Why So Many Raidho Speaker For Sale?

You know what bo1972, your constant self promotion over pages and pages is getting boring.  Not too many of us need you to save us from audio salespersons who don't have our best interests at heart and only want to turn a buck, and if you don't like our government, who cares. 

Do you really think that when a loudspeaker (Raidho D-5.1) costs 225.000 dollar that it should be good? Most people will think that it needs to be awesome for this money.

Written words people see as the truth. Raidho uses the word Diamond like B&W uses the word Diamond as well. But in real we are talking about a ribbon tweeter for the Raidho and B&W is only jusing a dome tweeter.

And again I ask this question? What do you want to hear? The truth or the thing you would like to hear?

At the end there are people who will buy it. When most people have no reference frame you can sell them whatever you want. People who has the money could buy it. A nice story in an audio magazine will cover it up.

You can compare audio with the election in the US. People get the feeling that the government is not honest and never will be there for you.

Do you really think that most people in audio will be there for you? They do it most of all for their own benefit. I don’t see any protection for costomers. It is not that different compared to the government of the US.

The problem is that people are not able to look further. They focus on their life and on their pesonal needs. What does looking further really mean?

This means that you are able to think what others would think besides your own thoughts.

When you create audio by Tru-Fi, you can use the full DNA of a loudspeaker. This makes a huge difference when you would have created your set by trial and error.

Based on properties, the differences between the Pl-500 and the Raidho loudspeakers become a lot bigger when you use the speakers at a higher level.

Audio needs parameters, now it is a loose world. Many brands use the word highend, in real it has nothing to do with it.

Using the same parameters will give a more realistic and honest view of an audio product.

I own Monitor Audio Pl500's and my friend has Raidho C3.1's. They are different and when played at low to medium volume, the Raidho's sound good to my ears. The problem is they fall apart at higher volumes. Considering how much Raidho's cost, I submit they are bad values.

Even beside the price for free I would not want a Radiho. I can proof by Tru-Fi that the Pl-500 is superior to any Radiho loudspeaker.

I dare Radiho for a battle, because audio is all about shootout. The sound tells the truth, a paid review does not say a thing.

The Pl-500 outperforms the Raiho in speed and realism. I can show that in differences in height the Radiho even can’t compete.

The AMT tweeter of the P-500 is superior in all parts compared to the ribbon tweeter of the Radiho.

Beside this in stage depth and width the Pl-500 can create a much bigger stage. I want audio to be fought out in ’real’ shootouts. It is time customers get more value for their money.

I will protect the audio lovers!

I am interested on high end gears and always try to find something new but I must say on upper levels the prices are madly unjust! the problem back the consumers phycology that think if I pay more, i get something better and the dealers that narrow buyers choices base on the profit that they can earn! Now on the the top of these 2, add HIFI journalists that make a life by writing about products and must say sometimes they are not honest at all.
At the end Radiho is a good brand but i never buy from them unless in a good price!
p.s) Tubes are good with any good speaker !

You need to think and work in properties. When you are not able to think in properties you can’t create 3 dimensional sound.

This is based on the fact that you need amps, sources and speakers  who can create a deep and wide stage. Because most brands and products are 2 dimensional. Even with cables you can influence the stage depth and width negative.

S.A.P. measurements brings 3 dimensional sound also to a much higher level. There are many other things what is very important.

I have done a lot of research this year in diversity in the middle frequencies. Because this is the most important part to create emotion for us humans.

This makes a huge difference. I saw people cry when I let hem hear my improvements in this part.

I met a person who has done the marketing for big companies in the world. Audio is his biggest hobby  what counts for many of you who are here at Audigon I guess.

I started in 2010 with acoustic measurments. In 2012 I started with S.A.P.-measurment. We improved it during time. Even in 2016 I was able to bring to an even higher level.

Beside this I have done a lot of reseach in electricity, smog, magnetism and other things what influences audio. I communicate a lot with specialists in different parts. I use their technical support to create things I have in my head.

At this moment there are different products I have in my head what will bring audio to a much higher level than the poor level what we hear now. The things I created are so much more effective than other stuff in audio.

The problem in audio is that people almost don't test and communicate with other people. It looks like audio is freezed. When you do research you will see how much there is to improve.

In vision we do the same. We just bought the best Calman (Studio) system to calibrate screens and projectors. In my world to need to push the limits tot the max. Only the best is what matters, everything below it is for losers.

I created Statement Audio Pro-measurement, this will bring audio for many people to a much higher level. We will share it with manufacturers. Beside this we have done so much reseach in sound and created many more things. The problem is what I call: audio blindness.

Audio blindness means that you don’t understand what you are doing. Based on trial and error audio always will be a big guess. People make many mistakes as well.

When I am at a show before I listened to the set I already see how many mistakes they make. For me audio is like a game against children. Because the distance between our quality and those of others is planets away.

I am addict to music and sound. Each day I test and it never stops. For a perfectionist only the best counts. It needs to become better over and over again. I created a big leap between me and the rest.

Now it is time to share it. I know it will make many people very happy.

So Bo tell us all how to go from a 2 dimensional set-up to a 3 dimensional set-up? Curious minds want to know exactly what you are referring to?

Bo - what does "I will be there soon" mean?

The new Monitor Audio Platinum loudspeakers are one of the best we ever auditioned to show the differences in height of all the voices and instruments. For example: the Wilson Audio Sasha was not even able to show us the differences in height.

This is what we call highend++, it makes music so much more exiting. The new AMT tweeter also often let you hear the space of the room even infront of the loudspeakers. Besides this it can create a huge deep and wide stage.

An AMT tweeter creates a much bigger soundstage than a dome tweeter. It is also able to give a much sharper ( intimate) focus of instruments and voices. 

The big advantage we have now is that some techniques and systems bring audio to a superior and new level. When you go to shows it looks like we go back in time. When you don't have any idea of many aspects in audio you will stay on the same level for a long time.

Do you have any 4th dimensional sets or 5 dimensional sets :-) this is starting to feel like metaphysics.

Just joking :-)

There is a main reason why many sets often at shows sounds so poor. When you are not able to understand the properties (DNA) of the speaker you never will be able to use all the properties and at the right way.

We can judge each single set by Tru-Fi and all sets at shows are incomplete. We can explain with facts what is missing. This is why Tru-Fi outperforms any way of the silly trial and error.

Beside this people in audio almost have no knowledge in electricity, smog, acoustics, music, magnetism and many other parts.

This is why only a very small % of the whole quality of a loudspeaker could create is being used. And that is why buying very expensive audio stuff is not the answer.

When we visit clients the first time I often give an indication of how low the % is what they are using of the loudspeaker. At shows you see the same kind of poor level.

The main reason why people sell their stuff all the time for new parts is based on the fact that any kind of 2 dimensional sound never will be liked for a longer period of time. This is based on our emotion.

With 2 dimensional sound (most people own a 2 dimensional audio system) the distance between you and the music is bigger. When you go to a 3 dimensional sound it connects you so much more with the music.

In over 7 years of time we brought many people from 2D to 3D systems. We never will sell any kind of 2 dimensional audio again. It influences people a lot.

All the people who own a 3 dimensional set now use their sets so much more often and for a longer period at the same time.

I did run an audioshop from 2007-2009. I had a 2 dimensional set always set up and a 3 dimensional set. When you let people hear the difference between the 2 you see in their exitement and face how big the differences are.

And now comes the most important part. I learned in this period that when you let women listen to a 3 dimensional system they also start to like music and audio a lot more. Many of the women of my clients use the 3 dimensional sets of their partner. When this would be a 2 dimensional set they never would have used it.

If ever you have such misgivings about any audio product, do not buy it. I had a number of reliability issues with Cary Audio products and would not buy them again. When in doubt, leave it out! +FD

rspyder +1

I heard the D5.1's and D3.1's at the Munich Hi End Show last May.  The D3.1's sounded very good.  The D5.1's, disappointingly,  did not. The feedback we got there from a couple of rooms that used the D3.1's is that they are difficult to place in a room and are near field speakers requiring lots of space as others have commented. 

Comparing the D3.1's to the ProAc K6's, I far preferred the ProAc's.  Less room sensitive, way better bass and less that half the price.  And ProAc gets its cabinets made in Denmark.

Czarivey, I think you are in the right area talking about slave labour but pointing to the wrong direction, and you know what I mean. It is the South that won the civil war, and we are beginning to see more and more of the consequences of that. Interestingly enough, in some cases we see millionaires slaving for billionaries.
Nothing audio related is overpriced. Don’t buy it and it won’t be worth anything. Asking price means nothing. Just saw an add for Wavac amps, suggested retail is $350k. I’d say there are at least 100000 people in NYC area who can afford it.
Recently I took a look at all speaker offerings on Audiogon. To my regret, I think I found only two pairs that I would consider if I could afford them. Very different speakers - $10k JM Labs Utopia and $20k Lansche. And judging by various accounts they are worth the price.

"there is an ass for every seat". Wise.

I find horn speakers with Tube amps more emotionally involving than big Class A Solid State amplifiers driving difficult speakers, but that’s just me. Some claim Solid state gear is the future.

How did we just jump to NYC Real estate. I did not say High End Audio was the only business doing this but getting back to the topic. Yep its proven Raidho is super over priced. So are some of the smaller US Speaker Companies operating from their back gardens and charging Silly amounts for a so called Perfect Storm Speakers. Everyday their is a new audio company popping up claiming they have the next best thing. Personally iv gone back to horn speakers with high sensitivity and low powered tube amps.

Slightly off topic, I find MSB DACS in the similar bandwagon as Raidho.

Raidhos are THREE times more expensive than they should be, that's why.
Many other brands are overprices as well, e.g. Revel Ultima Salon 2 etc.

A guy tried to sell Raidho D1 on agon for $7500 but he was unsuccessful.

Many people are sheep and they should be shaved by dealers and magazine "reviewers". When I first heard D1s and when I heard the price and looked the face of the dealer full of himself, I spit on the speakers. They were no anywhere close to the price. Right now, if somebody buys D! used for $5000 it is overpriced. He won't be able to sell it next year for $4000

I give you another example; Monitor Audio loudspeakers are made in China. The build a factory overthere. The have the stock still in England. It is about 30-40% cheaper no to create them. This gives us a better price for the speakers.  It effects labour in their own country.

The biggest problem in audio is that people build their system on trial and error. We think that this way we will get the sound we prefer and the best sound possible.

In real this doesn't make any sense at all. In real it is a very ineffective way of creating an audio system.

When you are not able to think and work in properties, you never will understand why the sound and stage is what you hear.

Even simple questions in our world could not be answered by many people who work their whole live in audio.

I give you an example: A person who is distributer of different highend brands. He sell speakers who also make loudspeakers of over 500.000 dollar.

I asked him the next question: Can you tell me which properties I take out when I replace your loudspeaker by the B&W 800D3?  (we were talking about this speaker) And which properties you bring in when you connect the B&W?

He said: I don't know. So I said: This means that you don't have any idea why the stage and sound is what you hear?

He said: I think you are right. So I said: It is not about if I am right, you need to understand that the way you create audio is just a matter of luck.

Music is all about emotion. The emotion is inside the music. You need to understand how humans experience emotion in music. That is why we work by Tru-Fi. These are 8 parts you judge sound for. Each single part even infle\uences our emotion.

That is why each set created by Tru-Fi will outperform any set created by trial and error. And you know why?

Because it is more complete and owns a much higher level of emotion. This is choosen by each person. Because humans prefer a more emotional and intense sound.

seems like cineese slave labor is far more pricey than USA's local mid-class labor
cliche!

I thought it was the Raidho 4.1 I heard at Blink High End  but I guess it was the 5.  My apologies for the mix up on that.  It doesn't change my opinion as while I was listening I kept thinking what all the fuss was about.  

As far as my comments. I had a dealer who was fortunate to set up his all out audio assault cost no object system.  It was insanely expensive.  He was dying of Lou Gehrig's disease and had an audio bucket list.  He put the Raidho with solutions and it's the best sound I have heard. However it was in a perfect listening room measures precisely for his system. I could never by a system that expensive but it's the best by far for my taste.  The I put together a system that is 1/20 the price and I am very happy! It's up to the persons and their means. Be patient and do your research and decide if it's for you. It's funny how the bets 2 system I heard are by guys who are no longer living and both of them have died in the last year. Be careful to enjoy what you have tomorrow isn't promised and when you die your stuff will be sold at pennies on the dollar. 

In the last 2 years I met different people who had the feeling that they were screwed. For me it was diffucult to understand why they bought it. Because they are aware now that what they bought was very poor.

Here you will find the critical part. They buy it often based on confidence in the sales person. When the set was ready they still were not happy.

Often the sales person says: it needs time. They keep on repeating this. Each set I create sounds very good at the first day. After some time even stunning.

Consumers trust the people who sell audio. These days many of them are not honest and second not well educated in knowledge and insight in audio.

Even when we visit shows and there are manufacturers who do the presentation the results are often poor. We see a big lack in knowledge and insight in audio even at manufacturers and distributers.

The word what I hear from people who own a shop or who are a distributer is surviving. They need to pay their bills at the end. This has a huge and negative influence on the level in quality consumers get these days.

This makes it clear why the audio market is a decreasing market. They do not have the power and knowledge to change it. And hat I said earlier: THIS IS WHAT IS NEEDED NOW.

The way they work and think now will have a very bad influeunce on the market. You can’t go on this way.

Yet some reviews reflect the reality and are quite accurate. Backdoor deals are made in many places. Do you have any idea of how real estate business in New York City operate? Or most of downtown businesses of any kind? Do you know why in NYC there is such demand for envelops and why so many new bank accounts are open? Think about it and forget the audio business, it’s child’s games, there is no real money or power there, it’s really nothing. The level of corruption in many areas is incredible.
As for Chinese cabinets, again, I wouldn’t care much, there are Chinese parts in American fighter jets and other military hardware, and not always of the highest quality. Also, at least some major power plants are Chinese with them holding the know-how.
So let’s keep scratching our vinyl while we still can.

I agree on the poster which states magazine reviews are all paid. This is very true and backdoor deals are made this way on high end gear. Alot of people are fooled into buying into products based on online or magazine reviews. I would call this the corruption within the high end audio business. Raidho never appealed to me from the start regardless of the reviews. My friend now admits this, everytime he has based his purchases on magazine reviews or online advertisements he has ended up being burnt out or developed buyers remorse.

This is the lesson we all learn but unfortuantly some people don't learn and will constantly repeat their mistakes till they are broke.

Hahaha.
I meant speakers not drivers.
And I am European. What a cute bunch.

Inna 

"Danes don't know how to make speakers"  Are you Serious ????  Some of the most respected high end drivers are form Denmark, I assume you are aware of Brands like ScanSpeak used widely in numerous high end speakers all over the world.


Good Listening 

Peter

phusis231 posts11-11-2016 10:15pm

Cheap Chinese cabinets. As for overpricing, since there are a lot of people who don't earn but make a lot of money, why not try and cash in, Danes and others think ? They play 'the stupid and ignorant' card, and often it works. Besides, Europeans generally despise Americans and get pleasure out of that too.

inna --

You seem to do well yourself in regards to what you assume Europeans to similarly throw at you. Perhaps you'll come in handy helping Mr. Trump to build them walls.

be aware as OP doesn't like jokes and have no sense of humor. So what walls we're talking about? Bringing external politics to internal? It's a very good wall! It's the best wall you can think of!. Switzerland doesn't have external politics and have great internal economy and human wealth. Why worry about ANYTHING outside of HUGE and powerful nation? Quarter size of US army is ENOUGH to build invincible defence inside nation! Everything you want you can get HERE at ANY TIME if everything DONE RIGHT or you're so found of outsourcing labor for profit? Anyways any political whore gets fired, I'll raise my cognac shot and celebrate and grow my trust to our new driver that I in fact didn't vote for... I'm too liberal or even more anarchist than liberal. I'm only driven by humanity, TRUTH and peace that I found in neither of 2 candidates.

I have been to Blink High End numerous times recently and as far as I know they don't have D4.1s. So how did you got to hear them? Tim said he was not going to get them either.
Also, you say that you never heard the D5s ... how is this possible as Blink have D5s on a permanent basis - so the likelihood of you NOT hearing the D5s is very small indeed if you were in their showroom ... something's not right here ...

Cheap Chinese cabinets. As for overpricing, since there are a lot of people who don’t earn but make a lot of money, why not try and cash in, Danes and others think ? They play ’the stupid and ignorant’ card, and often it works. Besides, Europeans generally despise Americans and get pleasure out of that too.

inna --

You seem to do well yourself in regards to what you assume Europeans to similarly throw at you. Perhaps you’ll come in handy helping Mr. Trump to build them walls.

However, I’ll agree with you on this: some of the Danish brands of speakers are indeed overpriced, most notably perhaps Raidho and Peak Consult. Mr. Kristensen of Raidho has openly declared the cabinets of their speakers are made in China, a fact he feels no qualms about revealing. Raidho cabinets are typically "livelier" than other brands of similar-ish aspirations, but for a reason, and this translates to their views on room acoustics as well where they favor a predominance of diffusion rather than absorption in an effort to preserve the energy and "life" of music. In regards to their finish, well, I’ve never had an issue with it as such, but others seemingly disagree. I digress..

The finish and overall construction quality of Peak Consult speakers is, to my mind, absolutely gorgeous, and they’re hand-built to tank-like sturdiness at the facility in Denmark - to whom this may concern. I find Mr. Kristoffersen voices the different speaker models to maintain a certain house sound, and yet each of them has a unique trait or "personality" in a sense. Here it’s more about absorption and absolute weight of material, which lends to it its own traits and challenges. While both brands are sonically rather fascinating in their own right, I neither would nor could afford any of their larger floor standing models.

[...] Overall, Danes don’t know how to make speakers, they know how to make electronics, though. Gryphon is a notable exception.

I don’t agree with the former, overpriced Raidho and Peak C. may be, but it’s not like I have a particular inkling towards them either. Dali speakers never really appealed to me (too well-behaved, even boring), and with the exception of the older Contour 3.0 and 3.3 models Dynaudio’s sound in general always struck me as rather bland, and oddly uninvolving. System Audio speakers are simply too small, though Blue Trumpet speakers (new brand) are interesting, and very fairly priced. The natural imprinting and spatial abilities of Peak Consult’s speakers is a something to behold, I find, and they are rather dynamic - but, again, expensive.

The US is a much bigger country and market, and naturally you’d expect a diversity here more pronounced than a smaller country like Denmark (by factor 50), but that doesn’t make the latter incapable per se of making good speakers. The evidence at hand to my mind certainly doesn’t warrant such a conclusion. My sensibilities are more towards horn speakers, and would highlight Wheel-Fi, OMA and Simon Mears Audio as particularly interesting items, along with the more regular or mixed brew of (active) ATC, the former S.P. Tech. and some of the bigger models from JBL.

Buyers Remorse, exactly what my friend down at Singapore had with his monitors. He actually preferred my Quested Studio Monitors more than his Raidho. I was never a fan but could not comment as i have not spent more than a few hours in front of one. I do find them boring. Some people love them others end up hating them after living with them for a few months. We all have different taste.

The way audio is being exposed these days in 10 years the market will be so much smaller. We all see it during audio shows. The average age is getting older each year.

They are not able to create a better quality for consumers. Besides this younger people are not interested in audio as we are. They cannot adapt, this is what is needed.

They only way you can reach more younger people is to create a much higher level in quality for reasonable prices.

Audio is a decreasing market, and the people who work in it are only making it worse. You see that most decisions which are made are all based on short time notice.

The use of cheaper parts is a good example of it. Most people in audio cannot think further, when you are this blind you should not be working in audio.

When I would write about brands overhere, Audiogon will delete my message direcly. They are paid by the brands. This way everyone is covering the backs of others. Consumers are the ones who get less for their money.

TAS is now so shameless, isn't it? Zero credibility.

I will be there soon. I can promise I will change the Audio world for many people. I will give many people a superior level in sound than what is possible at this moment.

I will share my knowledge so many people can listen music to a new level.  I can connect the music with people.

We are now busy with our new website. I will be a new level in sound&vision what is not there in the world yet. We will also make a professional webblog.

With our Statement Audio Pro measurement it will be so much easier for many people to create a stunning level in sound at any place regarding the acoustics.

In almost 2 years of time we have done so much research that we can outperform any company in audio regardless price. And we will proof it with sound. Sound tells the truth.

Each single person will choose for the sound what has the highest level of emotion and intensity. That is why we sell a sound instead of products. Tru-Fi is what we create. Each set created by Tru-Fi will outperform any set created by the silly way of trial and error. This is based on the fact that the level of emotion and diversity is of a much higher level.

Supremacy overrules everything

I agree with bo. nice to see his posts again. 

When a speaker is being seen a lot on the internet for sale there is a reason for sure? When people are not convinced or happy they will sell it. This is how the world of audio works.

At many shows we found the speakers often rather stressed in sound. I think this can be a reason why you find them a lot used on the internet.

When people would have had more knowledge and insight they would never bought them. During different shows we visited we heard the saturation of the tweeter. Beside this they can create stage depth and width. There are enough who are a lot better in this part.

A dealer overhere who sells them is the person who also is the distributer. He buys them for 3.0. So he has a lot of % to give a discount. Even for this money they are still rather expensive.

The other drivers also often showed difficulties during shows. It is a pitty that the knowlegde and insight of people who work in audio is limited these days. This also works negative on consumers. Raidho is only one example of that, because there are many others.

You need to understand that the problems start at the magazines. These days many people buy speakers based on reviews. Many reviews are paid these days, the text you read it often not the truth.

That is why I always ask to my clients: What do you want to hear? The truth or the thing you would like to hear.....

metro Detroit has some great audio manufacturers

xti161,332 posts11-11-2016 7:30amstereo5
Yes the cabinets are made in China and the Walnut burl is from Italy. Every country has skilled craftsman. They are beautiful and great quality.

Does it mean that we soon won’t need any skilled craftsman and will be fine and dandy with entertainers, police and soldiers? Looks like Detroit MI is a very good start for such endeavor!

Let’s not forget Apple products are made and assembled in China and really high quality.

Agree, but at the same time I would like to assemble them here in USA and so is Lenovo computers and so is many other great and affordable products, but at the same time don’t want to be slave... Anything can be done or anyone thinks about that?

inna2,846 posts
They play ’the stupid and ignorant’ card, and often it works. Besides, Europeans generally despise Americans and get pleasure out of that too.

Agree! $30k Nordost wires is one of the great examples.

I don't have a problem with anything made in China.  My speakers are made there and that is why they were affordable enough that I could purchase them.  I truly thought the cabinets of the Raidhos were made in Denmark as they were absolutely gorgeous and like the finest furniture one could buy.  I'm just not in tune with their sound but that's why there is such a large range of speakers out there. 

stereo5
Yes the cabinets are made in China and the Walnut burl is from Italy. Every country has skilled craftsman. They are beautiful and great quality. Let's not forget Apple products are made and assembled in China and really high quality. I'm not a Apple fan boy at all but not because of where they are made.

Welcome to this week's episode of Delusions Of Grandeur.
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