Streamers/DACs

   FWIW, I’m running the TP link powerline adapters. Due to location , I was limited to this or Wi-Fi. I was aware of this devise but ignored trying it until I saw it recommended by one of the streamer manufacturers as an alternative. I’m sure the idea will get hammered as this thread progresses, but it worked well for me Vs Wi-FI. If I had wall access I’d run Cat 8 or optical , but I don’t. Buy it on Amazon and utilize their 30 day return policy. We don’t know , if we don’t try.  Cheers , Mike B. 

“Mostly interested in streaming Quboz, don’t care about Roon.”

If you’re not interested in ROON, then there isn’t a better choice than Aurender. I am a long time Aurender user, the Conductor app is very robust, well laid out and makes it a breeze to browse, navigate and curate your music off Qobuz and local storage.

Couple of considerations while choosing Streamer / DAC’s. If you choose N200, then I would pick a DAC that offers the best possible USB & SPDIF implementation. So before you open your wallet for N200, do your research on a DAC.

As far the choice between WiFi or Ethernet, consider installing a mesh network. Both WiFi and Ethernet over power lines are not the best options.

I am loving my Aurender N200.   Sounds excellent with either of my DACs

I recommend using the DAC in the STR and getting an iFi Zen Stream or a Paradigm PW Link. Why go spend $$$ before you see the synergy between the Persona and the Anthem DAC. I have a Paradigm PW W Amp connected with a pair of Paradigm Reference Studio 20’s in another room. They voice these products with their own speakers, see how you like the Anthem DAC/Paradigm speaker synergy before changing it.

You will never see the potential of the equipment you are looking at on wifi.

The Paradigm streamer has an ethernet port

Check out the HiFi Rose RS150. It is also Korean and has many features Aurender does not have like a touch screen and a BT remote control for non network play. It includes a fine built-in DAC and Femto clock.

SPDIF out and a fine CD drive available for ripping or listening.

Hey @brewerslaw - Not sure if you saw my post here about the A15 and N200, but you might find it to be useful:

I also responded to your last PM now on how you could use your WAP if you have one in your listening room.

I have used Cary DACs in the past and they are "okay". Not the end in resolution. I worry about suggesting the DMS-700 to anyone regardless of whether the sound quality is good because Cary does not specialize in digital source playback ecosystems, which will result in a less mature/satisfactory user experience.

I am now a very dedicated Aurender fan. I bought my first streamer Aurlic Aries G2 because it had built in wifi and Aurender didn’t. Mistake on my part. My dealer told me to just buy an wall wart wifi extender and plug it in next to the streamer… wow, that was easy. I found my first Aurender way better than the others I owned or auditioned. My Aurender produces vinyl quality sound. You can see my systems. I know of a number of $150K systems running off wall wart Wi-Fi’s with world class sound. 
 

I have a EtherRegen. I put it in on my main system. I recently took it out. I could detect no difference. I have swapped it in and out… also upgrading the Ethernet from wifi extender to the EtherRen. This actually caused a slight hardening of the treble. I though maybe the newly installed Ethernet cable needed additional breaking… but it was not going away. I finally decided a Cardas Ethernet cable would probably fix it. Then I realized with the $200 cable already on there, adding a $350 cable… I would be paying as much on cables just to stop the EtherRegen from interfering with the sound. That just seems wrong. So I just took it out of the loop.

I don’t want anyone to think that I am suggesting EtherRegen will not help them. I believe the value of fiddling with your network is more valuable the lower the quality of your streamer. I have a flagship Aurender W20SE… and I believe it is very nearly completely isolating it from the network. When I have some time, I’ll put the EtherRegen in my headphone system with my Aurender N100 and hear what it does. 

we are apersona dealer and we sell servers the 432Evos we srll an amazing dac streamer from avik the S180

as per wifi vs ethernet a good wifi to ethernet bridge is your solution

knowing the personas you should look at a very warm sounding dac aor adding a tube preamp most dacs with volume control will not sound as good as a dedicated preamp

the naim nd5 xs is an excellent dac and streamer the naim app is excellent

also the atoll st 200 is really musical dac preamp and streamer 

th bricasti m3is an amazing dac and has a decent volume control

Dave and Troy

Audio intellect NJ

persona naim atoll bricasti dealers

@ghdprentice Seems the EtherRegen is hit or miss depending on how the rest of someone's internet is functioning. I too could hear very little difference with it on its own and almost returned it until a friend suggested I try a Farad Super 3 LPS on it. I did so with a good aftermarket cabling, and that smoothed a lot out while bringing out more detail. It was an unconventional route as I paid more for the LPS and cabling than I did for the EtherRegen itself. Unfortunately I did something stupid and fried the LPS, so I took the opportunity to upgrade to the Synergistic Research Ethernet Switch UEF and called it a day. These solutions cost way more than they should but now that they are in place I am happy to have them. In my system, even while using wifi via a Netgear Orbi into the switch, streaming and local file playback are nearly indistinguishable, which was not the case before.

@blisshifi

My experience with EtherREGEN was a mix bag as well. It did more harm than good in my system and I end up moving away from it. When it first came out, there weren’t many options to tweak Ethernet so many reported positive feedback. IME, the impact of FILTERS and Switches greatly varies depending on what’s ahead of these devices. If you were using a high quality streamer, their impact may not be profound as opposed to someone using a Nucleus or iFI Zen.

I keep an open mind when it comes to Ethernet tweaks and believe their is no substitute for trying them in your system to truly understand their impact. Like you, I got done tweaking my Ethernet chain when I switched to Telegartner M12 Gold Switch w/JCAT LPS. Further, my switch and router are grounded with a pair of Entreq Macro Ground Boxes, the additions of grounding boxes was like cherry on top :-)

@lalitk Thanks for sharing your journey. I hadn't heard about the Telegartner until you mentioned it, but that looks like both a serious AND seriously overpriced piece of kit! :)

JCAT makes incredible stuff across the board from what I've seen and heard. My only experience with them were their XE cards.

@blisshifi

Don’t even get me started on overpriced gear, you and I both know why most of our gear overpriced or carry fat markups….LOL!

Ok so as an owner of Persona 5F’s and former owner of Cary DMS 700 and the Lumin T2 I can definitely help you out. Also had the Aurender N series of streamers and Aurender A10 combo. 
Please pm me and would be glad to give you my take. 
Russ

I’m using the SMSL SD-9 streamer, with every output possible including I2S. It’s feeding a Musician Pegasus DAC. The SMSL streamer supports wifi and Tidal and Qobuz 

Having tried a variety of streamers and DAC's I have decided to separate the functions. I use a Lindemann Limetree Bridge and Denafrips Ares 2. Firstly there is no use nor need for a display on a streamer, had several and never looked at them, tablet or phone is much better. Displays in CD players can be turned off, to reduce 'noise', so why have one at all. The screen failed in my Naim streamer making it impossible to re programme. Advice, ditch the screen. The DAC is far more important in sound quality than the streamer, by separates also means separate power supplies. The Denafrips have a good linear power supply. If you wish to upgrade DAC you can easily. I compared the Lindemann / Denafrips to Aurendar and Aurelic streamers at up 3 times the price.  Could hear no sound improvement even in $100,000 systems, nor could anyone else. 

Have you checked out any of the Auralic streamers/DACs?

@blisshifi

@laltk

Thanks. Great to hear your experiences.

There's nothing inherently wrong with using WIFI for your streamer as long as the WIFI is consistent and can sustain bandwidth suitable for streaming audio (which really isn't that demanding). 

You can get a wifi extender with a hard-wire port on it (to connect to your streamer) for $50, probably cheaper.

I stream hi-res audio, and 4k video over mine in a detached garage, with nary a hick-up. 

Innuos Zenith and a good R2R DAC 

Lots of talk on how to improve Ethernet to the streamer. I am a big fan of Sonore and its use of optical to decouple your system from the noise on the line. USB to you Anthem and off and running.  I am roon user so not much help with which software to use but they support many options to control the streamer all via software and a web page.  It’s a nice simple and not to expensive way to get that job done 

I agree with @jerryg123 

Don’t depend on anything but an independent DAC.  Even in a great amp or streamer.  DACS get radically better every year.

I run a NUC server with an Innuos streamer and I have never heard anyone’s system at any price sound better than mine.

The Lightning DS software from Auralic products is light years better than the aurender app and I prefer the Auralic products over aurender products. As good as lightning ds is, Roon is much better.

As far as sound quality, I would take Roon or Audirvana over the others, followed by Auralic, then lumin.

As far as extending the reach of your signal the Netgear Powerline 2000 + Extra Outlet works great for me, have three in my home with great speeds, about a hundred bucks each on Crutchfield back over a year ago.

As streamer , i’m favorite of Lumin , Moon Mind 2. Always à separate dac :  Metronome Technologie is great. Do like also : Ear , Trilogy,,…

I can not accept the statement that there is no way to hardwire from the router.

Are you streaming now via WiFi?

Lumin T3

No Roon until you do!

@jeffseight Listening Room gear is being set up now.  The router and network switch are in a utility closet down one floor and on the opposite corner of the house with no unfinished or drop ceiling in between. Probably about two hundred of feet of physical space apart. Not literally impossible but real difficult to hardwire. 

Just get a WIFI access extender that has and ethernet port.  That will offload all the noise associated to WIFI to the extender and you can isolate the ethernet with fiber if necessary.

i would like to see a blind test between a Bluesound Node and a Aurender.

Mytek Brooklyn Bridge II another great streamer too. But……

As for the LUMIN is has Leedh Processing Volume control. Meaning the streamer works as a pre amp (exceptionally well). Mytek does this too ( no pre needed) but not with Leedh. Worth a read on Leedh!

There’s gobs of info on these forums about cleaning up your Ethernet connection. Some have reported great or little success with an EtherREGEN. I’m in the plus column big time and I can’t stress enough that upgraded linear power, and cables play a big roll. 

Could you run optical/fiber (cheap too) to your new setup?

@malibu457 

Excellent idea. I highly recommend it and give give us your impressions.  

Separate DAC, tech is moving fast an getting better quickly. Denafrips Pontus II $2,000 or Holo Audio $3,000 are great R2R DACs. I have the Pontus II and added a Denafrips Iris DDC at $600.....a terrific pairing, and can always be upgraded if you should choose to....easy to sell on Audiogon

the denafrips pontus ii and mercury streamer is also good option

Total unexpected 180 on my part: Did the free Roon trial, got hooked, and set up a new Mac Mini M1 Roon Core.  

I’ll be looking for a separate DAC that pairs well with the Persona 3Fs/Sub

Strongly considering the following: Bricasti M1, Terminator Plus 12th, Chord Dave, and T+A DAC 200.  Any thoughts, particularly from the Persona-knowledgeable?

thanks much!

@brewerslaw,

Nice list of DAC options, so far. Please let me add this one.

I’m having very good success pairing an Ayre QB-9 TWENTY with my Persona 3F’s.  The Persona’s holistic imaging and full range, broad off-axis response is well supported. 

The TWENTY upgrade is essentially a new board with most of Ayre’s latest DAC technology. I’m running Cardas Clear and Cerious loom in fully balanced mode,  but frankly with its built-in power filters and FPGA schemes, the DAC seems less dependent upon higher end connections.

I'm currently using the STR Stack and I'm using the Auralic Aries USB into my preamp. So with that I'll recommend the Auralic Aries G2.1 and they prefer WiFi use. I tried and sent back the Lumin and a HiFi Rose 150 to keep my Auralic.

I am going crazy, I have finally added a DAC to my Auris audifi streamer and I am using Qobuz for a high resolution service. I see on my screen that it is 96khz yet it says 44.1 on the display. Does the Auris audifi digital output limit the signal to 44.1?

Well I figured it out, the Auris audifi is limited to 44.1 from the coax digital output. I believe that it is something to do with the ability to hook up multiple devices and stream music at the same time. It sounds a little bit better when it comes out of the analog outputs . It looks like it is going to be a  backup instead of something that I will use as a quality front end. I am just going to dig out my raspberry pi and save my $ for a unit to feed my new Dac.