LOOKING TO IMPROVE THE ACOUSTICS OF MY LISTENING ROOM

What’s wrong with the room? Or, are you reacting to what you’ve read?

Create a Virtual System with photos to give a better idea.

Took a picture of my system with my i phone and could not create the virtual. Was really looking for someone to meet with me and maximize my room. There is science to this and I believe there is no substitute for someone with technical knowledge to help me. Trying myself, putting tube traps in corners, absorption panels here and diffusers there is only guessing and trial and error at best.   Thnak you.

I'd give another try to create a virtual system. I is easy. I see you have Created a Virtual System... only with contents empty. It would be very helpful for us to see it and know all your components. You probably do not need an engineer... although there are always folks ready to do so. 

There’s so much variance in rooms and their acoustics - I can understand why you’d like in-person technical advice (I have no suggestions). In light of this, you could spend some time submitting the free GIK Acoustic Advice form found here which may point you in the right direction. I’ve found that there recommendations are a little heavy handed in respect to absorption and level of panels, which seems to lean towards pro studios vs “normal” shared listening environments. Members here may disagree with this last statement.

An acoustic engineer or someone competent and experienced in listening spaces would of course be ideal - and something that would have been greatly beneficial for me as well (historically and currently).

Here's a video on the topic of the acoustic treatment of listening rooms that Danny Richie of GR Research posted on YouTube just yesterday:

https://youtu.be/rKhcABvL7tc?si=NpH3zZ5TIdjXHFbD

Given your location, you might look for a Pro Studio designer who can create a specific plan for your room. GIK is a good online resource and has quality products but every room is unique and an experienced designer can take your budget and customize a solution. 

Very smart question from someone who is doing it the right way.  I was in the same place as you.  I was starting a listening room from scratch and a dealer recommended treating the room first and then working out the equipment.  Best advice I ever got.  

The dealer worked with Viacoustic and sent my room specs to have recommendations made.  Viacoustic came back with a comprehensive, fully modeled schematic to optimize the room.  I followed the guidance and was very, very pleased with the results after installing treatments.

Money well spent that gave me confidence that spending hard earned money on electronics will yield the best possible return.

My best advice is don't half-ass the room treatments, get professional help, then enjoy your room.  I'm not all that far from you and if you would like a tour of my room hit me up.  Good luck and cheers. 

"The room can make or totally wreck a system" discussion posted by hilde45 today

m

ay be a good way to start.

I have two 2-channel systems, one with flexibility in placement of components (dedicated listening space), the other inflexible (living room).  I was not happy with the sound in either space.  In my listening room, I played extensively with speaker placement and ultimately settled on a location that sounded best.  But it still didn't sound right, lacking the tight bass I was used to, and fatiguing when I look back.  I decided to invest in Dirac Live (via MiniDSP) and wow, what a life changer.  Best money I ever spent in audio, like a veil being removed from the music.  Thousands of dollars spent on an audio system cannot guarantee good sound if your room isn't up to the task.  I experienced all the benefits advertised by Dirac.  I am now onto my third MiniDSP unit, for my HT.  

I should have added that one of the negative aspects of the MiniDSP in my setup is that I no longer play any of my DSD files because Dirac only processes PCM.  But the incredible improvement in sound I obtain with Dirac far surpasses any theoretical advantages that DSD brings to the music.

What would really help is to know what exactly are you experiencing sound wise in your room with your system. I have corner bass traps at my ceiling corners and (2) GIK Absorption Panels on the wall behind my listening sofa. I also made sure to have some absorption material behind my system to absorb rear reflections due to the size and shape of my room. Carpet on the Floor, Thick Drapes and almost nothing that has a reflective surface to it as well. I had to correct a 50hz Bump that was sending havoc in my SQ all the way up to 100hz…Finally ended up replacing my Maggi’s to CUSTOM Built Soundfield Audio MMW-1’s that incorporate DSD and was able to tune the speakers to my acoustically treated room. At this point and not to sound prejudiced, but I and numerous audiophiles who’ve come to check out my system at a recent audiophile society listening session event hosted at my home felt it was one one the best sounding set ups they’ve heard and could not believe what I was able to accomplish sound wise in my room. Note: I went through 11 pairs of speakers prior in my room over the past 5 years driving myself, my wife and the many manufacturers crazy with returns… Finally I’m happy, It’s a journey.

This is why I ask, COULD IT BE SYSTEM SYNERGY ?  You can over do it with room treatments, best to start slow but if you don’t know what YOU need FOR YOUR EARS to correct then you really have no starting point. You may need Defusers, You May Need Absorbers, You May Need Bass Traps… Without knowing what you’re looking to achieve and just reading over and over “Acoustic Treatment” in numerous posts you could be sending yourself into a whole other rabbit hole in addition to the one you started with your Equipment. LOL 

If you send room pictures to GIK Acoustics, they can make suggestions. 

@kjl1065 

This is a very wise step wanting to consult a professional. Most people here want to do it themselves. I hired an acoustician to design my room and I built it while my speakers were being built. I knew I didn’t have the knowledge to try it myself and wanted to get it right the first time. I strongly recommend a consultation with Jeff at hdacoustics. He is very good and I am extremely happy with my room. You want to control your room not let it control you. You won’t spend years guessing what goes where. Good luck!

I was in your situation and what I did was use GIK’s online resources and they had a sound engineer working with me. It’s basically free and relevant consulting.

On their website, you request a free recommendations/estimation and you submit drawings with measurements and photos.

Naturally, the more detailed your drawing(s), and the more photos you can provide the better and more accurate their recommendations can be.

I think this will give you a very good, if not final so at least a solid first, idea about what type of treatments, absorbers/bass traps versus diffusers, for example would be useful for you.

like many things, I think it’s the 80/20 rule – you can get quite far this way and then you need to spend a whole lot more time, money and effort to get further but the nice thing is that you can decide on that later, after you’ve taken this first step

Good luck.

I strongly recommend a consultation with Jeff at hdacoustics. He is very good and I am extremely happy with my room.

Because your room was initially overdamped, you added diffusion down the road, if I remember. Was that because he didn't suggest it or because you decided to not take his advice at the start? Because if he didn't suggest diffusion at the beginning, that, in my opinion, was a mistake on his part. 

I used GIK and then was able to speak with them on the phone to help me further understand the process and what would work.  The size of room and type of speakers are all factors you must consider. My space is small and am using Martin Logan Electrostatic speakers, being dipole speakers a lot of sound is going towards the front wall, given my small space controlling that was huge so absorption on the front wall was key.   
bottomline I think GIK’s free advice is a great place to start and do speak with them directly, don’t just take the recommendation and run with it. 
made a huge difference in my room.  

Check out acoustic treatments from Synergistic Research before spending a ton on other things.

Get the better sound book

Or call the author and book an appointment. Rather than chase trial and error solutions he can give you a specific plan

@kjl1065 I used Music City Acoustics to come up with a plan. They, like some others, will come up with a plan for no charge. For some simple work on your part like photos and measurements the result will be wonderfully successful. I did a very deep dive (on vendors, reflections and how to treat)  before selecting this company. Additionally I hired a finish carpenter to hang panels and the laser levels were his guide. 

Yup. GIK!

@hilde45 

I don’t believe the room was over damped at any time. It is just controlled. Most people are just used to hearing the colored sound that many reflections cause and they think that is the correct way to have the room. The sound was fantastic but I got to wondering what some diffusion would sound like. Jeff designed up the panels and told me exactly where to mount them. They did fill the room with sound better than without the panels but I could have been happy either way. 

I have had people come over and tell me my room is over damped when their system is in the corner of the  family room with windows and is open to other rooms with no control over anything. Or in the basement where their system comes in a distant second place to everything else.  

Here are two company's in NY to contact that will provide a pro design for a fee:

Truephonic (Steve Sockey)

WSDG (multiple designers)

Both are well regarded and design pro studios, listening rooms and theaters. 

There is no room that is acoustically correct without treatments. Rugs and drapes are not very good and could actually make your room to dead. You need a mix of absorption and diffusion. All corners will accumulate bass, this can be wall corners, soffit corners. Then there are 1st reflection points: in front of speakers on the floor, ceiling, side and the 1st reflection point for the opposite speaker.

The room is 1 of the most important pieces of an audio system

@ronboco 

I don’t believe the room was over damped at any time.

My mistake. I thought that's why you added diffusion.

If it sounds better with diffusion, what would you say has changed for the better?

@hilde45 

Actually I’m not totally sure if it’s better or just different. When you came over to listen the soundstage was well past the speakers in width  ( per a well recorded song ). Instruments were nicely separated throughout. But the music didn’t wrap around to the sides and behind like it does now. Maybe I should remove them to see which way I really like better. 

@OP Please post a photo of your room in your virtual system. It's impossible to offer any advice without seeing your room.