@imgoodwithtools Great moniker! I just put a new fuse into the receiver of my HT rig. I’ll retrieve it in 300 hours for my main rig. After burning-in new SC’s, PC’s and IC’s over the past year, my ears can’t take it any more. I wish to enjoy what I have while the new fuse is cooking elsewhere. I also have a first generation AM Beeswax and a SR Black. Different results in different components.
The new Synergistic Research BLUE fuses ....
New SR BLUE fuse thread ...
I’ve replaced all 5 of the SR BLACK fuses in my system with the new SR BLUE fuses. Cold, out of the box, the BLUE fuses stomped the fully broken-in SR BLACKS in a big way. As good as the SR BLACK fuses were/are, especially in comparison with the SR RED fuses, SR has found another break-through in fuses.
1. Musicality ... The system is totally seamless at this point. Its as if there is no system in the room, only a wall to wall, front to back and floor to ceiling music presentation with true to life tonality from the various instruments.
2. Extension ... I’ve seemed to gain about an octave in low bass response. This has the effect of putting more meat on the bones of the instruments. Highs are very extended, breathing new life into my magic percussion recordings. Vibes, chimes, bells, and triangles positioned in the rear of the orchestra all have improved. I’ve experienced no roll-off of the highs what so ever with the new BLUE fuses. Just a more relaxed natural presentation.
3. Dynamics ... This is a huge improvement over the BLACK fuses. Piano and vibes fans ... this is fantastic.
I have a Japanese audiophile CD of Flamenco music ... the foot stomps on the stage, the hand clapping and the castanets are present like never before. Want to hear natural sounding castanets? Get the BLUE fuses.
4. Mid range ... Ha! Put on your favorite Ben Webster album ... and a pair of adult diapers. Play Chris Connor singing "All About Ronnie," its to die for.
Quick .... someone here HAS to buy this double album. Its a bargain at this price. Audiophile sound, excellent performance by the one and only Chris Connor. Yes, its mono ... but so what? Its so good you won’t miss the stereo effects. If you’re the lucky person who scores this album, please post your results here.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ULTRASONIC-CLEAN-The-Finest-Of-CHRIS-CONNOR-Bethlehem-Jazz-1975-NM-UNPLAYED-...
Overall impressions:
Where the RED fuses took about 20 hours to sound their best, and the BLACK fuses took upwards of 200 hours of total break-in, the BLUE fuses sounded really good right out of the box ... and that’s without doing anything about proper directional positioning. Not that the BLUE fuses don’t need breaking in, they do. The improvement continues through week three. Its a gradual break-in thing where each listening session is better than the last.
Everything I described above continues to break new ground in my system as the fuses continue breaking in. Quite honestly, I find it difficult to tear myself away from the system in order to get things done. Its truly been transformed into a magical music machine. With the expenditure of $150.00 and a 30 day return policy there’s really nothing to lose. In my system, its like upgrading to a better pre amp, amp, CD player or phono stage. Highly recommended.
Kudos to Ted Denney and the entire staff at SR. Amazing stuff, guys. :-)
Frank
PS: If you try the SR BLUE fuses, please post your results here. Seems the naysayers, the Debbie Downers and Negative Nellie’s have hijacked the original RED fuse thread. A pox on their houses and their Pioneer receivers.
Frank
I’ve replaced all 5 of the SR BLACK fuses in my system with the new SR BLUE fuses. Cold, out of the box, the BLUE fuses stomped the fully broken-in SR BLACKS in a big way. As good as the SR BLACK fuses were/are, especially in comparison with the SR RED fuses, SR has found another break-through in fuses.
1. Musicality ... The system is totally seamless at this point. Its as if there is no system in the room, only a wall to wall, front to back and floor to ceiling music presentation with true to life tonality from the various instruments.
2. Extension ... I’ve seemed to gain about an octave in low bass response. This has the effect of putting more meat on the bones of the instruments. Highs are very extended, breathing new life into my magic percussion recordings. Vibes, chimes, bells, and triangles positioned in the rear of the orchestra all have improved. I’ve experienced no roll-off of the highs what so ever with the new BLUE fuses. Just a more relaxed natural presentation.
3. Dynamics ... This is a huge improvement over the BLACK fuses. Piano and vibes fans ... this is fantastic.
I have a Japanese audiophile CD of Flamenco music ... the foot stomps on the stage, the hand clapping and the castanets are present like never before. Want to hear natural sounding castanets? Get the BLUE fuses.
4. Mid range ... Ha! Put on your favorite Ben Webster album ... and a pair of adult diapers. Play Chris Connor singing "All About Ronnie," its to die for.
Quick .... someone here HAS to buy this double album. Its a bargain at this price. Audiophile sound, excellent performance by the one and only Chris Connor. Yes, its mono ... but so what? Its so good you won’t miss the stereo effects. If you’re the lucky person who scores this album, please post your results here.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ULTRASONIC-CLEAN-The-Finest-Of-CHRIS-CONNOR-Bethlehem-Jazz-1975-NM-UNPLAYED-...
Overall impressions:
Where the RED fuses took about 20 hours to sound their best, and the BLACK fuses took upwards of 200 hours of total break-in, the BLUE fuses sounded really good right out of the box ... and that’s without doing anything about proper directional positioning. Not that the BLUE fuses don’t need breaking in, they do. The improvement continues through week three. Its a gradual break-in thing where each listening session is better than the last.
Everything I described above continues to break new ground in my system as the fuses continue breaking in. Quite honestly, I find it difficult to tear myself away from the system in order to get things done. Its truly been transformed into a magical music machine. With the expenditure of $150.00 and a 30 day return policy there’s really nothing to lose. In my system, its like upgrading to a better pre amp, amp, CD player or phono stage. Highly recommended.
Kudos to Ted Denney and the entire staff at SR. Amazing stuff, guys. :-)
Frank
PS: If you try the SR BLUE fuses, please post your results here. Seems the naysayers, the Debbie Downers and Negative Nellie’s have hijacked the original RED fuse thread. A pox on their houses and their Pioneer receivers.
Frank
2,978 responses
Frank - I'm trying the two new fuses in my Ref 6, and comparing what I hear to the SR Black and Blue. One fuse change only, in my preamp. geoffkait - I try the orientation of the fuse immediately. Switch back and forth a few times. Whichever way it sounds better out of the box is what I stick with. Has anyone had experience to the contrary? The system sounds absolutely fantastic with either the SR Blue or Black fuses. I'm curious what these new fuses bring to the table. But I question how much valuable listening time I use... chasing... |
The trouble with that strategy is that because breaking in a fuse can be very uh, rocky, with many ups and downs along the way and you might not know if you’re UP or DOWN. Hey that sounds like a Hendrix song! So, if you try to draw conclusions too early, you might conclude the fuse is crap prematurely. If you see what I mean. No one promised you a rose garden. (Your humble scribe had the Audio Magic Super Nano Fuse a couple years ago, trust me it’s not crap.) 😁 You were the one who signed up for this duty. It’s up to you to do a thorough job. We’re all counting on you. 👪 The philosophical question is do you try reversing the fuse early in the burn in process or after burn in is complete? And why? 😳 |
Today I received both the Audio Magic Ultimate Beeswax fuse and the HiFi Tuning Supreme fuse. Right on the Beeswax fuse is a sticker that says Recommended break-in time 125 hours. I do not plan to listen to or burn tube life on something that sounds like crap. So, in a few days I will post my initial impressions of what I hear. Only if what I hear sounds promising will I proceed with further listening. |
Hi, Charles ... nice to see you posting in this thread. Yep, I have a lot of Bird’s recordings in my collection. Did he ever play the same idea twice? We can listen to the likes of Sonny Stitt and Cannonball Adderley, both greatly influenced by Parker .... and as great as they are, they still ain’t Parker. :-) Here’s one of my favorites: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Charlie-Parker-Dizzy-Gill-Bird-and-Diz-CD-NEW/401403945842?epid=129911438&a... I can’t vouch for the sound of the CD as I have it on vinyl. Its one of the more well recorded Parker records. By the way Charles, do you have any of the Super Sax albums? They did a nice job of transcribing Parker’s ideas onto modern recordings. Its some fun listening ... https://www.ebay.com/itm/SUPERSAX-L-A-VOICES-SUPERSAX-L-A-VOICES-CD-NEW/232288684900?_trkparms=ao%3D... https://www.ebay.com/itm/SUPERSAX-PLAYS-BIRD-LP-ORIGINAL-MASTER-RECORDING-MFSL-AUDIOPHILE/3223307294... https://www.ebay.com/itm/Supersax-Chasin-the-bird-1st-W-Germany-pressing-cd/322363281174?_trkparms=a... Frank |
Frank, Thanks for the recommendation. I'm a huge fan of both of these iconic saxophonists. Sonny Stitt BTW is as masterful with the tenor saxophone as he is with the alto. He's a marvellous musican who is historically under appreciated in my opinion. You and I both know the sheer greatness of Bird. Charles |
Oregonpapa If I could describe the Blue fuses in a few words, I’d say they *put a lot more meat on the bones.* The *textures are much more of what I hear in live music*." Robert has been bringing over some of his collection of ten-inch classical records from the 40’s and early 50’s. Some are *dead silent* and *spectacular.* I *wouldn’t call them "audiophile" recordings*, but man ’O man are they ever *enjoyable from a pure musical standpoint.* Beautiful covers too. Robert continues to amaze with his knowledge of recorded music .... performances and all. Last night *I dug into the vault* and dug up a Japanese pressing of Sonny Stitt playing Bird. *Charlie Parker was in the room.* Its available on Ebay in both audiophile pressings, standard mono, stereo and CD’s. If you like great bebop jazz, Parker in particular, this is highly recommended. Go for the stereo version: :. I can detect no cliches. You are granted safe passage. 😀 |
If I could describe the Blue fuses in a few words, I’d say they put a lot more meat on the bones. The textures are much more of what I hear in live music. Robert has been bringing over some of his collection of ten-inch classical records from the 40’s and early 50’s. Some are dead silent and spectacular. I wouldn’t call them "audiophile" recordings, but man ’O man are they ever enjoyable from a pure musical standpoint. Beautiful covers too. Robert continues to amaze with his knowledge of recorded music .... performances and all. Last night I dug into the vault and dug up a Japanese pressing of Sonny Stitt playing Bird. Charlie Parker was in the room. Its available on Ebay in both audiophile pressings, standard mono, stereo and CD’s. If you like great bebop jazz, Parker in particular, this is highly recommended. Go for the stereo version: : https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2380057.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xstitt+plays+b... Frank |
As I said previously, for me, it’s mostly about getting more low level musical information out of my system. Things like tone, PRAT, and dynamics are all dependent on this information, and are better when there’s more of it. Characteristics like brightness, darkness, hardness, sterility etc. are more dependent on the individual recordings, than the system they are played back through, IMO. My system can go from one to the other, and back, depending on which recordings I put on. Although I've tried to make my system as neutral as possible, I'm sure it does have some character. That character, though, is much less audible than the differences between various recordings. |
I installed a SR Blue fuse into my Exemplar 2900 CD player (replaced an Audio Magic premium) with outstanding results. I agree with previous posters sonic assessments. I'm using AM Beeswax fuses in the preamp and amps. This combination is sublime for me. I did try the SR Blacks in the amps, and preferred the Audio Magics. I'm getting quite a collection of high end fuses. How about you guys? |
Mitch2 writes in the Padis vs. Furutech tread ".... when I read about how the SR20 fuse "totally changed" somebody’s system but then how the SR Red further improved it with results that "are not subtle" but later that the SR Black "blows the doors off" anything that has come before...then along comes the SR Blue, etc., etc., etc. ..." When I wrote the same here, in this tread, some individuals felt offended all of sudden... One started coughing so my post has been removed. This is how people feel when reading exalted , exaggerated poems. The truth is fuses affect sound significantly but nothing close to the exalted statements. There are a number of good fuses on the market. Same of them better than the SR fuses, all depends on application and user preferences. I use two Blacks myself. |
My system is now all Blue. I changed Black for Blue in my CD transport early this week, and just did the same with my DAC. So far, I’m really happy with the results. For me, the priority is how well does my system extract low level musical information from the medium (CD in my case) and pass it on through to my ears. The Blue fuses are a clearly audible improvement over the Blacks in this area. |
@auxinput - I confirmed, I hadn't tested Padis. I only heard Padis in my friend's system and it was sounding bright. That's why I didn't test it. There are may testimonials on internet saying Padis is bright. Many more than opinions Padis is not bright. From your post ".. Both the PADIS and Furutech share the same essential sonic signature..." and also "At the 180-200 hour mark, the PADIS did get very bright/hard-edged". Furutech is Cryo treated and sounding better, not to everyone though. This is system dependent. Apparently, you don't understand what it means bright sounding system. System can be very resolving, with lots of highs but still can be dark sounding. I’m not saying Padis is bad. It's a good fuse but just bright sounding (I heard it for the record) which is not to my liking. I'm sure it can find it's place in some darker sounding systems. |
@jkuc - per your statements below:
Furutech fuses are NOT rebranded PADIS fuses. They are not the same thing. It is true that PADIS is the company that manufacturers the Furutech fuses. However, the generic PADIS fuses available on ebay for $25 plus shipping from Germany are NOT the same thing as Furutech fuses. Please see my testing results here: https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/padis-vs-furutech-fuses It could be that one difference are that Furutech fuses are cryo treated. However, I suspect that the Furutech fuses also have a thicker rhodium plating on them. There were definitely some corners cut with the generic PADIS fuses because they do not sound the same at all. The PADIS will share a "house sound" with the Furutech, but the Furutech are significantly better. The audible difference is obvious. The extra $25 you spend on the Furutech is worth it, unless you are on a very tight budget or if you just cannot get yourself to spend that much. Please do not make statement based on your assumptions unless you have actually tested and listened to these items. As far as brightness, I have listened to Furutech, PADIS, Hi-Fi Tuning and Synergistic SR20 side by side, swithing out fuses one at a time. The Furutech fuses are definitely resolving, but I would not call them bright. The SR20 and Hi-Fi tuning are definitely bright because they push the upper mids and highs. the PADIS is warm sounding in comparison to these, but very even and natural overall. |
Al, thanks again for another useful explanation for the lay person. Some of us who are enjoying these fuses are stuck within the qualitative realm of evaluation. Whether or not they protect as well as a stock fuse, they sure do something good for my sensory perception of the music. Would you ever try one? |
@almarg , yes, it was a rep from The Cable Co. who told me he researched as best he could how and where fuses are made and told me there are basically three types or grades of fuses and the applications used for each. He also went on to say that the lowest grade of fuses can vary in performance despite the specs and the next two levels adhere better to the specs. The mid level fuses, which is what the boutique audio fuses are based on, have been around a long time for use in other, more critical applications. One would think that since this has been known for awhile, the more knowledgeable folk around here who are more versed in this would have said something sooner. Something like, "all those fuses are are rebranded, higher quality fuses that have been used in ...." and the conversation wouldn't have been so heated. In my simple googling of high rupturing fuses and their uses, there are plenty of sites explaining them by highly degreed engineers so there is no mystery to these boutique fuses other than why they charge so much but that is another matter. Hearsay, yes. But I'm of a mind after researching what I could that it all makes sense without any need to strain credulity. That, and what my ears tell me. As for my last paragraph, there was a bit of snark in it. Not all the equipment should be considered faulty or poorly designed but who's to say that some of it isn't? We only have their word to go on, like mine and others who do hear a difference. The statement I made was to make people think before decrying aftermarket fuses. All the best, Nonoise |
Jafreeman 10-27-2017Aside perhaps for some unusual circuit configurations that may exist in a few designs, a fuse will always be in series with what it is protecting, rather than in shunt (i.e., in parallel). Otherwise the fuse wouldn’t be able to interrupt the current drawn by the equipment that is being protected, when a fault in the equipment makes that necessary. Regarding upgraded fuses being better conductors, I’ve indicated in some previous fuse-related threads that when the resistance numbers that are available for various fuse types are looked at quantitatively the bottom line generally appears to be that they are small enough to at most be marginally significant in some applications, but not in most applications. And in the case of mains fuses the voltage drops corresponding to those resistances would certainly be vastly smaller than the +/- 6 volt tolerance we have in the USA on our incoming 120 volt AC. IMO what stands a greater chance of being significant more often are the **fluctuations** in fuse resistance that occur in applications where the the amount of current being conducted by the fuse fluctuates widely. Which in turn could very conceivably result in modulation or intermodulation effects on the signal. That would apply to speaker applications (as you’ve found with your Maggies), and to many power amplifier applications. Most preamps and source components, though, draw essentially the same amount of current all the time. Nonoise 10-27-2017I recall that you’ve mentioned the statements in the first paragraph were told to you by a seller of boutique fuses. Is there any other basis that you are aware of for these statements? I am not aware of any other basis. And I can recall that at least 8 different members have reported here in the past year or two that boutique fuses blew in their equipment, which in most or all cases had presumably been operating without issue for a considerable amount of time with the stock fuses. In most of those cases the fuse which blew had the same current rating as the stock fuse, but in at least one case I can recall the upgraded fuse blew even though it had a significantly higher current rating than the stock fuse. Also, it’s perhaps relevant that the technical data supplied by Littelfuse and Cooper Bussmann for their fuses is vastly more comprehensive than data I’ve ever seen for any boutique fuse. And included in the data provided by Littelfuse and Cooper Bussmann is a melting point specification, measured in amps squared x seconds, which I’ve never seen provided for a boutique fuse. Admittedly, though, that particular spec is just provided in the form of a nominal value, without a +/- tolerance. Finally, my perception and my own experience has been that with very rare exceptions stock fuses in audio equipment tend to blow when and only when a fault in the equipment makes it necessary. So if I’m correct in interpreting the second paragraph I quoted from your post as implying that the equipment should be blamed when a boutique fuse blows and there is no evidence of an outright fault in the equipment, I would have to respectfully disagree. Best regards, -- Al |
Furutech fuses are rebranded Padis. The only difference Furutech's are cryo treated (and more expensive :) ). Padis rolled off in highs doesn't mean it's not bright. Furutech: bright, dynamic, detailed, lean. Padis must share "the housesound" . I haven't tried Padis though. Hifi Tuning Supreme (silver) is slightly bright and lean, Supreme Cardas is a different story. |
As I pointed out on (I think) a different post, there are 3 levels of fuses out there with the first two for commercial use. The 1st level is the cheap, standard fuse that varies more than it should concerning it's rating and the next level up are the boutique fuses which melt exactly when they should. If you're device is drawing more current than what it should, maybe you need to take a long, hard look at your component and find out why it's doing what it shouldn't be doing. All the best, Nonoise |
There is just no mistaking the sonic improvements of the SR line of fuses over several years in my system. Their value is to extend the useful life of the component you may have wanted to upgrade. Spending 2K on fuses has been far more economical to me than spending untold thousands more. How do they work? They are better conductors than the tiny filaments in glass---question is, how much are they part of the circuit? Wolf, you seem to be hung up on this aspect. Perhaps Al can define the various positions of fuses and their part in signal conduction. I know if I remove the fuses from the AC main inputs, the equipment won't work at all. I believe the fuses in my Maggie 3.6 tweeter and midrange fuse bank are part of the final signal pathway. Are they the complete pathway, or are they a shunt to receive an overload? How about the AC position--and the rail fuse? |
I actually did test of a pile of SR fuses a while back and found that they did nothing special at all except for a melting issue (!) seemingly due to a poor fuse rating. Nothing when compared to the $2 Littelfuse products I generally use. Zero. So, regardless of the SR fans who claim to not wonder at all about how or why the SR fuse magic manifests itself (and my ongoing utter disbelief of the claims of profound audio tonal improvement from use of a "special" fuse), my question remains…Ted Denney…you listening? Maybe provide a simple answer, or a complicated answer, or something, as I’m not the only one who would like to know. Thanks in advance. |
PADIS are not bright sounding. I would actually say they are slightly rolled off in the highs and a tiny bit warm when compared to a true Furutech. The Furutech may be described as lean/bright because it is so revealing, but in my opinion the truly bright fuses are Synergistic SR20 and Hi-Fi Tuning Supreme (because of the silver). |
@jkuc - Padis fuses have a reputation of bright sounding. Is the Blue as "bright " as Padis? Personally, I don't like bright sounding systems, not natural, kind of sterile.I've only tried two types of fuses-the HiFi Tuning Silver Star and the PADIS and to my ears, the PADIS are not at all bright sounding. They sound very even handed to my ears. The HiFi fuses had an emphasis on the leading edge, giving them a lively presentation, but at the expense with a slight lessening of everything else. If I hadn't tried the PADIS, I'd be happy with the HiFi fuses. For about $30, the PADIS are at least worth a try. All the best, Nonoise |
@bdp24 it’s an odd phenomenon, but many people only value something if it is expensive. They equate cost with performance. For people of this psychological make up, if something is free or inexpensive, it must be worthless. Likewise, if something is expensive or hard to get, it must be incredible. Not only does SR sell more fuses this way (because let’s be honest, many audiophiles are in this psychological camp), they also make more money and acquire an air of exclusivity. This has nothing to do with the performance of the fuses, simply an observation I’ve made, teaching yoga and DJing over the last 20 years. If I offer my services for free, my students aren’t as committed or the people I’m playing for aren’t as interested in what I’m playing. If I charge a bunch, my students are focused and come to class more consistently and my DJ clients promote me more and are more interested in what I’m doing. Humans. What a weird species |
At least ten of us here have testified that we hear an improvement over the stock fuse with SR fuses. Most here agree the new Blue fuse is best. I'm still investigating, and am still on the fence, whether the Blue fuse is best, for me, considering All the competition. I am an engineer by trade. The Only thing that matters is how does it sound. But if an explanation on how the technology works is available, I'm interested. I don't want to diminish the fact that $150 is a lot of money. To some people, that's their food budget for the month. But, I'd suggest that if one is considering spending $150 on a fuse, that they are most likely into high-end audio, at least where the benefits can be heard. I spend more than $150 per month on music. High-end audio is a niche market. There is little or no benefit of scale or volume. Think of the time and money spent on development. Then manufacture. With fuses, all the different loads and sizes. Then packaging and marketing. To my ears, a $150 component that provides what I've heard from fuses is a bargain. |
Even if you accept the premise of a fuse having an audible effect, or better yet hear it for yourself, why on Earth should or could one retail for $150? It is the price more than anything that raises a red flag for skeptics, is it not? Of course, if a money back guarantee is in fact offered, the genuinely curious can listen for themselves. If you don't hear a difference, what does it matter what the designer cites as the rational for it's design, or claims of performance? If you do hear a difference, and assuming it's for the better, the question then becomes does the improvement justify the cost? |
The real weakness of SR fuses is timbre. My question: is the Blue any better than other SR fuses in this department? Willgolf, you did compare Padis and Blue fuses. Your conclusion "..I switched back to the Padis fuse. There is absolutely no degradation of sound and imo it might be better than the SR Blue." Padis fuses have a reputation of bright sounding. Is the Blue as "bright " as Padis? Personally, I don't like bright sounding systems, not natural, kind of sterile. |
That's what I did testing half a dozen brands of vibration devices in 2015. I chose Stillpoints for my tube gear of various types Ultra and SS. The absolute worst was the Magico Q-Pods which had blacker backgrounds as claimed but killed the pace of the music most definitely as well as sounding dark and bloated. Robert and I tried it under all source equipment phono pre-amp, CD player and both pre-amp and amps. Nada, just bad! Some of the other vibration devices were nearly as good or similarly good as Stillpoints, but I liked the greater clarity and openness of them over the slight loss of tonal richness. Then I changed the fuses from stock Littlefuses to Black fuses bring back the tonal richness. So, when I heard the blue fuse, I immediately liked the sound. Robert heard them in Frank's system and immediately liked the sound. So, three unbiased opinions. And my very critical wife. The blue fuse is great in our tube based systems based on what our ears tell us. |
It must have been over 25 years ago, Dave. I was auditioning a used Conrad Johnson PV-5 preamp in a small, second-hand audio store in Denver. They threw together a turntable, the PV-5, a Mark Levinson ML-9 (I think), and some speakers. The system sounded a little bright and edgy. I said so. The owner of the shop changed One Thing, the interconnect between the preamp and amp. No more bright and edgy. Wow. That change changed my world. I've been trusting my ears since that day. |
