@ozzy That sucks. I ordered a different cable from vinshle Official store and broke the ground pin on it, and they responded in a few ours and shipped a new pin out to me the same day. Of course, I had to pay 3.50 in shipping.
Counterfeit Chinese Cables
I thought that I would write this for those who are curious about one of the many counterfeit Chinese interconnect cables that are available these days. I know that there have been threads about the subject before, and I was always curious because they seem to be such a bargain. I don't really recall much about what any members actually said about the performance of these counterfeit cables, and I didn't look back and do any research, but a couple of months ago there was a thread that came around to discussing the quality of Chinese made components, and oldhvymec said something that made sense to me.
He said that people that say that what they are making is junk should consider that much of what is in our gear, and a lot of our American brands are actually manufactured there. I decided shortly after that that I would take the chance on a set of interconnects, because I suspected that the interconnects going from my pre to my amp were the weak link and needed upgrading. The interconnects going from my DAC to my pre were Kimber Select which are very good, but the other set were LAT International (now defunct) which had cost $500.00 when new, but I had reason to believe they were lacking because I have one of their digital cables that turned out to be very poor sounding in comparison to others I own.
I decided on a one meter pair of counterfeit Nordost Odin interconnects for a total of $104.00 from Aliexpress. I received them a couple of weeks later. They appeared to be well made, and the locking fake WBT rca's were very impressive and are very tight.
First impressions after installing them were light, thin sound, lacking bass. Each couple of days brought improvements, but from the beginning I noticed that they were quieter. Now, weeks later, I can say that they are drastically better that the LAT's in every way. Detail and ambience are much better, but it's the focus and separation of instruments that is most noticeable.
I have no way of knowing if they are really a copy of the Nordost design, but I am impressed enough that I am going to try a counterfeit Nordost digital cable.
Obviously, this isn't a comparison that is useful to most, because there probably isn't anyone here using the LAT's, and everything is system dependent. I just wanted to relay my positive experience.
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@rolox I think there is 3x 16ga solid core runs for each positive and negative leg. This adds up to a fairly decent gauge power cable. Enough for most power amps IMO. |
Good to hear you hear an improvement. What are you comparing it to, and what is your system. Power cords can make a significant difference in sound quality. I certainly have heard it and choose mine with many comparisons. There is a place under your UserID to put photos and identify your system, this way you need only do it once. You can see my systems there. |
Well, my second chinese order was for some spades and AC plugs that I placed with the Furukawa Flagship Store went astray. I ordered 2 items. One item was received but contained only half of the item. The other item never arrived. (Been over a month now). Very poor communications. I guess I am SOL and I’ll just have to accept the fact that I got stiffed, glad it wasn’t too expensive. So, others be careful don’t buy anything from this supplier. ozzy |
I received this Odin Gold power cord yesterday (EU version), installed it on my analogue active crossover (where I didn't think it would have much impact) and HOLY CRAP. from the very first second, the scene widened, deepened, mids are smooth and liquid, detail is there but zero agressivity, this is so far the best power cord I've tried in my system - and it's a cheapie! Small gauge, tho, so probably not suitable for power amps or subwoofers. Now my impressions are from a brand new PC, so we will see how it evolves after burn in, but in all logic it can only get better (after some rollercoaster with difficult moments of course). Fingers crossed!
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I bought a pair cardas clear knockoffs just because I had an original pair and was real curious,both xlr...took about a month free shipping.when I got them I literally wrapped them with some blue tape so as not too confuse...visually they are identical, it's scarey...too me in my system I can't tell the difference ...if there is it's so minute it certainly not worth 100s more for original ones |
Update: After getting several more hours in with this braided silver plated power cord I have to say it was mesmerizing initially… the details and clarity really stood out but it is just too much for my system. I felt the mids suffered a bit and the highs, which are really good and jump out at you, are just fatiguing. Didn’t get the sense the cable was improving with more playing time. I have gone back to my DIY Chinese KimberKable 12TC ($7 per meter) with added ground helix. Warmer, fuller midrange sound, nice smooth bass, more real sounding, nice clear highs non fatiguing and the cable continues to improve with use. Amazing value but for $’s you can do better. |
Good to know. Thanks for the follow-up @kray. That sure makes it easier for those who are wondering and want to give something a try. There ya go!
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@bfb1963 yes the connector plates are plated and silver in color, the screws appear to be brass and are gold. No shielding connected on this 12 strand braided cord… |
@decooney it states on most listings... "Free Return - Return for any reason within 15 days" - I've also noticed they have an US based address to return items to. |
Did you look to see if the internal wire clamping plates of the connector plugs were also plated? Is the shielding grounded only to the male plug? |
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@jetter : I understand that completely. Belden, Gotham, Mogami too. My point is you cannot accuse Ghent for being dishonest or lying for using "canare" as someone put in parentheses above. |
Ghent's Canare cables are genuine Canare. At least those that I have personally bought and still own.
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Canare cable is manufactured in Japan. I am currently using Canare interconnects (Redco) and speaker cable (Blue Jeans), as are many here and I am told recording studios often use them. These Ghent cables seem fairly priced, I am not sure why you are implying negatively about them. |
I checked Ghent out, they use AliExpress material!! Palic Chinese connectors, 'Canare' cable, that's funny... |
It’s interesting to me the amount of pearl-clutching generated here by obviously fake knockoffs being sold to informed people who never would/could buy the real deal, whereas the idea of sourcing dirt-cheap cables from China and marketing them at a greater than 10x markup is something that no one seems to bat an eyelash at.
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@ghdprentice you must have bought some very bad fake Odin. If I except the last Odin "Gold" ICs I returned because they sounded overly smooth and dead, I’ve never had a single fake Odin sounding bad. Some take a bit longer to burn in. But I’ve never had a single one sounding harsh, trebly, compressed - maybe slightly congested and dynamically challenged before burn in, but that goes away quite fast. In any case they all turned way better than they have a right to be at the price - and I vastly prefer them to all my "genuine" cables which include VanDenHul and (entry level) Nordost. Bear in mind I’ve never tried any off their XLR cables, only RCA, but still, I guess you just purchased some very bad version (bad solder, wrong use of the cable geometry, whatever). The speaker cables were the only ones sounding very bad at some point. They took ages to break in in my system due to the very high sensitivity of my speakers and the very low current traveling through the cables. At some point they became so harsh and congested and bass shy that I almost took them out of the system, but I’m glad I didn’t, because they now sound fantastic, smooth open and transparent. Of course I never compared them to the real Odin cables, but in my opinion the right versions of the counterfeit cables can easily compete with cables at 10x the price, which is already not so bad. |
@rickysnit exactly, Chinese counterfeit have been there forever, they're a part of life and one could say they're a cultural thing - in the meantime Rolex has never sold so many genuine watches, stores are empty as there is too much demand vs production, with prices skyrocketing in the stratosphere, and I'm not overly worried about LVMH either - smame as I'm not worried for Nordost! In the end I would say those counterfeit cables hurt the smaller, less known brands more because they can sound just as good for a fraction of the cost. |
@rfnoise that Underwood power cord is definitely exactly the same as the "Accuphase" branded PC sold on AliExpress. I have a couple of them, they're OK and look great, but I would NEVER pay 300$ for one. They are 20$ on Ali. For 300$ you can buy two extremely good PC on Ali... |
I think these were about $110 delivered. I certainly did not think they would sound like the real thing. But I am a scientist… and couldn’t help but want to actually know what I was talking about.
My interest was, we’re these actually “made in the same way”, so they were really complete rip offs and sounded very similar… with some compromises. Or, alternatively, like Mexican Salsa in Eastern Montana. Yeah… “it is red” in photos… and looks a lot like ketchup… let’s use ketchup!
Yes, when bicycling across Montana and going into “Mexican” restaurants I got served ketchup as salsa with chips (having lived next to the Mexico boarder and spent a couple years living in Mexico, I can assure everyone salsa tastes is nothing like ketchup… anywhere in Mexico. So my conclusion is that Chinese Nordost Odin 2 knock offs are nothing like the real Nordost Odin 2. They only look like it. Ok, not a surprise… but I know this from experience not just thinking.
I was in charge of all information technology at a global semiconductor company (Burr-Brown Corporation) in 1999. I needed to assess the risk of the “millennium bug” shutting our system and consequently putting us out business when the date flipped over to 2000. I read these ridiculous books that premised that “this chip” has an embedded date with the year represented as two digits (like ‘99, as opposed to 1999) and therefore chips are in 60% of the mechanical devices on earth… so they will all fail. Utter nonsense. None of these idiots actually sampled the percentage of components with the problem and did the legwork to figure out which devices and consequently systems would be vulnerable. What BS. I would read the first few chapters of this stuff and toss it in the garbage. We, upgraded two systems… (a couple million dollars)… and not a single system failed… I was there at corporate headquarters when we powered down all our system a couple minutes before midnight and brought them back up a couple minutes after. Yawning, and heading home a half hour later. |
I have absolutely zero problems with Chinese branded genuine, honest audio cables brands. I am sure they are great value for the money. My issue is with the outright violation of IP rights and use of brand names. True story: I have bought a bunch of stuff from Ghent. Awesome guy to deal with, great products, no lies, no violations of anything. Ethical: https://www.ghentaudio.com
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Ok. I got my set of fake Odin 2 XLR interconnects today. While not broken in, I do generally remember what my Transparent Ultra XLR (current generation… $3,150) sounded like when I put them in. I put the new Odin2 between my DAC and preamp Audio Research REF CD9se DAC and Audio Research REF6se preamp. Incidentally, the same position I once had real Odin2. The new Odin sound compressed, harsh, trebly, lacking bass definition… not quiet or smooth. While the Transparent sounded better with time, they never sounded anywhere this bad. I really could not listen to them for more than a couple minutes… they were actually uncomfortable to listen to. Reminding me of inexpensive silver… are they really made of silver? I figures they were colored silver on top of copper. I have listened to the real Nordost Odin 2 in my system…. There is absolutely no similarity. Not that one could reasonably expect it. This certainly reminded me how much of a difference a single set of interconnects can make. I was thinking that since all my other sets of interconnections were very high quality, maybe one set would not matter that much. Wow, that’s not right. So, I need to break them in. I’ll have to pull out my break in system. All my systems are tube, so I have a separate system with only a couple small tubes for breaking in stuff. I’ll have to put a few weeks on them to see how much the calm down. |
Most people here know I completely rewired my system with Neardost mostly Odin 2 IC/PCs, BUT, after wards I saw the Gold and had to try it to compare. I placed it on my Audiolab 6000 CD transport and the Odin 2 on my LSA Voyager GaN 350 amp. I have been curious to find out how much (if any difference) swapping them would make. Last night I finally did, and it was a WOW moment. Today I am ordering another Gold to replace the Odin 2 powering the transport |
Recently bought a Benchmark Media AHB2 amp and their DAC3L. They sell/make their own cables and identify most of the OEM they use. I made my own DIY cables using the same products and Cardas solder. Their 3ft RCA interconnect is $35. Their locking power cable is $20. They report these are the same cables they use in house. I made my own so I could have precise lengths and the color jackets of my choosing. I wonder why they don't know about the wonder of uber high end cabling? Hmmm... Or maybe their equipment is so good that they don't need $10000 cables to sound great. Wouldn't mind seeing some A/B testing with their cables.
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Heavenly? @thyname |
@rolox : I was not shaming anyone. I was simply pointing out what I saw wrong with the picture the poster painted. You do you. How you spend your money is none of my business. Your money, you can support whom ever you desire |
@thyname have you seen the world we live in? I'm all in to make the world a better place but I doubt shaming a bunch of audiophile geeks buying counterfeit audio cable is the place to start... |
Say more. Cannot imagine. What might you be thinking of or suggesting?
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I started the original topic, which ran for several pages, when I bought pairs of fake Cardas and Nordost Odin interconnects out of curiosity. I still have these and continue to be most impressed by the SQ and value for money. Recently I bought a new power amp which was balanced only and as I did not have a pair of XLR terminated interconnects and the amp purchase had exhausted my available funds to the extent I couldn't afford quality genuine cables, I went for a pair of the fake Chinese Odins. Much to my surprise the cost was cheaper ( A$60.00 including shipping and taxes) and the quality, if anything, was even better. The XLR connectors were marked Nordost Odin and the quality surpassed any other XLR connectors I had previously used. Did I feel guilty - yes fleetingly but that passed as I am an aged pensioner not a wealthy US businessman or ex businessman. Ok so my integrity level might have slipped somewhat but what about the integrity of US cable manufacturers or rather assemblers who charge the cost of a well appointed car for a 1metre pair of interconnects. Incidentally since I bought the initial pair of fake Odins I have been receiving unsolicited newsletters from Nordost. Coincidence or what? |
Nothing to do with the Chinese building stuff from their garage. Kudos to them. This is about counterfeit cables. Using other people’s brand names, logos, technology, design, IP, to come up with their “replicas”, imitation, copy/ cats. That’s completely ethical to you? |
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