It is simple to test if your fuses are limiting something without having to invest hundreds of dollars. Just jump them with some spare wire and have a listen. You can even get fancy and jump them with pure silver solid or other exotic wires. If you can't here any difference it is unlikely a fancier and expensive fuse will work.
You can decide if you want to live on the edge and skip the fuses. I never blew an internal one in anything solid state.
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Mapman sez people can draw their own conclusions. Oh, you mean like the 100,000 happy campers who have bought audiophile fuses? Good detective work, Moops!
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Whoa! What the ding ding?! Folks, can you believe it? we have a tie!! Pseudo skeptics 4, fuse apostles 4. We even have wolfman and madman repeating their same dreary claims of “extensive testing” and that nobody has explained how fancy fuses work. Yawn! I’m feeling a little sleepy. Now, get back in there guys and let’s see the feathers fly.
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I did a fairly extensive test of the efficacy of SR fuses a while back...recorded results to play for reference, tried reversing them, had one blow for no apparent reason, and otherwise tried hard to see if the things made any difference...they don’t, and another interesting thing about the endless nonsense regarding Magic (and expensive) Fuses is nobody has offered up any reasonable explanation why they would. |
Yea well the problem is Op offered to send me a fuse to try and I accepted because I was genuinely curious. When I reported back and did not get the advertised results I was marginalized and my ability to listen questioned. One particular "pest" suggested my findings were an outlier and should be disregarded. Not preaching the mandated fuse product gospel did not go over well with anyone.
Good news is I know from experience just the act of reseating a fuse can make a difference so changing one surely can as well. Of course nobody ever factors that in rather any positive change reported is automatically attributed to the fuse. I may have even heard some difference with the fuse sent but if so it was very minor and hard to confirm. I ended up going back to the stock fuse in my Arc pre-amp which appears to be of very good quality.
To me its like wires and power cords. They can make a difference but not always. Some are just designed way differently than others and some are cheaply made and some not. Maybe replacing a cheap or partially blown fuse with a new or higher quality one can make a big difference in some cases. Most likely when directly in the audio signal path like with Magnepan speakers but that is usually not the case with most home audio electronics.
So that’s the story. mapman out.
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Just for the record, I agree with prof.
Also I have stated multiple times in the past that fuses can make a difference and even described scenarios I have encountered over the years where changing a fuse did.
So based on that guess what? One might consider me to be a "fuse guy".
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Frank, Notice that in the post you alluded to I didn’t say the doubters CAN’T
hear. What I did say was that perhaps they don’t know what to listen
FOR. That’s a big difference, and not intended to be a slight in any
way. Sure, you have a point. It's at least possible that the fuses make a certain sonic difference that a skeptic isn't listening for. I'd say, ultimately, that can't take this very far though. Plenty of people with sharp ears, and who have technical knowledge, are skeptical of the claims. Thousands upon thousands of aftermarket fuses sold by various
manufacturers, and thousands of happy customers attesting to the
viability of these fuse tweaks. Are they all just "imagining" an
improvement in sound quality? YES. Really. That could easily be the case. If it's a normal part of being human to experience bias effects, we can expect a lot of people to experience bias effects. And so long as we are talking about people taking a "subjectivist" approach along the lines of "I don't need this to be objectively verifiable, if I hear it I know it's true" then that very approach self-selects for the pattern of people who "hear differences." They are all using the same problematic methodology. Again, it is this same reliance upon subjective experience, without objective evidence or controls, by which people in the millions come to believe...anything! Anyway, that's all I mean to comment on this here. If you want to test fuses and find you hear a difference, and it's all worthwhile for you, enjoy. We all practice this hobby our own way. And I'm not actually saying fuses can't or don't make a difference. Cheers. |
aux you actually gave a constructive response earlier about how fuses are used in various gear and I don’t hear anyone complaining so not sure what you are fussing about. Would you prefer all assertions no matter how much based on conjecture be taken as gospel? That’s called the road to nowhere. |
It's unfortunate that threads like this are always brought down by the same people and the same negative arguments. Nobody can have a constructive discussion on this topic.
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Well that did not take long now did it......
May as well cull it Frank. |
Tell us about directionality one more time GK. Please!!! Don’t make us wait. |
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How many copper wrist bands have been sold?
Does that mean they have magical healing powers?
The people who are "astonished" are those successfully selling fuses for 50x cost. |
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No need for me to guess. People can draw their own conclusions.
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Mapman - That small handful of people are the marketing team . |
Don’t be a refusenik. Go ape! 🕺Live a little, guys. Try not to be sticks in the mud. As for your friend and humble scribe, I hopped off the AC grid some time ago and never looked back. 👀 |
Mapman sez ... - "Not to mention that its mostly a small handful of people here who talk about them repeatedly. Gee I wonder why?"
So, maps, you've been one of the most prolific doubters in all of the various fuse threads, so I'd like to ask you what your best guess is as to the "why." Thanks ... Frank |
prof ... Thanks for the interesting response. I see where you’re coming from but I don’t think your analysis is relevant to the physical properties of hearing. Your argument is more attuned to the spiritual and not the physical realm. Here’s why I feel that way ... The spiritual experience is not logical, it is illogical. It is not natural, it is supernatural. That’s why those who have not had a profound, overwhelming, spiritual experience ridicule those who have, or deny that the experience could even exist in the first place. And that’s why we have mountaintop retreats where cloistered Monks delight in spending their entire lives in prayerful rejoicing. Notice that in the post you alluded to I didn’t say the doubters CAN’T hear. What I did say was that perhaps they don’t know what to listen FOR. That’s a big difference, and not intended to be a slight in any way. I find it interesting that it is the same people in every fuse thread I’ve started who claim they cannot hear the difference. I say ... too bad for them. As for those who have taken the jump, they enjoy an improved listening experience almost every time. Hard to account for that. Geoff is right ... Thousands upon thousands of aftermarket fuses sold by various manufacturers, and thousands of happy customers attesting to the viability of these fuse tweaks. Are they all just "imagining" an improvement in sound quality? Frank |
There goes GK making things up again to support his cause.
References for that fuse # please.
Regardless, the # of "audiophile" fuses sold has no relevance as does the # of all fuses ever sold which its a safe bet eclipses audiophile fuses by a massive margin.
Not to mention that its mostly a small handful of people here who talk about them repeatedly. Gee I wonder why? |
The trouble with the professor’s theory of faith healing and mass hallucination is that the number of fuses isn’t just thousands we’re talking about here, folks, but closing in one 100,000. That’s some pretty bad juju if it’s a mass hallucination, professor. In fact, it would almost certainly be the biggest hoax even choreographed and executed by a coordinated group of fraudsters on naive gullible newbies. Most likely we just got us some mule-headed “skeptics” around here.
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Frank,
The exact same argument you just gave is made for psychics, faith healers, new age therapies, spiritualists and alternative medicine and pretty much every dubious claim you can find. People’s subjectivity can “confirm” the efficacy of just about anything anyone has dreamed up.
Thats actually a problem - a bug, not a feature - of human psychology to take in to consideration when it comes to staking claims on “what people think they experienced.”
And there are limited ways of trying to avoid dealing with this problem of separating real world properties vs human imagination. The most common is to put the blame on the person skeptical of the claim: they either don’t have the secret power or mindset to detect what others detect, or they just don’t have he appropriate opennes of mind to get the experience.
If you feel that pull toward that type of “explanation” when there is no objective evidence for a claim, consider the company you keep with that excuse. ;-)
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It is interesting to think that thousands of after-market fuses have been sold to perfectly satisfied (and sometimes astonished) customers, and yet there are those who still can't or won't hear the positive differences they make. Could it be that they simply don't know what to listen for?
Frank |
I haven’t been wrong since 1977. How does it feel being a Human Pincushion? 😬
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This is like a bad relationship. Some bring their baggage from past discussions (relationships) and ruin it for those who know better from actual experience.
Maybe there should be something like speed dating where once the discussion goes south, or when the timer mercifully chimes, move on until you find like minded individuals and leave those of the same mindset alone.
All the best,
Nonoise |
You beat me to it. But there are obvious reasons why some people will not or do not hear fuses. I actually think they psych themselves out. 😱
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Not everyone can hear a fuse difference, nor, have never even tried it. So the few who troll the idea, as there will always be those few, we fuse guys, just need to move on, and try extracting every last bit of detail through our systems.....It is our hobby, our passion, our money, and fundamentally, our ears, to be satisfied.....simple....end of story. |
Interesting....
I remember talking to someone at Ayre ( sorry do not remember the name) about my ax7e and then at a later date my EX8.
On both occasions they were in full agreement with not only replacement of stock fuse for a boutique fuse but also vibration control.
Hence they even include with their units a set of Myrtle Wood blocks for them to sit on rather than the stock rubber feet.
A toofer from a high end manufacturer.
Or is Ayre not high end enough? |
wolf_garcia
Fuses don’t and will never have any meaningful effect on a well designed power supply when working to accomplish what fuses are actually designed for (protecting the component from catastrophic failure due to sudden power surges), have zero sonic effect on any signal if working as designed (with clean contact points and proper ratings), and to believe otherwise is silly. This is why very few high end component designers care about "premium" fuses in their products. It takes a lot of purposeful hyperbole to sell snake oil, and if that’s entertainment for anybody, enjoy this space! >>>>>>Wolfman exposed! Wolfman and clearthink are THE SAME PERSON. 😩 sidenote - if someone can’t hear the difference fuses make they’re either hearing impaired or their system is all messed up. |
^^^ - "It takes a lot of purposeful hyperbole to sell snake oil, and if that's entertainment for anybody, enjoy this space!"
Please note the heading of this thread:
"Something For The Fuse Guys ... " Thanks ... Frank |
Fuses don't and will never have any meaningful effect on a well designed power supply when working to accomplish what fuses are actually designed for (protecting the component from catastrophic failure due to sudden power surges), have zero sonic effect on any signal if working as designed (with clean contact points and proper ratings), and to believe otherwise is silly. This is why very few high end component designers care about "premium" fuses in their products. It takes a lot of purposeful hyperbole to sell snake oil, and if that's entertainment for anybody, enjoy this space! |
Book your ticket for the early bird special
Make sure you check the “round trip” box HMMMM, Can think of a few who maybe should just check the one way box...….. |
Obviously this new fuse uses quantum technology.......because everything is "quantum" now.
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Book your ticket for the early bird special
Make sure you check the “round trip” box
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Gee whiz, you really are gullible, aren’t you?
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Geoff, the Moon is just a launching pad for the trip to Mars....try and keep up
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mitch22,012 posts09-20-2019 10:58pm @geoffkait Who’s more demanding - the space program or audiophiles? If you replace "demanding" with "gullible" what would the answer be? >>>>>I never bought into that, Hey, let’s go to the Moon and Mars baloney. |
I’m from the future. In the future there are no fuses. There’s a lot less noise and distortion that way as it turns out. I only come back here for the jocularity. All the audio forums in the future are wastelands.
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^^^
I just love a good mystery.
So, did any of you pick up that Erica Morini CD I posted above? Come on guys ... there's more to this audiophile business besides 70s rock and Patricia Barber. :-)
So, this coming Sunday's listening session will be interesting. A fellow A'goner will be coming over for the day. He's familiar with the system and he has ears that can be trusted, so I'm looking forward to his input on the prototype fuses. So far, I think they're pretty special. We'll see what he thinks.
Stay tuned ...
Frank |
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@geoffkait
Who’s more demanding - the space program or audiophiles? If you replace "demanding" with "gullible" what would the answer be? |
The new fuse will make everything better that was even better than the last fuse which was even better than the previous fuse which was even better and more lifelike than the previous fuse . Your significant other will come into the room smiling and exclaim "you must have got another new fuse ?" |
I think it’s a Perfect Path fuse
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I nominate OP as the chief fuse guy. He is always the first to break the news here about the next best fancy fuse. |
I'm betting it has some type of light gray matter inside it that absolutely doesn't go bad after a year or so... |
Based on history the new fuses will instantly trump the old fuses and be the best thing ever. Until next year. |
Speaking of which, one wonders how much NASA pays for mission critical fuses and who makes them. And are they just stock Littelfuse fuses? 👩🚀 Who’s more demanding - the space program or audiophiles? 😳
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It ain't rocket science..... |
