Seller asked for PayPal fees after the sale. Should I pay them or not?

Give him nothing keep on trucking!!!!!

While I’m not a prolific buyer or seller on Audiogon, I have happily completed a number of transactions here. I endeavor to be as straightforward and transparent as possible, which means that if it were the policy, I would clearly state that the PayPal fees are in addition to the asking price. In my own case however, I don’t think it’s fair to ask for this fee on top of the asking price if it’s the only available option the seller offers, so in my listings I clearly state that the PayPal fee is included in the asking price, and, in agreement with the above post, the asking price takes this into account. IMO trying to extort a PayPal fee after the agreed-upon price has already been paid is highly unethical.

I like PayPal and never ask for the fee's when I sell. I just set the price taking them into account. Shipping depends on item and where shipping to. I would not have paid the fee's but may have agreed to split the difference with the seller if he insisted. It is not that much money. 

I always find it interesting that people get bogged down in small details. When we purchased our home I told my wife, if we make an offer $5000.00 less than the sale price the buyer will come back with a counter offer of half that so now we're negotiating over $2500.00. If we offer the ask then that puts us in control. We offered full price and demanded possession at closing, we were in control. There was no further discussion. A paypal fee on a hypothetical $5000.00 deal is $150.00 (which I think is crazy but it's not my company) so you're haggling over $150.00 when spending $5000.00. Doesn't seem like much given the purchase price and certainly isn't worth causing a lot of consternation by either party. I have heard of real estate deals for hundreds of thousands of dollar falling apart over minutia. Doesn't seem worth it to me in the long run. Work it out, make an agreement and don't get bogged down in minutia. Good luck!

In my offers, I always explicitly state it includes ALL fees (shipping, PayPal ...) to avoid confusion.

Who is this seller?  Let us know who to watch out for.

Ebm, the whole point is that the seller neglected to mention the fees.
The OP (buyer) isn't being a cheapskate, just nonplussed that the seller is asking for the fees after he received payment.

I guess the OP as 2 choices:
Either ask for his money back and cancel the deal.
Or,
Pay the fees and be done with it.

Though, if it were me, before doing anything, I would contact Audiogon and ask them what they feel is appropriate in this situation.
I also hope the seller is following this thread. I would like to hear his/her version of the story.- Just to be fair.
Miscommunication happens. It would be nice if both parties could come to an agreement.

There is nothing carved in stone that you must use PayPal. I have sold here and taken certified or personal checks as payment. Of course you don't ship until the check clears.  

The whole PayPal thing sucks.  Man, I miss the day when we sent each other a money order, ship the item when you get the $.  Done deal dude.
Sigh...

It is not contrary to Paypal terms of service to ask for the fee. That rule only applies to Ebay. It is an Ebay rule, not a Paypal rule.

I've had the same experience. No mention of fees to be paid by the buyer in the ad (it would have been contrary to Paypal terms of service) and then they demanded them from me after the Ebay auction.  I declined and suggested that they review Paypal rules and send the item, or I'd be contacting Paypal to complain about his actions and he might lose his ability to use them at all.  Needless to say I didn't have to pay the fees.

OTOH, if a seller states that a buyer pays those fees, that is a contractual term regardless of whether or not it violates Paypal rules, and I would feel obliged to cough up for them as I knew the rules going in.

I have been on this site for a long time and years ago, it was common practice that almost all sellers asked for the paypal fee in their ads. It's not against any paypal rules to ask for the fee, but it is against ebay rules to ask for the fee. Some people have gotten very lazy when they place ads, not including all available information regarding any fees or other costs, they expect to get. Someone here said communication is the key here. So for sellers, take the time to spell out all of the fees and costs you expect and as a buyer, when making an offer, explicitly state that the offer  includes any and all fees and costs plus or minus shipping.  A lot of gas stations in my area have two prices, one for cash and one for credit. Its the same thing here. The seller has the right to ask (or build it into the asking price) and the buyer has the right not to agree to pay it or move on to the next seller. It's all part of the negotiation.

i agree with the consensus that you shouldn't pay a previously-undisclosed cost. more fundamentally, i've always found it tacky for a seller to lay off paypal fees on a buyer, much as i would object to a merchant laying off credit card fees--paypal is largely a convenience to the seller by enabling immediate, verified payment and various other protections.

IMO all fees should be listed in the origional ad so it is clear to all parties involved.

If it was not listed for fees in the ad .then you are in no way obligated to pay this .
 If you don't want to pay ,then donot if he does not agree .he has to give you a full refund .for you fullfilled your end of the bargain.

That sucks, @biggiglypanda.
When I list an item for sale, I absorb the Paypal fee. Most buyers will negotiate a price, and if it's too low, I'll remind said buyer that I am paying the fees. IME, the buyer will then accept a fair price.

Audiogon listings are very different than Ebay, where it's the policy that the seller pays all fees. Just look thru the Agon classifieds and see how many sellers are charging a 3% Paypal fee.

Someone above pointed out that it is against Paypal’s rules for a seller to ask the buyer to pay the Paypal fees. Unfortunately, a lot of seller’s ask/require that buyers do pay the Paypal fee, or circumvent the fee by asking the buyer to pay via friends and family. To head this off, before I send a Paypal payment I try to remember to inform the seller that I will be paying for goods and services, and I add up the price and any shipping. This gives the seller a chance to "correct" the final price, and gives me, the buyer to back out or renegotiate. Usually, if someone tries to stuff in last minute charges, I walk away on the basis that they have not been honest. And what if something goes wrong; I don’t want to have to deal a person like this if the item arrives with shipping damage, etc. On walking away from a deal, rarely is a deal a 'must have' deal for me. Letting your acquisitiveness cloud your judgement regarding safety is bad idea. (Acquisitiveness is a mortal sin for Catholics!) Another 'must have' item will probably show up for sale soon, I have learned.
Paypal Friends and Family versus paying for Goods and Services (or merchandise): If you don’t understand the difference, there are no fees to send funds to friends and family. Some sellers of merchandise want to be paid via this method, as it saves them Paypal fees. It is also fraud against Paypal. If you are okaying defrauding Paypal, think about this:
you pay good money for something and pay via the Friends and Family method. The seller sends you a brick. Try going to Paypal and getting them to return your money.  They will say, "what merchandise?" They would at least put a check on your account as someone who doesn't follow their rules, and who, knows? They may kick you off.
End of rant. Sorry, if I had more time I would write a shorter pos
DrSteve

IMO, it should be the seller's responsibility to absorb paypal fees since he/she is using the services of such 3rd party payment method. I am not pleased to pay other fees other than the offer price. I dont understand (and i refused to) why sellers are passing the fees to buyer since they always have the option to include %fees to there offer price. These happened to me in one of my transaction here in audiogon. After making offer for an item which he accepted, he send me a second bill with additional fees. I ask the seller to remove the additional fees since the first bill did not reflect Any additional fees which he accepted it. The seller didn't gave me option so i old him that I'm not buying the item anymore. The seller got irritated and became arrogant and threaten me to report to audiogon which he did plus leaving a negative feedback that "i didn't pay for the product i purchased". I explained my side to audiogon that there was a misunderstanding in the transaction and there was no final sale done. Afterwhich, audiogon reversed the fine (charges for buyer backing out )for buyers but did not removed the negative feedback and told me that they are going to review it.
Too bad that audiogon sided with the seller instead of protecting the buyer. 

So buyer beware and always ask for out the door price before paying...

Definitely not to pay 3% PayPal fee. If he disagrees, ask him to refund the amount you have paid, and terminate the deal. If he refuse to refund the money, report to PayPal to resolve it. Don't worry, you won't lose your money because PayPal will pay you back and deal with him just like credit card company. For your information, when using PayPal to pay a large amount, use credit card and PayPal to have double protection. In the case PayPal takes too long to resolve the issue, call credit card to put amount on dispute. Finally, if the issue is not ended up the way you want, report the incident to Audiogon, or eBay, and give him negative feedback.

IMO, if the seller as you said did not list in the AD that paypal fees must be paid by the buyer then you should not have to pay. It's really the seller's fault for not listing this fact and if the buyer presents this fact to the seller, the seller should be professional enough to accept his or hers mistake for not putting this note in the AD and not fight over it.

I have both sold and bought on Ebay for years. It is the seller's responsibility to have all expectations of the buyer's payment included their ad.

The fees are actually the responsibility of the seller, and the seller should include anything they expect to recoup in the price and the shipping fees -- including any tax. If it is a foreign seller, they the buyer has a responsibility to pay any fees necessary for satisfying customs, etc., but I think this also needs to be explicitly explained and plainly documented within the ad. In my ads, I plainly have all that I expect with regard to the buyer's responsibility right in the ad itself. This will eliminate misunderstandings and hard feelings.

This also includes any fees that are charged to PayPal if that is being used. If Ebay or PayPal held you responsible for those fees . . . you would be charged directly by them. If you have already paid half . . . you paid too much because they are not your responsibility.

If this cannot be settled -- contact Ebay customer service and allow them to arbitrate.  Hope this helps.
http://ocsnext.ebay.com/ocs/cusr?query=597

@parabolic Paypal would reimburse you the fees if you challenged and documented the seller's late request. 

At the very least leave neutral feedback for the seller alerting future buyers of this practice. If the seller did NOT mention Paypal fees in the ad, I would never pay them. 

I also agree that it was the seller's responsibility to disclose his terms BEFORE the deal. Whacking someone with additional hidden charges after the fact is not an honorable negotiating tactic and holding the item hostage smacks of scumbaggery. You would be within your rights to demand he ship the item as defined in the ad, and if he doesn't like it, then it'll be a valuable lesson learned on his part to be more diligent when posting an ad.

Seller seems like a jerk if it's as you say. You honored your end, seller needs to do likewise. Report extortion to A'gon

No.

Personally, I think we should accept most buyers will be using PayPal and price our items with the understanding that we'll have to pay a fee. Guess what? Virtually every merchant you deal with who accepts credit cards pays a fee for that service. I never charge PayPay fees but do ask that people consider paying as a "friend" and I've done the same. No PayPal fee but less protection for the buyer. I have a 100% rating here and palm to keep it that way. 

You are not obligated to.  The terms of the sale should be before the sale.

Mistakes do happen.  I listed 2 pairs of cables for what I thought was $100.00 each pair but my wording was poor and I realized I had listed the 2 pairs for the 100.00.  Buyer was smart enough to realize what I meant and I would have sold him both for the $100.00 as I didn't want any negative feedback on my first sale.  He paid for both sets and we were both happy.  Communication is key.

@gdnrbob "I know sometimes I have made a mistake in a listing, but I always try to make thing right" - that is what makes this site work, members treating each other with respect and always trying to do the right thing. I have dealt with many members here, good members, who also try and deal that way, many issues have arisen over the years and they always got resolved because in the end, everyone shared a common love for the hobby. Hope its stays that way, OP's seller not withstanding.

OP, you say you have already paid half the Ppal fee.
If so, and the original listing didn't mention anything regarding Ppal fees. Then, I think the seller should be gracious enough to accept what he has been paid-Even more gracious to refund you the fees you have paid.
I know sometimes I have made a mistake in a listing, but I always try to make thing right.
A Paypal fee is only 3%, so unless it is for a huge sum, then the amount should be something any reasonable person could afford to eat.

jea48: 
I was not pleased with the seller but it being my first transaction on Audiogon and the fact that the seller already had my agreed upon payment I went ahead and paid his ransom(extortion).

Jea48:
I had already paid the agreed price for the item. The seller then required for me to pay the PayPal fee before he shipped the item out.

Thanks very much for the feedback.  Just to clarify I, and I believe the seller, have no complaints about our deal.   I received some good guidelines for how to handle future offers so this will not occur again.

I believe it's against PayPal terms of service for a seller to ask for pay pal fees.

This happened to me on my first deal here on Audiogon. I was disappointed at the lack of integrity by the seller but since I had already made payment I paid his ransom payment. The seller's Audiogon account was later discontinued by Audiogon for some other nonintegrous behaviour with another member.
All fees should be disclosed upfront. If the seller didn't mention the fee in his ad it should not be your responsibility.

Next thing the loser will want is packing and fuel fees.

The deal is done. We call that balls up in my neck of the woods!

Does Audiogon have a written policy about a seller adding PayPal costs when  the listing is silent about who covers PayPal fees?   

If the seller didn’t ask for Paypal fees in the ad, then you’re under no obligation to pay them. If you paid half the fee...good for you, but you had no obligation to pay and the seller has no right to ask. That’s the simple answer!

+1 @lowrider57 - The deal you made was not to pay the fee but if you feel like you were getting a good deal in the first place, you may want to go ahead and offer to pay half of the fee to get the item you want. The other side of the coin is that if you do agree, then after reading this thread, some sellers may feel more empowered to try this tactic to get more money from buyers over and above what was agreed upon.

I have done a lot of buying and selling on this site, and when I am buying and am making an offer on an item, I always specify that my offer includes any and all fees such as paypal and includes shipping so there is no misunderstanding later on. Good Luck,

Mike

It's the SELLERS responsibility to list all fees upfront.  Since you have already paid half the fee I would leave it at that, if the seller refuses then I would contact Audiogon.

Many sellers here want the BUYER to pay the PP fees. You can alert him to the fact that the ad did not specify this, but I’ll bet he will still want you to pay. If the amount is significant and you really want the item, offer to split the fee with him.
But, since you've made a payment, I believe the seller has all the power in this transaction.