Best DACs under $7,000.00

I have just read about the $5,000 Audio GD R-7HE  Mk2 dac in the latest issue of Stereophile and it took my breath away. Included in the review is a very good comparison with the sound of the Holo May, Denafrips Terminator and Mola Mola Tambaqui. And dsd sounds great too even though this is an R2R dac.

Pass on the PRC stuff have a DAC on the way to demo and it is R2R see if it beat my 680D. Of its a LessLoss.

jon2020

Thanks for the info about the Audio-GD R7HE Mk2.  I cannot find the link to a Stereophile review.  Could you put a link up for us?  Thanks.

No such review that I see.

From what I could find, there are some positive reviews as well as negative and also some mixed ones.  It might improve someone's DAC need if they are moving up from a < $1K level DAC.

Sorry guys, I read it from a subscribed copy. It is not on their website.

Found another review.

Big difference is the reviewer here prefers upsampling while Stereophile prefers NOS.

The 10 Audio review was positive until he switched to upsampling.  Many of us leave our DACs in NOS anyway. It sounds like this unit does get the job done.

The 10 Audio review was for the standard version and Stereophile reviewed the HE version which has an upgraded power supply that adds about $1200.

Skimming this, I would caution against assuming you agree with the designer of your speakers. I did that once as a short-cut (bought a highly regarded dac that my highly regarded speaker designed also used), and ultimately didn't care for it.

If you just want something that "gets the job done", any of the DACs in this thread would do just fine. If you are curious and/or have a perfectionist streak (as many audiophiles do...), I think you just have to buy a few dacs that intrigue you (ideally used, so you don't get hosed when re-selling -- you'll lose some cash, consider that the price of your tuition) and hear them for at least a few weeks each (I'm no fan of rapid A/B switching), and see which one is best *for you*.

Good answer and good point.  Yes, if I was exclusively doing what the speaker designer recommends, I wouldn't have created this whole discussion.  I do respect his opinion as it jibes with many others and has won best of show in some setups. But I still have to work within my budget and also find what works best (or good enough) in my setup. And the DAC world continues to evolve...  Thanks for your input.

The 10 Audio review was for the standard version and Stereophile reviewed the HE version which has an upgraded power supply that adds about $1200.

Not sure if the upgraded power supply would impact the difference in SQ between upsampling and NOS.

@tvad I would still say the Lampi Baltic 3 is still warmer and does have some bloom compared to most DACs on the market. Maybe not in comparison to other tube DACs, but certainly compared to the DACs I listed. I agree that there is a dimensionality and wonderful midrange to it, but I tried my very best with it and felt it was lacking in speed and control in the bass and did not articulate highs as well as the T+A DACs, the Tambaqui, or a fully-modded PS Audio DirectStream DAC.

In all honesty, I A/Bed the Lampi Baltic 3 against a 10 year old Modwright Transporter which uses the same tube set, and I could barely hear a difference between the two. There was a slight improvement in detail and clarity the Baltic 3 brought, but it was minimal upon multiple times of switching back and forth.

The lack of speed, and the sonic similarity to a much older unit I already owned were the reasons I found it easy to part with. For sure it was a very engaging DAC, but at the end of the day I longed for more.

To blisshifi and tvad:

Thanks to you both for good thoughts and opinions based on your experiences.  It sort of goes down to solid state or tube.  In my own reduction to some of the ones left on my list, I've narrowed down to a Bricasti, the T+A DAC 200, or one of two Lampizators. Since I'm certain I'll be buying blind it makes it tough.  I won't get an opportunity to try them first in my system.  So the solid state worry is the nagging "high frequency characteristics" that you refer to, tvad.  With a solid state DAC, there isn't even the possibility of slight modifications via tube rolling.  Barring a change in other parts of the system, the solid state is what it is.  And the criticisms of the Lampizators, besides their appearance, seem to be an opinion of a slightly soft, aging DAC system that is being passed by other DAC entries. It still holds charm from what I've read and heard from fans.  tvad:  Have you ever listened to the Atlantic?  Compared to B3?  My budget could go up from the B3 if there were clear reasons and I did decide to go with the Polish tube...

@tvad Regarding the Modwright Transporter, one is able to use a 6922 to 6SN7 adapter and accommodate 6SN7 tubes. I did so successfully for years in a second system. That unit was what made me so drawn to the Baltic 3 when it was announced.

Also, like you, I did not love the Mola Mola Tambaqui. I found it to be too clinical and dry, but it has admirable speed, separation, and decay. T+A helped me land the absolute best of both worlds. 

The Bel Canto e1x DAC/preamp at $6.8k just got a fantastic review on Stereophile October 2022 issue by John Atkinson - Measures great and has no sound signature of it’s own.  

@tvad Good point on the additional tubes on the Baltic 3. Noted, though my experiences still remained what they did. Always a pleasure discussing with you. 

To blisshifi:

I know you have a very high-end T+A Dac system.  My question:  have you spent any time listening to the DAC200?  I spoke with Elliot from T&A NA and he has been very helpful.  He also directed me to the very good review recently done:

https://audiophilestyle.com/ca/reviews/ta-dac-200-da-converter-review-r1135/ 

Here is what I wrote him in our correspondence:

"I read the very good review.  I am now down to the choice of two DACs (from eliminating over 20 on the list):

T+A DAC 200

Lampizator Atlantic TRP

"At some point, I'll just have to plunk down and commit.  As far as the DAC 200, I know there is the positive review you sent me but I sure wish I had additional support for that or, even better, someone who could reflect comparisons in a musical way.  The reviewer of the article spent a lot of time talking about the technical prowess of the DAC 200 but not as much in detailing tone quality (super important), soundstage, analogue-like descriptions, etc.  It's the sound comparison that will be the leap of faith in the end."

So, blissfhifi (or anyone else), I was wondering if you had any opinion about the tonal qualities or any other descriptions that might give more insight into the musical positive attributes of the DAC200?... Thanks.

@gregjacob Elliott is wonderful to deal with, and I’m glad you spoke with him.

I’ve spent a lot of time with the DAC 200 since June or so and know it very well, though I can’t compare it with a Golden Atlantic TRP. I was able to compare the DAC 200 to a Lampizator Baltic, but I’m betting the Golden Atlantic TRP is a different beast. It’s also hard to compare the two as the Golden Atlantic TRP can use a variety of tubes. I have a hard time settling on EL34s (one of my favorite tubes), let alone dealing with other pentode variants like the KT88, KT150, etc.

What I can say is this. The DAC 200 is quite neutral and natural. It does not have added bloom, perhaps slightly better tonal density and richness compared to other DACs in its price range, but it’s not enough to classify it as “colored”. What I love about it is this character combined with speed and a ridiculously low noise floor. It can be articulate and immediate without fatigue, and it is wonderful to have that hint of tonal richness combined with the speed and definition in the bass that is really hard to accomplish with a tube DAC.

On the DAC 200 you need to remember that there are six DAC filters to choose from. I prefer Bezier 2, which is a bit-perfect algorithm. Two customers who have purchased the DAC 200 from me have found they like Bezier 1 more (which provides a softer, and they claim more organic, delivery that is reminiscent of analog). 

One other consideration is that while Lampizator often comes with other inputs aside from USB, most will state that Lampizator sounds best over USB. The DAC 200’s clock is very good, using special Femto clock oscillators with extremely low jitter and phase noise to synchronize the digital audio signals, and some of this tech is still utilized even if leveraging SPDIF inputs like AES, Coax, or Toslink, which inherently prioritize the digital source’s clock over the DAC’s clock. This means that while it can prioritize even better clocking from the source, it has technology within that basically synchronizes both clocks, acting as a masterclock internally. So if you are using a digital source (server/streamer) that has a very good quality clock internally, then the DAC 200 might have the upper hand over the Lampi with regards to clocking. 

If I had more than one floor model of the T+A DAC 200 I would happily send it your way to demo and a return policy. Unfortunately it is currently one of my more inquired pieces and I have customers here often that are interested in listening to it. 

Feel free to PM me if you have interest in discussing in-home evaluation options in more detail.

To blisshifi:

Thanks so much.  Best breakdown I've been able to get!  Even though I haven't directly experienced this dac, I have experienced other equally costly ones that were mentioned in this now-long thread that I just didn't feel had a soul.  They might check all the digital correctness boxes, but they aren't seductive in their interpretation (the magical balance of tonal density?).  Designers will crow about being analog-like but in the end, they fall flat. The end goal of all my music listening is to be taken somewhere--a journey of thoughts, memories, emotions, enchantments, and liquid poetry.  Many of us have had that with great vinyl. I can see it at times in the digital setup I have, causing the renewed search to take it to the next level.  That is precisely why the Lampitzators have remained on my shortlist.  Reviews and opinions about them tend toward the emotion and involvement they can produce, regardless of or in spite of any weaknesses. That's where we are trying to get to. The DAC 200, being solid state, easier to manage and with some great ways to finesse the sound, might get there as well or better.  Thanks for taking the time to analyze this.  From what you've written, it is definitely at the top of the list. 👍

@gregjacob You’re welcome. I would say the DAC 200 has soul, and many other characteristics. It’s a DAC I could likely live with if I didn’t already have the SDV 3100 HV. That one definitely has much greater tonal density, richness, and decay, but it’s scary how well the DAC 200 performs at a fraction of the SDV’s price.

If the Lampi Atlantic TRP has the better Mundorf caps in them, they might be worth considering, but you’ll also have to land the right tubes which will give you the balance of soul and resolution, and that can be either very rewarding or very frustrating. I know in all my time, I’ve always wanted my solid state to have more tube characteristics, and my tube gear to have more definition and improved performance at the frequency extremes like SS. It wasn’t until I went T+A that I got the best of both worlds and likely will never look back. Prior to that my primary system had anywhere from 10-30 tubes in it. Now… zero.

I also subscribe to Stereophile and have not seen a review on the Audio GD R-7HE. Also, an R2R DAC cannot do DSD by itself. My Audio Holo May R2R DAC has a Separate built in DAC just for DSD processing.

Budget friendly and remarkably good. Benchmark

@willywonka The Audio-GD review is in Herb's Gramophone Dreams segment.

Beware of Audio GD. I had two of them. The last one would not play DSD as announced. After 40 messages with the omner, he said he would refund me. So I sent the DAC to China.  But the Chinese customs held it up and wanted to charge import duties. Kingwa refused to clear the issue, saying that I should have made a fraudulent low evaluation to clear customs. Eventually, the unit was forcibly destroyed by Chinese customs. I lost all my money and shipping, because he refused to behave responsibly.

There are lots of DACs out there. Stay clear of Audio GD, unless you don't care about quality, service or both.

I now have a Pontus . I don't like any upsampling DACs. They all sound brittle to me. I hear good things about the Sonnet Passithea. I will try it soon.

Please note that we (Underwood Hifi) are the Audio GD US importer and do warranty repair for all units we sell in our Georgia service facility. Unfortunately we do not service we do not sell.

Walter Liederman

Underwood Hifi

Beware of Audio GD. I had two of them. The last one would not play DSD as announced. After 40 messages with the omner, he said he would refund me. So I sent the DAC to China. But the Chinese customs held it up and wanted to charge import duties. Kingwa refused to clear the issue, saying that I should have made a fraudulent low evaluation to clear customs. Eventually, the unit was forcibly destroyed by Chinese customs. I lost all my money and shipping, because he refused to behave responsibly.

There are lots of DACs out there. Stay clear of Audio GD, unless you don’t care about quality, service or both.

@ lucmichaud1

Many thanks for the heads up. I almost just ordered one.

Yes thanks @lucmichaud1 for the info…..most helpful. 

 None.

Happy Listening!

That is not factual. 

No up sampling LessLoss or Border Patrol  both OS R2R 

Dodge 7 DAC is amazing, Better than Berkley Audio, DAC 1, Dave, Hegel, Vega G2.1........you can't go wrong.

I have the audio gd r 7 mark 2 without lower regeneration.  Have a la audio already. 9 months plug and play listening. Herb Reinhardt review was overdone with optical metaphors, but in the end, he has the correct point is that you have digital clarity and range of digital, yet the sonic qualities vinyl keeps you off Netflix and audio forums, irony appreciated

Should I be convinced that the PS Audio DSD DAC (with latest software) and Network Bridge II is out there which notably superior to what I own? With an AQ Vodka Ethernet cable, it is all dead silent and audibly serendipitous. Am I to upgrade a DAC and separate streamer, or is there a superior DAC + streamer $7K or less. Neal

I now have a Pontus . I don’t like any upsampling DACs. They all sound brittle to me. I hear good things about the Sonnet Passithea. I will try it soon.

@lucmichaud1 I have the Sonnet Morpheus and it’s excellent, so I’m sure the Pasithea even better

@gregjacob @juanmanuelfangioii @willywonka  The Audio-GD review is in stereophile Nov 2022 print/digital edition magazine, page 25

• I own a Terminator Plus which I use in my main system. Its feed by an Innuos Zenith Mk3 and a Phoenix USB. Love the result. I bought a Terminator 2 for my second system with a Gaia DDC. Fabulous results. Have not heard the other DACS.

@skinzy I've been wanting to try the Terminator II with Gaia DDC, since I currently have the Gaia. Do you prefer to OS or NOS mode?

I prefer NOS as it results in a more Detail sound in my system.  I have tried both OS modes. 

For those interested in the Denafrips Terminators, they recently released 12th Anniversary Editions of the II and Plus which replace previous versions.  https://www.vinshineaudio.com/12th

maybe the title could be what streamers or amps have the smoothest sound.

@skinzy 

If you haven't, try the Gaia with the Phoenix on your main system with I2S it is better than USB.  If you use the clock out with the Gaia and TPlus it is even better.

I have a Statement, Iris and TPlus.  The quality of the HDMI, USB and clock cables is important.

I'm having a Lampizator Atlantic 3 made and shipped to me right now.  I have the Innuous Zenith Mk3 as music server and still have a Denafrips Iris DDC that I've been using with a Denafrips Pontus II (that I will be selling once the Lampi arrives).  I haven't seen or read of anyone who has connected a Denafrips DDC model to a Lampizator and given a "before and after" review.  So I'll be using a Callisto USB from Zenith to Iris then a AES/EBU connection from Iris to Lampi.  Cannot use the I2S connection with Lampi.  I'd be curious to know if anyone has put a declocker (of any type) in front of a Lampi.  Before trying, I'm wondering if it's overkill.  I can say that the Iris DDC made a significant audible difference with the Pontus II.

When I bought my B3 I had a Phoenix USB connected with AQ diamond USBs but decided to sell it soon after. Of course everyone's setup is different but I got much more improvement by adding an NA ENO filter with a router on the input side of my Zenith. YMMV.

@chilehed 

I had a NA ENO Ag filter on the input of my Statement and it was an improvement on whatever I had been using.  I now use a SOtM dCBL-CAT7u.  In my system it was an improvement on the NA ENO Ag.  I moved the NA to my NAS an Antipodes CORE.

chilehed  Thanks for your input on this. I do have the ENO filter connected from ethernet line to Zenith.  I have it direct-connected to a LAN wall slot fed from router in different room,no network switch, just direct connected.  Like you found the Phoenix USB unnecessary, I will probably find the Iris DDC no longer needed as the cleaned up signal has gone through the ENO filter, the music server and the all the clock checking inside the Lampi.  I'll try the Iris just for fun.

anzaanimalclinic  Did you find a genuine sound difference / major improvement between the ENO filter and the SOtM dCBL-CAT7u?  It's a pretty serious layout to switch the former for the latter...

gregjacob

If the Atlantic hasn't shipped yet have Lampizator put in an I2s input.  I have a Golden Gate 2 that they pit in the I2s and it beats the other inputs by a good amount.