Need help choosing a new DAC

I 2nd the Musician Pegasus. Contact Rob at AudioArt Cables. I think it comes with a 1 week trial period so you can check it out.

rob@audioartcable.com

@52356 I just did a Google search for HDCD and it looks like HDCD decoding has been reversed engineered.  You can now rip a HDCD using a plugin and play it through a modern DAC.  I'm going to give it a try tomorrow on the 2/26/77 Dave's Picks

Merason , Sonnet should definitely be on your short list. I looked at both and very impressed 

Your willingness and desire to audition the candidates will serve you well. I would  add to the several who have spoken in favor of the Yggdrasil, and in particular I would recommend the new "less-is-more" variant. I predict it will eventually be the only variant as it has proven to be very popular. Your statement that you prefer musicality over measurements means you are exactly who this DAC is made for. I also highly recommend that you leave it powered on 24/7 for at least a week before you listen critically. I will just say that it has taken me out of the DAC market for several years at the very least. It's sublime.

@yyzsantabarbara 100% second those recommendations.

Gustard X26 Pro for $1,500 is excellent!

Musetec 005 is my current DAC $3,200'ish and is just brilliant.

Love seeing all the recommendation, spurs on my reading.

Good luck! @terrapin77 

@terrapin77 

A very good choice you have made. Let's face it, you've received a plethora of really good choices and yet there's even more. You could randomly select from the recommendations and choose a winner. I will say that the used Aqua La Voce S3 DAC is a wow at 2800.00

Charles 

Someone should jump on that La Voce S3.  I already have one, or I would.

Great build and SQ from Gustard.  And you can buy new underwear with the 1K you saved!  

Something to be said about budgets.  Forget about them!  Buy something that makes you feel like you got a big improvement or you will be upgrading again way too soon.  Do you want your kids to get all that money that you saved?  Spend some and enjoy it.  Life is too short, at least at my age.

The AM Tubadour 3 SE has been purchased.  Got it for $1795.  That La Voce S3 at $2800 was tempting, but it was more than I wanted to be spend at the moment.  Other than finishing treating my room, I'm done spending money on audio for a while. 

@boxcarman I wish I could do that. I got into a bad financial situation about 20 years ago by ignoring budgets and being reckless with spending. Once I dug myself out of that hole, I promised myself I would never repeat those past mistakes.

@boxcarman I wish I could do that. I got into a bad financial situation about 20 years ago by ignoring budgets and being reckless with spending. Once I dug myself out of that hole, I promised myself I would never repeat those past mistakes.

Understood! You know what's best for your situation. Congratulations again on acquiring the Audio Mirror Tubadour.

Charles

@charles1dad Thanks!  I'm very happy with my current system. Hopefully, the Tubadour DAC will be that.missing.piece.  The Don Sachs preamp and D-Sonic amp were definitely a great upgrade from my old Adcom components.  And the Gunned MMGs destroy my old AR speakers.  The ARs are now in my office system because I will never sell them. .They were the first speakers I bought back in 94 and at this point have sentimental value to me. 

A lot to take in!   I listen to solely R&R, loudly, large room. Current system is Tekton DI's, SVS SB 4000 sub, Audiolab 6000CDT, Benchmark LA-4 Line Amp and a Benchmark DAC3B, Peachtree AMP 500  First and only DAC so far. May try in in a secondary system soon, while looking at another, MAYBE. A lot of GREAT choices and suggestions, Thanks to all.  Just want to share one thought, The Benchmark DAC 3B was a huge difference maker, WOW, just can't describe the audible difference, I could use all the terms, holographic, etc. But a huge difference, so audibly noticeable.  I believe a lot had to do with their line amp (LA-4)   30 day free trial, Made in NY  Very happy!   Robert TN

I really like my Exogal Comet Plus DAC can be used as a pre amp and can control two subs Lots of connection options and designed by the Waldi engineers Cost is $3,500 with separate power supply and l think just under $3,000 without

+1 for the Schiit Yggdrasil. I have had many, the Yggi is amazing for the money.

Fellow Deadhead here... 

I posed the DAC selection question to Schiit just yesterday and here is their (surprising) response:

I would like to incorporate a standalone DAC in my rig and was looking for suggestions.  Your prices are all very reasonable.  The top end Yggdrasil is a stretch, but I would be comfortable with the price of the Gungnir or lower.  If the Yggdrasil is heads above / end game DAC, I would consider it.  Looking to improve soundstage and 3 dimensional sound.

Also, I've been told that different tubes on my Freya+ would improve soundstage.  Could you recommend any tube upgrades?

My Rig:

Node 2i (Streamer/Dac)

Freya + Pre-amp

Krell Duo 300 XD Amp

Klipsch Forte IVs Speakers

SVS 4000 Sub

Music Taste:

High db listening to dynamic music

Rock, Jazz, Electronic

RESPONSE:

Tom E (Schiit Audio)

Dec 28, 2021, 9:21 PST

Hello,

In my opinion, I would go with the Bifrost 2. It's an outstanding DAC, maybe even better than the Gungnir in some aspects. Here is a link that you may find helpful as well:

https://www.schiit.com/guides/choosing-a-dac 

All the Best,
Tom E.

Well, well, well u can never tell

Congrats on your purchase of the AM Tubadour . I truly enjoy mine.

I actually own a Benchmark DAC3, MHDT Balanced Pagoda, and Schitt Yggdrasil.

Each is in different systems: the Benchmark directly into a Parasound A23+, the Yggdrasil into a McIntosh MA252, and the Pagoda into a Conrad Johnson ET3SE then into a Pass XA30.8. However, I have traded the three DACs around using the various amps/preamps so I believe I can compare them to some degree.

The Benchmark is very neutral and detailed. Very solid performer in every way.

The Pagoda is almost as detailed as the Benchmark but more fluid. Music, especially vocals, has more depth and wonderful tonality. 

The Yggdrasil is a fine DAC but does not have the detail of the Benchmark or the great tonality of the Pagoda.

The MHDT Pagoda is easily my favorite DAC of the three.

@terrapin77 -2/26/77, Swing Auditorium. Epic show that kicks off a wonderful run of performances. 

If you enjoy detail and accuracy in your music I don’t think that you could do any better than demoing a Chord Qutest. I think it’s the best sounding DAC at its price point. And given your budget getting one either new or used would leave you room to purchase quality interconnects and other peripherals that might come in handy to compliment your system. 

Hey there @terrapin77.  Am very curious about your thoughts on your new DAC and how much difference the big step up makes.  I'm a fellow SMSL user, though a little beat down the line at the Sanskrit 10th mkII.  It's cheap but it's great, does DSD very well which you should look into for classic rock and jazz, plenty available.  Well, the Tubadour III SE does DSD to PCM conversion "on the fly", so I guess not native.  But your SMSL does!  IMO it spanks PCM up and down the street.

FYI there's only 4 Dead albums on SACD, done by MFSL: Workingman's Dead, American Beauty, Blues For Allah, and From the Mars Hotel.  The first 2 sound incredible like they do in any format. The last 2 not so much, and I much prefer live versions of those songs anyways.  I have the 24-192 versions of some '77-78 Betty Board stuff, love the Get Shown the Light box, but the hi-res is barely distinguishable from redbook.  Maybe I need a better DAC.  This is a great thread, I have my eye on the Denafrips Pontus II for a (far in the) future purchase.

+1  Pontus ll.

@drewdawg999 The DAC is currently in transit.  I will let you know my thoughts on it once I get a chance to listen to it. 

@Terrapin77,

I wrote this before realizing that you had already pulled the trigger. 

My DS2 doesn’t have a balanced in, but you can get balanced to RCA conversion connectors, and that’s what I use on the outputs of my Yggdrasil. If you are not in a big hurry, I have a Yggdrasil Less is More board coming in a few months, the updated Unison USB in a couple of days, and a Holo Audio Spring 3 in 5 weeks give or take. The Holo supposedly spanks the Pontus II, which I was originally thinking of buying. So, if you are not in an awful rush, I should be able to give you my input in a few months. From what I gather though, they lay out this way.

1. Yggdrasil OG

Tied for second are the less is more, and the Spring 3 for detail retrieval.

The less is more is supposed to be more "pleasant" to listen to, which I suspect means that the highs are slightly muted, and the Spring I understand is similar. The better than Yggdrasil OG DACs are supposed to be the Holo Audio May, and the Dumfries Terminator I believe it is called, and I believe that one reviewer claimed that the Dumfries Terminator sounded better than the Holo May.

The Yggdrasil is the first component that I have had in my system that I absolutely needed an isolation transformer due to noise on my AC. I may have been able to benefit from one before, but I thought all of the power conditioning and various power cables were snake oil before out of desperation I tried an isolation transformer on the Yggdrasil. The highs were ear bleeding hot, but to my disbelief the isolation transformer cleared up that issue.

Anyway, having the DS2 I am assuming that you love neutrality, so that we then share the desire for a precise playback. Therefore we may share similar taste in DACs. The Yggdrasil with the older, less capable analog card was reviewed as sounding better than 13K and even an 80K DAC if memory serves. It’s no more perfect than is any piece of equipment, but it is pretty darned good.

 I had an original Bifrost that I used with a Chromecast plugged into my Oppo 105 just to get introduced and familiar with streaming, mainly Spotify. This would be feeding my Rogue Athena, Cary cad-200 and a pair of Totem Forests.It was def smoother than the dac in the 105. Knowing I was about to begin a long journey, eventually upgraded to a Bluesound node 2i, which allowed me to then start with Qobuz. I finally picked up a Yggdrasil and feel like it could really stay for awhile. The definition and quality improvement has really been amazing. I must also give credit to the Forests, as they have revealed every change I have made, thankfully for the better, including cable changes.

If u can find a used audio Note Kit dac, 2.1 or 4.1 it would be worth your while to try the out.  They ooze musicality, but very simple w no mqa, or OS,, etc.

+1 for the Frerot.  Incredibly good for the price.  I have one w a external power supply for sale...if interested, give me a shout.

Good luck in ur search.

I have the MHDT Orchid (with choice of 2 "rolled" NOS tubes for the buffer circuit) and heartily recommend this DAC. It sounds wonderful, is very compact, and allows tube swaps in the buffer circuit. 

NOS is the way to go in digital, and this is one of the most reasonable options around if you're not intent on getting DSD, MQA, or any other acronyms in your system. 

If it’s digital then strongly consider HiFi Rose.   I have heard and listened to a huge amount of very very good dacs.  These are streamers,preamp dacs. The sound and usability of these units are magical!  I have never heard a product that has had such a profound effect on my system.   I bought the rs150b and I’m still in shock how good it is.    Just my 2 cents but check it out for yourself.   
 

Regards,  j

@lous,

The name of the company in question is"Denafrips"

mr-m,

Thanks, I like to forget that name for some reason, so much so that I am no longer aware that I have done it...

I would look at the Holo Audio DACs. They are ladder DACs like the Denafrips but have remote control and displays. They get great reviews.

@terrapin77:

Given your desire for "musicality", the Aqua could very well be to your liking BUT be aware that the S2 and S3 versions reputedly sound quite different!  I have not heard both but the consensus seems to be that the S3 is brighter and more "lively" -- not as overtly "warm" as the S2. 

The fact that you have a tube pre-amp might favor the S3-- the S2 might be "too much of a good thing"-- but you will only know by listening. 

I own the S2 and for awhile, came close to selling it, due to an annoying "cloudiness" I heard in the system's lower mids/upper bass region.

Another A'gon member had asserted this was typical of the S2. However, when I upgraded my integrated, this "cloudiness" went away. 

I simply mention this to underscore that every component makes a difference and that the same DAC in different systems may present quite differently.

Another reason to try before you buy! 

@stuartk I ended up buying an Audio Mirror Tubadour III SE and it delivers tomorrow.  If I end up up not liking it, the Aqua S3 is definitely on my radar.

@terrapin77:

In that case, I hope you love the A. Mirror  ;o) 

The AM Tubadour III SE delivered today.  Been listening for a few hours and my initial impression is very positive. It's a very organic and natural sounding DAC. Pairs nicely with the Don Sachs preamp. 

Congratulations on your new purchase. Don’t forget to avoid trying to draw conclusions on its sound until after at least 200 hours of play. Break in has a significant impact… taking the edge off the treble and improving bass… making it sound more natural. It is really easy to be really happy, then notice and edge you don’t like and be dissatisfied before it is even broken in. 
 

Do leave your system on and try not to draw any negative observations for a week or two.

@tterrapin77

Congratulations!!! 

You re off to a very good start given your initial listening impression. I believe that it will only improve moving forward. I do not believe that edgy/bright colorations will be an issue with the particular DAC and preamplifier you have. I strongly suspect that this pairing will prove to be exceptionally natural,  full tonal body along with very good resolution. 

Charles 

@ghdprentice Thanks!  The person I bought it from said it has around 1000 hours on it.  He never used the USB input so that path will need some break in. 

@charles1dad Thanks! Definitely not edgy/bright colorations with the DAC. Other than upgrading the crossovers on my maggies to Peter Gunn's latest recommendation, I'm fairly certain that I have the system that will provide many years of listening enjoyment!!

I have an MHDT labs Steeplechase 2 for my mac and a Kora Hermes, also tube output, that I absolutely love, for everything else.

I have had less than stellar results with the Schitt gear

If you ever looked under the hood of an Audio Mirror you wouldn't buy it.

The Kora is built by French Aerospace engineers and it looks and sounds it.

I know a lot of people like Audio Mirror, a lot of people drink Budweiser too...

Best of luck!!

@terrapin77

I noticed you said you had no interest in DSD. I too once had that sentiment. I had no music locally stored that was DSD. However, my LKS DAC MH-DA004 was capable of handling DSD512 so I was intrigued to find some of these files to see how good the sound was. Wow what an amazing difference it was.

Once I delved down this path, I eventually found that upsampling everything to DSD512 was stellar. I accomplished this through Roon/Tidal/Local/HQPlayer/Mac Mini M1. I really can’t believe how good even mediocre 44K CD rips sound now.

I listen to a broad range of music from Classic rock Led Zep Grateful Dead,1960's Jazz, Adele Norah Jones etc. I'd highly suggest trying upsampling, you may like what you hear

Playback Design Dream Series Dacs, if you wish to stop the merry go round

Very Musical, ultra low Fatigue for a Digital System, Using propertery connection No USB. Designed by a Audio Legend.

Did i say Very Musical? I prefered this Dac to DCS and MSB.

Wadax? Not sure never heard priced over 150K ++ for Streamer and DAC, What happens in 5 years with the Tech?

Personally, I can’t wait to hear the new Mojo Audio DAC coming out soon. The last couple of iterations have been musically satisfying and engaging. Ben says the latest one is quite a bit more refined

I sold my AudioMirror Tubadour recently replacing it with a Pontus 2.

I had the Ares last year and enjoyed it but felt I had "cheated out" 

and should move up.

Bottom line- The Audio Mirror Sound is perhaps less detailed

but just as enjoyable as the Pontus. 

The Holo May is priced with the Terminator so these are about double

the other models being discussed.