When someone tells you it's a $40,000 amp, does it sound better?

I think most folks use dollar value in posts as a proxy for sound quality. I don’t think anyone assumes any $40K amp… but one well researched and which appeals to your sonic values as opposed to other less expensive amps also that play to your values.

Dollar value is used as a proxy for sound quality in order to remove our differences in sonic preferences out of the equation.

"Dollar value is used as a proxy for sound quality in order to remove our differences in sonic preferences out of the equation."

I don't think that is true for the majority. I think that it is for a small number.

I think there are a lot of good applications for Class D amplifiers, such as small devices that need small amplifiers, but I don’t have that constraint for my home stereo. Of course, I’m the idiot who bought a 175lb amplifier that I am unable to move. Perhaps with the help of one other person I can duck walk the thing into its shipping container.

Was it my thread? I’ll have to look in the summary of threads.

@roxy54  A repeat of that OP's histrionics. I wouldn't be surprised if it comes back to life. It has, before. : )

"Speaking of big amps. a certain long-running thread was just shut down at the request of the OP. Hooray!"

Hooray!  really?  You sound elated.  So happy for you.

Wow, you all that seem to be celebrating are real class acts. 

There is a certain kind of humor to be found here which will escape some, but not all.

ah @ps please enlighten w us with your erudite understanding and humor that few if any can understand. I am clearly lost in the humor you refer to.

Your recent post: “Cults and their members are where one finds them. This is simply a general observation based on keen observation of human behavior. All in a historical context of course. :)”. I have reread the screen grab that I have in your reference to Jay’s thread on the previous page in my attempt to understand.

Can you 1) explain who is the “cult” you happened to be responding to? and I am sure you understand the weight, implication and historical references to using such a term and 2) who are the cults “members” that you refer to and how would you describe their roles as part of your said cult, and 3) if you posit a cult has a leader, which I believe you do, what is it that is the offense/sabotage/influence (guessing) that you attribute?

Honest questions. No need to make riddles. I trust this won’t escape you.

Yes ps,  please enlighten us with your high brow humor.  You may have to dumb it down for some of us, but I will certainly try my hardest to understand it.....don't want it to escape me.

I prefer the term " fan boys ", vs cult members, and you all know who you are. Just admit to it, and move on. I will not respond to anyone beyond this point. Enjoy ! Always, and my best to all. MrD.

I am a fan of the Audionics CC2…. FAN

I've always enjoyed your posts mrdebacle.  Very much looking forward to you not responding to anyone beyond this point.  Enjoying! 

Isn't the harsh reality of class D is that it's to clinical and precise, and harsh. With class AB you get distortion and isn't that what harmonics is all about when you listen to music. It's all about the design and the colorations that are done by the amp designer. Most class D stuff is all about fitting lots of power in a small package.

And class D it's kind of cheap stuff so good luck making class d a preferable way to go

@jumia In a word, no.

I've heard class D amps that are smoother than any class A/AB amplifier. Its easier to design a class D amp that exhibits lower ordered harmonics rather than the higher ordered harmonics which cause harshness and brightness.

This is because with class D its possible to run a lot more feedback than you can with conventional designs! Its a nice side benefit of course that they are less expensive and less heat. There's a problem with feedback in conventional designs; not enough of it results in the amplifier's presentation being harsher and brighter due to unmasked higher ordered harmonics generated by the feedback itself. But if you can run enough feedback, it can clean up the mess it otherwise causes.

So at least with the class D amps with which I"m most familiar, they sound as smooth and sweet in the mids and highs like the best tube amps, but with more detail (easier to hear into the rear of the soundstage) than conventional amps.

Yeah that probably relates to higher cost class D amps.  But mostly d amps are bargain basement variety and sound pretty bad.  Because home theater is the niche market for d stuff in a world where sound Quality don't matter too much.

Yeah that probably relates to higher cost class D amps. But mostly d amps are bargain basement variety and sound pretty bad.

@jumia  That is true of some but not all. I have two customers that were quite surprised by the Nobsound class D amps which are less than $300.00! I’ve not heard one myself. As best I can make out some of these less expensive amps are bass response limited to avoid all their power being gobbled up but otherwise sound pretty decent.

Ok so $40k sounds better in what system. Everything in the system comes into play. Setup, synergy between components, and room all are factors here. You can’t just pick an amp and drop it in. Most of the time within the same company the more expensive will do something the cheaper one won’t. However it may not be better depending on the application.  ie: if the more expensive amp is more expensive because it offers more power and you have very efficient horn speakers then the less expensive low power amp may produce a better sound. So, No! all more expensive amps are necessarily better sounding. Depends on application,  too many variables for a single answer. You have to get specific in order to get more solid opinions. 

Something to keep in mind is that a $40,000 amp is likely not going to be playing $200 speakers; its likely to be playing on speakers that have a similar price tag. Some speakers with that sort of price really are wider bandwidth and lower distortion. So it may well be that the $40,000 amp sounds better on that account alone...

The best sounding gear are that which you can afford. I’ll leave discussion of the rest to the masochists. 😬😝

Once we’ve agreed on a suitable, appropriate, and applicable definition of "better" in the context of reproduced music, only then can the dialog proceed. My first questions, and of course they are simply mine, is: "’better than what?". How and why? That question is only answerable when a detailed study/revelation of specific systems, the owner’s hearing acuity, and her/his musical/audio tastes are factored in. And even then..... It’s tough nut.

So, I posit that OP has asked a question which is both rhetorical and unanswerable in any meaningful way.

Ultimately: word games, at best.

FYI/ and full disclosure : as i type this, I’m binging Ahmad Jamal with a modest CJ control tube amp and vintage Franco ( may he RIP,) Serblin speakers. My investment is no where close to $40K for everything.

But is sure sounds durn bueno. And I humbly submit that bueno is ultimately preferable to better.

Better:

Smoother, more detailed, greater center image palpability. Wider bandwidth, particularly in the bass. Greater speed and so on.

"

Better:

Smoother, more detailed, greater center image palpability. Wider bandwidth, particularly in the bass. Greater speed and so on."

@ atmasphere: With great respect, since I'm well-aware of your expertise- is it possible to assign a monetary value to those attributes?  I think my question gets to the essence of OP's post.  Of course, I could be wrong.   It wouldn't be the first time.

With great respect, since I'm well-aware of your expertise- is it possible to assign a monetary value to those attributes? 

Yes- and depends very much on who is doing the assigning 😉

I've considered that at some point I would upgrade from my $3,500 ATC P1 Pro amp to a $6,500 Parasound JC-5 amp. To me both of these are in the sweet spot of their price range. I can't imagine spending more in my 9 ft by 12 ft listening room. I imagine the ultra high dollar systems are how extremely wealthy people try to impress (and poke fun at) other extremely wealthy people. Not that I wouldn't like to have a system like that myself. I'm imagining a similar scenario where Oprah (or some other billionaire) calls her friends from her yacht and ask them if they're enjoying their weekend on their 80 ft "dinghy" and then scoffs "What yours didn't even come with a helicopter?"

I would think it depends on a designer's ability to resource and buy parts for less to build an amp at a reasonable price. For example some well established companies like Audio Research and Conrad Johnson buy parts in bulk and pass on the savings to their customers. So this could be true that just cause an amp cost more doesn't mean it sounds better. No savy businessman would spend forty thousand dollars on something that loses a lot of its value once purchased, only a rich audiophile would do so

For some audiophiles the Placebo effect cannot be controlled and will make an amp sound better if it is expected to sound better. Cable manufactures are very dependent upon the Placebo effect due to besides too high capacitance for some cartridges, their cables do not sound much different than other cables (spaghetti size cheap cables are excluded).

You do not have to be wealthy to buy a $40K amp. I just started a second full time job to maybe buy a $35K amp in 2023. Priorities.

@yyzsantabarbara  +1  Burmester 216?

@dayglow I owned the KRELL K-300i integrated amp and also the KRELL Dou 175XD amp and loved them both. The 175XD is better and I sold both.

There is a new KRELL amp that is supposed to be released in Nov 2022 called the KSA i400. I am thinking that amp will work great for my future Livingroom system. Only issue is the price (which I figured a way to solve) and the 26-inch depth of the amp. That is a bit on the large size. Got to see if I can sneak it by the wife without her noticing :)

Option 2 is the CODA #16 which is not as big.

@yyzsantabarbara   Always had respect for Krell electronics. Sure Krell have had some misses but when getting it right they hit a grand slam! I mentioned the Burmester 216 due to hearing it drive a Sonus Faber Lilium with such ease and graceful authority. At 75/w/ch/8ohms (Class A) might not appear a great value at $35k to some but it MIGHT be the best sounding amplifier I have heard.