I aspire to a turntable it takes 40 years to set up properly.
Who knew?
I am a big fan of the Linn LP12 table, having owned one in one form or another since the mid 80’s. I have always had my LP12 serviced and modded by a dealer. Knowing how it is not an easy table to set up, and that a bad set up is going to be detrimental, I have had ‘fettlers’ set up the table.
This year, I decided to replace my original Afro fluted plinth with a new Oak plinth. The original plinth and top plate were the only remnants from my original LP12.
Unfortunately, the art of ‘fettling’ these tables is going the way of the blacksmith…and fewer people are able to do this.Now, the LP12 is not a table that needs constant attention, even though folk who owned one back in the early 80’s thought so.
I acquired a beautiful new Linn oak plinth and then decided I needed to visit my closest LinnLP12 dealer for a plinth swap. For those in the know, this requires a complete and total tear down of the table. Not an easy task, specially since I own a Well Tempered Black arm, an arm I have used and liked for many years.
My closest Linn dealer has now retired, so my next option was to drive about three to four hours each way to North LA. Specifically to see Mr Stan Zeiden at Shelley’s audio. Stan has ‘only’ been working on these tables for decades and I knew he was the man to do the upgrade.
On Wednesday, I drove up to Stan and let him do his magic..and believe me, Majik it is!
Stan took several hours to swap the plinth, adding a new top plate and brace along the way. To say that the tonearm was a head ache, would be an understatement, since it utilizes a liquid bearing with silicone oil as the liquid. We had to remove all of the silicone and then replace it, luckily with new liquid that I had brought along. A very messy affair.
Stan set up the table and re-adjusted my Lyra along with setting up the arm.
After four plus hours, we were ready to test the table…and sure enough a big problem!
One channel was out. Stan quickly chased the problem to my arm wiring, which is something of a nightmare, as the arm utilizes litz wire. For those in the know, each strand of the litz is smaller in diameter than a human hair!
With exactitude and decades of knowledge, Stan re-soldered the litz at certain points and figured out that the cartridge pin had separated from the wire!
IME, very few techs could have done this, maybe one or two on the whole coast!
After re-soldering the pin to the wire, which is almost too small to see, we were back in business.
Now here’s the real eye opener, I always thought that my Linn was well set up, the pros who worked on it before were highly thought of. Yet, after Stan had worked his Majik, it was obvious that I had never really heard what my table was capable of!
Yes, it was good before, but now…simply better in so many ways. Who knew!
This is the crazy thing, I suspect that there are numerous Linn LP12 owners out there, who are happy with their table and sound, but have never heard what it can truly portray. Anyone who thinks they can get the maximum from the table, because they once set up a VPI or similar are delusional.
Moral of this story, a real and expert set up of any table, and particularly the LP12 is well worth the expense and the effort.
Thank you to Stan and the good folks at Shelley’s audio.
31 responses Add your response
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Meaning no disrespect to the value of proper set up, could it be that some of the improvement in SQ is also due to finding and fixing the open circuit at the cartridge wire, which might have been partial continuity for quite a long time beforehand? Anyway you might consider a new tonearm next. The WT tonearms are even more finicky than an LP12, IMO. |
@lewm I very much doubt that there was an issue with the arm wiring until I underwent the several hour trip to see Stan. Highly likely that the wire to connector got loose in the car. Before that, I had absolutely no issues with drop outs or any other sound problems.Yes, the WTA is a major pain to set up, but my modded ‘Black ‘ arm sounds extremely good, having replaced my old Ekos as a significant upgrade in SQ. To improve on the arm, possibly an Ekos Se, but not guaranteed, except in ease of use. Most folk have never heard a WTA on a Linn, it is a hard arm to better, and would require multiple thousands of $$ to do so. |
@jasonbourne71 Glad you like your vintage LP12, but don’t miss out on a chance to hear a new one if you can get the opportunity. Only problem is that you may well want to open your wallet at that point. |
@theophile is that a constructive comment? |
OP, Thank you for sharing your experience. I am the kind of person that never touches delicate mechanical devices. I would destroy something. Fortunately I have a local audio dealer that is a certified Linn technician. He loves setting up any turntable. He has basic Linn certification and went to the week long advanced training. He says by and large they are easy to set up these days, but that the problems he sees come back from the field are really elementary stuff. The springs in the wrong place… grossly unbalanced suspension.
Anyway I have a contemporary Linn LP12 nearly Klimax with an Audio Research Reference 3 phonostage. Sounds wonderful. |
@ghdprentice Glad to hear you have a local ‘fettler’,one that you like. The eye opener to me was that while I was at Stan’s, he showed me a couple of areas that the previous’ fettler’ erred with. Simple things, but important aspects. For example, not enough oil in the bearing, a wire that was incorrectly routed, possibly resulting in an interference with the suspension ( a major problem), incorrectly aligned cartridge SRA, and incorrect attachment of the Trampoline 2 base. I would not have known about these issues, until someone with his kind of expertise showed me. i won’t name names here, but my prior ‘fettler’, whom I had assumed was good, really is a big disappointment now.’ |
Glad to hear it turned out beyond your expectations. What did you do to transport the LP12 back and forth? My turntable path started with a SOTA Sapphire. At the time more than one dealer recommended the Linn, but I choose the SOTA because it was American made and the stories about how finicky the LP12 was. The stories reminded me of a friend who had a British sports car. After awhile I swore off suspension turntables completely and switched to a Well Tempered Ref. I have something different now, but it too has no springs. Seriously, isn't there just a whisper in the back of your mind that asks if there is an easier way? |
@bimmerman2 Yes, in many ways it was an ordeal. The distance and traffic was the main problem. However, I was fully aware of this issue, and expecting it. Unfortunately, the Linn table clearly requires an expert set-up, and while this is not really a problem in the UK, it certainly can be in a country the size of the US.
@stringreen The car ride is no problem, so long as the various requirements of the table during transportation are taken care of...and planned for. If not, then what you say is correct. @onhwy61 Yes, the issues with spring suspended tables is a factor to be considered; i do think they are a lot more head ache to deal with than a non-suspended table, but as with most things in audio, there are still compromises that are required. IME, if a table is not spring suspended it will need to be either extremely heavy and massive, or it will need some other kind of isolation device that is typically complex..
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OP,
Exactly… so Stan had the same experience… simple stuff done wrong. Well, it is a precision instrument.
Also, yes… there are trade-offs with different designs. Vacuum plater, idler arm, massive weight designs have their idiosyncrasies / strengths / weaknesses as well. Which is why there are different approach’s. |
+1 @jwei |
@daveyf My turntable, an Allen Perkins designed Immedia, using high mass. It's around 50-60 pounds and I do use isolation pads and a thick carbon fiber shelf beneath it. Alternatively, Rega goes in a different direction believing light weight, but rigid is the best path. I recently picked up a Rega P6 for a secondary system and it's an interesting contrast to the Immedia. It's nice that we have design choices that we can pick to best fit our tastes. |
@onhwy61 Agreed, it is good to have choices. One of the drawbacks, if you can call it that, is that all of the tables mentioned so far can only accommodate a single arm. (perhaps with the exception of some of the VPI models). IMO, having a couple of arms mounted is a great way to enhance the utility of the table. If i was to go away from the Linn platform, which right now seems a little unlikely unless they do not come out with a superior arm to the Ekos Se, which i do think is the current limiting factor, and one that is long long overdue to be addressed; would be to a table that is high mass and has the ability to mount several arms. |
The LP 12 remains a great TT but like anything else it has to keep up with the evolution of technology. I was lucky enough to get one that had been upgraded with Kore, Trempolin, Cirkus and Lingo3 by a 20 year Linn specialist. It replaced Hans down a brand new Rega P10 I had just bought. |
@ericba Nice to hear that you are still enjoying your LP12. I do think that one of the biggest strengths to the table is its ongoing upgradeability. When you went to Arko, did you have a chance to also hear the Ekos SE? I have heard that there are actually folk who prefer the Arko to the Ekos SE...although I personally have not done an AB, or heard the latest Arko. One of the things to consider upgrading when it comes to the Linn tonearms, is the tonearm cable, IME there are significant benefits to doing away with the Linn T Kable if possible. |
I have not compared the Arko to the Ekos SE. I preferred to go with the newer technology. I think it is better value for the price than he Ekos, but this is my opinion. I would not be surprised that Linn replaces the Ekos to keep pace with higher end tonearms. I checked with a Linn retailer and it is difficult to find a cable that will not hinder the suspension design given its position. However, the Arko internal wiring was changed to Cardas which a nice upgrade. Now looking for a cartridge that will fully maximize the potential of this new combination. |
I have been waiting for a replacement of the Ekos SE for years..clearly not one of the top priorities at Linn. As to cartridge, the Lyra line would work well, or if you like a bit more warmth, one of the current Benz's. The EMT cartridges might also be an option, as they make the re-badged Ekstatik. |
@zavato You are indeed fortunate that you have an established shop close by. My fettler was also close, until he decided to retire. Unfortunately, in the US it seems a lot of these guys are going the way of the blacksmith. Linn will most likely have a problem on there hands unless they decide to do more extensive hiring and training on the table in the US. Not an easy task, as we had a local dealer try to take on the LP12, but he couldn't get up to speed with the training and dropped the idea. |
OP i wonder also if Iam getting the max performance of my SME 10 and VPI prime tt. My VPi was set up by upscale tech place where I bought it. My SMe 10 was set by Acousticsound Tech where I bought it.I know a guy Brian Walsh who has high tech instruments to do his job.i live 45 min from Him, Very nice guy, with excellent feedback. |
@jayctoy As I discovered, the only real way to know if your table is properly/maximally set up is to visit with a specialist. Even though I had been happy with my prior ’fettler’, it is now obvious that quite a bit more performance can be eked out with a great set up. |
I started my audiophile journey about 8 years ago. My strategy was to hear the very best at audio shows and showrooms, then try to duplicate the sound that resonated with me but within my budget. The Linn LP12, while a long track record, seemed intimidating sifting through the different permutations and improvements. Also, because I rarely see them when demoing gear, seems to say other more modern options are sonically superior at that price point. The LP12 does seem it can be a fun tweaking sonic improvements. |
not true Minus K platforms provided superb isolation (think electron microscopes) are relatively inexpensive ($3500 -4500) and extremely easy to set up (remove 4 shipping bolts and turn a small crank to match it to the weight of your table)
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