Preamp Deal of the Century

HELLO Gang.The preamp will indeed operate without regulator tubes, However... please do not operate the preamp without them. The purpose of the regulators is to smooth out the dc ripple from the rectifier tube to maintain a correct and steady dc voltage to the other tubes.

Hi Bwhite. Wow, $10k certainly is an arm and a leg. Fat chance of me getting that rig. I think I might very well follow through on your Bidat recommendation.

Yea, I'm looking forward to the Teres upgrade - should be quite a treat. Cheers.

I usually have little response to the postings here on A'gon, but after reading the hundreds of wonderful postings regarding the Supratek I simply couldn't resist.

Currently, I have found, what I think, IMHO, is actually the best preamp in the world. OK, I know that sounds strong, especially after all the wonderful comments above about the Syrah preamp. Truly, after everything that everyone had to say, I must admit I am curious about this absolute, knock-out, spank-your-momma gorgeous Syrah preamp.

OK, I understand that by now everyone who is reading my remarks is saying 'Alright already, so what is this best preamp in the world?'. Well, fellow Audiogoners, the answer is: NO PREAMP at all. I am plugging my CDP directly into my power amp with astonishing results.

I know this isn't an option for everyone, and, in all honesty, sometimes I do think about adding a turntable to my system again. After reading all the wonderful things that everyone had to say regarding the Syrah preamp, and looking at this beautiful preamp, my juices begin to flow. Not to mention that the price certainly seems more than fair.

This all leads me to asking a few questions. Does anyone have any thoughts they would like to share with me about adding a Syrah into a non-preamp system such as mine? To my ears, nothing has sounded as good as going direct, but if I add a TT this becomes a necessity. Also, did I read that this preamp is remote controlled? Lastly, what about Supratek's power amps? Anyone have any experience with them?

In advance, thanks for your thoughts...Happy Listening!

Louis

Has anyone compare the Syrah to an Audio Note M5?

Outlier... our friend Twl doesn't like me to say this... :)
After hearing a turntable in my system, I became disgusted with all my previous $10K cd setups...I sold it all.

Then months later, I bumped into someone who turned me on to the Bidat.

Anyhow, sad to say, the Bidat makes me wonder why I bother with a turntable... Its that good. Unfortunately the Bidats are hard to find. Another Meitner product which seems to be more available is the Melior DAC which I have never heard. It too can be modified & taken to another level for $300. You might talk to Audiogon user "Sutts" as he is doing a comparison between it and his Audio Note DAC3 Balanced. He could give you some insight on the Melior.

Louisl - I have run my DAC direct into my poweramp for 3 months prior to purchasing my cortese. "No" preamp sounds very good, I am able to hear every note, every detail, the noise floor of the recordings is very apparent because my system is so quite. But this can be a little distracting because everything that is on a recording isn't necessarily music.

With the cortese I still hear every note, every MUSICAL detail, but the noise floor of the recordings isn't in your face although you can still hear it. There are plenty of things the cortese brings to my system that "no" preamp can not. These are palpability, presence, and the emotion of the music. And no, the cortese is not euphonic at all, I wouldn't have it if it was.

Recently I got my Syrah form Basstwo in HK who is now using Kent passive pre into DCS DAC. He told me it's more transparent with Kent, but less musical than with Syrah.
My combo consists of Apogee Stage,Syrah,Mentmore m-200(200w mono tube), Proceed CDP, MSB Gold Link. When adding Syrah, my hifi set sound much better. Nothing complainable. I listened to CAT III, Matisse Fantasy, CJ Pimier 14. Nothing is more impressive than Syrah.

If you run digital into SS direct - and like SS and digital - then you will like it better direct; more detail and you don't mind the ever more heightened incongruency between void space, even void-er, and detail (a bias towards hearing the detailed sound source over percieving the surrounding dimensional space and the two's relationship, i.e "transparent" as to sound projection, desiring it to be in greater relief from ever increasing void space, thereafter defined as a lower background "noise floor"). If you value dimensional spatial charactersistics, the aforementioned relationship to sound projection, etc., and usually, for the same reason are therefore into analog and NOS tubes, then you percieve the hardwired tube pre as the "fulcrum" of the system regarding the evolution of these traits and relationships in the future.

A little more complicated than what Jazzdude said, but same thing in more "objectified" subjective terms.

Oh yea, guys above who know about the WE 350B, please educate me: tell me about the various vintages, any difference soundwise, costs justified between them or just crazy collectors for the older stuff, like with the 300B (although there it may be justified...). Thanks, Mark.

did anyone compare this syrah with hovalnd hp100? i wonder?
thanks

Hi Louis...going direct, been there and done that and the results can be very good, but it's not always the solution?

Having gone down the direct/passive route and then to the Supratek Cortese and Cabernet preamps, I have to agree with Jazzdude and ASA that a preamp brings something to the performance of my system that recreates the musical event significantly better than without it! Like Jazzdude says, the Cortese does something extra that brings the music to life! The texture and tone of instruments and voices become liquid and seductive with a nice three dimensional bloom (with no loss of detail, either). It is not a euphonic sweetening or an 'additive' thing - the music just sounds more correct, more real through the Cortese, it draws you into the music rather than have you analysing it ( as you tend to do with passive/direct devices).

ASA has indicated that once you get a VERY GOOD preamp like the Syrah or Cortese, it becomes the fulcrum/centrepiece of your system (I've used the word 'pivotal' in previous posts). I can't really listen to reproduced music without my Cortese/Cabernet, if I take the Supratek out of my system the whole soundstage collapses and becomes flat and one dimensional.

Also, in going direct from the cdp volume to the amp you are assuming that the power amp sounds 'perfect'. In my experience this is not usually the case. The synergistic result and nuance a good valve preamp brings is NOT a small thing. Particularly, if you use a solid state amp which usually needs the help of a valve preamp to sound nice and add the right tone, texture and upper harmonics to the treble that only valves can bring. I do acknowledge however there are some exceptions in the s.s camp such as the little Pass Labs Aleph 3 (which I've got) that has valve-like virtues, but even this tonally correct sounding amp is 'synergistically assisted' by the Supratek pre's.

BTW, the Supratek power amps are just as good as the preamps. I use a pair of the 18w/ch Single Ended Triode 'Merlot' monoblocs using the very linear Russian 6C33C-B output valves, and the amp is excellent! being very clean, ethereal and correct sounding. You have to match them with efficient spkrs though to get the best out of the 18w that they produce, but then again the same can be said of the Lamm ML2 and Audionote Ongaku, which are also 'ultimate' low powered SET amps. If you need more power and have the requisite $$$$$, then the 100w/ch Supratek Burgundy sounds fantastic too...

Regards,

Steve M.

PS: In case you are wondering, I have in the past gone direct from the cdp to amp direct via the cdp's digital volume. And, I have used the McCormack - Mod Squad Deluxe passive preamp with silver wire and Penny & Giles attenuator; an Audio Synthesis stepped attenuator and other passive attenuators and NONE are as lively or real sounding as a good valve preamp like the Supratek.

Stevem1960 - You touch on a very important point that the "no" preamp crowd would do well to consider. The "no" preamp scenario presupposes several things. That the audiophile has a very good poweramp that he likes, that the source has enough voltage to drive the poweramp, that the source output impedence and poweramp input impedence match well, the poweramp has enough gain, and that the output stage of the source is up to the job. I truly believe that with the right preamp, the interaction between source and preamp and between preamp and poweramp can create a system whose sum is greater than the parts. For me the cortese is that preamp.

Another of the great things about the cortese is that the subtle variations of tone from the instruments really comes out. I am digging my jazz recordings all over again. Sax's don't just breathe more but you get some of the harmonic decay just like in a live performance. And guitar, wow! Buddy Guy, Lee Ritenour, Wes Montgomery, Jeff Golub, all sound kickin. I find myself sometimes playing just favorite parts of recordings so I can soak up the tone.

Dynamic contrasts were missing from any of the several passive pre-amp or cd direct to amp systems I have heard over the years. Dynamic structure and texture along with the jump factor were never present in any of the previous mentioned systems. I certainly want to eliminate any coloration of the circuit whether it appears to be a pass thru or an active line stage. A well implemented gain stage's voltage swing should accurately track the ebbs and tides of a live performance all the while being transparent.
For me this is the most satisfying presentation of the real performance..Emotion....Tom

Steve-Thanks for the thoughts. I guess I'll just have to get one and see for myself. You really have me thinking regarding you comment about the "nuaunce a good valve preamp brings". I do know what you mean, as I have owned several very good tube preamps in the past. I will add that the CDP I am using also uses tubes (Audio Aero MKII - the latest version). It, indeed, does add the "right texture and upper harmonics" as no solid state CDP or DAC ever has.

I still have a few questions.

Can I run balanced, or is this preamp strictly single ended? It seems that the Audio Aero, sometimes, sounds better when I run thru its balanced outputs and sometimes sounds better when run thru its single ended outputs. It seems to be related to the amp that I use, as different amps sound better using the CDP's single ended outputs, and some amps sound better using the CDP's balanced outputs. (It all get's pretty crazy doesn't it)?

Also, can I get a Syrah with a remote control option? Not that I'm lazy, but I'm a firm believer in the ability of being able to make volume changes from my listening chair.

Thanks again! Louis

Any owners in Los Angeles?

Please email me if you would be willing to let a member come by and see this beauty.

How about owners in the southeastern New England area (including Boston)? Am interested in taking the Supratek plunge (system is Accuphase and Avalon based).

The Supratek is a no brainer, unless you are spending big bucks, $8000USD or more...even then I don't know if the alternatives are better ??

We need to go back to Tubegroover's comments of one month ago, with which I strongly agree...

From Tubegroover:

"I have been withholding this but I think it just needs to be said so no one will have any misunderstanding or apprehension, don't think about it if you are, just do it. If you have a budget that permits it, you can't make a wrong decision with the Supratek. It is impossible unless you are prepared to spend considerably more money. Even so, the decision will still be valid because it can be resold without losing anything or very little and if you don't go ahead with it you will most likely never have the opportunity to hear if you made the right choice or not and the curiosity will never subside until you forget but after so many posts on this thread and still counting, the death of curiosity may prove quite slow.

My reason for the above comment is because I have communicated with a few that are on the fence and I have been too conciliatory to their concerns, the wait and the service. This is the real deal it can't be overstated. It is a $7K or better pre for $2.5K, it really is. I waited 5 months longer than I should have. If only I had believed what I read from the beginning. Read Mark Bucksath review on the Supratek website, and read it very carefully...

http://www.supratek.biz/review.htm

If you can connect to the contents of his most wonderful descriptives of this product, you will hear the Syrah. Keep in mind this recommendation is based on the extreme value of what you will hear, not in the context of the "best" that may be available. If you are prepared to pay considerably more, you will certainly have more choices. I have NO doubt this is the best pre-amp value at this price point on the planet and it is very easy to say it."

Tubegroover: 28/07/03

Regards,

Steve M.

i have noticed on the web site that balanced outputs are an option on the syrah. but it mention the rest of the pre's in/out complement. can anyone comment? also has anyone heard the amp with the balanced outs?

I don't think its true balanced, meaning balanced from input to output within pre, but rather, just has balanced connectors to enable those with balanced systems to get a Supratek. To be honest, I think balanced was a bigger deal back when RCA dig cable connectors sounded like crap, or people needed anything just to help a Theta DAC out of its raspiness, or a SS Krell out of its, well, you know... With tubed systems, particularly hard-wired ones, RCA is perfectly fine. Of course, many have balanced CD hardware already when they arrive at a Supratek from SS/digital-based systems, so maybe, justifiably - economically justified - they need balanced pre inputs. But, on the whole, IMHO the whole balanced pre/amp thing may be past its prime...Not directed at you, audioobsessed, just throwing kindling on the fire. :0)

Audioobsessed - Supratek preamps have balanced and RCA outputs. But only RCA inputs. The preamp will drive a balanced poweramp but you'll be single-ended from the source. The preamp is a SET, I think only push-pull configurations can be balanced all the way through. Email Mick if you have questions.

Without reading all 620+ responses what amps have worked the best with the syrah pramp? Tube or SS? I am ordering a syrah and just wonder what some of you have been using.

Thanks

Bobheinatz, I don't think it matters what amp you use, tube or ss. The Supratek has more than enough gain and flexibility to be used with any amp. The amp/speaker match is more critical. The output impedance on the Syrah is 600 ohms.

I am using a Berning ZH270 with superb results but expect most of the Supratek owners will tell you the same.

Hello Gang. What happened to the tube thread on the supratek preamp? Did it get yanked?

I cannot find the Supratek Tube thread anywhere - I think it got yanked. Why? I dunno.

Hey Bwhite. To reiterate: Under no uncertain terms would the WE 350b's be justified for regulators in the supratek given their current market value.As mentioned earlier in the tube thread; The only reason I use them in mine is... I had a pair left over from an old pair of theatre amps that I sold years ago.Yes, I do like them as regulators in the supratek.. however the tungsol 5881's or any of the older 6L6 G versions are terrific.Their purpose in the supratek is to smooth the dc ripple of the rectifier and regulate a constant voltage to the gain stage.Early st-bottle shaped 6L6 G'versions can be found for peanuts just about anywhere. The guitar guy's tend to prefer the higher rated GB and GC versions of the 6L6 as the G rated versions cannot handle being ramped up into overdrive and tend to distort far to early for them.I would hazard to guess that well over 90% of the 6L6's were traditionally sold to the guitar amp market.

Ecclectique, I've tried some Sylvania 6L6 GWA (I think that was the designation) from the 40's. Smoked - gray glass. Anyhow.. they were recessed sounding, dull in the Supratek. In fact, I think they sounded a lot like the Sovetek EL34's the Cortese came with - not great.

I understand that the regulators aren't supposed to effect the sound much but I do hear major differences in the depth of the music with different tubes in that position. Oddly enough, I can hear bigger differences between regulator tubes than rectifier tubes in the Syrah, Chardonnay and Cortese.

The metal 6L6 RCA's had a tremendously wide soundstage yet the music was almost flat sounding - not dull or lifeless - just not deep or 3 dimensional when compared to the TS 5881's in my system.

I'm still searching for a pair of Sylvania 5932's with the dual black plates, as well as some early GEC KT66 to try. If those don't cut it, I'll most likely stick with the 5881's.

On a side note, I got some Mullard ECC32/CV181's to replace my Ken Rads. Neat tubes. I know.. I know... they AREN'T 6SN7's... Oddly enough, they work great in my Cortese but didn't work in a friends Syrah. In the Syrah, the remote volume control stopped working and the gain/dynamics went to about 20% of normal. That's weird because they function perfectly in the Cortese.

Hey BWhite. Hearing the differences between regulation and rectification tubes is certainly not odd or strange,its a "good thing" ... as they do infact impart on the sound of the supratek. Your description of the 6L6 metal seems to parrallel mine... as I also find them rather lacking of air and space in the soundfield,and more so than any other tubes I have tried, sovtek included.I have not tried the 5932 however, the GEC kt-66 and the mullard EL-37 seem to be the closest to WE 350b than anything else I've used.These tubes all seem to add more depth and air to the soundfield without changing the tone of the music.Regarding the use of the ecc-32 in your friends Syrah..... very strange....something doesn't add up here, as they work just fine in mine.Have you tested these tubes? What rectifier and regulators was he using with these?

Ecclectique - I don't have a tube tester so haven't tested the ECC32's. I presume there is nothing wrong with them given that they work fine in my Cortese. The trouble my friend had with the ECC32's in his Syrah and the non-functioning remote volume lead me to believe that the way his Syrah is wired is different than newer Supratek's.

I think his Syrah is the second unit to ever have the remote control - my Chardonnay was the first. Switching the DC power cord between his Syrah and my Chard caused similar issues with the remote volume not working.

At that time, I believe Mick was pulling power for the motorized volume from different places in the pre - experimenting?? Perhaps this is an instance where the different internal electrical properties of the ECC32 vs. 6SN7 come in to play.

Hello Bwhite. Could be a weak rectifier and/or weak ecc-32's. Gentlemen... please do yourselves a very big favour , you "must" get yourselves a good calibrated tube tester!!! Absolutely indispensible,especially when considering the tube rolling everyone is doing here! Most any tube that tests anything less than 90% shouldn't even be a consideration. Even if one is purchasing nos tubes,a good calibrated tester is "imperative" as many NOS tubes right out of the box can fail to meet spec.To be blunt and honest! I think you will be somewhat surprised when you test some of these tubes you are using in the supratek. Matching the 6sn-7's per channel is paramount for top preformance in the supratek.... not to mention.... section to section matching of each of these tubes- which is even "more" important [in all triode tubes]! Check the strength of any rectifier you are using as these will have a large impact on the overall sonics of the preamp.Making a comprehensive evaluation regarding the sound of various tubes makes, types, and vintages of these tubes in any circuit is pretty much flawed without knowing these parameters.For example... A strong rectifier of the same type will sound very different than that exact same tube that tests even 10% less than the stronger one. Do not mean to sound so derogatory gang, however some things are a given and need to be addressed here .....Cheers David

Tube matching is a must with push-pull configurations. With single-ended configurations (like all SupraTek's) it is optional but still a good idea. Ditto the need for a tube-tester, esp for someone who has invested a couple thousand in tubes. A good B&K 747B or TV-7 can be had for just a couple hundred dollars.

Where did everybody go?

Do NOS tubes need to burn-in time to reach full sound potential ?

Got my Chardonnay 2 months ago.

Yesterday received NOS Ken Rad Black Glass 6SN7GT.

- Ken

Hello Georgia. Each and every NEW tube needs to be run in for a period of time to settle in. Some more than others.

I consider to order Chardonay. Would appreciated very much if anyone in Bay Area who has one and could let me audition? Does it have remote control? Thanks.

Hi Hpfish:
I have a Syrah, and I live in Los Altos, Ca. I'd be happy to let you hear it in my system. However, I'm between CD players right now, and only have a DAC on hand (no transport as yet), as I mostly listen to vinyl these days. Hence, if you can bring over your CD player (or Transport), you can check out my Syrah (which for line stage purposes would be the same as the Chardonnay).

To be honest though, you really can't go wrong with ordering a Supratek. I had a $5k Stereophile Class A line stage preamp before the Syrah, and the Syrah is unambiguously superior, with phono stage, for half the price. It's a no-brainer if you ask me. My next and last preamp will be a Cortese and/or The Grange.

Let me know if you want to swing by - just email me direct. Cheers,
John.

Thanks to all who wrote glowing reviews of the Supratek preamps. In short, the Chardonnay has transformed my system. Instead of listening occasionally, music is flowing most of the time now. From all of your reviews, I expected an intimate, dynamic and organic presentation, but
the transparency and spot-on tonality surprised me.

I think it is safe to say: Everybody digs Supratek.

Just replaced Sicte 6NS7(any one knows this Italian tube, pls hsare your experience) with CBS 5692 brown base(1958) on Syrah. The CBS sounds fuller but darker and less tranparent than Sicte. I hope the CBS can get better in hi-end with further burn-in. Or maybe my system(esp. Apogee) needs more extended hi-end rather than mid-low band which is the strength of CBS.

Hi Everybody.
I've got some good news and some bad news. The bad news for present owners is that I've completely redesigned the Cortese/Sauvignon and the Grange/Cabernet preamps. Sorry, but as the label on the old GE tube boxes says "Progress is our most important product"
The good news is that after many years I finally have the "higher-end" production pres sounding as I always have wanted them to sound.
It has been a hard and often frustrating journey- I've always prefered the sound of high gain preamps, although there is more to it than just the gain aspect as phase is a very important and often overlooked part of the overall sound design package.
The high gain pres sound more "alive" and 3D like- they have magical imaging properties that can throw a soundstage as deep as wide with the right speakers and amps.
The difference is not subtle- it is instantly more realistic and lifelike. Joyful isn't too strong a word.
The BIG problem is the high gain- everything gets amplified to high levels, including the inherant noise of the preamplifier, which is quite low, being fully regulated.
However the inherant noise of the following power amp also gets amplified and these are usually much noisier than a good preamp.
If the power amp has high gain, and many do these days in order to be used with CD direct, then the hum and noise can be intrusive,especially with high effeciency speakers.
The solution is to use a low gain/sensitivity power amp- then you have the preamp providing the voltage gain and the power amp turning it into current to drive the speakers.
Each unit does what it is best at then and gives the optimum sound. And noise levels are inaudible, even with high effeciency speakers.
This is what I've used for years, and is how I like to build systems- high gain preamps and low gain power amps.
Unfortunately, in the real world there are very few low gain/sensitivity power amps,so I've had to compromise the design of the preamps to limit the gain.
Over the last year Kevin and I have taken the design of the higher ended preamps even further up the scale- to a standard that I didn't think was even possible. I cant begin to describe how involving these preamps are. Even now after nearly 30 years of doing this, I still have to have my daily dose of sitting down and soaking up the pure enjoyment of listening to such a joyful sound.
But we've been doing this with preamps I couldn't sell!
Match these with a high gain power amp and the noise will come through-some who have heard them are quite prepared to put up with it to have the sound, but i haven't been prepared to sell them like that.
I 've been looking for a solution for years- how to get the magic sound of the high gain pres into a low gain version.
In August 2003 the solution came to me, and after a few months of fine tuning the concept, the all new Cortese/Sauvignon, Grange/Cabernet designs were finished and are now being built.
The web page will be updated soon with all the details.
Please note that this update does not relate to the Syrah/Chardonnay preamps- I'm very happy with the performance of these preamps and see no reason to change the configuration of them.

Cheers
Mick Maloney- SUPRATEK

Hey Mick, that's great I am very happy for you and the progress/success of Supratek but what about the Cortese/Sauvignon and the Grange/Cabernet owners who just got screwed over by your joyful announcement?

Is there any plan for helping existing owners in upgrading the Cortese/Sauvignon and the Grange/Cabernet preamps or should we try to sell these now before more people read the thread and the resale value of these units plummet?

Thoughts?

Long time ahead of us to find the pre-amp deal of the Century. I will continue my search..Tom

Hmmmmmm.....so if Mick dies or goes into some other business you are up the creek once he has your money and now he has new models. You know the old saying about "if it sounds too good to be true it probably is".

Sell now

there is one right now on Audiogon!

BWite, I feel your pain. If I had the previous version I would want the upgraded unit myself. But in reality, we are talking about progress here and it ain't never gonna stop. Actually I applaud Mick for continuing to push the envelope with his designs and trying to constantly improve them.

As the old saying goes, "Change or die".

Jsujo, wake up and smell the coffee. The Supratek that is advertised is not one of the units Mick was referring to in his post. Actually, he said the Syrah (advertised) was not affected by the changes!

Fiddler, you are correct. While Mick's products have been successful as a result of how they sound, that does not diminish the fact that his customers -- the ones willing to "bite the bullet" and buy a preamp on faith, without ever listening to it -- are the ones who financed that progress and therefore should be given the respect of an upgrade path.

I commend Mick on his progress both in the development of new products as well as his ongoing customer support & loyalty to his customers but I am a bit stunned at how careless this "new product introduction" was and how little it took those die-hard Supratek advocates into consideration.

My take on Mick's post was basically that it was a slam on the Cortese / Grange and the general overtone somehow seemed that Mick was never happy with that design to begin with. The slow progression/evolution of the Cortese design into something which is much more like the Syrah than it was in its inception is clear evidence of this dissatisfaction. Yet, Mick's never failed to tell his potential customers how great his preamps were and how he couldn't possibly build anything better - in so many words.

Now.. we hear it again. With this post, Mick claims to have done what he never thought possible. Just like what he said when he built the Cortese and then again when he built the Grange.

Sorry for rambling here. I'd really like Mick's input on this before writing more speculation. :)

So in closing, Fiddler... It's not just MY pain. If the value of Cortese and Grange preamps fall, so will the value of Syrah. This pain is for all Supratek owners. I am as I said, interested in Mick's follow up comments on this topic because I feel it would be in his best interest to provide an upgrade path for his customers - for many reasons.

BWhite, once again your points are well taken, but AA is full of posts complaining about manufacturer upgrades. Cable companies (especially power cords) seem to be the worst offenders.

I suspect that Mick thought his products were the best he could build at the time, but with continued testing and computer modeling, he discovered better circuits.

I wish everything I have purchased in audio was the last and greatest, but it ain't gonna happen. I know you are pissed, but look at Levinson, Krell, CJ, Plinius, MF, etc. They are constantly upgrading and last year's model drops like a rock.

Mick's products have held their value very well and I suspect they will continue to do so. They have consistently out-performed other gear in the used market because of the hype (justified), long wait and reputation. Will used Suprateks continue to sell in the used market for nearly 100% of the original purchase price? I doubt it, but they will still probably beat the averages.

I guess I am not upset because I never buy any audio gear as an investment. I figure going in I will lose 50% of the original purchase price when I go to sell it. If I can eventually sell Mick's gear for anything over 50%, I figure I am ahead of the game.

Good luck and happy listening.

Actually the body of my message disspeared,,,it wasnt supposed to be that way...

But thanks for the advice!..;-)

Hi Fiddler, I'm not pissed. I simply think that there should be some consideration for existing customers. The post didn't seem to indicate there was any - and I am waiting to hear back from Mick before getting too emotional about this.

Mick's products are great and *I* look forward to hearing what his newest designs sound like but truth be told, Mick's "sales force" is mostly made up of existing customers. I cannot even count the number of emails I've received/answered and the amount of personal time I've spent communicating about these products - and in effect, selling the Supratek brand. Likewise, I am sure there are many more people out there doing the same thing - and in essence, helping spread the word about Supratek products.

You'll notice that Mick doesn't advertise in the audio mags nor has he ever. The popularity of his gear has been generated by word of mouth and by satisfied customers. This "preamp deal of the century" thread is by far the most active/popular thread on Audiogon which in turn is the most active/popular audio website on the internet. This is where a great majority of the Supratek advertising happens and it's no wonder Mick posted his announcement here.

I am confident that Mick will offer an upgrade path (but dismayed that there was no mention of this in the "new product announcement"). If existing customers do not upgrade to the new design and confirm to the world that there is an improvement, the "sales cycle" as it is now will stop functioning. I'm not a sales genius but it occurs to me that taking care of his customers would be the best way to ensure his "life's work" continues to be successful.

Hey Gang. I'd take bets the Syrah 4 sale here doesn't last the weekend.