So influential.
No Beach Boys->no Pet Sounds -> no Sgt Pepper?-->then what?
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I remember a long time ago there was a tune I had heard that I thought was kind of catchy (but not catchy enough that I knew the title of it or was inspired to buy the CD) with a corus that went "[. . .] I’m just lying in bed like Brian Wilson did [. . .]", anyway, many years later (probably ’06) I was listening to NPR and they were talking about Brian Wilson and I learned the song was Brian Wilson by Barenaked Ladies. On the program I was listening to they were talking about Brian Wilson’s battle with depression and all the time he spent in bed (like a year?); at the time I heard that on NPR I had just seen my career as an overpaid underworked lazy union airline mechanic going down the drain and I was finding nursing school to actually be Hell School . . . at that time I felt that a year in bed sounded pretty good. Later on (like 2014) I was going through a funk and working two back to back 16 hour 3p to 7a shifts on weekends (sat afternoon into sun morning & then sun afternoon into mon morning) and when I got home Monday morning it seemed like I was almost sleeping from when I got off work Monday morning until I went back Saturday afternoon. At that point I became more interested in depression and its effect on sleep habits and Brian Wilson. So then I ordered two books--the first one I read was BRIAN WILSON WOULDN’T IT BE NICE My Own Story WITH TODD GOLD, and if anyone is interested in reading about Brian Wilson, my advice is do not waste your time with that one. The second one I read was Catch A Wave The Rise, The Fall & Redemption of the Beach Boys' Brian Wilson by Peter Ames Carlin (which turned out to be decently written and an interesting read). But what I also learned in the second book was that the first book was NOT written in Brrian Wilson’s own words, but in Eugene Landy’s words, and according to Catch A Wave, Landy was a psychologist who basically manipulated Wilson for a few years. Anyway, I found Catch A Wave to be interesting and a much better read than WOULDN’T IT BE NICE, and if you are looking for something to read about Brian Wilson, I would recommend that one. |
I have been anticipating this for a while. Brian is now finally resting in peace. The Beach Boys were the first live concert I attended, at The San Jose Civic Auditorium in the Summer of 1964. I spent that summer listening to their All Summer Long album every day. A year later they had been relegated to the Oldies category, no longer culturally relevant (along with many other early-60’s musical acts). I didn’t bother listening to their Today! and Summer Days (And Summer Nights!) albums, or the now-legendary Pet Sounds. Pet Sounds was followed by an album entitled Smiley Smile, which contained their hit single "Good Vibrations". Suddenly the BB were cool again, so I gave SS a listen. WTF?! Nothing could have prepared me for how odd (in a good way) the album was (is), and I became obsessed with it. To find out why, read the chapter on the making of the album in a Outlaw Blues, a great book written by Paul Williams (not the songwriter/singer). I played the album for the guitarist in my High School garage band, and he was as impressed as I with what he heard. Smiley Smile became for us a litmus test of other musicians. If you got it, you were "in". We of course got Van Dyke Parks’ (Brian’s collaborator on what was going to be the Smile album) Song Cycle album, which had been released in November of 67. Double WTF! Song Cycle is still quite capable of blowing your mind.
Now follows a personal story, one some of you (one of you at a minimum) may want to skip. You’ve been warned! Years passed, and that High School guitarist (now also a pianist) and I were recording his songs (he majored in music at San Jose State College and then the University of California at Riverside) in a little studio we built in his garage. I was engineering, with a pair of small capsule condenser mics, and Revox 2-trk. and Teac 4-trk. recorders. By the Summer of ’75 we had a demo tape done, and the songwriter suggested we fly to Los Angeles and submit the tape to a few record companies. And while we were at it, go to Brian’s Spanish-style mansion in Bel-Air (we knew what it looked like from the pictures of it on the Sunflower album cover) and deliver a copy to him. The songwriter wanted to have Brian produce us in a pro studio. How naive was that?! We arrived at Brian’s house on Bellagio Road, and walked up to the wrought iron gate that was in the middle of the stucco wall in front of the house. I rang the buzzer, and a voice that I assumed was Brian’s wife Marilyn (I was familiar with it, having a copy of The Honey’s album) asked "Yes?" I introduced us, and asked if Brian was home. Duh. Did we really think she was going to invite us in?! She responded "Yes he is. What do you want?" I told her, and she said to leave the tape at the gate. I did, and we drove back down to Sunset Blvd., contemplating what had just transpired. Not comfortable with having left our tape out in the elements (there was a gardening crew working in the property), we went back up to the house. The tape was nowhere to be seen. It wasn’t until the following year that Brian’s condition was revealed to the world. We of course never heard back from him, and the songwriter/pianist informed me he had decided to not pursue a professional career in music. I still have the tapes (and the Revox), which contain some wonderful music. The songwriter passed away in his sleep in early 2009, a heart attack at age 56.
Okay, now to the important part of my post. After having heard Pet Sounds, I of course went back and listened to the Today!, Summer Days, and Pet Sounds albums. On Pet Sounds I heard a song I now consider one of the (if not THE) greatest ever written: "God Only Knows". The song is a master class in composition, and for those interested enough as to why that is so, the video below explains it all.
https://youtu.be/PjPN9zRUrgI?si=IXBsgx0oYei7MSC9
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Love Brian Wilson RIP, I watched a live performance where he said he was the first to use God in the title of a Pop Song, AI The Beach Boys’ "God Only Knows" was one of the first pop songs to use the word "God" in the title. Brian Wilson and Tony Asher co-wrote the song, and they debated whether to include the word "God" in the title, which was considered unconventional and potentially controversial at the time. Wilson initially worried about radio stations refusing to play the song due to the title, but Asher convinced him that it was a spiritual and ground-breaking choice. The song was released as the B-side to "Wouldn’t It Be Nice" in 1966 |
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While I think Brian wilson was super smart and talented and gave alot to society and brought many talented people together, I can't help think influence by Manson and heavy drugs led to his mental depression. I have seen patients self medicated with mental disease. The movie a beautiful mind is a fantastic look into that world with some brilliant people with mental disease.. he will be missed.i have almost all of his music and have followed alot of his interviews. He simply could visualize music in his mind and bring it out. He has my respect for the legacy he has left and is now at rest. Enjoy the music. |
@mark200mph: It was actually Dennis Wilson who was "influenced" by Manson. In 1968 Dennis picked up a couple of chicks who were hitch-hiking on Sunset Blvd., taking them back to his rented house on Sunset. The girls were members of Charlie Manson’s commune in the desert, and they returned to the commune and told Charlie about Dennis’ house. In short order Manson and many of his followers took over the house, and Dennis soon moved out. Before he did he bought from Charlie his song "Cease To Exist", changing many of the lyrics and renaming the song "Never Learn Not To Love". The Beach Boys’ recording of the song may be found on their 20/20 album.
Another Beach Boys story, again a personal one. If that doesn’t bother you, read on: Before The Viper Room was The Viper Room, it was a club named Blackie’s. There was a second Blackie’s, this one in Marina del Rey, located near the harbor where many SoCal boat owners moored their sailboats. One such sailboat owner was Dennis Wilson, who was living on his. On one night in the Summer of 1982 my then-current band was playing the Marina del Rey Blackie’s, and a bandmate of mine (who knew of my love of Brian Wilson) told me there was a guy sitting at a table whom I might want to talk to. It was Dennis, drinking alone. I had a nice little chat with him, telling me of my having seen The Beach Boys live in 1964, and about my fondness of his 1977 solo album. Dennis didn’t live much longer, drowning in 1983.
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When I first read this, @bdp24 , I actually thought of Charles Manson/Dennis Wilson/Terry Melcher/and the song Manson sold to The Beach Boys. But I am not comparing you to Charles Manson, it’s just what it made me think of. |
Very interesting sounds like you were around back then.what an opertunity to discus music with one of the greats and thanks for the first hand info. That's what's great about this forum there are people with talent on here that have done many things in thier life and are willing to share.enjoy the history. |
Brian Wilson and Sly Stone. Different musical genres (obviously) but a lot in common: Their songwriting and musical styles created new paths in music that basically did not exist beforehand; their (Top 40) popularity was only a few years each - but their influence on fellow songwriters and musicians spanned decades. 2 musical giants; 2 troubled geniuses. 2 musical legacies that will live on. RIP to them both. |
What a loss. Knew Brian a bit.His oldest daughter Carnie and my Daughter went to school together in Sherman Oaks , Ca. and were in the Brownies together then Girl Scouts. He lived up at the top of the hill off Mulholland Drive at the time and we lived down on the flats. He picked Carnie up I recall twice at our house and I was at his place couple of times. He was very cordial and just a regular guy. That was around 1973-1976. Twenty years later I was a service advisor at Martin Cadillac in W.L.A; and took care of his Cadillac for him. At first he didn't recognize me then it came to him. He hung around quite a bit after that because he started dating a sales gal there named Linda Ledbetter who he later married about 1995. He was the same cool dude. I always treated guys like him just like regular people which is what they wanted. I never told him that I thought he was the greatest voice that ever lived and I loved the Beach Boy's music. I you want a great album it's The Beach Boys Classics selected by Brian Wilson. The two copies I have are both HDCD's and a very good recording for a redbook. It is relatively unknown but if they ever make a SACD of it , I'll be first in line. I remember the first time I heard Surfer Girl , I was dating one at the time and almost flipped. What a beautiful young woman she was , hope she has had as good a life as mine. R.I.P. Brian as you cross the rainbow bridge. |
Good Vibrations was a timeless masterpiece. I often use it as an audio reference track. A Wall of Sound indeed. |
@zx10 do you realized you were practically in the movie ? That is wild... Love & Mercy (2014) |
I watched a lot of interviews with him. He was such a nerd, socially awkward, yet cocky, stubborn like a little kid but talented and focused and down to earth. Probably no one appreciated him more than his contemporaries, other world class musicians. The regular audience just thought it was easy what he did, they knew it required a genius. |
I knew Brian pretty well from my days representing The Beach Boys in the 1990's and early 2000's. He was a decent guy who had serious mental problems and was unfortunately manipulated by those around him for much of his life, first his father Murray, and then "Dr." Eugene Landy, who as one poster pointed out, really wrote most of "Wouldn't It Be Nice," various lawyers and later, his conservator. I think that his now-deceased wife Melinda really had his best interests at heart, though. When I knew him, the "musical genius" was not readily apparent, unfortunately, and when he played with the band, they would turn his mike down. However, his contribution to music in the 1960's was obviously landmark, and The Beach Boys were actually more popular than The Beatles in 1964-5. There was a big rivalry between Paul McCartney and Brian in 1966. Paul taunted Brian about the fact that he better hurry up and finish what became Pet Sounds because the Beatles were coming out with a blockbuster new album, a little album called Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band, which ended up being released just over a year after Pet Sounds. Paul has since claimed that Pet Sounds was his favorite album! Another fun fact from my storehouse of lore directly from the participants is about Good Vibrations. The 'boys" returned from a tour to find that Brian had spent about $75,000 on just Good Vibrations while they were gone (a ridiculous sum of money in 1966), used some "weird" instrument called a theremin, and had zero lyrics. They were freaking out. Mike Love took a tape, put it in a tape player in his car, and with his wife in the passenger seat and his two kids and their babysitter in the backseat, drove around LA listening to the tape and dictating lyrics for Good Vibrations to his wife, who wrote them down. They then headed back to the studio, gave the lyrics to everyone, and laid down Good Vibrations, similar to the released track. And the babysitter for Mike Love's two kids in the back? None other than LINDA KASABIAN, a full-fledged member of the Manson Family, who would go on to notoriety for her role in the Tate-LaBianca murders by the Manson Family! |
I liked the Beach Boys music. I liked Pet Sounds but never understood the mystique around it. With my system now completely refurbished/rebuilt in a new treated and dedicated room, I sat down to listen to it for the first time in years, in the grip of yet another bout of FOMO over it. I appreciate it, especially those vocals and harmonies and some of the weird compositional shifts etc, but it doesn't move me the same way that Tim Buckley's Happy Sad does, Laura Nyro's New York Tendaberry, of roughly that same period. |
I'm with @unreceivedogma ...to my ears pet sounds is undeniably original, but outside of caroline no and god only knows, the songs didn't really stick. Mostly, though, it always sounded a little compressed and lacking in low end---it doesn't swing. which isn't to say it's not a good record, but not earthmoving in the sense of, say, moby grape or blonde on blonde. |
@loomisjohnson: Here are my responses to a few of your comments regarding Pet Sounds:
- ..."it always sounded a little compressed and lacking in low end." Right you are. It is also pretty veiled and congested. It is very much a sonically mediocre recording at best. That makes hearing some of the musical "devices" Brian employs hard to hear. Things like the subtle use of inversion (rearranging the notes of a chord, placing the root note in the middle of the chord, or adding a bass note below the chord)---a favorite musical device of mine (bassist James Jamerson employed inversion on a number of Motown songs. Listen for it in "What Becomes Of The Brokenhearted." Thrilling!).
- ..."it doesn’t swing." You don’t really expect The Beach Boys to swing, do you?! Of course not, that’s not what Brian Wilson was about. There is lots of music I myself like in spite of it not swinging.
- ..."not earthmoving in the sense of, say, Moby Grape or Blonde On Blonde." As complete albums, you’ll get no argument from me. I have in fact been conflicted about Pet Sounds for many years. I have never loved it as much as I am "suppose to." It contains a lot of mediocre songs, too many for me to consider it a great album. But "God Only Knows" is so totally, utterly fantastic (McCartney still considers in the greatest Pop song ever written) I would not want to live without the album in my collection. It was actually Smiley Smile (the follow-up to Pet Sounds) that ignited my renewed interest in The Beach Boys. If Smile had been completed and released in 1967 as it was supposed to have been, we’d be having a very different conversation. Imagine an album full of songs as good as "Good Vibrations" and "Surf’s Up". Brian refers to Smile as a "Teenage Symphony To God." The theme of Van Dyke Parks’ Smile lyrics was The Manifest Destiny Of America. Rather highbrow for Pop music. If anyone wants their perception of The Beach Boys to be completely revamped, get a copy of the Smile Boxset.
- ..."Caroline No.": When Brian’s debut solo album was released, Sire/Reprise Records arranged for Brian to do a Record Release Signing event at the Tower Records on Sunset Blvd. in Hollywood. In addition to the that album, I took along my copy of the 7" 45 RPM single of "Caroline No" (see below for why). They had Brian seated at a table on a raised platform, and when I handed him the single he gazed at it (for quite a while), a wistful, heartbreaking look crossing his face (as if he had been transported back in time to 1965). The look on his face almost brought me to tears. I took that single for Brian to sign because it had been released with the center label credited not to The Beach Boys, but to Brian Wilson. I’ll bet that really po’d Mike Love.
I’ll take this opportunity to tell you all about something else I observed at that event: Brian was announced, led up onto the platform, and left there alone. He sat down, and I could see his hands shaking almost uncontrollably, a look of extreme panic in his eyes. All the other people involved (management, record company, "Dr." Eugene Landy, family) were off "doing business." I even saw author David Leaf (who has written three books on The Beach Boys, including the new one just out on the Smile album) busy schmoozing with other business types. I was filled with first disgust, then rage. Who could do such a thing to such an emotionally vulnerable and troubled human being?
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@bdp24 i always appreciate your comments, especially when they agree with mine... in my missive i was referring to "swing" in the sense of having rhythmic drive and movement. from that perspective, the bb's big influences like chuck berry or the four seasons had swing, while "pet sounds" (with the exception of sloop john b and that short instrumental whose name i can't remember) sorta just lies there, albeit in a pretty manner. delving deeper into google, it seems an accepted definition of swing is "music characterized by a specific type of syncopation that emphasizes the off-beat, giving the music a bouncy, lively feel." from that perspective, "pet sounds" is just the opposite. again, none of this is intended to suggest that the record is unworthy, though i think their best (and best-sounding) songs were "surf's up" and "feel flows", the latter a carl song. |
@loomisjohnson: I see what you meant by swing. Yes, the early Beach Boys show an obvious debt to Chuck Berry. I hear it in all their albums through All Summer Long. You don’t hear it in the band’s next two albums, Today! and Summer Days (And Summer Nights!). Those two albums barely qualify as Rock ’n’ Roll, being more Adult Contemporary. And at the same time bands like The Kinks, The Yardbirds, The Who, The Animals, Them, The Stones, The Paul Butterfield Blues Band, The Byrds, The Lovin’ Spoonful, etc. were grabbing our attention with much "tougher" sounding music. The Beach Boys---still in their matching stage outfits---were looking very anachronistic. They were, simply put, not cool. @loomisjohnson: To your titles I would add "’Til I Die" (found on the Surf’s Up album), I believe the only song on a Beach Boys album for which Brian wrote both the music and lyrics.
By the way, your mention of Moby Grape inspires me to say that I consider their debut a perfect album, and one of the greatest debuts of all time. They made a bunch of other good ones too (I’m real fond of Moby Grape ’69). Guitarist Jerry Miller was booked at a tavern in Portland last year, and I went to see him. His playing was still excellent (he was still playing his Gibson L-5), but he unfortunately had a terrible backing band. I couldn’t make it through his whole set, leaving early. He died a coupla weeks later.
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it's vanishingly rare for a band to have three good songwriters--moby grape had five--and their debut will still sound great in 50 years. the artsy second album, "wow", isn't as bad as its critics claim ("motorcycle irene" is a great song) but it downplays their strength as a band (driving beat, searing layered guitars) and sounds like another misguided stab at imitating sgt. pepper. "'69" is much less ambitious, but i like it--it's one of the formative americana records. check out wilco's cover of "i am not willing". |
Your phrase "songs about young life" says it all. Sure, I "got it" when I was in my early teens. My California girl and I moved on a long time ago and we are doing just fine.
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@loomisjohnson: My favorite song on Wow is "Can’t Be So Bad". When I did Evan Johns’ Moontan album I was thinking of that song as we recorded "Dear Doc" (both are fast tempo double shuffles). Evan didn’t like to do more than one take of each song, so I had one shot to get a keeper!
https://youtu.be/Jx6w2gGchoY?si=Bzs3ug8k1JagaKSN
https://youtu.be/tGCr89_F38k?si=nU3gWpd1pxmQoQ6N
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I cant help but feel how directly influential the Beach Boys were to the Manson murders. I mean after Dennis picked up the 2 girls of Charlies hitch hiking, then Dennis gets to know Charlie, he gets Brion to come out to the farm so Charlie can audition, this didn’t go so well but hey at least Brion swiped a song from Charlie so it wasn’t a total waste of a trip. Does anyone else know this story?? I found this whole thing to be fascinating, and sad. |
@mattmiller:
- It’s Brian, not Brion. - Charlie auditioned for producer/A & R man Terry Melcher, not Brian. - Brian didn’t swipe a song from Charlie. Dennis bought Charlie’s song "Hold On To Your Ego", changing some of the lyrics and renaming it "Never Learn Not To Love" (it’s on The Beach Boys 20/20 album).
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Here’s a Beach Boys song most have never heard, and not written by them. The a capella treatment shows off their voices and harmonies, in this case, derived partly from the Four Freshman version being covered. Their Hearts Were Full of Spring was recorded in 1967 but not released until 1990 as a bonus track for the Wild Honey reissue. Now that Brian and Melinda are both gone, one might think of them when listening...
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