Last week the wife and I brought a new baby home - our first - and it's been fun introducing her to the music we love. It dawned on me this morning that this child will be crawling before I know it and my lovely pair of Magnepan 3.7's might be sitting ducks. They're less agile than the cat, closer to the ground than the house plants, and more fragile than the couch. As I've calculated I've got approximately 6 months to find a way to prevent any child-induced damage so your input is greatly appreciated. What can I learn from the grand wisdom of AG about how to keep the kid away from the speakers?
I have 2 lounges.... One for music and one children are allowed in. Hence now if the grown children show people around they say this is dad's room.... Also have a cupboard with the 5 bikes, sup kitesurfing stuff that my girls say this is dad's toy room. Good old vistorian flats with 3.7m ceilings... Plenty of space.
"I'll pull them forward when I'm going to do a serious listening session..."
Then you won't be pulling them forward for some years to come, I am afraid.
Expanding on jetter's outlet covers, etc., just so you know there is no such thing as "childproofing a home". Still, you have to do the best you can. She will always make you proud how she outsmarted every obstacle and childproofing contraption you have come up with.
Having had cats 'n dogs over the years, we were advised multiple times that the way that one treated and 'raised' the kitten/puppy new to ones' life would reflect the cat/dog you got to live with for its' lifetime.
This bit of advice is even more important...in fact, Critical....to the infant you've sired and created within your spouse.
The first years are the most important time you will Ever spend with that child. They're dependent upon you for 'civilizing' them.
Self realized that the drive and energy required wasn't present for the task. Spouse eventually came to the same conclusion due to her childhood traumas....:( Not an easy choice, but ultimately the Right One.
We've all seen the outcomes of choices made.....both good ones, and the bad ones.
It's the hardest thing to do in ones' life. When done well, I salute y'all. Done 'not so well'....I'll commiserate, and hope time and experience will 'straighten things out...."
Meanwhile, 'we' will create 'places' for them to burn off energy. ;)
People like what we do.
I can't think of a better profession to be in. *S*
Ok circling back to read these responses and you people crack me up! As much as I'd love to have a dedicated listening space, my setup is in the living room and is common space. I love the idea of a moat, but the spouse approval factor is pretty low - lower even than the Maggies themselves (boy it was a delicate negotiation to even get those in the house!). Seems like the approach I'll be taking is to have the speakers pushed up against the wall when not in use and a gate or barrier around them. I'll pull them forward when I'm going to do a serious listening session and work on the setting limits/saying no. The joys of dad-life! Thanks all!
So um, Where is it "exactly", that I can attain this "Penitentiary Grade", "barbed-wire", mentioned earlier? I would love to try it! "Cough", "Small rodent problem"... I am just not sure whether that rating would actually suffice in regards to having a truly "Toddler Proof", barrier. Even "IF", used in conjunction with the infamous, "240,000V shock Mat", with it's twin bank of those obscenely enormous "Mundorf" caps. (Aren't those the same caps that were used to "Fire-Up", the Space Shuttle during it's launch sequence)?? (But they only used two). I mean, keeping a hard-nosed, institutionalized career criminal, "in-Check", is one thing. But keeping a "Toddler"? "In-Check", around your gear?? Quite another!
I grew up in a house with a big stereo, power tools, firearms, motorcycles, instruments and a boat . I had engaging parents . I blew up the stereo, and damaged a few tools . But learned about music, hunting, fishing and building . I had fun on classic motorcycles and have always enjoyed music and outdoors . Embrace the situation as we only live once ! Cheers , Mike.
"With a new child (congrats, BTW), all bets are off....and you likely won't have the time or energy for 'sonic amusement'.....;)"
Yes. Yes. Yes.
There's are very good reasons why it's best to have children whilst you're young and able.
Especially if both of you work. Not that childcare isn't work, but some like me found it tough. Just wasn't enough time.
I would also strongly suggest giving your child (and any future ones) the maximum attention you are able to in their first couple of years. It won't be easy but it will pay off on the end.
A child's brain is almost fully formed by 2 and those years will really really count.
Hence start the 'difficult' audio years.
No worries though with a bit of luck your child might one day follow in your footsteps.
@noroMy first pair of “good speakers” were Magnepan MG-1.4 (~1987). Those had the L-shaped feet, so they tilted back, with nothing extending to the front. Our first child (who was about a year and a half then) casually toddled up to the left speaker and pulled it forward. It fell right onto the floor, right in front of my eyes! She was fine, the speaker was fine (non—true-ribbon maggies are actually pretty tough). No harm, but that started my routine of repeated “reminding”! I’ve also had MG-1.5qr, SMGa, MG-3.3/R, 1.7, then 1.7i. I’ve owned other speakers as well, but always feel something that “I like” is missing from the various box speakers I’ve owned and heard.
I’d just nail some chicken wire to the walls and to a wooden frame too high for the rugrats to climb and screen off all the equipment that way, get a remote line-level volume control if your amp does not already have one, and you’re all set. Not pretty but the kids are gonna make a mess of the place for the next few years anyway, so who cares?
Speakers you have heard advice on. If your amp or preamp allows you to limit the volume, you may want to keep that in mind. My boys are teens and I still limit the max volume.
For those of you suggesting stand-mounts - be careful there as well. My 3 year old son was able to poke a hole in the tweeter of a nice pair of Mission Speakers with a pencil. How or why I will never know . A replacement tweeter was in the cards and an easy fix. the same son enjoys those same towers now in his house 27 years later powered by Rotel . Built like a tank.
Now the other son found a way to use a small rock to scratch the paint on a near concours 74 Alfa GTV that was in the garage . It wasn't as easy a fix and I surely didn't forgive him for quite some time. AND no he doesn't have the car in HIS garage :) !
Good Luck , nothing more rewarding than raising kids.
In a little different approach, I feel the kids should be allowed to touch all the things with some directions, if possible. However, and that is why bottom-heavy large-base speakers were my recommendation, it may be unavoidable that a child bumps into something while growing up so that particular thing may need to be set up safely.
The famous Bose 901s were either set on a "tulip" stand or suspended by chains from the ceiling. I think you can see which method would work best for your situation. Enjoy you new gift. Stereo gear won't be a priority for next 18 years or so.
I used 2 of those plastic gates to close off the living room where my system was, also used those for the stairs. Get them put up asap that way the kid is used to them and not inclined to mess with them. Worked on my son, and my dogs. With the dogs after they got to be about a year old I could take down the gates and they just wouldn’t go in the room.
We raised five children with various Maggies in the house the whole time. It was labor intensive, but as some others have mentioned, letting them know the speakers, and the rest of the audio equipment (and the stove, and AC outlets, and the stairs, etc..) are not to be touched worked for us. One must use the theory of repetition. I’m not a “man-cave” guy... our nice system has always been in the family living room. Everything survived. Now we have twelve (!) grandkids, and guess what? The “No honey, don’t go near daddy’s/pop pop’s speakers” lessons started all over again! Lol. All the kids have always loved the music, so when they’re old enough to understand, I explain that broken speakers play no music. They get it. Then the older ones teach the younger ones. I love my kids, and grandkids more than my stereo (of course), but I expect them to respect the things that are important to us. And fortunately they do.
Not certain if you are concerned with the speakers toppling, or other damage.
If possible tipping/toppling is the concern then look into after market stands that are more stable then the "stock" stands (Mye stands for an example).
You could also "affix" the stock stands to the floor with a few small drill holes and suitable wood/masonry screws.
Another option would be to place a pair of "target" speakers next to the Maggies and plaster them with My Little Pony stickers.
I would suggest, due to their attention getting looks/think Transformers, a used pair of Wilson Audio Alexandria speakers.
Train your child by all means but the real danger is when their FRIENDS are in your house. Especially if you have tube amps - the ultimate child magnet.
"I also recall a friend’s child tried to play a PB&J sandwich in their VCR."
This reminded me of something unrelated to speakers.
If you have a CD/DVD player or something like that and you cannot find some CDs/DVDs in their cases, take the cover off, remove all 10 CDs/DVDs that you daughter managed to push in the player without you noticing, put the cover back on. It is surprising that these players play with a bunch of discs crammed inside (not on the tray, though).
I find it interesting that some posters think that buying monitors and placing them on stands (whether weighted or not) is a wise move. To me it is a recipe for disaster.
As a young kid my son would open the glass door of the stereo cabinet and push on the power button of my then integrated. Then one day he managed to do it concurrent with turning the volume to 11. Shocked both of us, and funny he was more reluctant to mess with the stereo thereafter..
Machine gun emplacement with landmines has worked for me. Seriously if you can't move them to another more secure room, I would fence them for the first two years then teach them not to touch afterwards. Either way, you have to assume that they will touch it and possibly damage it. My buddy opened his Oppo player tray only to find it packed with Peanut butter. If it does happen it gives you a good reason to upgrade and the wife can't argue.
I agree with the other parents in this thread. It's easy to tell who they are! 1) Congrats! Becoming a parent is a really wonderful phase of life.
2) From now on your kid will always be the most important thing in your life, period. More important than your gear for sure, and even more important than your wife. She'll eventually agree with that too if she doesn't already.
3) Personally, I went to replace my B&W 802M on SoundAnchor stands with their bottom woofer dust caps at eye-level with something smaller (805M + sub so I can have a respectable-if-older surround system in future) on weighted stands. By the time I got around to filling the stands, my son had learned not to touch the 802s. So they still sit where they started out.
4) I did install a large piece of Plexiglas-type material in a wood frame across the front of my system. That's been a huge help to keep his little hands out. Now he can reach the top of it but still leaves it alone... for now.
5) As the other parents here have pointed out, start thinking about how to secure your large speakers (and EVERYTHING else) from falling on your child. Sure it's fun to joke about protecting the speakers in various cruel ways but your mindset will eventually morph into seeing things as a parent whose job it is to protect the child from dangers. This is no one else's responsibility, quite a large realization as a new parent if you ask me.
Babyproofing is challenging and fascinating unto itself, but is nice because it goes in phases. Do you need to secure the kitchen drawers when they can't yet stand? Nope. Should you watch your child's development and sort out in your head what might need doing next? Yes! Should you crawl around on the floor with them to see things from their perspective? Yes! And bring a vacuum, Swiffer, etc. with you. Good luck!
cd318; "
Short sharp shock . . . . " Nice audiophile quote. Pulled that one out of the woodwork from say, 1973. Good one there. :') " I didn't really know I was drunk at the time."
As a former Substitute Teacher in my kids school district, being a father of two (now 8 & 11), years of experience being around kids, also having been in the Audio Video Industry since 1992 and having all kinds of equipment around the house, my best parenting advice is don’t do anything - other than monitor them as much as you can as they’re growing and are around your equipment - stop them when they get close or let them touch stuff, but tell them NO and after several times, they learn ( I’m not supposed to touch that).
Now if your equipment is in a high traffic area and you can’t be in that space enough to monitor what they do, then you may need to take some extra precautions, but I warn against gates and other obstacles/barriers because to them, it becomes a challenge as to how do they get past it.
We had four levels in our old house when the kids were born, so the steps weren’t a lot - maybe 10 or so going to each level. We never used gates and yes, both kids took a tumble once, but that was it. By the time they were three, they could fly up and down the steps and kids that would come over where the parents used gates in their homes, their kids, many older than ours 4 and 5, looked like they were just learning to walk for the first time trying to go up and down our steps as my kids would just fly past them.
Never did our kids ever go around the equipment or break things - I always stopped them myself and made it clear not to touch. I even had B&W Nautilus 804’s at the time and the tweeters looked like a microphone - major attraction as they got bigger, but I always had to watch other peoples kids way more than my own when we had visitors. They never touched those tweeters or any part of the speakers.
Lastly, we had people over for a gathering and we always had all kinds of breakables laying around the house - glass orbs and decorative stuff - and everyone that came over would always ask why we never put them away or how they never got broken. It’s because we wanted our kids to be able to be around and exposed to those things so they wouldn’t get broken. It’s when you work so hard to prevent something from happening, that’s usually when it does.
Dekay Miller & Geoff, I they re-made the movie "Three Men and a Baby" cast with you three, it would have to be one tough kid to survive that hour and a half.... HA
Audio is fun. Baby's and toddlers are even more fun... that is unless you're spending your time blocking and tackling so they don't destroy your gear.
As soon as my first child started to pull herself up from crawling to standing, my Maggies became her go to spot, especially because they magically make sound and play "wheels on the bus." Child barriers never worked, they just bumped up on the equipment. Shocking the baby and squirting her with water never worked either.
My advice and this is what I did, get some sturdy speakers in there that will do the job for a few years. My go to was a pair of Vandersteen 2Ce Sigs that I had in storage. When your last baby turns 5 bring back the Maggies. In fact, maybe get even bigger Maggies, with more amplification, and a better source too, after all you had to sacrifice so much for 5 years.
Because of the times (this too shall pass, but not w/out a lot of damage) and the fact my driveway is 800' long I bought 50 large steel tire spikes. Those are welded double xs that leave a very sharp point upright no matter how you toss them. In your case bird spikes on a strip would also work. Just surround your equipment with either of these and after crawling through your security perimeter once, I don't think they will go there again. Please be sure your local ER is in your insurance system.Best wishes to allMark
Correct the child ,if they do something wrong ,it’s not rocket science . in mybaby boomer generation. you are not taught any of this liberal BS about if it may hurt your feelings ,yes or no ,youjust have to be persistent if thst means raising your voice , or a talon the hand so be it get the message across. i trained my kids,as well as cats and dogs none of them go behind the stereo ,all will sit on the couch and listen and enjoy the music .being consistent is the key ,
My daughter had zero issues with my hifi rig as she wasn't crawling or later toddling around without an adult watching her as should be the case with any little kid...that's simply called parenting, and it's not that difficult.
Watching a toddler is like nailing Jello to a tree. My daughter liked to "adjust" the settings on my subwoofer in my home theater system. I just made sure I wrote down what they were so I could put them back. Still have the same system now. She will be graduating from college soon. She is doing very well. My 25 year old ht system works just fine too.
Nope, as Mark said it just takes teaching kids their limits. It’s not perfect, but it’s good most of the time. Raising our daughter we never removed things just so she couldn’t get her hands on them, we taught her what she could touch, or not. Just like the grandkids. It’s not a matter of being heavy handed, it’s simply a matter of teaching the kids (god forbid) boundaries.
Congrats on the little one. My four year old is number six and more rambunctious than her four older brothers ever were.
Over the years I've found that what works best with children is giving them lots and lots of attention and not sweating the small stuff. For example any messing about with power outlets, the stove or my speakers was a resounding "NO!" Whereas the electronics, the refrigerator or certain furniture, while off-limits didn't get the DEFCON-1 treatment.
By keeping it simple, the kids always know where they stand.
I had Magneplanar Tympani IVs when my kids were babies/toddlers. These were probably no more stable than your 3.7s. I never had a problem (at least with the kids...the cats were another story).
Invert your thinking. Literally. Consider ceiling mounting your maggies. Same location as now, just hang them from the ceiling. I my last house, the perfect location for the speakers would have also destroyed a beautiful view and much of the utility of the room. Solution was to hang them from the ceiling. Admittedly the soundstage was elevated, but otherwise they sounded fabulous. Just be sure to hit for ceiling joists with your mounts, and run the speaker wires through the ceiling, and down the inside of the walls to your amp.
Raised 2 now 2 grand kids no problems with floor standers, never been touched. Was more worried about montors on stands. Kids take direction remarkably well.
Lots of fun responses, but children actually learn the word “no”. It’s pretty simple really. Applied with proper tone and with diligence, it’s amazing what kids can learn... I’ve got three grand children, 7, 4, and 1... the “N” word works every time. Little ones are like puppies. They need constant visual attention. Just the way it is.
Too late for a vasectomy. Have you researched child surrender laws in your area? You might still have time. i imagine it will be longer than 6 months before you even consider leaving a mobile child unattended. Play pens and child gates should work fine until they're old enough to understand that some places are OB. The kitchen is probably a more dangerous environment. As in climb the cupboards for cookies (or vitamins), get hands on the butcher knife to hack a piece of cheese, or put toy dishes on the real stove. if you’re set on keeping the Maggies (and the kid) you might look into aftermarket stands that are more stable and possibly weighted.
Man, The most precious thing in the world you have is your daughter everything else is nothing, can come n go. Your daughter is your future, your caretaker when you are old. preserve her not other asset. Whenever in the room hold her and listen to music Other time lock the room (if possible/ if not leaving room). children are very smarter & responsible than we expect them and you can teach her not to touch it, why she touch speaker when she has plenty to play with Or chew.
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