Power Cord for Accuphase Amplifier
I have a new Accuphase P-4600 amplifier and am looking for a power cord to replace the stock. So far I’ve tried the Cullen Crossfire and the IceAge OFC Frankencable. While both cables have worked well on my source components they have not performed better than the stock on the amplifier. So to those who have Accuphase amplifiers what power cable has worked for you?
As I mentioned in other threads Accuphase strongly recommends that you use only the stock cord and so far that has been the best. The. other two have resulted in a darker sound with less soundscape openness.
I’ve been trying to stay under $500 for the cord but would be willing to go a little higher if it improves the amps performance.
That’s a logical fallacy, straw man argument:
No one here is suggesting that science be dismissed - except you. |
- Yep, just because it has better measurements doesn't mean it will sound best to all. "What can be more arrogant than to dismiss science in favor of pure subjectivity?" - Audio is not a objective endeavor from a listening point of view, it has to be subjective because the hardware has too many variables when interacting with other components. You then have human hearing and brain function where no 2 people on the planet are the same. Science can't explain everything because it was created by humans. |
@rtorchia I think the issue here is we all listen and perceive sound in different ways. It may simply be some are left brain and some right brain dominant. Obviously you can’t be convinced that cables make a difference and I can never concede that they don’t. We have both had different experiences. I’m not going to be dogmatic about this. However I can’t un- hear what I’ve heard for years and I certainly can’t expect your experience to change your perspective however ASR to me is very dogmatic. There are no exceptions to their position that only measurements matter and they seem unwilling to use the best measurement possible - their own ears. And if they do then we’re back to the different ways we perceive sound and more specifically music. Another possibility is that those of us who are “ subjective” oriented may be sensitive to and listen to reproduction characteristics that are not important to “objective” minded listeners. I’ve always believed there is a distinct difference between hearing music and listening. It’s a matter of degree of focus. Focus that is directed towards specific presentation characteristics. ASR offers a service that has value. Specification testing is important to verify a manufacturer’s claims. But to say that the specifications of audio equipment will always tell you exactly how it will sound is short sighted I initially went to ASR 4 years ago when I was getting back into audio. They led me to the Benchmark products which are highly revered there. So I bought the Benchmark stack : Amp, Pre, DAC. Great products especially for the money and of course they measure impeccably. When looking for speakers I heard other products with the speakers I bought. I realized even though Benchmark measured off the charts other products actually sounded better. After upgrading and confirming at home I went back to ASR to report that I found other amplifiers that sounded noticeably better than Benchmark even though stated specs were not as high as the Benchmark. Well the dogmatic tidal wave hit me and called me delusional. It was untenable to them. All amps once given level of basic specs are met all sound the same. There was no room for even consideration. It was like I was threatening their perception of reality. I had just experienced auditions of two or three amps with my speakers, DAC and streamer and they all sounded different and better than the Benchmark I had. So where does that leave us? We just have to go our separate ways. Those of us who have experienced these differences in amps, cables etc will enjoy the hobby and our search for more life like reproduction. Those who feel comfortable with living by the spec will enjoy their equipment knowing they have a component that meets their measurements criteria. I would never label the ASR group as delusional as they seem to think us subjective minded are. I just think they are unfortunately missing out on the greater improvement and refinement that is attainable. But as I noted those types of musical characteristics we are sensitive to may not be the ones important for them.
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The OP was very gracious about my criticism of power cords so we can agree to disagree. But to the person who said I was arrogant I beg to differ. What can be more arrogant than to dismiss science in favor of pure subjectivity? I think the OP would be best advised to put the money into speakers where improvements are audible. I hope he will read some reviews and comments on the unjustly maligned ASR. I thought my comments might be useful because I did the power cord thing hook, line, and sinker. Then, after a lot of listening and afterwards reading, realized it was nothing. I willingly admit that some of these luxury items look very cool but that isn’t why people buy them. Show me a measurable, quantifiable difference, something other than what the manufacturer supplies, and I will look again. |
@ rtorchia
Thanks for sharing your life-long experience, Two thumbs up!!! Stay healthy... |
@rtorchia Well then don’t make a statement like you did when the OP has already said he heard significant improvements upgrading a couple of his PCs because your comment comes across as arrogant and is utterly useless in this instance. Sometimes it’s better to say nothing at all. |
@rtorchia Sorry didn’t mean to offend you in anyway. Like you I have been an audiophile for over 50 years and learned many years ago how cables can change a system. We just have had different ways of listening and from my perspective I just don’t know how anyone can’t not hear these differences. They are so obvious. But I guess we all have different sensitivities to these differences or listen for different characteristics in a system. |
"I readily admit that these designer power cords look beautiful, but don't sound any different than a standard power cord. That is a legitimate opinion and many audiophiles subscribe to it. " - You are absolutely entitled to your opinion, however don't inject it into a thread that the OP just wants suggestions from others on a PC for a specific amplifier. He clearly doesn't share your view or your arrogant attitude. You made it clear that you tried aftermarket cords and didn't hear much of a difference. That sir, doesn't mean that others don't. Everyone hears differently and brains interpret differently. Neither side is right or wrong, it just is. |
Because I don't believe in power cords the OP told me: @rtorchia You clearly do not know how to listen or listen to music and recordings that would never allow discrimination, have a system that can’t resolve the differences or have never tried a better cable. Cables make a difference. Sometimes not for the better but they do make a difference and when you get the right one the improvement is clearly evident.
I am 73 years old and have been a music lover and audiophile for over half a century. During that time I have owned numerous classic and high level components. Many of my friends were audiophiles and heard their equipment. I was in the music and hi-fi business while in college and graduate school. Yes, I listen to a lot of music and don't take kindly to being told I don't know how to do so. Yes, I owned some fancy power cords that I was extremely pleased to sell. Why? Because I didn't hear an iota of a difference. But I must confess that I am an ASR enthusiast and believe in science. I readily admit that these designer power cords look beautiful, but don't sound any different than a standard power cord. That is a legitimate opinion and many audiophiles subscribe to it. |
@pennfootball71 Haven’t upgraded the cable on my power amplifier yet. If I do I will probably spend a lot more on that cable. @rtorchia You clearly do not know how to listen or listen to music and recordings that would never allow discrimination, have a system that can’t resolve the differences or have never tried a better cable. Cables make a difference. Sometimes not for the better but they do make a difference and when you get the right one the improvement is clearly evident. |
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@r27y8u92 If you have a decent system you are missing out on what a power cable may do for you. I spent a small amount about $300 per cable for my DAC and Streamer. The change or should I say improvement was Not subtle. Soundstage on my Streamer was clearly much better. Depth of image improved. The DAC offered more refinement in the high frequencies and in general these cables eliminated the power issues I was having that were probably due to noise. Swapping better quality 10 gauge cables for the thin stock did the trick. Try it you might be surprised. |
To anyone: First of all, can anyone tell how the good power cable is better than not-so-good cable, in terms of scientific description? (rather than "feeling better, ...", "just really better") If you are not old (younger than 50 years old), then you can tell some subtle sonic differences changing some gears including cables. But, BUT, if you old or older than 50, most of you cannot hear very subtle changes because your hearing sense have become weakened by the nature of living creature! Please, do not try to think that "this expensive one should improve my system, because it is expensive, I don't know the mechanism, but they must make well." Many people say "only trust your ear". Both true and not true. Anyway I do not waste my money for the any company who sells unnecessarily expensive stuff. Unnecessarily expensive stuff? One example = power cable of $100 or higher price. |
I tend to look at it from this point of view. We all know you can’t listen to a power cord, but of course, you can listen to how your system sounds with different power cords. So from now on when I talk about how power cords sound, you should know I’m really talking about how it effects the sound in my system. That said, I’m currently using a full loom of Audio Envy Ocean-Expanded power cords in my modest system. N |
“Once the amplifier is broken in I do plan to try a few with the Cable Company which is near me. ” I suspect a sub $500 power cord will yield a meaningful upgrade. Given your system, you would need to look beyond your budget. I am sure you know the importance of a good PC on Integrated which happens to draw the most current and heart of your system. Either stick with stock cord or go all out…just don’t half-ass it (no pun intended). |
@ghdprentice it’s like a label on a mattress. If you remove it you will go to jail. |
You have great and revealing equipment so not surprised your hearing the PC differences. I've had great experience with Shunyaya power cords. The Gamma is $498, so at your price. TheCableCo.com does 30 day free trials and they're very helpful. They have helped me with good advice and appropriate recommendations. Once your Accuphase is broken in it might be good to contact them and see what they recommend and do a trial. |
They’ll just have you eat fugu sushi prepared by a trainee. |
Wow PROHIBITED by who? Doesn't make sense at all... It would make sense if there were a warning states use of cheap power cords like 22awg are prohibited since they are dangerous. but we're talking about 10awg aftermarket power cables on amazon. A question for you what's the definition of "aftermarket power cords"? |
"The most likely reason they recommend staying with the supplied PC is liability. The system has been tested / certified with that PC, and no others." - That is correct, when I was in the business, years ago I sold high end electronics and after market power cords where only being produced by a couple dozen providers. We had this exact conversation back then. The three electronic companies I represented all provided UL approved cords only. It had to say that on the cord for the companies protection. |
The most likely reason they recommend staying with the supplied PC is liability. The system has been tested / certified with that PC, and no others. The only time I've heard a really noticeable improvement in power cables is adding a used 20 amp Voodoo Infinity to my T+A integrated. Half price at $575. Either use thecableco.com or buy used and resell if you don't like it. |
zlone, if you have the money the NEOTech rectangular OCC is even better than the round if you go on the NeoTech site just look up rectangular cable they have two the Amazon which is the silver rectangular OCC which is crazy expensive and the Sahara which is the copper rectangular OCC wire I upgraded my whole loom to the rectangular OCC and what a difference, but if you really want to hear the biggest difference put your speakers on Townshend podiums they stop the vibration from going back into the speaker and the improvement was mind-blowing Best upgrade I've ever done. |
DM @jfrmusic and ship those AE Cords if he is up for it. They are not doing any good sitting in your garage. BTW, I had no trouble reselling my AE power cords on USAM at 40% off retail. |
@zuesman +1. I am working towards and all OCC loom, currently a mix of Wireworld and Acoustic Zen. Geometry matters too of course, but it makes sense to me that OCC could make a real difference. My experience has been very positive so far, though mostly in the speaker and interconnect space.
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If the rest of your system is on the same or higher level as your amp, I don’t think you should start with a price limit. Though I have not used the service, this might be the place to start as they might have some advice based on experience with your amp and system: https://www.thecableco.com/lending-library
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If you are trying to stay under $500 - For the past few years, I have been using ANTICABLES Level-3 Power Chords and am quite pleased with them. They sound better than stock chords and start at a sensible $330 (more $ for longer lengths). I have never used their Level 2 Power Chords. I have no affiliation. If you want, here is the link: Level 3 Power Cord (anticables.com) |
