audition Teac & OPPO Sonica also
I need a new DAC! Advice/Recommendations?
The good old Cambridge Dacmagic is finally done for, making this the last product from CA in my collection. My gut combined with a general understanding of quality (I bought used and owned it for six months) tells me to stay away from Cambridge Audio, but I did enjoy the sound from that DAC. It's probably one of the better things they made in my opinion. After a short, but good sounding run with the DAC it appears the unit needs servicing, harsh audible distortion at anything over -10bd. We all know it's not worth servicing , which leads me to my next point:
What Next?
A little about me; I'm young with excellent ears, I produce, mix, and critically listen to music everyday of my adult life. I knew the dacmagic was going to be a stepping stone into High End audio, so no, I don't want the dragonfly. Moreover, I don't want something that's only powered via USB with an rca out. I'd like something with a few input options to run my audio interface with preferably XLR inputs. Sample rate is not of huge importance to me. DSD compatibility would be nice. Something that's made in house would also be nice for quality control purposes. Id also really like this next dac purchase to be an investment and last for a long time.
My budget: $1000 give or take, probably $1500 max.
My current ideas in no particular order:
1. The Naim dac v1 because Naim has the reputation of lasting forever, sounding great, and it just looks so good. I've never heard this one, but unless it's like the NAC 112 in regards to sound I'd probably be satisfied. Also, the idea of being able to use a nap 100 and the v1 alone is promising, possibly adding a stageline when I'm in the mood for vinyl.
2. The Rega DAC-R because it's Rega. Not a lot needs to be said in that regard. I also have the brio-r so the remote feature would be nice. (Neither one mentioned so far have XLR)
3. The musical fidelity dac M1. It seems to fit bill with what I want, and the price is reasonable considering it's age. The only concern I have is the quality control being made in Taiwan.
Other ideas include, w4s's dac v2, building my own DAC and gaining solder practice at the same time, and getting a life outside of posting on Audiogon for DAC recommendations.
Any help or for that matter any response at all would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks for the help!
What Next?
A little about me; I'm young with excellent ears, I produce, mix, and critically listen to music everyday of my adult life. I knew the dacmagic was going to be a stepping stone into High End audio, so no, I don't want the dragonfly. Moreover, I don't want something that's only powered via USB with an rca out. I'd like something with a few input options to run my audio interface with preferably XLR inputs. Sample rate is not of huge importance to me. DSD compatibility would be nice. Something that's made in house would also be nice for quality control purposes. Id also really like this next dac purchase to be an investment and last for a long time.
My budget: $1000 give or take, probably $1500 max.
My current ideas in no particular order:
1. The Naim dac v1 because Naim has the reputation of lasting forever, sounding great, and it just looks so good. I've never heard this one, but unless it's like the NAC 112 in regards to sound I'd probably be satisfied. Also, the idea of being able to use a nap 100 and the v1 alone is promising, possibly adding a stageline when I'm in the mood for vinyl.
2. The Rega DAC-R because it's Rega. Not a lot needs to be said in that regard. I also have the brio-r so the remote feature would be nice. (Neither one mentioned so far have XLR)
3. The musical fidelity dac M1. It seems to fit bill with what I want, and the price is reasonable considering it's age. The only concern I have is the quality control being made in Taiwan.
Other ideas include, w4s's dac v2, building my own DAC and gaining solder practice at the same time, and getting a life outside of posting on Audiogon for DAC recommendations.
Any help or for that matter any response at all would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks for the help!
50 responses Add your response
No DSD but if you're looking for something made in-house with QC then take a look at Shiit (http://schiit.com/) - especially the multibit models if you listen to mostly CDs. |
This one kills for the money: http://www.audiogon.com/listings/da-converters-hegel-hd12-dac-2017-06-28-digital Read the reviews. They are true. Dave |
+1 Ayre Codex DAC. I own the Ayre Codex DAC and it is Outstanding and highly recommended (new or used). https://www.ayre.com/codex.htm |
Do you need Variable out ? if not this little gem is outstanding https://www.vinshineaudio.com/product-page/denafrips-ares-r2r-dac Theres a few interface setbacks - the indicator LED's are microscopic and the legend is dark Gray ink on Black. SQ is outstanding Good Listening Peter |
Don't be quick to dismiss Cambridge. Yes, you had a failure. Any brand can have that. I have had and still do have a Cambridge CD Player with accessible DAC's. Had a 840-C and still have a 851C. Both player/Dac's have been as reliable as the rising sun, ten years running.....Cambridge has a Dac called the 851N I believe. A highly rated Dac at a reasonable price that can compete with the big boys. |
Lots of good Dacs out there in and around that price range as you can see from all the various recommendation. My suggestion, buy used and buy smart so you can audition, resell without a loss, and audition until you find a Dac you love. It’s easy to do, Dac's being fairly small and easily shippable compared to other components. Plus it’s fun checking out different gear, at least I think so. Whichever way you go good luck and happy listening and trust your own ears! |
I agree with mr. M. I've had the Cambridge BD650 in my HT system for seven or eight years, loaned it out, got it back--never missed a beat. Use it mostly for CDs and SACDs, and the odd DVD-a. In my main system I recently added the 851N streamer and it has a killer DAC. Absolutely changed my view on Redbook CDs. I see the 851D used for less than $1,000, and it has the identical DAC as the streamer. |
@mr_m Don't be quick to dismiss Cambridge. I'd like to point out that I entered into high fidelity audio with support of Cambridge because I saw, and in certain aspects still see it's worth in the high end community as producing realistically priced equipment that sounds good. With that being said, the dacmagic wasn't my first bad experience with a Cambridge Audio product. The first being my Azur 640a integrated that went into protection mode for no apparent reason, diagnosed as a glitch, and consequently forced to disable protection mode to get the thing to amplify any signals. This is a problem that exists amongst several Cambridge users. In my opinion it's unacceptable especially in regards to the Hi-fi community where there's hundreds of manufacturers making high quality products priced around the same. Shitt, for example. Also, on both the dacmagic and the azur I had to literally break off two screws because they became so stripped that it my best option without drilling them out. I mean, the least they could do is ensure their warehouse uses quality screws. This opinion I have isn't just brand-xenophobia as much as it's first hand experience that is given more weight when you compare it to other brands. I'm not meaning to to start an argument or anything like that. I just don't want to be viewed as the "if it's not expensive it's not good" type. |
@dlcockrum @hgeifman @pbnaudio Thanks for the suggestions! I'm looking into the hegel especially. The codex seems interesting, and the r2r dac seems great! Even though I want this to be more of an investment that sits on the rack for years to come, @jond brought up a good point with getting something that holds its value. The only thing about that is apart from the big brands I'm not really certain which other DAC's are generally desired on the used market. I've seen Hegel pop up a few times, but the only dealers around me do Rega, Naim, Creek, ect, ect. So my point of reference isn't that large. |
Already many great-sounding suggestions, I’m sure. I’ll add another vote for a DAC from Schiit and in particular, the Gungnir with Multibit upgrade. New, it will come in slightly under your $1500 top budget at $1249. No XLR input but the Gungnir does have a pair of balanced XLRs OUT (as well as 2 pairs RCA out). It is a true balanced design. Inputs are BNC, Optical & RCA SPDIF + USB (now standard). It doesn’t "do" DSD as @djohnson54 also noted. Find all the info at the link to their site, below. Do note the 5 year warranty along with a 15 day in home trial period (money back less a 5% restock fee). You will need to burn in any new Gungnir a solid 10 days (at least!) processing signal 24 hrs/day to start to hear what it really "sounds" like. FWIW - I just had my Gungnir upgraded to Multibit and have been knocked out by the new and unexpected high level of performance that resulted...and I was already very happy with it before sending it in. It’s almost worth getting the stock Gungnir first ($849) so you can appreciate what the MB upgrade does. Prior experience was with a Musical Fidelity V-DAC (1st gen) in combination with their V-Link.. http://schiit.com/products/gungnir Good luck with your decision. |
I had W4S DAC-2, Rega DAC-R, Ayre Codex and Hegel HD25 on my system for extended period of time. For your budget ($1000), I'd highly recommend a used Ayre Codex or Hegel HD25. The both have some limitations such as connection ports or DSD support. But they both give you excellent sound quality compared to the their prices. |
Rega DAC-R has been in my system since November of 2015. It's the most budget-minded component I have, but it more than holds its own. There's plenty of detail to compensate for the slight euphonic coloration. I use the USB input after having compared it extensively with the optical. The DAC-R USB implementation is solid. With Audirvana as my player, I use the max upsample to feed 192khz to the Rega on all my lossless files and Tidal. I really like the component. |
I would recommend the Musical Fidelity Tri-Vista 21 Tube DAC; I'm using this tube dac with a Sony DVP-NS9100ES DVD CD player as a transport. This Musical Fidelity dac sounds very analog. Also someone mentioned above the Electrocompaniet ECD-1 dac. I have heard this dac and also liked the sound to it. |
I've heard the Ayre Codex, it's crazy good. But it has limited input features. No Coaxial,, no XLR inputs,, Optical and USB only. But that's not a deal breaker for me. And it is fully balanced with XLR output. In addition, it has an awsome power supply with a power cord. Not a wipmy wall wart. I have Ayre. Ayre does digital and does it well. If you liked the Cambridge sound, perhaps look at the Arcam D33. Lot of functionality. https://www.audiogon.com/listings/da-converters-arcam-d33-free-harmonic-tech-digital-cable-2017-07-0... N |
If you don’t need DSD there are 2 Wadia 321s on Amazon and I think they are new for around $900. This was a $3k DAC but the new di321 added DSD so you can find these new 1 to 2 year old models for cheap. I think they are basically the same as the new di321 just PCM only. I got mine for ~$1.5K when they first went on sale. It has been in service now for a year or so and I really like it. I demo’d it to a guy who lives down the block from me and he promptly bought one, haha. Build quality is rock solid but the foot print is large so that can be a negative. They made it the same size as the amp so you could do the wafer stack. |
My dac is somewhere between 12 and 9 years old. I bought it used and absolutely love it. New it was very expensive and now it is not worth much. I have a few more dacs where depreciation has killed my "investment" Why am I mentioning this. I believe that technology is improving with leaps and bounds and that dacs will improve continiously. The only way to protect yourself/ourselves against this is to get a dac that is FGPA or modular in construction so that one can get software or modular updates. One of the brands offering this is PS Audio. This is way out of your price range - but have a look at the PS Audio Jnr. As others have said - best value is to buy used. And after that if you wish to get into high res and MQAetc maybe use software rather than hardware to stay off the continous upgrade path. Good value for money can also be found in Audio GD dacs. |
Tascam DA 3000 has everything your looking for except a USB input. You would need a USB -Coaxial/AES/EBU/optical converter. It is a pro audio recorder (PCM or DSD) that can be used as an excellent dac for playback. Can be found at most pro audio dealers for about 1K or try Ebay for less $$$. http://http//tascam.com/product/da-3000/ |
Save some of your money. Get a used Rega DAC-R to match your Brio-R. Live happily ever after (or at east until you can afford to upgrade to Rega Elicit-R integrated amp). Last year I switched from separates to Rega Elicit-R and Saturn-R and I've stopped looking at electronic (I still look at speakers!). Enjoy! |
Check out the Lumin D-1 it will cost you around $1700 ,and can do pretty much anything no more digital cable, it has the upgrade as booster power supply $350, or ever a much bigger upgrade the Linesr tube Audio power supply get the upgraded cable , for around $700 Fantastic , you like myself wondered why I overlooked this excellent player. |
@jventer Yes, DAC technology is always improving. Which is why buying used is a good strategy to "move up" into better technology. But yesterday's $5,000 DACs will be easily beaten (or matched) by today's $1,000 DACs. It all depends on how much value you place on being on the 'bleeding' (i.e. latest and greatest) edge of technology? I recently sold my 2-year-old Teac UD-501 DAC to someone who was replacing the DAC he bought 12 years ago for $3,000. On Redbook CD, they were very close. But he had started to collect hi-res digital files. The difference on hi-res playback was very evident to him (and me). |
The Lumin has 2 usb inputs I just bought a T5 Samsung SS drive and it is Biasing fast the Lumin app same or similar to the Lynn. Soon, Tidal 1,000s radio stations you set it up this player is a great piece of gear. With linear Quality power supply such as the Linear Tube Audio .I bought with Audience custom wire Umbilical cord under $700 and many think better then their T-1. Just read all the accolades, before the PS upgrade. |
