Post no more then, I already told you that tidal has the same problems of not having something available that was before. The nature of streaming is conflict with licencing. Just canc
Serious Problems with Qobuz
About six weeks ago I started having trouble with Qobuz. Many recordings that are available to stream suddenly appeared as "Unavailable" in Roon and as "Sample" in Qobuz own app (in this last case, you can stream only about a minute of each track and nothing more). I contacted Qobuz on several occasions and they emailed me saying that it is a "rights" problem. The labels affected are Chandos, BIS, Naxos, Capriccio, and CPO, and not all of the recordings are affected but mainly high resolution ones, and featuring certain composers, orchestras, conductors and performers. According to Qobuz, Naxos is the culprit as it owns all of those labels. Qobuz mentioned that the "are working with the labels to solve the problem", but up to now nothing has happened and the list of unavailable recordings is growing. In fact, some labels, like BIS and Chandos, have told some customers that have contacted them about this problem, that they are not the ones doing this.
Interestingly, this is not affecting the same recordings in Tidal, which are only available in CD resolution (44.1/16). This raises the question, at least for me, how viable is Qobuz when the recordings I want to listen to are being made unavailable. Mind you, recordings that were available before and which I listened to and marked as "favorites". Customers are paying for this service, which is not cheap, and it seems that Qobuz is reneging on the recordings it made available when one signs on.
I asked some very well known reviewers, some who had featured Qobuz reviews and interviews with the company's CEO, but none answered, and one is "sponsored" by Qobuz.
Qobuz has to answer to its customers and be forthcoming about the real problem and let us know if this problem can be solved or not. If not, they will be losing a lot of customers to others. A very bad way to run a business.
Interestingly, this is not affecting the same recordings in Tidal, which are only available in CD resolution (44.1/16). This raises the question, at least for me, how viable is Qobuz when the recordings I want to listen to are being made unavailable. Mind you, recordings that were available before and which I listened to and marked as "favorites". Customers are paying for this service, which is not cheap, and it seems that Qobuz is reneging on the recordings it made available when one signs on.
I asked some very well known reviewers, some who had featured Qobuz reviews and interviews with the company's CEO, but none answered, and one is "sponsored" by Qobuz.
Qobuz has to answer to its customers and be forthcoming about the real problem and let us know if this problem can be solved or not. If not, they will be losing a lot of customers to others. A very bad way to run a business.
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The problem is with Qobuz because Tidal is not facing the same problem. I do not understand why so much interest in defending Qobuz and not their clients. Why do I sense there may be Qobuz employees lurking here to protect the firm and attack anybody that says anything contrary to their firm or jobs? Regarding the labels in question, Chandos, BIS, CPO, Naxos, try recordings by Hickox in Chandos as an example, most BIS. |
First, I do have a very large collection of cd, lp, tape. I still buy them. However, there are many recordings available snd I can’t buy the all, so I rely an streaming services for them. Second, yes it has been Sebastien the person I have been communicating with. And it was him who told me about the rights issues. There is another person from Qobuz USA who I have been in touch too, but I do not have his name immediately available. And, in addition, I have maintained communication with some members of the Roon community which have experienced the same problem and have contacted persons from the labels affected, including the CEO of BIS recordings. And these persons mentioned that they had not changed thei availability of those recordings. The only culprit, it seems up to now if the rights issue is real, is Naxos, who owns all those labels. But, at this moment this is only a speculation based on Qobuz information. |
I find Qobuz customer service to be very good. I recently emailed Sebastien who provides most of the Qobuz customer email promotions. I asked Sebastien if Qobuz could look into getting Lyle Lovett on their service as most Lyle Lovett albums have terrific SQ. He replied quickly letting me know that he would look into it. About 3 weeks later I get an email from Sebastien letting me know they posted most of Lovett's collection on Qobuz. Even if I was lucky and they were already in the process of doing this isn't the point. The point is that Sebastien took the time to reply and hope I enjoyed listening to the Lovett albums. This is a characteristic of a world-class customer support organization. |
Did you read all the small print on your subscription, I don't think they guarantee that they will always have the music that they may have at any given time. They are still way better than cable or satellite tv, who will make you sign a contract and then drop the channels you had when you signed up. Tidal is the same, I had some Ronnie Earl MQA albums on tidal then they vanished about a year ago. |
The initial statement about Qobuz is perfectly an honest statement and question. You don’t have to like what he or she is saying. It’s your right but suggesting that if he or she doesn’t like what’s happening with Qobuz and that they can‘t stream specific song, maybe they should cancel their subscription! Unbelievable!!!! How about if you didn’t like their comments and if it offends you in any form or fashion, maybe you shouldn’t respond if you can’t offer any positive advice. So negative! If you understood their comments, they were asking for help, not sarcasm. Grow up and have some decency for this or any other thread. Amazing, it’s always the same negative people on a lot of these threads. There, I said what most are thinking!!!! |
Qobuz don’t give you anything other than access to content real-time. This isn’t even equivalent to cable TV networks having rows with local studios. This is like complaining that Amazon no longer streams the movie that you’ve seen before but added hundreds of others. If this material is something that you treasure why not purchase a copy? |
Yes, I tried that. But according to Qobuz France and Qobuz USA, the problem is related to other things. They mentioned “rights”, and some other difficulties. The “rights” thing is strange as Tidal has many of the recordings in question and they stream, albeit only in 44.1/16 and not in higher resolution. It is true that this possibly is affecting only the labels I mentioned and possibly only classical recordings, but I can’t vouchsafe for that. I read from other customers about non classical music. I pay Qobuz on a monthly basis and on the 25th of this month is the renewal. I do not know if I should continue with their service. What really bothers me is that, if it really is related to recording rights, they must have known it fir quite a while. These legal issues do not just spring up unannounced. And if that is really the issue, Qobuz should have notified its customers about the problem. If they would have warned the customers, I would have probably reacted differently. Business, as with our society in general, is based on trust. I have owned a business and I know that I must keep the trust of my customers because once it’s lost it’s gone forever. And being forthcoming with those customers is important. I really feel sad about this because I like Qobuz more than Tidal. Perhaps is just an illusion, files being digital and probably the same, but the sound I get from Qobuz streaming seems better. Again, this could be just an illusion or preconceived notion, but that’s how I perceive it. We will see what develops from now on. I really would like for Qobuz to straighten this problem and if there is a rights problem and they need, if they are forced, to increase their streaming price, I would be willing to pay it, as long as they make available the recordings from those labels. |
Sometimes you just got to roll with the punches. Streaming services are a veritable treasure for a music junkie but 100%-every-moment-of-the-day reliability is just something that doesn't happen in the real...or shall we say virtual...world. If something you want isn't available at that particular moment, find something else to stream and enjoy. |
I think somebody here needs to take some lessons on a way to carry on a dialogue. I do not came here to Audiogon to be called a "whiner". I am ENTITLED to say what I have been exposing because I am a paying customer and have the right to express my dissatisfaction with a service provider or any business that does not behave well with its customers. Protesting a bad treatment from a business is not whining. It is a right that every paying customer has. |
“Neither Qobuz or Tidal guarantee the availability of any specific files, as far as I can tell.” Exactly! There isn’t a single streaming site I’ve found that’s got it all. Being an early adopter of Qobuz, I say they have come a long way. If I see a album missing, I let Qobuz know via email and so far they have not disappointed me. A missing album or album no longer available from their extensive catalog is hardly a ‘serious’ problem :-) |
brucknermahler "Matter of perspective" is not.It isn't? Do you mean we all have to think and feel the way that you do? ... When I signed, all those recordings that are now missing were available, thus, this was one of the main reasons to join. Qobuz made the offer of giving me that music in order to have me sign to their service.Yes, and they initially provided those recordings, correct? Now they don't, apparently, but you are free to cancel at any time, right? So I don't understand your complaint. ... there are more persons mad at this state of affairs ...And of course they are free to comment here. As a paying customer I have the right to voice my concerns ...Of course! ... yes this is a serious problem because it could mean that all those recordings will not be available anymore from Qobuz if they do not reach an agreement.You're free to think it a serious problem but frankly, I don't understand the problem. Neither Qobuz or Tidal guarantee the availability of any specific files, as far as I can tell. If you've now decided you no longer like Qobuz, just cancel your account. |
"Matter of perspective" is not. First, I signed with Qobuz, as well as Tidal, because I wanted to stream the music I like. When I signed, all those recordings that are now missing were available, thus, this was one of the main reasons to join. Qobuz made the offer of giving me that music in order to have me sign to their service. Second, I joined because I want to stream music I like, not to buy and download. If I want to buy, I can do it in other sites and many times at a lower price. In addition, if you want to buy music from Qobuz you don't have to sign for their streaming service. Third, yes there are more persons mad at this state of affairs. You can check it in the Roon community web site. Some of those persons have contacted the labels directly. One contacted the CEO of BIS and this person told him that they were not doing this, nor had they asked Qobuz to do it. It is interesting that some people accuse others of "blowing things out of proportion" when the conditions do not affect them, or when it suits them. As a paying customer I have the right to voice my concerns. And if the firm in question does not answer clearly, I have the right to bring those concerns to others that may be facing the same conditions. As I mentioned in my original post, six weeks ago Qobuz promised to correct the matter. Different Qobuz personnel have given different versions. And if the rights argument is true, then Qobuz should have issued a notice to all its customers about this condition as soon as they knew it. Not to keep silent about it and wait until customers start complaining. Thus, yes this is a serious problem because it could mean that all those recordings will not be available anymore from Qobuz if they do not reach an agreement. |
big_greg3,201 posts09-24-2020 8:35am This "serious problem" may be a matter of perspective. Every once in a while, I’ll run into a song that isn’t available ... 99% of the time I can find and listen to anything I want on Qobuz. That 1% (or less) of times that I can’t hear a song I want to is NOT a "serious issue" ... I think you’ve blown this way out of proportion.I agree. I've actually found a few major artists totally missing from Qobuz (there's no Bob Seger, for example) and of course there's plenty of more obscure music that it doesn't have. So what? For a single payment of $150/year it's a pretty good deal. |
This "serious problem" may be a matter of perspective. Every once in a while, I’ll run into a song that isn’t available. From what I remember, it’s usually on compilations. So one artist’s music hasn’t been licensed by Qobuz and they can’t stream that song. 99% of the time I can find and listen to anything I want on Qobuz. That 1% (or less) of times that I can’t hear a song I want to is NOT a "serious issue". If there’s another service that caters more to your musical tastes then vote with your wallet. I have Tidal and Qobuz in part, for this reason. I much prefer Qobuz, but sometimes Tidal will have something Qobuz doesn't. As another poster mentioned, Qobuz has to pay to license songs to deliver them to you. If the licensing groups jack up the prices and Qobuz pays them, guess who ultimately pays. You and me. I think you’ve blown this way out of proportion. |
I don’t think what the OP describes is a "serious problem" at all. It sounds like a licensing issue. This frequently happens with CATV providers who get into a spat with a local station or cable channel about licensing fees, and channels are sometimes removed from a lineup - for a period of time - until the matter is resolved. As @jjss49 noted, Qobuz itself doesn’t own the music and neither do you. Qobuz does offer the option to purchase and download its files so if there are some albums that are especially important to you, you might want to consider that. I like Qobuz a lot, but I’m not giving up my LPs and CDs anytime soon. Your experience is just one reason for that. |
Well that's a bummer, recently switched from Tidal and Spotify to Qobuz. I did notice last weekend a few tracks were shown and then failed to load or not found on 2 of 50 tracks or so. They've had an uptake on membership lately and just wonder its a matter of a company trying to grow too fast, overpromising and underdelivering. Have you checked other forums and found similar complaints lately? |
interesting to note this we think of streaming sources to always have the music we like to listen to all the time, anytime not quite so easy... you don't own the music, they don't either hiccups like this remind us all of this hazard, and having a streaming subscription is not equal to owning the music ourselves in cd or lp form |
