3402
Second- any player per Naim.
Happy Listening!
Second- any player per Naim.
Happy Listening!
Suggestions for New CD Player
I'm looking for a new CD player, modestly priced under $1,500, that will work well with a 2-channel system featuring B&W 804S floorstanders, a McIntosh MC402 power amp, and a Magnum Dynalab MD208 receiver used as a preamp.
My wife and I mostly listen to classical music, and have an extensive CD collection, particularly heavy in orchestral (e.g., Mahler, Beethoven) and opera (Wagner, Verdi) and piano/violin. (My wife is a Julliard-trained musician.) Pre-pandemic, we were frequent concert-goers, preferring about rows 8-15. We also rock out on occasion. We appreciate fine equipment, but we're music-lovers rather than true audiophiles.
We previously had a Consonance Droplet CD player (tubed, nice sound quality, when it worked, which wasn't often enough) and a Lexicon RT-20 (a little harsh, and wouldn't play many discs). I won't buy a used player. In my experience, CD mechanisms are the most fragile of all components.
I realize I'm asking a lot at this price point, but life itself is compromise. Don't really care about wireless capability or digital files. SACD is nice, but redbook capability is what really matters to us. Considering Cambridge Audio 851, Rega Apollo, but open to suggestions.
Your thoughts?
My wife and I mostly listen to classical music, and have an extensive CD collection, particularly heavy in orchestral (e.g., Mahler, Beethoven) and opera (Wagner, Verdi) and piano/violin. (My wife is a Julliard-trained musician.) Pre-pandemic, we were frequent concert-goers, preferring about rows 8-15. We also rock out on occasion. We appreciate fine equipment, but we're music-lovers rather than true audiophiles.
We previously had a Consonance Droplet CD player (tubed, nice sound quality, when it worked, which wasn't often enough) and a Lexicon RT-20 (a little harsh, and wouldn't play many discs). I won't buy a used player. In my experience, CD mechanisms are the most fragile of all components.
I realize I'm asking a lot at this price point, but life itself is compromise. Don't really care about wireless capability or digital files. SACD is nice, but redbook capability is what really matters to us. Considering Cambridge Audio 851, Rega Apollo, but open to suggestions.
Your thoughts?
67 responses Add your response
https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/searching-for-a-new-cd-player Another alternative I had posted in another thread if your interested.... |
its more than 1500 but this is the best Ive heard https://www.whathifi.com/naim/cds3xps2/review |
The new cables are Audioquest Rocket 44 bi-wire -- an upgrade from the Home Depot solid copper bi-wiring I'd been using. As hoped, they made an immediate difference. At this point, the law of diminishing returns may have come into play in a big way. But that may not stop me from attempting further improvements! |
A further report on the Denon DCD 1600NE: Jafant, you are correct. After six more weeks of break-in, the Denon has improved. Not dramatically, but audibly. Particularly, the top end sound less "digital" and more natural. While I'm still not in love with the Denon, I like it more than I did. My wife, an experienced classical musician and former recording artist, feels the same. The biggest improvement to this system, however, has been the addition of a pair of Sonus Faber Olympica III speakers. After auditioning Focal Kanta No. 2, SF Olympica Nova II, and Wilsons (forgot the model), the Olympica IIIs were the clear winners, with an organic, non-fatiguing sound that serves the human voice, solo instruments, and full orchestra equally well, and invites long listening sessions. I'm now awaiting the delivery of new speaker cables, and I expect to take further steps to upgrade as time progresses. Audiogon has been a valuable resource in this process. Thank you for your contributions. |
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I've now been listening to the Denon DCD 1600NE for just under three weeks. While there may be further break-in improvements, I think I've now got a firm sense of this player. I'm still not wildly enthusiastic. The Denon is admittedly a big step up from my aged Sony SCD-CE 595, but that player is over 15 years old, and not as costly as the Denon to begin with. With an aftermarket power cord and interconnects, the Denon is a decent player, with respectable tone quality and dimensionality. But as compared to other players with which I'm familiar -- the Consonance Droplet and Lector CDP -- the Denon is not really competitive in sound quality. These tubed players were just far richer, and more three-dimensional. To be fair, these were and are much more expensive pieces of equipment. I likely overestimated the improvement in sound quality that I could expect in the intervening 15 or so years since I'd last purchased a disc player. I remain disappointed by the slow loading of the disc tray, and the inordinately long time the Denon takes to respond to commands. The fast forward function on the remote is particularly slow. But these are relatively minor points. The Denon does do noticeably better with SACDs than it does with redbook. With the best-recorded and best-produced SACDs I have, it sounds quite good. But the vast majority of my collection is redbook CD. I've decided to keep it, because I think at this price point ($1,199, delivered) I'm unlikely to find another new CD player that is significantly better all-around. But I think the Denon is destined to move to my secondary, office system, sooner or later. |
Sorry to hear this, as I had this piece in my system for a week and was really impressed with it. ( I bought it for a friend ) I can't speak to their customer service, but I don't recall anything odd about the plug receptacle, I recall plugging in the PC I was using on my current CD player ( shunyata) with no issue.. The size of display and slow load time I had seen mentioned in a review, but that isn't an issue to me. Hopefully with some hours on it you will enjoy it for its sound. Rooting for you. |
In response to your suggestion, twoleftears, I’m considering returning the Denon. But I’m also considering (a) living with it for a while, because patience is a virtue I often find worth exercising, and/or (b) moving it, sooner or later, to the second system in my office, a more likely route, and getting another new CD player for the main system. The CD player in the second system -- an older Sony SCD CE-595 -- has stopped recognizing the SACD layer of discs, a sign that its remaining useful life may not be a long one, and a replacement may be due. And the inexpensive receiver it’s mated with -- a Sony STR-DE185 -- has now developed an intermittent problem of cutting out on one channel. So my audio dollars may be directed there, as well. Additionally, I find that after more than a dozen years of quiescence, my audio-gear lust has awakened again. I wonder if recent developments in speaker technology would justify the purchase of, say a new pair of Revel or Focal floorstanders to go with my McIntosh MC402 power amp? Or would I really prefer a tubed preamp? |
I've had the Denon DCD 1600NE for a week now, and unfortunately, at this stage I can't give it an enthusiastic endorsement. 1. When I received it, I called Denon US customer support with a question. I left a call-back number through Denon's automated system. I never received a call-back. 2. In my experience after-market power cords can make a real, audible difference with CD players. But the Denon has a two-prong receptacle for a power cord, meaning I can't use either of my three-prong receptacle power cords with this unit. If I had realized this before purchase, I probably wouldn't have bought this unit. Caveat emptor! 3. The CD tray mechanism's operation is relatively slow, and doesn't inspire confidence. 4. The visual display is small and not easy to read from more than a few feet away. The unit's appearance in general is more consumer-grade than audiophile-grade. (I know this going in, however.) 5. Sound quality: I understand that components have a break-in period, and it's still quite early. I am also awaiting arrival of a new set of Audioquest interconnects, which can improve sound quality. At the moment, I'm using the Denon-supplied interconnects. So my opinion could change. But with that stipulation, at present, color me unimpressed. I can only fairly speak of my own experience with the audio components I already own (see my original post). I've also moved, and the new room is less system-friendly (finished concrete floors, glass). Evaluated in this context, the Denon is far less pleasing than the (more expensive) Consonance Droplet, or a Lector CDP I had for a while. Both these tubed players produced richer, more full-bodied sound. Instruments were more clearly situated in a 3-D-like space. A closer and fairer comparison is to the non-tubed Lexicon RT-20 player. The Lexicon surpasses the Denon on slam -- speed and impact -- by quite a bit, and is preferable for rock (maybe 10-20% of my audio diet). But for classical solo instruments -- particularly the piano -- the Denon wins on tone quality. It sounds much more like an actual piano. For orchestral music/opera, I'm reserving judgment until I receive the new interconnects and the break-in period has progressed. You might say I'm asking a lot at this price point. I won't disagree. But I think if I had to make this purchase over again, I'd try the Yamaha, or the Cambridge. |
tonykay It seems that the Blue Ray Panasonic DP
UB
9000 resemble to the Oppo ? It has also XLR connexions. The Yamaha BDA 1060 seems to be great for less $, it has also XLR connexions, SACD too. I dont know if if they compare too the Oppo ? But seems to be good. |
Mids are awesome! https://holmaudio.com/ This is the shop I use in the Chicagoland area. I just listened to this last night. The Cambridge CXC is a very good transport. You will need to figure out the DAC that goes well with your sound signature and type of music. I was in the store a few months ago and a gentleman listened to the four CD players playing mostly classical music and ended up with the Rega. One of the CD players was $3000. He took home the Rega. This is the CD player for you. You really need the mids to reproduce classical instruments. This Rega will do it. |
Thank you to each one of you for your thoughtful suggestions. Especially helpful now that the pandemic has made in-person auditioning unattractive. At this point, I've narrowed it to 3 contenders: 1. The Yamaha S1000. I am concerned about reliability. 2. The Denon DCD-1600NE. No reservations based on what I've learned, but I suspect the Yamaha may be more pleasing -- probably based on the fact that Yamaha is a musical instrument manufacturer. 3. The Cambridge Azur 851c. A part of the attraction is the built-in DAC, with the promise that it could be run directly into my McIntosh MC402 power amp, freeing the Magnum Dynalab receiver for my secondary system. I can feel my audiophile impulses awakening after a decade-long sleep. |
Dear gg107....if you can act fast Accessories 4less have a Yamaha S2100 player REFURBISHED for around $1500ish. The retail is $3500. It is just below their flagship model. I've owned a series of cd players including NAD, Oppo, Cambridge Audio....The Yamaha is on a different level completely but be quick... |
I have owned Cambridge--nice detail, Rotel years ago, a good player but too bright, and more recently Marantz spinners. These are my default suggestion. ESPECIALLY given you enjoyment of classical music. I owned the 8005 years ago. A huge value, solid build, easy recommendation on a budget. A gently used KI Ruby, which is what I now own, is an unmistakable step up in their line. Nice detail but never harsh. Huge soundstage, recreates the venue very accurately. Great all around player. Given the helpful info you provided, I would suggest a Marantz player over the ones on your short list. P.S. Doesn't it bug you when you clearly state your needs and some try to steer you towards streaming or players that clearly do not meet your needs. Brother. Good luck on your search. |
Given that you wish for a new CD player, you will have some difficulty finding one with the TDA 1541 chips in them. They have been out of production for a long time - 25 years?I prefer the R2R PCM1702 and PCM1704 over the TDA1541 they are still around in CD players. But what would be really nice to see, is a manufacturer make a CD player using discrete R2R dac inside, this has yet to be done. (I think) Cheers George |
Not sure why anyone these days would purchase a CD player? You have to get off your seat to change the CD. Streaming hi res on Tidal is a much better alternative and I think the sound quality is much better. You also have access to a huge library of music. I would be interested in hearing expensive streamers compared to the Bluesound Node 2i to see if there is a noticeable difference in sound quality to warrant the expense. Problem is dealers don't have many choices to hear the differences. And I don't walk into stores due to COVID. |
hickamore : I stand corrected. In English, "A cdp can be prone to issues". and " don’t marry Dora, she can be prone to issues" |
I bought the top of the line Sony CD/DVD player and stops working frequently. I have sent it back to Sony and they have sent me a brand-new replacement unit several times, but the same problem keeps happening. I gave it to a friend and the same thing happens, so it’s not my house or my system which I thought was a possibility. This is a $500 machine. Back in the 1990’s, these players, even the cheapest ones, would work perfectly for years! Why do new things just not work? For the OP, try to find something with a good service process in place if it breaks. Sony, has top-tier service, but frequent failures, so it’s a catch-22! |
I had an almost identical situation over a year ago, and went with an Audiolab transport and Topping D50s dac. The latter was intended to be a bit of a stopgap measure, figuring I'd replace it after a few months if it wasnt up to my taste. I've now had it a year and its going nowhere. The Audiolab made a big difference in sound over my Denon 1920 universal player, even with an original Cambridge audio dacmajic paired with it for a couple of months before the Topping purchase. As in your case , redbook was my primary concern. The Audiolab does that brilliantly. I find the Topping to do Redbook well but has additional flexibility such as higher bandwidths and excellent Bluetooth connectivity. |
I’d look for either the audiolab cdt6000 (transport) or a marantz hd CD-1 (use as transport). Then combine either with a Border Patrol dac with Tubed power supply. Together, that will put you at about your budget, and you still get the benefit of tubes, albeit in the power supply of the border patrol. The Marantz hd cd-1 is known to be a very good when uses as a transport, and also very good as a stand alone redbook cd player. I own both and must say they are very nice products. Another "tubed" dac would be the jolida glass dac 111. Do not do universal players! They are generally used for video/blue ray/dvd etc, and just happen to play cd's as well. Focus on dedicated audio cd transports/players. Jmo. |
You guys love Classical Music. I would get a Universal Player so that you can play the abundant Classical SACDs and Blu Rays. Sony and Pioneer make Universal Players, I own the Pioneer which cost a 1K, the Sony goes for around $400. If you buy the Sony you can add a nice external DAC for 1K and still be under budget and really have a nice system |
Have you thought about the new streamers with built-in cd-rippers? You place a cd in it and wait a bit then you can listen to that music whenever you want without putting it in the player. Like Cocktail Audio CA-X500. There are a couple of others also. If you want to actually play cd’s I would go with a transport and a dac. That makes it easier to upgrade the dac later or use it with a streamer. |
I haven't owned it for very long, but I would still recommend the Denon DCD-1600NE. It has very impressive build quality for $1199. The disc tray is fairly substantial and operates smoothly and quietly. It plays SACD, CD, CD-R, CD-RW, mp3 and AAC files, and even DSD files burnt onto DVD-R or DVD-RW discs. Mine is so far, perhaps the best CD/SACD player I've had. |
Given that you wish for a new CD player, you will have some difficulty finding one with the TDA 1541 chips in them. They have been out of production for a long time - 25 years? You mentioned the Rega Apollo. They are a tremendous player and comfortably within your budget (I think). I have the stupidly expensive Rega Saturn, but quite honestly any difference in sonics is marginal at best and psychological at worst. The most recent Apollo has the Wolfson WM8742 DAC. Its a touch of magic. Make sure that whatever you get has this chip. |
check this one out DENON - DCD-1600NE SACD/CD Player
https://www.musicdirect.com/disc-player/Denon-DCD-1600NE-SACDCD-Player |
