The urge to tinker is awash. What TT might better mine and why?

Curiosity empties wallets.   If you're happy, go no further  

That is true.
But also is true then that we would all be stuck with Tandy and Radioshack pieces if we did not let curiosity out of the bag now and again.....

If you haven’t already, try a tubed phono.

Just MY opinion-it delivers a more convincing, realistic presentation. They may be a wee bit hissy at stadium level volume, if that’s your thing. Ever notice in some SS unit reviews, the reviewer writes- "almost tube like" or something similar?
Hmm...??

Look used/demo and get half of retail. Pass on specific suggestion. Something in the 2-5K range will get you a keeper.

Your system profile looks solid. Audio Nervosa seems to flare up among us, now and then.

When that happens, I just play a new bin find.

Perhaps I could have phrased it better
Yes I can change the tone/ sound with a different cart or phono stage but that’s not what I am asking.

What makes a better TT than I already have and why?
What features would be improved upon and how much will that cost?
Better motor?
Better platter?
I mean I know there are considerably more expensive TT out there so what/where do I need to be looking?

Try an idler drive turntable. Garrard 301/401, Lenco, etc

The sound is more dynamic

Why might an idler drive TT be superior to what I have?
I am a little surprised that nobody has come forward with their particular TT of choice and giving some good solid reasons for choice of same.

Definitely not going to splurge any moolah without some basis for what I can potentially expect.

Seems like there are mixed reviews on your table. If I was starting from scratch, I would look at a 301/401 with new massive bearing and heavy platter in the right plinth with a top notch arm. I don’t know your budget but as a starting example of cost, my rebuilt 401 with custom idler in a slate plinth and decent arm set me back less than $4k. It sounds wonderful - musical, transparent, resolving, and utterly involving. It is also a respected reference class transcription table that has stood the test of time.

Side bar question, how do you like the Goldnote PH-10? Did you splurge for the separate power supply? 

@dmix I believe the OP has the GN power supply.

@uberwaltz Why not try moving your speakers onto the tile for better rigidity? 

Thx Noromance.
Budget is not a huge issue IF there is a worthwhile gain to be had.
Although I listen to a lot of digital via streaming etc I still love to spin vinyl, I do not even try to compare the two, just too different imho.

Sidebar answer.

I love the flexibility and convenience of the touchscreen and being able to a-b two TT instantly. Did not crack and spend 1k on a power supply but it is fed through my equicore 1800 conditioner.

Noromance.
Where my speakers are right now gives me best presentation overall. Moving out to tile loses some focus and depth of vocals.
Right now they are spiked to 2 inch maple block's which in turn are spiked right through the carpet to the tile underneath. 

Sure thing on speaker position. I was thinking of moving the rug! Fair enough if they are spiked through. I wasn’t sure.
I enjoy Tidal streaming too but find, in many cases, my vinyl rig is more enjoyable especially with my collection of analog recordings. I heard the Space deck many years ago in London and thought it was okay, somewhat dark and unexciting. I felt that others, at the time, namely the Rock and Oxford Acoustics were better. I understand it’s been improved since so probably a moot point. Nevertheless, if that is the house sound, it's not to my taste. 

Move the rug.... the wife would not approve.... lol

its a pretty old model and dark might be fitting but very detailed with the present cartridge. The shelter 501 it came with did not suit my ears at all

Why not stay with Tom Fletcher's sound?

When I heard the spacedeck (1997), I ordered the Mentor (now Dais). It is notably superior. Pear Audio is also a Fletcher design. I also have the Wave Mechanic power supply - another improvement.

IMO the tonearms were always a weak point, because of limited adjustability. The Trans-Fi Terminator tonearm also works superbly with NA. Don't know if it's still available - you could try.

Both my TT use the Trans-Fi arm, which is going back into production.

  ++++++ what @stringreen

Said..... 2 many gear changers never even break in and optimize before moving on..... and on..... and on

my good friend RV says “ chasing tail “.....

i advise buying room treatments, isolation, laser measuring tool, RTA ( runs on your ipad w calibrated mic) and every Opus 3 test disc....

but hey, I get it

that is not sexy new....

btw enjoy your music posts

 But
mostly for fun
and using your words
” some BASIS”
.....

I have the same itch. I have an lp12 with Dynavector xv1t cartridge and AudioOrigami arm. I am very pleased with it and have tried other decks at costly expense and have always reverted to a well set up lp12 as it is so much more musical and dynamic than for example direct drive decks. I have a Tom Evans Groove + and from discussion with Tom I am upgrading to a Mastergroove. The point of this is to get as much as I can from my favourite equipment so I have a base level of high satisfaction  to value other options. Different records have different needs so I am interested in switching options.
I have tried a number of other phonos and none comes anywhere near the Tom Evans in my view for a number of reasons. I am running a bespoke high quality hand made switch box to put other turntables in my system for easy AB comparisons. I have heard the suggestions re GL 99 (?) above and was surprisingly impressed for the price ,so I am having a bespoke plinth made for 3 arms with the GL99 with 3 vintage arms and cartridges for fun. Will be ready maybe Jan 19 so that is something to look forward to.
What I am saying is basically max out (my suggestion is look at the phono stage first?) what you now enjoy, or prefer, to obtain a level that you can use as a reference point for any options. I haven't heard your deck so I don't know how far you can take it.

So the majority so far appear to consider not changing my TT but for odd reasons imho.

Not because it is the best already but because I should just not upgrade. Maybe they are right but there would be very little progress or evolvement if we did not make changes along the way. Sure I have already made my fair share of backwards changes but mostly in speakers so far.

Or so far nobody can really give me a good reason or model to upgrade too.

@tatyana69

I will be interested to hear your comments on you Goldring/Lenco 99 when it arrives. Please post you comments. Thanks.

https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649211194-goldring-g99-heavy-platter-lenco-transcription-deck/

I use two turntables, The Technics 1200G and the venerable VPI Scout with the acrylic platter. They are both great tables. Maybe keep yours and get another one. Sometimes you don’t know what you have until its gone.  The right cartridge make a difference.

I too have the Technics 1200G. Anyone want to buy it at £2,250 + postage? I did intimate that a quality set up LP12 would be much more preferable to your Nottingham. For example, I would certainly not buy a Nottingham over the lp12 as I would need to spend much more  than that to improve on what I have already. I am saving up for a limited edition Avid turntable as I reckon that may be the logical next step up, but it is 4 or 5 times the price of an lp12.
It depends on whether your overall goal is to improve (subjective) or just have a different experience. In my view (and Tom Evans) a good phono is more important than a good cartridge - but just as difficult to choose, well not difficult  for me as I know what I like.

I  have had the GL 99 modified as you can upgrade the idler and bits more than you can the GL75. I certainly think you will not buy a pig in a poke with a good condition GL99 and 479$ in the above advert is a steal if in good nick. I paid £500 for mine but it was refurbished in all super finishes and looks perfect /new

As the owner of a much modified Lenco and four high quality DD turntables, and having owned a Notts Hyperspace before embarking on my odyssey with idler- and direct-drive, I feel confident in saying that any top notch vintage DD or any well developed Lenco or Garrard will certainly sound "different" from what you've got and in my opinion, better.  You keep asking "why", but most of the why is built into your own preferences, so it's hard to say why.  I can only say for myself that the idler and DD options produce music that is more like real.  You can read the cliches about rhythm and pitch elsewhere.

@lewm 

Thank you and I guess I should explain what I mean by "why".
Not asking why will it sound better but why might the technology of a different TT help better the SQ of my present TT.

And yes I fully realise it is all still down to personal preference but with prices of TT running many thousands above mine I am genuinely curious.

You mention dd, something like Denon DP 3000 or similar?

Belts are elastic. Stylus drag is real. ;-)

So are we saying that DD and idler drive maybe better tech than belt drive?

We are not, noromance was pulling your leg

Uber, My only "Denon" experience is with the DP80, the best they made for home use.  Second only to the DP100 and DP308, which are both megabuck items these days.  I would shoot for a DP75 or DP80, if I were you.  The cost is only a few hundred bucks more than a DP3000, if that's what you've got your eye on, and the product is better developed (since it came on the market later than the DP3000).  (DP75 is essentially the same as DP80. I used to know the difference, but I've forgotten.)  I'd also suggest Victor TT81 or TT101 or Luxman, if you can be patient enough to find any of those.

"Curiosity empties wallets.   If you're happy, go no further"  

I agree

It would be quite a boring world and not much of an adventure if we all followed that admittedly sage advice.

Fortunately I am inclined to explore and tinker, it's my nature.

I’d like to upgrade from my stupid Pro-Ject table. I chose to donate to specific charities though.

money well spent. 

@lewm 

Have been reading up on the dp80 and it is certainly highly regarded from my perusal.

However the majority of the ones I see for sale are Japanese market at 100v.

Any detriment to running one of these with a 120 to 100v step down transformer?

I am sure someone else must have done this with Japanese market equipment 

uberwaltz

... the dp80 and it is certainly highly regarded ... the majority of the ones I see for sale are Japanese market at 100v. Any detriment to running one of these with a 120 to 100v step down transformer?

I am not sure that Denon ever made a 120VAC DP-80. When I bought mine new (from a US authorized dealer) it was delivered with a Denon-branded stepdown transformer.

It would be quite a boring world and not much of an adventure if we all followed that admittedly sage advice.

Fortunately I am inclined to explore and tinker, it's my nature.

that is true as well

I have a rega RP8 which I love ..... it’s not better than yours prob worse - but just leaves me wrapped in music hearing everything. But my only experience is coming from older Thorens 160super / sme/ nagaoka 500 which had no where near the clarity of Rega. 
I would spend it on records if I was you ....

Technics SL1000r with 3 arms??? Different sounds different genre - maybe a mono cartridge on one..?

seems like a space saving concept - my pal has 3 decks - 3 separate PHono stages .....
https://goo.gl/images/2jxLmN

Thinking it will be very wise to keep my present TT setup BUT dip my toes into the vintage DD word with possibly a slightly cheaper model to start with, just as an alternative.

Present models I am looking at include Denon, dp-3000, DP-72, DP-1250 , Pioneer PL71

We will see....

I have a Technics SL-1200G and SL-1600-MK2.  I've had the 1600-MK2 for about 35 years and it's still going strong.  I use an Ortofon Blue with it.  The 1600 is a fully automatic TT, which I love.  

The 1600 can't touch the 1200G (with Ortofon Quintet Black), but if you can find one in good condition, it should serve you well.

Bit the bullet on a Denon DP-1250 cw Infinity Black Widow arm and 103d cart.
We will see how this pans out.
My phono allows for instant switching between 2 inputs both configured independently.
It should give me some interesting times.

Congrats on your purchase. I would be interested in your comments on the comparison. A vintage MM like ADC ZLM or other high compliance cartridge will be a better match for the Black Widow. than a low compliance MC.

jperry
I would agree that the 103d is not the perfect match for the Black Widow but that is what is included so that is why I mentioned it.

I did read some reports on the black widow and carts that should work well with it and will have to go back and find them to get some better ideas for a good matching cart.

Quick look back through my history.

Yes the ADC ZLM was one, Grado Platinum  too, Shure V15VMR  as a few.

From what I understand I will need a high compliance cart in the weight range of 5 to 8 grams to stand a chance of the best match?

Uberwaltz-
You seem to shoot down many suggestions and want someone else to do all the work for you. If money is not the problem, buy three or four complete turntable systems, try them out and post your results. We can all benefit, your ears can determine the winner and we would not be wasting time offering suggestions.
I see you made a decision....good luck.

@uberwaltz,

"From what I understand I will need a high compliance cart in the weight range of 5 to 8 grams to stand a chance of the best match? "

That sounds about right, and you can use the tools available on vinylengine.com to calculate results. This and the very similar ADC LMF tonearms were designed to work with high compliance cartridges. So most of the Shure, Stanton, Sonus, Pickering and ADC cartridges were good matches with this tonearm. I used to own an ADC LMF-2 tonearm. I used an ADC XLM III and Sonus Blue with it.

Have fun!

Jim Perry

2psyop

Sorry you feel that way.

Not all suggestions can be winners obviously!

No I do not want everybody to do my work for me, that is a silly statement.

Rather I prefer to take counsel from more experienced members and research from there.
I thought that is part of what these forums were for? To help, share and guide other members.
If my usage of them for that purpose offends you I am truly sorry.

After a number of members suggested a vintage DD might be worth a try, some by pm, that is the avenue I decided to pursue.

However I decided not to replace my present TT but experiment with a slightly cheaper version than the dp80 as a toe in the water.

We will see.

Thx Jperry.

Looks like vinylengine, eBay and the Gon will be my best friends in researching best cart for this arm.

You ask why.

I suggest that it depends on your taste. If you can’t stand wow and flutter, get a direct drive. They tend to control that very well. Personally, I don’t find wow and flutter nearly as offensive as tizzy digital-type sound.

If you can’t stand tizzy, try a premium belt drive. I suspect that tizzy comes from higher frequency speed variations, which can be audible if you listen carefully. The thrust bearing on a DD can be a noise generator - yes, even the best. At a recent trade event, the big new Technics was being demo-ed. They had a motor assembly on display, so I picked it up and turned the spindle. I could hear the bearing (teflon PTFE variant) - not loud, but it was there.

And compared to my NA and my air bearing, to me the sound (of music) was tizzy. Just like my Technics SL150(2) - set up with an air bearing tonearm, so that I could swap out wands and cartridges in known-perfect alignment, for comparison with my other tables in my own system.

Now try turning the spindle of a NA Dais bearing. Silence. Try that with an air bearing. Silence. I conclude that bearing noise is the source of tizzy, solving the mystery (to me) of why I didn’t like DD - and why, incidentally, one needs a bearing which is silent both axially and radially.

If you have perfect pitch and can’t abide even a hint of wow, get a CD player instead.

Why is direct drive incompatible with an air bearing? Are you aware of a few of the vintage direct drive turntables that use magnetic levitation so that the vertical bearing is not doing much weight bearing.?