Good idea OP -
buy the fuse, try the fuse, 646 hours, turn it around, 646 hours, return it, receive/install replacement, 646 hours, turn it around, 646 hours, and then, and only then, if you don't like it you can return it for your refund. I have like 18 fuses in my system, so I should be able to have my fuses squared away sometime before 2020. I think I need an owner's manual. |
@nonoise Here is another video of a fuse manufacturing machine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47mBkCTWQJs
that shows the element soldered to one end cap first. If SR thought directionality were so important it seems they could mark the end cap that the element is first soldered to, maintain one directionality of the wire, and then basically, Bob is
your uncle. I can't believe SR would risk having up to half of their $150 fuses being returned for not working as advertised when the only problem is that the fuse should be turned around. Notice the end result is a purple fuse....I hope I didn't let the cat out of the bag on the color of the new SR fuse.....did anybody say $200? |
^^^ He may well have a defective fuse. Unless we have transended into a Utopian world, nothing is perfect.
How about returning it for another fuse? If that doesn't work, then send the new one back and get a refund.
Frank |
First, if there is no improvement immediately, install the fuse in the opposite direction. If still no improvement, then send it back, it doesn't work
You mean it's faulty? No, there's a secret micro switch just under the end cap he didn't switch on, that's the problem. Cheers George |
First, if there is no improvement immediately, install the fuse in the opposite direction. If still no improvement, then send it back, it doesn't work for your audio system. Building an audio system requires synergy, if it doesn't improve the sound, then at that point in building a system it is a wrong choice. It maybe a correct choice in the future as the audio system changes. It's an art to building a system, not a science. |
mapman
These fuse threads woukd make a great Monty Python sketch. Way better than the granny gangs bit.
moops, you remind me of the Monty Python sketch where the guy brought his parrot back to the pet store and complained they had sold him a dead parrot, The guy at the counter told him it’s not dead. It’s just sleeping.
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That’s weird. Nobody suggested he put the fuse in the wrong direction. You guys are slipping.
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So, you got the blue and now you got the blues. 😀
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OEM-Wheels:
The fuse did not work for you and there is no need to try it for a longer period of time. Send it back to your SR dealer and you will get a prompt refund. No problem and no fuss.
David Pritchard
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oem-wheels103 posts04-07-2018 12:49pm
I got the blue and about 75 hours and hear no improvement what so ever.. Ah, but!!!! the awesome foursome or their cronies will say it has to "burn-in" another 646hrs before it magically turns on or expectation bias sets in, and that’s 1hr past the 30 day return date. Send it back now, express. Cheers George |
"...And when I bought it not half an hour ago, you assured me that its lack of movement was due to it being tired and shagged out after a long squawk."
"It's probably pining for the fjords."
"Pining for the fjords, what kind of talk is that?"
Appropo. Nice and deft touch there, uberwaltz. |
Pining for the fjords...... |
I got the blue and about 75 hours and hear no improvement what so ever.. |
These fuse threads woukd make a great Monty Python sketch. Way better than the granny gangs bit. |
This is just another kind of blue ooo
dadada dada dadada dadada
ooo ooo
This is just another kind of bluuuuue ooo |
If it's the wire that gives the fuse directionality, why can't the wire be inserted into the fuse with one of the end caps marked?
If a mains fuse is marked as a reference to directionalality, the the manufacturer would be liable. As there is no direction with main voltage as it changes (cycles) 60 x a second. The only way this could be seen as directional, is if the fuse was taken out and reversed 60 x a second as well to stay in syc with the mains. BTW Jetter, had a quick look at your fuse "snake oil" posts, and it seems you are neither yay or nay, are you a fence sitter on the subject, is this right or did I miss something? Cheers George |
wolf_garcia
I seriously doubt that HiFI tuning and SR would be conferencing together, but if they were, why? Planning a sales territory treaty? Trading fuse coating recipes? Deciding on the table settings for a masked ball? One thing claimed "insiders" can't know is the ratio of audiophile fuse "naysayers" to "the faithful." A point successfully ignored by Kaitty. I get continued flack for repeatedly asking why fuses work, and although it's not "rocket science," this this forum thread is about expensive fuses, not rockets. Nobody has yet to make clear in any post anywhere what these special tiny wires do to "gain about an octave in low bass response," or help a system become "transformed into a magical music machine." Without the pesky directional issue. How? Why? Remember, regardless of the quantum coating of vibration damping directional nano juice, it's a teeny, tiny, little wire that is designed to melt.
What you believe is entirely irrelevant to me. You can jibber jabber until you’re blue in the face, knock yourself out.
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My experience with SR blue fuses indicate a consistency in their directionality. The Black SR fuses and Blue SR fuses exhibited the same directionality (writing on the fuse and arrow). In one pair of mono-blocks the writing faced inward on both screw-in fuse holders. In another stereo amp the writing faced outward on a screw-in fuse holder. My conclusion is that the fuses are probably consistent in directionality but equipment using the same basic purpose (turn-on power supply fuses) can differ. |
geoffkait - Gdhal, would it be safe to say you’re experiencing another one of your Deadhead acid flashbacks? Or are you always like this? 😬 Question. Have you given any consideration to going back and finishing up your GED? 😀 Possible. Admittedly, I suspect my mind isn't always as "normal" as it would have been had I not "experimented". |
uberwaltz - Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Please wake me when anything sensible is posted..... @uberwaltz By all means, please do let me know of anything non-sensible you find with my question to you 04-06-2018 11:44am herein this thread. My suspicion is the answer to my question in that post is "no". Happy listening. |
Gdhal, would it be safe to say you’re experiencing another one of your Deadhead acid flashbacks? Or are you always like this? 😬 Question. Have you given any consideration to going back and finishing up your GED? 😀
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geoffkait - Make sense? 😳
No. Delusional. Remember? |
A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines. With consistency a great soul has simply nothing to do. He may as well concern himself with his shadow on the wall. Speak what you think now in hard words, and to-morrow speak what to-morrow thinks in hard words again, though it contradict every thing you said to-day. — 'Ah, so you shall be sure to be misunderstood.' — Is it so bad, then, to be misunderstood? Pythagoras was misunderstood, and Socrates, and Jesus, and Luther, and Copernicus, and Galileo, and Newton, and every pure and wise spirit that ever took flesh. To be great is to be misunderstood.
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I could be wrong, but I doubt SR makes the base fuses themselves. I’m thinking they get them from a fuse maker, and then add their treatments. |
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Please wake me when anything sensible is posted.....
💀💀💀💀
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I don't see that the video disputes mitch2's point. If it's the wire that gives the fuse directionality, why can't the wire be inserted into the fuse with one of the end caps marked? I assume the machine will be inserting each piece of wire into the fuse in the same directionality as the previous one. Perhaps its the cost of having to buy cap ends that some are marked and some are not? |
@mitch2 This video of a typical fuse factory shows the rough and tumble a fuse goes through before it’s even sorted and packed. By the time it is finished, there’s no way to tell unless you test each and every fuse. I'm assuming that aftermarket fuses are made in the same manner, just to different specs and treatment. All the best, Nonoise |
Did somebody forget to take his smart pill this morning? The only way to proceed and the way that’s effective, is to establish proper direction one fuse at a time. Duh! 😛 Any other way is like trying to solve x number of simultaneous equations in x + n unknowns. Make sense? 😳 |
13 posts and all on "snake oil" fuses have you no shame. Your definitely
not doing the fuse "snake oil" brigade any favours.
If fact your helping the detractors. Keep it up!
Cheers George
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^^^mitch2 It is also a mystery to me that why, if the fuses are directional, SR doesn't indicate the proper direction on them. As far as I can tell there are only two possible reasons. One is that they don't think the fuses are directional. Or two, if they do think the fuses are directional, they are amused at the thought of purchasers of multiple fuses turning them in a hundred direction combinations, especially if in the same piece of equipment, to get the final "right" combination. |
There are oft times when it’s not clear which way the fuse should be pointed to be pointed in the “correct direction” such as when the fuse is located right where the power cord enters the component or inside sometimes it’s not clear of the direction of electricity flow, as it were, unlike cables and interconnects for which arrows are often provided and for which there’s no such issue.
For those reasons alone it’s best to instruct the user to try both ways. Not to mention even if the wire was controlled for directionality coming off the spool, as Cable makers do, I suspect handling the teeny wire when fabricating the fuse might change the direction accidentally. Most high end fuses have some sort of writing or symbol on them so the user can remember which way the fuse was last pointed, so he won’t lose track (ideally).
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I stand corrected. I must admit, Al, that your writing skills are more in line w a JD than an EE ;-). |
Haha, he said melt again, oh my. Had to happen sooner or later.
Oh and I LOVE the "my friend loaned me two fuses" BS. Nice. Roughly translated, you went round to your mate's house to hear a system you weren't familiar with, he said he'd bought a couple of fancy fuses, you listened, had nothing to reference it against, and decided they were smoke and mirrors. Lol. How close to the truth am I, wolf? Haha, can't wait for the dummy-spit reply, PLEASE don't disappoint. Priceless. Carry on everyone else. |
They'd have to test each and every fuse for directionality, adding to the cost. Not really. If directionality is a function of the wire production (as Geoff suggests) and not the fuse body or end caps, then, assuming the wire comes off a spool, SR should know exactly which direction is optimal and be able to account for that in their machinery and their tiny elves that paint arrows on the fuses. |
I seriously doubt that HiFI tuning and SR would be conferencing together, but if they were, why? Planning a sales territory treaty? Trading fuse coating recipes? Deciding on the table settings for a masked ball? One thing claimed "insiders" can't know is the ratio of audiophile fuse "naysayers" to "the faithful." A point successfully ignored by Kaitty. I get continued flack for repeatedly asking why fuses work, and although it's not "rocket science," this this forum thread is about expensive fuses, not rockets. Nobody has yet to make clear in any post anywhere what these special tiny wires do to "gain about an octave in low bass response," or help a system become "transformed into a magical music machine." Without the pesky directional issue. How? Why? Remember, regardless of the quantum coating of vibration damping directional nano juice, it's a teeny, tiny, little wire that is designed to melt. |
thecarpathian - If these fuses are directional, why doesn’t Synergistic Research label them to indicate the direction they are to be installed? That would expose the fallacy. |
If you've ever seen a video of fuses being made, there's nothing graceful about it. They'd have to test each and every fuse for directionality, adding to the cost.
It's really simple enough to figure out for oneself as the results are immediately apparent.
All the best,
Nonoise |
I’m not posting to debate the efficacy of SR fuses, merely curious about something. If these fuses are directional, why doesn’t Synergistic Research label them to indicate the direction they are to be installed? |
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uberwaltz - ....At first I really could not detect much change, so I decided well maybe direction is a possibility after all so I reversed the direction of said fuse. This wrought a major sq change and for reasons I admit I do not understand it made me a believer of fuses and direction of said fuses!...
Hi @uberwaltz. I'm curious if the major sound quality change you heard was detected blindly or with your knowing whether or not the fuse direction was changed. In this context, blindly means you do not have sight or any kind of knowledge as to the fuses(s) orientation, you must have at least one other person who performs the fuse reversal (or not), then asks you to state if the fuse orientation was changed, then scores your response, then repeats same for at least a dozen times in order that your claim is consistent and reliable, and your total score is better than 90 percent correct. Thanks. |
We’ve been all over the fuse distortion and noise subject already many times. Please stop pretending it’s some big mystery, folks. Well, maybe in the inscrutable minds of the Uber Skeptics. Where’s Wolfie to ask for the umpteeth time, “Uh, why doesn’t anyone ever give an explanation?” Sob, sob! It’s not rocket science, people! 🚀 |
Al
A very well thought out and interesting post on the subject but to me just leads me to more questions from my own fuse experience.
The most dramatic effects I have witnessed on sq from fuses has been in source components, for example when I inserted a SR Black into my Exogal Comet Plus DAC.
At first I really could not detect much change, so I decided well maybe direction is a possibility after all so I reversed the direction of said fuse.
This wrought a major sq change and for reasons I admit I do not understand it made me a believer of fuses and direction of said fuses!
Now a pair of SR Black fuses as main line fuses in my BAT VK600 reaped much more minor and subtle changes, maybe if I had changed out all 4 buss fuses as well I may have heard more.
I am the first to admit I do not know why or how they work and you could well be right that it is a combination of many factors and in some peoples systems those factors may indeed be absent or at least of minimal consequence, hence the few non believers of the power of the humble fuse.
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Some comments regarding Teo_Audio’s post, in which as I understand it he attributes the audible effects of fuses, at least in amplifiers, to odd order harmonic distortion which “is the distortion pattern a fuse exhibits under the highly dynamic load that a piece of audio equipment puts the fuse under.” Generally speaking harmonic distortion occurs as a result of non-linearity. And a fuse is indeed a non-linear element, in the sense that the voltage drop across it is not in linear proportion (i.e., is not in direct proportion) to the amount of current it is conducting. That follows from the fact that the fuse’s resistance changes depending on how much current it is conducting. It should be noted, though, that Teo’s explanation mentions the specific case of amplifiers. And indeed, in the case of most amplifiers the amount of current conducted by both mains fuses and fuses in internal circuitry will vary dramatically as a function of the dynamics of the audio signal. (Although in the case of mains fuses, amplifiers operating in class A are an exception to that). As I said in my lengthy previous post: Almarg 4-4-2018 I suspect that the effects of the small but rapid variations in fuse resistance that occur in applications in which the current through the fuse fluctuates widely are somehow affecting circuitry that is downstream of the fuse. Presumably the fluctuations in resistance differ significantly among different fuse types. I can’t explain exactly how those effects on downstream circuitry may result, though.
However, I don’t see how Teo’s explanation would be applicable in the case of mains fuses that are used in preamplifiers and in most source components. In those cases the current being conducted by the fuse, rather than being subject to the “highly dynamic load” Teo refers to, is essentially constant. Other questions also arise in connection with the harmonic distortion explanation. Under typical circumstances are the odd order harmonic distortion components that are referred to large enough to add significantly to the corresponding distortion components that may be present on the incoming AC, even if a power conditioner is being used? And in the case of components which provide tightly regulated DC voltages to their audio circuitry, such as most well designed preamps and source components, how would higher order odd harmonic distortion components that may be introduced by a mains fuse influence the audio signal, given that rectification (i.e., AC to DC conversion), extensive filtering, tight voltage regulation, and the typically very great “power supply rejection ratio” of the audio stages would all greatly reduce (and arguably eliminate) that influence? I’m doubtful that any of us are in a position to provide definitive answers to those questions, in part because such questions cannot be readily analyzed from a quantitative standpoint. Finally, to be sure it’s clear I am certainly not saying that fuses don’t make a difference, and I am not saying that anything in Teo’s post is incorrect. What I am saying is that the explanation he has provided for audible differences among fuses does not appear to apply to many and probably the majority of the circumstances in which benefits have been reported. Regards, -- Al |
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My wife stopped watching soapopras, now she just reads this thread...
;-)
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The odds are against it, grasshopper. Look in the mirror. 👀
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geoffkait - Maybe it’s because I’m...(gulp) ......de-lu-soin-al I agree. You are. |
Maybe it’s because I’m...(gulp) ......de-lu-soin-al 😳
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geoffkait - Besides, most fancy fuses are noticeably better than stock fuses right out of the box, even when they’re in the wrong direction. Maybe its your ordinary speaker wire in the wrong direction, fooling you into believing it's the fuse. |
teo_audio....I'm here as the idea that a fuse's distortions and effects are inaudible in an audio amplifier is extremely laughable. Absurd. And, delusional. |
