or someone else for a while? :-) Seriously though thanks for the entertaining banter guys it's why I keep coming back to this thread. Peace out.

plutos >>>

Why not give the SR Black fuses a try? They have a 30 day money back guarantee if you don't like them. In the event you don't like the fuses, or find them ineffective, you'll just be out a few bucks for shipping. After you do that, then I'd love to see an unbiased evaluation from you. 

Wolf >>>

So happy to see that you are "softening" on your viewpoint on my "employment" with SR.  Does this mean that your insults and personal attacks will finally end??

And again Wolfie ... most of us don't care HOW the fuses work, only that they do. Geeze, if I had to analyse everything to death like you do, I'd never get anything done. How do you ever arrive at a conclusion or make a logical decision? You remind me of the engineer I sold a home to years ago. He wanted to know how thick the drywall was. What???  I told him I'd try to get the owner's permission for him to drill a hole through the drywall so he could measure, but he would be responsible to return everything to its original state.  He never drilled the hole. Wolfie ... life is WAY too short, and you can take that to the bank. :-)

On posting your favorite music choices ... If you don't want to post them here just to further interest in this thread, then how about providing some links to threads where you have posted them? A lot can be revealed about "audiophiles" just by the music they listen to. Have you ever followed up on some of the suggested music reviews in Stereophile or TAS? I download them from Spotify just to see what the reviewers are listening to. Most of the time I just shake my head wondering how they can make an accurate assessment of any equipment they review by listening through electronic trash or recordings that are drenched in artificial digital reverb. This includes even some the most well thought of reviewers too. 

Frank

wolf-garcia,

Making a multiple accounts here is a piece of cake. So we newer know who is a dealer, promoter or a satisfied customer. 

I`m actually also in your boat. I don`t buy that fuse + many other tweaks theory.
But again.... I have never tried the damn fuse, so I can`t comment or take sides here.
I believe in science and this fuse upgrade has nothing to do with it as far I know. Prove me if I`m wrong.
I believe that we can`t underestimate our psychology, conceived preconception and pre-biased expectations.
I also believe that if someone feels like the expensive fuse has bettered his system and he is happy..... Then I believe that the fuse is not so expensive at all...!

Nyname…my thoughts on SR fuses are pretty clear, so feel free to read my previous posts, and indeed, I clearly wish I was oregonpapa due to the sad little life I lead in quiet (or noisy at times) desperation. I mean really…that's simply obvious. However, I don't wish for the closure of this thread because that would deprive me of a regular  opportunity to continue my ranting against what I view as a silly overprice pseudo tweak. Why would anybody want that? I utilize plenty of tweaks that I find useful, use good cables, etc., so I'm not a complete luddite (or philistine…or something), but the promotion of a nonsensical, inexplicable, expensive and utterly useless fuse "upgrade" will garner my ire as long as this thread continues. If you're secure in your faith in SR fuses, you shouldn't mind my criticism, but the energy spent criticizing me could possibly be better utilized by simply answering my often asked question: What the heck do these fuses actually do to the electrons they encounter that less precious fuses don't? Sorry that this question is so upsetting, but hey…that's on you. Oregonpapa…you may not be an actual employee of SR, but it sure seemed like you could be, and my view on that has softened somewhat…I hope you find that comforting. My listening preferences are saved for other threads as this is my regular anti pseudo tweak exercise that I relish…and what shouldn't I? (note…that was a rhetorical question).

Guys be calm and accept dissenting opinions :=))

"audio-sadists" LMAO

^^^ nyame ...

Thanks for the kind words. They are very much appreciated. 

Wolf and his very small gang of audio-sadists have in the past accused me of being on the payroll of SR. Also a "shill" for SR.  What they neglect to mention is all of the other tweaks and improvements that I've reported on in this thread and in others here in various A'gon threads.  I report on what works for me, hoping to help others along the way. For anyone who has followed this thread from the beginning, they know that it also includes many music/recording suggestions. 

I'd like Wolfie to answer the question that if he thinks I'm on the payroll of SR, does he also think I'm on the payroll of AudioTechnica, Gaylord Legend speaker and IC cables, Audio Research and Herbie's tube dampeners? All of these products, in combination with the SR power cords, fuses and room treatments have improved my existing system immensely without upgrading to more expensive electronics up the ARC line.  

This thread has become much more than just a "fuse" thread, something the naysayers seem to miss. Lots of friendships have been formed and music shared. Why anyone would want to destroy that is beyond me. Folks like Wolfie remind me of baking a delicious looking cake ... but when the batter was being mixed, a pinch of sand was added. No matter how good the cake looks, the pinch of sand ruins it.  Wolfie and his little gang of acid throwers are the pinch of sand in the batter.

Wolfie ... how about giving us some music suggestions? What are you listening to? What's your favorite? Any ballad singers you particularly like? Who are some of your favorite jazz performers? How about classical? In other words, how about becoming a positive member of the group and get in on the fun instead of tearing at the seams of of the dreams and positiveness of others???? 

Frank

wolf_garcia

Your posts suggest you have a personal preoccupation with Oregonpapa. 
I think you are envious of him. He has everything you wish you had. he had a lucrative career and can afford to buy three power cords for $9000. How this must have hurt. Unlike you he has earned the love and respect of  99.99% of Audiogoners. 

You have lost the war. Synergistic Research has sold thousands of fuses to their happy customers. The game is over. I suspect your morbid ambition is to see the closure of this thread so that you can boast that you are the one who closed it down. Most happy customers no longer post on this thread. They see no further need to. Audiophile fuse are now one of the options that must now be taken into account by anyone building a system.

Are you suggesting that Oregonpapa  and this thread are part of a fraudulent conspiracy?  

guys quick question which may have been answered in this long thread- can I burn in the fuses on my cable cooker by attaching a wire to each end of the fuse and then through the cable cooker or will that not send the right signal- thanks

I am reminded of my all-time favorite bumper sticker:  "You just think you're happy"

# you just think it sounds better

Uhealthy relationship? Exposing fraud in audio tweakdom is a rewarding enterprise that can fill one with a feeling of righteousness and the warm glow one can only acquire from helping the misguided to avoid spending their hard earned tweak bucks on silliness (should there have been a comma in that sentence?). Way cheaper than therapy (or so I'm told). I refuse to accept imagined results because I can, and as long as people continue to make exaggerated claims of the wonders of a half inch piece of "special" wire, I'll jump in and have some fun with them. You, nyname, should welcome my posts as a bit of light in the darkness of faith based conformity and peer pressure from overly excited or thin skinned believers…you're welcome.

LOL:)) 75 pages and 2 years of debate over a fuse....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYByo7KPnwo

Nyame
I have the greatest respect for people like Mapman who tried a red fuse and decided it did not help his system. But he never ridiculed those who were able to enjoy the benefits of the fuses.

Well, actually he did. He was one of the most constant thorn in the sides of the fuse afficiandos. Not that there’s anything wrong with that. Speaking of Mapman, has anyone seen hide or hair of him? He seems to disappeared off the face of the earth. Mapman, come back! Mapman!

uberwaltz 3/10/17

"What I think happened and is also happening on the fuse front is that there will be some components and combinations that benefit from these tweaks and some that just do not "

Well said uberwaltz. Not all systems have reached the high level of sophistication required to easily demonstrate the benefits of the SR black fuses. In my experience systems which are highly dimensional, and with
accurate and musical bass response, obtain the maximum benefits. 

I have the greatest respect for people like Mapman who tried a red fuse and decided it did not help his system. But he never ridiculed those who were able to enjoy the benefits of the fuses. 

I do have a problem with Wolf Garcia, who has an unhealthy relationship with this fuse thread. He claims to have tried the black fuses and  said it did not help his system.  But he refuses to accept the testimony of the many hundreds of audiophiles who reaped the benefits of these fuses. His
position is that fuses are incapable of improving the fidelity of any high fidelity system. The stated reasons for his opinions are all without foundation and are so weak that I now forced to wonder what motivates his continuous and unwelcome appearances on this thread. 

I recently replaced my stock power cord for my Bryston RM 20 power conditioner with a custom made Grover Huffman 20 amp a/c cable. It is more open sounding and clear. Music is sounding faster with more detail and less glare. Now I inserted my system which is plugged into the Bryston except for amps into the SR black duplex whereas I previously preferred the amps in the black and Bryston into a red duplex both dedicated 20 amp circuits. Now, with everything plugged into just the one black duplex my sound is even more dynamic, clear and interesting. SR is doing something right in their fuses and duplexes which allow high end equipment to reveal their best qualities as well as the music.

andynotadam.
My systems as pair of Mcintosh MC 501 mono , Mcintosh C50 preamp , Wadia 781i cd/sacd player , 1 pair Nordost Valhalla 1 XLR ( connected from CD to Preamp ) , 1 pair of Transparent Reference XL /  XLR ( from  Preamp to MC 501 ) , pair of Purist Corvus Luminist 9 Foot long speaker cables , 4 Cardas Golden Power Cords ( 2 for mc 501 , 1 for C50 and 1 for power strip ) and 1 Cardas Clear Beyond for Wadia , Oyaide R1 outlet and Oyaide power strip , to drive pair of B&W 803 D ..... but still drive me crazy with very weak of BASS and made me so angry ! I been tried with this set up took me almost 3 years for many many times to exchanged all of cables .... The final work i just replaced 4 stock fuses with Synergistic SR Black and they are pair very well to my systems , now i got plenty strong clean, tight bass , excellent soundstage , clarity , punchy , i am happy and love it now , i trusted SR fuses and they made things better ! cheers !!!

Something I find interesting about this thread is that I can't recall a single poster being an all-Synergistic, all-the-time fan boy. A few notables here use Synergistic power cords (and I have one in my system for my REL sub), but it seems that most go their own way when it comes to interconnect, speaker and other cabling and tweaks in their systems. In my view that increases the credibility of the many positive experiences with the Black fuses posted here.

I think at this stage I am ready to believe anything after an event last night.
Acquired a McIntosh mvp851 very very cheap on ebay due to broken front panel although in perfect working order. Came with stock power cord about 6ft long and where it sits in rack is only about 1ft from power. So again perusing ebay saw a listing for a 1.5ft power cord by company called BLE Designs for just $32 shipped. Well it will fit better and look nice if nothing else so bought it. Arrived yesterday along with a new cd so stuck the cd in listened to a couple tracks and then powered off and changed out the power cord. Back on started playing same tracks again and I did not even get back to my sofa without knowing this was totally different sound!
Talk about reverse expectation bias if there is any such thing!
The whole sound was ...well just "more" for want of a better description.
A very audible difference
This is not my first power cord...lol. Have Cardas, WireWorld PS Audio and never heard any difference at all.
So what makes this different?
Am I going to suggest you all rush out and buy power cords from BLE Design?

Hell no!

What I think happened and is also happening on the fuse front is that there will be some components and combinations that benefit from these tweaks and some that just do not.

I truly believe that all these people on both sides cannot be wrong. Some have heard a difference and some have not.
Does that mean these fuses will work for everybody in all systems, of course not, just the same as this el cheapo power cord I bought worked well for me it may well do nothing for you.

This is just one of those threads that is never ending and truly there is no right or wrong.

 
mar14lee
mar14lee3 posts03-04-2017 2:11amZORRO
Thanks for your reply .
I also been placed fuses with arrow point down and the wadia as well .
sound very good so far .
I just bought another SR black for Mcintosh C50 preamp , do you have any idea with arrow point LEFT or Right ? I currently place fuse with arrow to RIGHT ! ( from front view of C50 i flip 180 degree from right to left , bottom of C50 face up then I set fuse into it with arrow to RIGHT , dont know and not sure it is right or wrong ! ) Best regards !

*** Up to date after test the Synergistic SR Black fuse in my Mcintosh C50 preamp .... the correct direction is arrow to the LEFT *** . I had 4 SR black fuses in my system .... sound fantastic !!!! Hope this posted a hint to some one has the same preamp. Cheers .

I suppose the take-away here is that the fuse is directional and that it should be tried both directions to see which way sounds best.

😛

mar14lee3 posts03-04-2017 2:11amZORRO
Thanks for your reply .
I also been placed fuses with arrow point down and the wadia as well .
sound very good so far .
I just bought another SR black for Mcintosh C50 preamp , do you have any idea with arrow point LEFT or Right  ? I currently place fuse with arrow to RIGHT !  ( from front view of C50 i flip 180 degree from right to left , bottom of C50 face up then I set fuse into it with arrow to RIGHT , dont know and not sure it is right or wrong !  ) Best regards !

*** Up to date after test the Synergistic SR Black fuse in my Mcintosh C50 preamp .... the correct direction is arrow to the LEFT *** . I had 4 SR black fuses in my system .... sound fantastic !!!! Hope this posted a hint to some one has the same preamp. Cheers . 

Just had to make it #3700. I picked more money and younger women.
Superb Match.

There ain't nothing scarier than a fuser lynch mob getting all riled up.

I posted thread #3200. Thermal Magnetic Breakers - I find it hard to believe this thread is almost at 3700. Try Older Whiskey, Faster Horses, More Money, Younger Women.

Best to All on this Journey 

Wolf -  ain't nobody gonna pull the wool over your eyes. 

The Tice Clock was the re-marketing and consequent up-pricing of an inexpensive Radio Shack electric alarm clock that was somehow treated by Tice to allow it to have a positive effect on the circuits in the room in which it was plugged in, thus allegedly making your hifi rig work better. An amazingly and somewhat sadly worthless bit of legendary audio nonsense, thoroughly discredited and kicked to the curb of hifi history. The story of the controversy around that thing stands as an example of how a hyped pseudo tweak can impact the audiophile world in the best and worst ways. That episode was fun to watch.

georgehifi

Someone wrote: Paul McGowan of PS Audio has articles on their site that states since the fuse is the bottleneck of the entire.

and Georgehifi responded,

So are all the fine circuit board tracks that lead to and from the fuse and every thing else. why not rip them out too and turn them around the other way, and cryo them while your at it.

Whoa! What! That would actually not be such a bad observation except for one small detail. The fine circuit board tracks are not drawn through a die like wire, including the wire in fuses. Therefore they ARE NOT directional. On the other hand all the internal wring in electronics, in capacitors, transformers and speakers and wire in cables IS directional and should be oriented accordingly.

Paul McGowan of PS Audio has articles on their site that states since the fuse is the bottleneck of the entire .

So are all the fine circuit board tracks that lead to and from the fuse and every thing else. why not rip them out too and turn them around the other way, and cryo them while your at it.

Cheers George

For the record so do I. If he heard no difference so be it. . I also trust the listening impressions of the multitude who report very positive findings, many who happen to be well seasoned members on audiogon. They represent every bit as much creditability without question.
Charles

I trust Wolf when he says he heard nothing. I don't have any doubts about his listening capability.

I respect individuals that post on this forum regardless if you hear an improvement using the SR Black fuses or not.
What bothers me are the people that don't try the product and voice their opinion or the people that tried the product, did not hear a difference there for everyone else that heard a difference must be wrong.

ebm, you have tried them and they improved the sound of your excellent system?