There are plenty of great bargains in speaker cables.....you don’t have to spend thousands of dollars to get a good sound. My high end speaker cables (OCC copper) cost was $368 for 10FT.
Are cables really worth their high price because of their geometry?
They’re some pricey cables that have claim to fame because of the high tech geometry used in their cables.
Many of these cables have patents on specific geometry patterns used in their cables and use this as a reason their cables sound so good. For that reason, many say the reason their cables cost so much is they’re so complex . The man hours to make a pr results in their high price. That maybe true for some cables, but I’ve seen very pricey cables using the same geometry reason that look like a thin piece of wire rapped in outer jacket no thicker than a pencil. So,Is all this geometry just another way to justify their cost or is it true science that we are paying in the end?
Many of these cables have patents on specific geometry patterns used in their cables and use this as a reason their cables sound so good. For that reason, many say the reason their cables cost so much is they’re so complex . The man hours to make a pr results in their high price. That maybe true for some cables, but I’ve seen very pricey cables using the same geometry reason that look like a thin piece of wire rapped in outer jacket no thicker than a pencil. So,Is all this geometry just another way to justify their cost or is it true science that we are paying in the end?
180 responses Add your response
There's a whole Facebook group, called "Audio BS", devoted to hating exotic speaker cables. There's good reason. About 10 years ago a buddy of mine was landlord to a hi-end audio distributor. One night, he went into their space, disconnected their hi-end audio speaker cables, and wired up 24 gauge zip cord. What Radio Shack used to call "speaker wire" back some 40 years ago. He did this in such a way that it wasn't visually obvious. You had to look for it. The next day he was chatting with the guys who ran the shop and they were gushing forth about how wonderful their rig sounded that day. He left it there for a week before going back in again in the dead of night and putting things back. Save your money. |
Twisted cables tend to have higher capacitance but lower inductance on average. It's a trade off so there is no perfect solution.This isn't relevant to speaker wire used at home. The main thing is resistance as long as that's kept to less than 5% of a speakers impedance we're good. The capacitance and inductance of the wire is insignificant relative to the capacitance and inductance of the speaker. |
@b4icu So the difference in resistance, if I read you correctly, in any speaker cable is the ONLY determinant of its sound quality. Of course we are not in need to look further into the damping factor, as always the same power amp and also speaker/x-over is used. Right? 🤔 So in this my mentioned case, the cable with the second lowest resistance sounds the worst, the silber litz with 0.2 ohm. The copper braid in cotton bedded, the second 'worst' has 0.1 ohm resistance (as allways one only conductor). And the best sounding cable, the StraightWire has at 0.3 ohm the highest resistance. The DF of the Pass X350.5 is about 700, and the 3 way Burmester 961 has a linkwitz type x-over... but none of that playes into your equation. If I got your right. Something does not mesh with my present learning, looking at your very simplistic argument. At all! So, we're either not sharing the same hearing, or some other unknown influence is at work. Differences of ~100 milli-ohms at such a high damping factor, being the cause of such noticeable SQ differences, really? So, me too, let's agree to disagree 👍✔️ |
@b4icu - I think I will just say that w.r.t. cables - we will have to agree to disagree. I have received observations from dozens of people that have implemented the DIY cables i promote, in a variety of systems both tube and solid state and of varying levels of "quality" (including McIntosh) and I am yet to hear that they made little or no difference - most are ecstatic with the levels of improvement they observed. As for your statements.. What exactly justify a cable’s price of US $1,800?The answer is simple - improvement in sound quality. Maybe YOU are not willing to pay that much, but many people will What makes it a high end cable?One that provides a significant improvement in sound quality - but it does not necessarily have to be "high priced" - however in audio circles, the two does seem to go hand in hand. Would such a cable (as called high end or high cost) would fit all systems ?Quality cables will achieve improvement in most systems - but there are caveats e.g. some TOTL speaker cables that have a very high level of capacitance can cause some solid state amps to oscillate and cause internal damage - so NO - not ALL cables will be compliant with all systems Regards |
Mr. williewonka Sorry, but none of your reports were on the subject. Speaker cables do have a significance, when use a higher DF Amp. Lets say, above 150. On tube Amp’s or tube alike (McIntosh) the cables are insignificant. As the DF is very low (less than 20, maybe down to 3!) any cable would do. What exactly justify a cable’s price of US $1,800? What makes it a high end cable? Would such a cable (as called high end or high cost) would fit all systems ? |
If you only have a low end system, then Belden cables or even some zip cords should be OK. I have found that using quality cables on a system of any price will enhance the performance of that system - dramatically, - Provided you choose the cables wisely.. My $350 mini system has rudimentary speaker and power cables made up from left over pieces of wire I had lying around and it sounds so much better, even when played very loud, which was something that I could NOT do before upgrading the cables I once took one of my power cables to a store to audition a Bluesound Mini Pulse speaker - the guy at the store could not believe the improvements he heard, when I changed to my power cable - his jaw dropped. On another occasion, I was fortunate enough to be able to audition (free) a pair of IC’s (MSRP $1800) on my Bluesound Node 2 (MSRP $600) and it performed way above it’s price point - but some might consider it is ridiculous to have cables of that price on such a component. - they would probably feel more comfortable spending $1800 upgrading the component resulting in less of an improvement because their cables are "restricting" the signal I have repeatedly demonstrated the improvements cables make to friends and family, most of whom are not really into music that much - but they heard the improvements cables make The point I am trying to make is - even low end components today perform way above their price point when good cables are installed. So opting for cables that will simply "make do" may not be the best way to proceed - especially for "audiophiles" People often spend hundreds (or even thousands) on upgrading components, when they could have spent less on some decent cables and would have achieved better results. The "problem" with cable selection... - you can replace an interconnect, but if the power cable on the attached component(s) is the problem, the new IC will not demonstrate its true abilities - and the converse is is also true. As a general "approach" I advise people to start with upgrading their speaker cables - audition ask questions on this forum for the best performing speaker cables you can afford - then focus on power cables for source components - they benefit greatly with better power cables - finally, upgrade your IC's - at this point you should be able to hear significant improvements in sound quality, but it is not all due to the interconnects - the other cables play a huge role in overall system performance - then, and only then - upgrade the power cable to the amplifier But a hit and miss approach to cable selection will not do any justice to the components you own. I consider my cables more important than my components, after all they are the "conduit" for the signals that the components process - so they should be top notch as well Regards - Steve |
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Mr. kennyc
Copper purity: The industry standard for cooper used in electricity is 99.98% All left to improve between the standard cable (99.98%) and the absolute purity (do not exist!) of 100% is 0.02% No matter how much is that cost, or if there is any truth in that claim, as who can check it, but 0.02% of purity, if equals in 0.02% in conductivity, it is an absolute waist if money. Put it in a thicker cable! You will pay less and gain way more. Same BS with silver cables vs cooper cables. Silver is a better conductor, over cooper, by 5%. But as last week crude metal prices, it's 104 times more expensive. Put a thicket cooper cable by 5% and you get an equivalent of the silver cable. But you will pay so much less. All those arguments, of desperate cable makers, are BS. they may justify charging a leg and an arm for those says, but they add nothing to your sound. The sad truth is, that they have no idea what cable we need. They make a few but never said which out of their line is the one that will be best for me or you. I can! the cable can be calculated and when applied, sound improves dramatically. The explanation for why that cable is scientific. |
^^^ I agree. As I said before that the cable budget should be proportional to the overall system cost. If you only have a low end system, then Belden cables or even some zip cords should be OK. But if your system costs north of 20K or so, then you really need some high end cables so to bring out the best of your system. |
The claims of these cable manufacturers with regards to their proprietary geometries, materials, processes' effects on sound quality (ie holography) would be a lot more useful and credible if they told you what level or type of audio system was required to fully express them. Selling "holographic" cables for an unknown or mediocre system is like selling specialty racing motor oil for your Toyota corolla. I guess everyone wants to believe they can turn their system into a racecar with the right cable setup. It's just so freaking silly! |
Twisted wire will help guard against interference. I've never tried these but they look pretty well made and offer to measure the LCR for you at a reasonable price.Cable snake oil does not only belong to the high-end, but also at the low end as well. Belden is an example of low end snake oil. |
Mr. Justmetoo, why do insist on calling anticables a scam? He isn’t packaging his cables to cover up anything. If you see his cables the geometry isn’t complex and he doesn’t claim they’re. What he does do is talk about the actual conductor and how it’s drawn and how they have improved this technique to make a better sounding cable. I’ve been to anticable’s business and have seen how they produce their cables and believe me it isn’t some do at home company. |
Mr. justmetoo
At the bottom line, all that matters is the resistance of your speaker cable vs. the Amp's DF (Ro). All the descriptions of yours about the three cables, are good for Fri. eve, to tell around the coffee table, or to put asleep a kid. None has any contribution to the facts of electricity and electronics. As the speaker cable is an extension of the Amp's Ro, the speaker load is of no significance, and so are all the BS that the cable makers and sales guys spread (as a pandemic). When you get the right cable (calculated) the sound is so much better. After that, no matter what you put there, it wont match or improve. |
@williewonka As to 'anti-cables' I had some tested some time ago, that were offered to me free of charge for a trial periode, 1-2 weeks. Seeing them, I right away had a suspicion they were made up by some not so very professional folks - do they give franchises to some 'operators' ?!? 🤔 In any case, they were made up (rather crudely) of two different thicknesses of lacquered transformer wire and ever so terribly stiff! with very cheap banana type connectors, and badly fitted to boot. The sound... not very coherent and quite bright - in my system, and apparently a *very* long time of burn-in required. This whole 'episode' reminded me more of a scam than anything else. 👎 But - I can imagine, also given the most affordable price, some folk will find them A1 OK, now who am I to argue about it ? 🤔😏 |
@justmetoo - Thanks for that info - I've not heard of that cable, but from your description it sounds very similar in some respects to my Helix Cables. Another very similar cable I am aware of is the Interconnect from Anti-Cable http://anticables.com/interconnects/analog-rca-interconnects But I have no experience with what they sound like. Reports on this forum seem to be very favorable though. The problem with cables like these is the time to fabricate them and they become difficult to make when you get up to 2-3 meters long, making them more expensive to the customer Regards - Steve |
@b4icu Wow, taking about a strong opinion, I say! Colour me daft, but I still possess 3 kinds of speaker cables, in my system since a VERY long time, and always coming back to it! A Straight Wire WaveGuide, using teflon insulated solid copper wires 4 each for plus and minus, wound around a teflon string type centre core ~2.5mm ø , both ends using good quality (Furutech) cable shoes. Nothing soldered, which earlier on was mildly degrading performance, since very hard to get good solder joints even with a high wattage solder iron. Something I really only learned after de-soldering! 😒 Second, a very noticeably DIFFERENT sounding set, also 5 foot long, pure silver strand litz (many strands) clear ABS coated cable. Rather bright sounding, ok tight bass but ~puny~ midrange, to put it quite simply. Third, thicker copper strand ± same gauge as the silver cable, again using waxy ABS type insulation but seperate round strands, red and black pigmented ABS, running next to each other straight, but all embedded in cotton fibres! (damping?) and finally coated in a white PVC outer layer. Not as bright as the silver litz, but not as coherent sounding as the StraightWire, which sounds overall more natural by comparison. I had also listened/tested in my system a *very* elaborate construction Kimber copper SC, about 1½ inch thick! with lots a of ’fancy’ inner foam damping etc. and found no real difference to the StraightWire. At all. So, in my learing, speaker wires, different makes and constructions, *can* absolutely sound noticeably different - yet some, even of mightily different design/construction .. don’t necessarily do so. Ergo... it ALL depends. Why? 🤔 That’s another story. 😊 PS: I do not underestimate the influence of the speaker’s x-over, design and construction as all has an influence too, and of course NEVER MIND your power amp’s damping factor! 🙃 |
Mr.
speedbump6 I understand about speaker cables more than any other. It was always left to charlatans who has no idea what cables the customers need. The BS around it, went from weird to bizarre. It was a trend, waves of BS and now we are at geometry. It's a temporary BS till the next one. The only thing matters with a speaker cable, is it's relative resistance value to the Amp's Ro or DF. The other parameter that goes in, is the cable length. Put that in a calculation, would generate results of some thicker cables that you would find on the market. Most cable on the market are of #12 or #14 awg, as it is easy to work with and they fit into most banana plugs and spades. What about some thicker cable, required for Amp's with DF of 400 and above, at a 10' length? They should be of #0 awg or more. No geometry, no cryo, no directionality, no purity, no silver over cooper, no, no, no...even the bi wire is a BS. Run a simple simulation on Spice and you will realize that a single wire, with the same resistance of the two (bi wire) is better. But who will give up a double sale over a single? |
Imagine all these controversies about cable geometry.... Those who experiment with it.... And others who do not.... My ears/brain tell me that except for experimenting with it, it is not possible to develop a sound opinion... It is like with my last homemade "creation" the " The twin Fans combing sound" all will laught without even knowing anything, i will smile with my low cost reverse engineering tweak, not of a cable, but a room enhancer..... « Those who speak sometimes know, those who stay silent always learn in all case » - Groucho Marx |
@williewonka Hi, I'm not certain you ever heard of, or are familiar with, a certain HPC named interconnect type cable that was produced/marketed by Madrigal (Levinson) way back in the early mid 80s? H standing for helical, P for planar, C for copper. Yet, HOW is it actually constructed? Well, it has an inner centre/core of a very thick like fish-line string about 1/16 inch ø of (I'm guessing) teflon. Around this is wound tightly, helical, a very thin foil like, some ⅛ inch wide copper foil. Followed by a dual (or tripple? layer of helical wound telfon tape. Now in the opposite direction, wound helical is the negative conductor, followed by the second insulation layer of teflon wound tape. This is followed by the screen, of a fine mesh 'sock' and then all covered by some type of light grey shrink sleeve. All this is some VERY unassuming looking cable, but the efford of criss cross helical winding of every delicate (planar conductor) foil and teflon insulation material needs to be seen to be believed. Then appreciate the skill, by use of silver solder connected XLR plugs to these delimate foils, is quite something in deed. So how about the sound presentation? Well, it sure beats every thing IC I ever had in my system, including my last, Transparent Music Link Ultra XLR, this by a really most *noteable* degree in trebble, bass, and overall clarity. This is the most elaborate construction I've ever seen - and it truly works. Don't ask me about the original cost. It must have been rather high, and looking almost puny and very unattractive, pencil thick only - not a marketable smash hit for sure. I guess that's why they didn't make it for more than a couple of years - if even that long. But - the best IC I *ever* had in my system. So... CONSTRUCTION MATTERS - BIG TIME, in my learning. |
Being a thread about "cable geometry" and since I believe cable design is far more complicated than many believe, I thought I would pass on my own experiences, i.e. for those of you that might be interested... I have been researching cables for about the last 15 years (on and off) and within the last 6 years I have pursued cable geometry with much more focus and have found good cable design is very complex and dependent on many factors - not just resistance My first deviation from the standard ’twisted pair" (with & without shielding) was Stager Silver Solids - solid silver wire with a tightly twisted geometry. These provided much more detail and openess than the more conventional cables I had used to date. Then I took a leaf out of Kimber’s geometry book and tried braiding cables - braiding surpassed the everything to date and I was able to extend that geometry to Power cables, which again proved t be very beneficial. It was at this point I got to know a person with over 30 years in the cable and connector business. He made me aware of how using different sized wires and different numbers of strands of solid wire per conductor could improve things even more. Unfortunately using different sized conductors and different number of conductors did not work too well with the braided design. SO I then decided to look at the possibility of eliminating crosstalk (if there was any) between the conductors in a cable. Audiophiles often position the various cables in their systems such that if two cables have to cross, they do so at 90 degrees to minimize crosstalk. So I looked again at the Stager Silver Solids geometry and asked myself, what if one of those conductors were to run straight through the center of the tightly twisted conductor. Would this provide enough of angle. My first prototypes were made from CAT5 wire and consisted of a straight positive lead with a coiled neutral wire. Why not the other way around? - mainly because the neutral might just be able to provide some sort of "screening" to the signal lead This approach proved to be extremely beneficial compared to the braided approach in terms of clarity, imaging and bass performance and detail. So then I decided to turn my attention to the metallurgy used in the wires for my interconnects. For me, Silver became the obvious choice for the signal wire because of it’s superior conductivity. But since the coil of the neutral was 3 times the length, it made it a little expensive so I selected a silver plated copper wire. Thinking back to my experience with different numbers of conductors and different wire gauges I experimented a little with the size and number of conductors used for the neutral. Since the early designs there have been many many permutations of wire types and gauges, and most combinations have proven to be advantageous. Several people that have adopted this geometry approach have also assisted with testing wire types and provided valuable feedback of their observations. The last area I have been recently testing is the type of insulation on the wires. One contact in Austria made me aware of the Dielectric Constant of insulation. I have found that using wires with the lowest possible level of Dielectric constant provides the very best sound. e.g. - Air is around 1.1 - Cotton is around 3.0 - AirLok insulation (see VH Audio) is around 1.45 - Teflon is around 2.2 - foamed insulation vary between 1.6-2.0 As I said, this journey has taken many years and in that time I have been fortunate in that many others that have adopted what I refer to as the "Helix Geometry" have provided some excellent feedback on wire types and insulation. Each cable variant takes some 300+ hours of burn-in and subsequent auditions. so the process has not been quick. My system is modest compared to some of those now using the Helix Cables, and based on their observations they appear to work extremely well on a variety of systems, both tube and solid state. SO - If you believe Cables make a difference, then you might like to see the latest variant of cables I have made on this site. http://image99.net/blog/ ALTERNATIVELY: For those of you that believe all that matter is resistance and would like to point out my approach and geometry is flawed - I will point out that I will not respond to your comments, simply because I have heard ALL the arguments as to why they will not work before. But everyone is entitled to an opinion - so post away - like minded individuals will appreciate it greatly For those sitting on the fence - trust your ears - they are the best "tool" a person has - and try some of the more unorthodox geometries from companies like In-Akustik, Nordost, KLE Innovations and Kimber. Regards - Steve |
The thing that gets me is if you have 50,000 for a pair of speakers then I guess you think it's well worth the price for these exotic speaker cables and other cables.But for a guy to have 2,000 speakers and then to spent 500 for cables that's nuts.Everyone I know say spend more on your cables but these are the guys with 50,000 speakers or Systems..... |
@hiendmmoe I’ve always wondered why geometry in speaker cables is so important if they sound better un-shielded. Isn’t the geometry suppose to suppress interference from RFI? Wouldn’t shielding do the same thing?The basic geometry in cables and the basic twist (double helix) is not broken and really doesn’t need to be messed with, it is used everywhere in professional environments. The many complex geometries and materials introduced by high-end cable manufacturers are used to alter the sound and to set that company apart from everyone else in the cable game. It also helps marketing a lot when you have something different to sell, everyone can’t be selling the same basic twisted pair design. If I remember correctly, adding shielding (outer copper braid) to the length of a speaker cable increases capacitance significantly which is why it's not done. |
@thyname - many thanks for your comments. It has been while since I used Kimber Cables and my comments reflected the TOTL cable I used several years ago Their Naked series (IC's) are a departure from their long time braiding approach and will definitely provide a significant improvement in sound quality over their more affordable braided cables. It appears to be very similar in geometry to the DIY cables that VH Audio posts on their web site. So if you are adventurous and can solder, you could try that geometry before splashing out $$$ for the real thing. Regards - Steve |
OP shielding can really mess up the sound if your not careful. I have a less is best type system. PC, RCAs, XLRs and speaker IC, can ALL reduce RFI EFI with a weave, so it doesn't throw a blanket on the SQ.. The quality of the material and different conductors, whole different ball game. The Composition! You keep using the word "Geometry", size and shape, relative position of figures, and the properties of space... Composition, the "what" of the WHOLE, (what it's made of). Still, BAD cables, need to be good cables, crazy thing to say, but cables only go so far.. like 2-3% if they are good to begin with. NEVER jaw dropping.. LOL, that one kills me.. No cost/ low cost solutions, get my attention...and have improved my system more than ANY cable.. BUT, I started 40 years ago, with large conductor, pure silver and pure copper, USAF surplus. The improvements over the years have been VERY minim, because of that alone...Like ZERO, other than network (HARP Box) an added wire or type of wire, armor....maybe some of the tuning terminal ends. Not much of that either.. I've had 3-25,000 cable over here. ALL were red faced. One cable made MY 300s shake rattle and roll..Oscillation big time...MITs I was at a house with JBL Everest speakers, everything was wonderful. Speaker IC was off the real, as per installer...10 gauge copper, in the wall, with short tuning patch cords, from the wall to the speaker.. GREAT speakers.....good cable... SQ... oh yea.... Regards |
As a manufacturer I can honestly say yes...and no. Ethical manufacturers price their cables with a nod to materials cost, hardware cost, build time and...here is the kicker... amortizing out the hours, days, weeks, months and sometimes years spent researching, building prototypes and refining their (our) designs. Intellectual property does not come cheap. The realization that “wire is not just wire” is merely the beginning. Having materials made to our specification is getting to be stupid expensive in the relatively small lots that audio manufacturers need. |
quite unique however also quite minimalist.
after invest $300+ in my own DIY IC's, = a complete failure,, super thick cable froma DIY site, solid copper ends , = a flop,,I only go now ~~minimalist~~~ skinny is good, as in my new navships IC 16 gague,,,,super skinny,, pure minimal. sound like million $ IC's. navships teels you what the wire is, your Reson does not describe the makeup of the core. navships is the last IC I'll ever buy/care/want to own. Its that good an improvement. Completely opened up my Jadis Defy7 with new Mundorf Supreme caps./F&T caps, + Takman Metal Resistors. IC's make or break the sonic fidelity. No doubt about it,, = Not snakeoil, ,,contray to my previous bias/disbelief. |
I've settled on Audio Envy cables. I'm off the cable merry-go-round. Good riddance.
Ok so 2ft @ $160, Yeah I read the blah blah blahhhhh in the descript https://audioenvy.com/product/speaker/sp9-each/ But could you at least consider navships 16 gague @ $40? see my recent topic on his cables. Returnable,,,, ,,but i bet you'll be glad i mentioned navships. |
Ironically, I use DNM Reson ICs almost exclusively. The geometry of these are quite unique however also quite minimalist. Not cheap for a very minimalist product, but I do find the sound to be uniquely coherent compared to others. I suspect that is due to the minimalist design (they basically look like old 300ohm antenna wire) but can't prove it. At the same time, I can usually pick these up used when needed for under $100 so not so bad compared to the other high end competition. http://stereotimes.com/cable022205.shtml#:~:text=The%20DNM%2FReson%20cables%20are%20seductive%20and%20addicting%3A%20the,correct%20trade-off%20to%20suit%20one%E2%80%99s%20larger%20musical%20goals. |
The geometry of a cable is a big determining factor in how a cable will sound, but a complex geometry doesn't mean it's better sounding than a simple geometry. Oftentimes, these complex geometries measure worse than the simple ones. Like most things in audio, it's about system synergy and listener's preference. No two systems/rooms are alike, so there's NO perfect component nor cable in audio regardless of how exotic the geometry or materials are! Add salt to a bland dish then it's right, add it to a salty dish then it's wrong, that's why we hear praise and insult for the same component all the time. Somehow we keep spending more and more thinking the higher price cable will be better. As for the high price of cables in general, a lot of the cost is the labor, especially for the hand-built and custom made ones. Boutique connectors are also very expensive, much more than the conductors, dielectric, fillers, and dress up materials. Then there is the cost of R&D which varies greatly amongst companies. And then there is rent, employees, marketing, etc. that most businesses endure. All of these costs add up pretty quickly. |
Twisted wire will help guard against interference. I've never tried these but they look pretty well made and offer to measure the LCR for you at a reasonable price. https://sites.google.com/view/pine-tree-audio/speaker/speaker-cables/visceral |
Madman, there are less high end cables for sale then there are high end amps, speakers, etc. I just looked at Audiogon for each category and searched by price starting at high to low, so your statement is not correct. People change components, and different cables work better in different systems, so they get swapped out. |
Another cables thread..... :) I am amazed by the way most people think they will solve the upgrading S.Q. problem... Any upgrade is welcome the more costly the better, cables, amplifiers, dac, speakers, etc except the most important thing to take care of... The most important factors to take care of are the acoustical, the electrical, and the mechanical embeddings...NO other one....Certainly not buying something because of frustration or unsatifaction by way of a solution... No new electronic design in dac and amplifier or even speakers, will compensate for a bad or inexistant controls of these embeddings.... I know that firsthand....If you want to upgrade wait till these controls embeddings are rightfully implemented...Money dont necessarily buy Hi-FI, this is a costly myth....Listening experiments will give you Hi-Fi.... Nobody will acuse me of repeating myself now, with all these tedious discussions about cables differences....MIssing the essential audio problem and taking for target a secondary one.... i must repeat myself for the benefit of newcomers.... Newcomers dont buy anything, think and experiment with what you have first..... My best to all..... P.S. yes cables sound different, but are mostly overvalued in all ways....The upgrading of the embeddings may cost peanuts for those who try....Newcomers be warned.... |
Yes I do the same. Buy used mostly. The costs of the wires I’ve settled on for years now run from ~$60-$400 all used. I payed most for a longer run of speaker wires. To each their own. If the wires are worth it to you that’s all that matters. I just see all the 4 digit cost wires for sale here cluttering up the site and get a little dismayed at The amount of nonsense that goes on. |
Are all in the same ridiculous BS, spread by the industry.
I'm from the 70's audiophile gen,,,i never bought into all those high flown tech terms. ,.,,shielded, purity,,,OFC,, blah blah blahhhhh. Shielded from what? the air? how is the air going to add distortion,,My navships IC's has a thin layer of coating , = and sound fantastic, as good/better than those super thick high tech high priced, snakeoil IC's. |
mapman The problem there is if they are worth it then people would not be selling. But they are so apparently not.Non-sequitor. People sell cables for all sorts of reasons. Maybe they've moved their system from the living room to a media room. Or maybe they moved into a new home altogether. Perhaps they've evolved from separates into more integrated components, or vice-versa. Perhaps their new components are balanced and need XLR connectors. Maybe the new preamp won't fit on the same shelf a s the old one, so new cables are needed. Or - although I realize the thought may offend you - they simply seek to upgrade a cable. I imagine some take a beating Buying new then selling for a fraction of what is paid.People imagine all sorts of things! ... regarding geometries please show where the relative merit or performance of different geometries is compared scientifically to establish the winners and losers ...This is a hobbyist's group, so no one here is obligated to perform any research for you. Please feel free to conduct your own research and share the results with us. |
Someone must be buying, right? Example: me --- for every cable I sell, I buy another one to replace it. And not all prices are very high. There are plenty of cables for sale at very good prices, for any budget. For example: me (again): I only buy what I can afford. I don't buy stuff that I cannot afford. Buying used makes it easier. |
