Something For The Fuse Guys ...
^^^
mkgus There are no dumb questions. Not all audio equipment have fuses. Most do. The fuses mentioned above protect the circuit in case of a surge or a short. They are in the signal path, and the after-market fuses sound better than the stock fuses, some more-so than others. Read the Blue Fuse thread. Here's a link ... https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/the-new-synergistic-research-blue-fuses Hope this helps. Frank |
I've taken a lot of notes so far and will be sharing those at a later date. All I can say at this point is ... they need a little breaking in. Upon initial installation into four separate components, the sound was too relaxed. There were, however, improvements heard right off of the bat, like a more accurate tonal balance. But the sound was just too laid back. That went away after a couple of hours of listening. Thoroughly enjoyable though after that brief period. On the tonal accuracy ... that is one of the most, if not THE most, important areas in my estimation. Instruments and voices have to sound right to my ear in order for the whole system to be enjoyable. These prototype fuses improved tonal accuracy beyond what it already was. That's saying something considering the lengths I've gone through to get it right over time. Last night I put on Tchaikovsky's violin concerto played by Erica Morini, backed by the LSO with Artur Rodinski conducting. Wow! That violin was dead-nutz on. And the performance is truly great. What else could it be? ... It's the great Erica Morini, after all. Here's the CD: https://www.ebay.com/itm/ERICA-MORINI-BRAHMS-TCHAIKOVSKY-VIOLIN-CONCERTOS-CD-6-TRACKS-COMO-NUEVO/322370981557?hash=item4b0ececeb5:g:QrQAAOSwImRYYXLR It is available on LP, but a VG+ original vinyl in stereo goes for around $150 and is extremely hard to find. I have the budget CD transfer reissue from the Westminister tapes. That's all one needs. It is beautiful. I've found that some of these budget CD reissues really sound the best. The reissuing companies really don't take the time to muck things up, so as a result of their budget mindedness, we get more of a direct transfer from the master tape type of sound. I'm boycotting recordings and reissues that are drenched in artificial digital reverb. Stay tuned ... Things continue to improve. Frank |
^^^ I just love a good mystery. So, did any of you pick up that Erica Morini CD I posted above? Come on guys ... there's more to this audiophile business besides 70s rock and Patricia Barber. :-) So, this coming Sunday's listening session will be interesting. A fellow A'goner will be coming over for the day. He's familiar with the system and he has ears that can be trusted, so I'm looking forward to his input on the prototype fuses. So far, I think they're pretty special. We'll see what he thinks. Stay tuned ... Frank |
prof ... Thanks for the interesting response. I see where you’re coming from but I don’t think your analysis is relevant to the physical properties of hearing. Your argument is more attuned to the spiritual and not the physical realm. Here’s why I feel that way ... The spiritual experience is not logical, it is illogical. It is not natural, it is supernatural. That’s why those who have not had a profound, overwhelming, spiritual experience ridicule those who have, or deny that the experience could even exist in the first place. And that’s why we have mountaintop retreats where cloistered Monks delight in spending their entire lives in prayerful rejoicing. Notice that in the post you alluded to I didn’t say the doubters CAN’T hear. What I did say was that perhaps they don’t know what to listen FOR. That’s a big difference, and not intended to be a slight in any way. I find it interesting that it is the same people in every fuse thread I’ve started who claim they cannot hear the difference. I say ... too bad for them. As for those who have taken the jump, they enjoy an improved listening experience almost every time. Hard to account for that. Geoff is right ... Thousands upon thousands of aftermarket fuses sold by various manufacturers, and thousands of happy customers attesting to the viability of these fuse tweaks. Are they all just "imagining" an improvement in sound quality? Frank |
Mapman sez ...
So, maps, you've been one of the most prolific doubters in all of the various fuse threads, so I'd like to ask you what your best guess is as to the "why." Thanks ... Frank |
A fellow A’goner is due here in a few minutes. He’s very familiar with my system. It will be a lengthy listening session today. Stay tuned ... we’ll see what he thinks of the prototype fuses. Frank PS: I didn’t know there was a "salesforce" involved here. I can hardly wait for my huge commission check to arrive in the mail. |
uberwaltz ... Yesterday’s listening session turned out to be a marathon. Two fellow audiophiles came over with some fantastic records (LPs). The prototype fuses continue breaking in. Things are still a little laid back, but with an overall improvement in inner-detail, sound staging and focus. Where the soundstage used to start at the plane of the speakers and go back to the back wall, it now starts behind the speakers and goes to the back wall. In other words, the presentation isn’t as upfront as it was prior to the prototype fuses being installed. I like the effect. The fellow A’goner present for the session had just returned from the Rocky Mountain show. His comment was ... "with the exception of maybe two systems displayed at the show, nothing could touch what we're hearing here. And even they couldn’t do what this system is doing." So, the general consensus is that the prototype fuses are a winner and an overall improvement over the previous fuses used in the system. By the way, one of the beautiful recordings listened to yesterday was a 45 rpm reissue of a Nat King Cole LP brought to the session by the fellow A’goner. It was fantastic. The Audio-Technica OC-9 MK III is a very revealing and musical cartridge ... and a bargain to boot. Frank |
mrdecibel ...
Exactly. But, it is more than just an increase in finer details. There's more of a tactile presence to the whole picture. I credit a whole bunch of "tweaks" applied over the past three years that allow for this kind of information to be passed through the system. The prototype fuses have brought the realism of the event a little closer to the listener yet. That's saying a lot when one considers how good the SR Blue fuses are/were on their own. Impressive, indeed. jaybe ... ^^^ Time marches on, my friend ... and so does progress. :-) Frank |
Directional? I put them into four different components. I reversed the one in the line-stage ... and it sounded better. By "better," I mean more well focused. Same as all of the other aftermarket fuses. Placed the wrong way, the sound is slightly defused (no pun intended), like the system is out of phase. Placed in the proper direction, things just seem to snap into place. I know ... I know .. Impossible, right? Frank |
^^^ Maps ... I certainly appreciate how concerned you are over how other people spend their money. I suspect that it is much appreciated by others posting on this site as well. In three-plus years of using after-market fuses, I’ve only had one fail. That’s not a bad record considering I’ve been through stock fuses, HiFi Tuning fuses, and the SR Reds, Blacks, Blues ... and now this no-name prototype fuse. Not a bad record, wouldn’t you say ...?? Frank |
Maps ... Thanks again for your concerns. Much appreciated. Other than you, who is debating whether fuses blow or not? If a stock fuse blows, it will cost pennies. If an expensive fuse blows, it will cost ... well, it will be expensive. What's more expensive ... an expensive fuse blowing, or an expensive fuse NOT blowing and the surge taking out the entire circuit board? Frank |
I would like for one of our professional metallurgist members to chime in here and share with us any information they may have about the way metal is extruded during the manufacture of wire, and how that extrusion would affect the direction of molecules, and subsequently the directionality of said wire. Frank |
With these prototype fuses, I'm able to turn the volume knob down to a considerably lower setting and still get the same volume out of the system as before. Could some fuses be more efficient than others? Any science-minded folks want to chime in on that? And by the way, the system is sounding fantastic. Frank |
AhHa ... I thought so. Thank you, Mr. Humble, for that. So, there's the wire extrusion factor (which no one has commented on yet), and now we have cryogenic treatment. How many more factors could affect the "sound" of different fuses? How about the use of different materials like graphene, beeswax ... etc? Frank |
Once a system reaches a certain level of refinement, one can discern the smallest changes in sound reproduction. This would include the direction of fuses. The question is ... how do we attain that level of refinement? It has all been laid out in this forum, and in the "Member Review" forum over the past few years. Those who have taken heed can hear the difference. Those who haven’t ... well?? Frank |
There's another conclusion ... If you are thinking about upgrading your fuses, wait until at least mid-October. For those short of memory ... When the SR Blue fuses first came on the market, the same naysayers participating in this thread, (and others), wailed on about the fact that there were no warnings about the SR Blue fuses coming onto the market, and that (whine) just wasn't fair (whine again) to those who had just bought the SR Black fuses. Well, consider this thread the heads up ... there's a new fuse (possibly) coming out, from a still-unnamed source, and at a still unstated price, that is better in every way from those fuses I've had the pleasure of using in the system prior to this date. In addition, there's one more conclusion. Put simply, those who can't hear the improved SQ that upgrading fuses can make to their audio systems just cannot hear, period. Either that, or their system and/or room needs a LOT of work. Frank |
Guyz ... All of the changes & tweaks done to my system over the years have built upon each other. Each one has added more transparency, three-dimensionality and an overall sense of realism. With everything being added together, the overall system has been transformed to way beyond where I ever thought it could be. It seems as though the more good tweaks I add, the more obvious are the improvements attained from just one additional tweak ... like better fuses for example. The current fuses under evaluation are no exception. We can start with a better rack. Then move on to effective room treatments. Then, macro/micro-vibration control. Then upgraded speaker cables, interconnects and power cords. Then there were several incarnations of after-market fuses. From there, I moved on to the PPT products, all excellent, but The Gate was the final icing on the cake (those who own one know what I'm talking about). All put together, the wow-factor in this system is unbelievable. Unless these details have been taken care of, there exists additional opportunities for added resolution in any system lacking them. If anyone is thinking that anything used above was snake oil, I've got a bridge to sell you. For those of you who have paid attention to these details, you already know what I'm talking about. That's why this thread was titled "Something For The Fuse Guys." If you cannot hear the improvements that upgraded fuses bring to a system, then again ... either it is your hearing, or your system that isn't allowing you to hear it. Nuttin' but the facts, my friends. If any newbies want to know specifically what I've done in total, either check out my system page here on A'gon, or PM me. I'd be delighted to hear from you and offer any suggestions I can. Happy listening ... Frank |
^^^ Hello, Proud Fuser ... :-) Are you kidding? After spending 50 years in commissioned sales, my skin is a foot thick. Fortunately, I didn't lose my sense of humor in the process one iota. What cracks me up the most, Boxer, are the naysayers who continue following my threads regarding after-market fuses with their same tired old bromides about how fuses don't make any difference, how they are nothing but snake-oil, and that they can't be directional. Those who are in the know, like yourself, know better. Above, I listed some of the things I've done to the system over the past few years to attain the present SQ I'm enjoying. I know there are those who think I've overstated the case, but man, there are times when I'm listening to the system where I just have to shake my head in disbelief. It is that good. Keep on fusing, Boxer ... The new ones should be out by the middle of this month. So far, I can unequivocally say that they are significantly better than the SR Blue fuses. Frank |
^^^ uberwaltz .... Yes, I believe there is a market for good used aftermarket fuses. I haven't tried selling any, but I have given the SR Red fuses away to friends. I still have all of my SR Black fuses and the newly replaced SR Blue fuses. I was keeping the SR Black fuses for spares. I would imagine that if one were of the mind to, they would sell for about half of retail. I don't see why they wouldn't. Frank |
jafreeman ... Your assessment is right on target. I’ll tell you, when I try a product that significantly improves my audio system, I’m going to report it here, no matter the flack. Over time, those who have taken the jump on these products have benefited greatly. Audiogon has benefited greatly as well. After all ... Audiogon is in business to sell advertising and to make fees from various sales. If positive reviews help that, then Audiogon makes out, and so do we, because we still have this little niche’ of the audiophile world where we can express our opinions share our successes. Frank |
lalitk ... The post was in response to this:
I haven’t tried unplugging the refrigerator or the TV. Way too many dead brain cells that have reduced my short-term memory. I’d get up in the morning only to find that the freezer compartment has melted all over the floor. That would be right before I called the TV repairman to fix the TV because it won’t fire up. :-) On another note, I do have a couple of audiophile friends who unplug their appliances for all serious listening sessions. They are yet to purchase "The Gate." Frank |
geoffkait ...
I pasted my refrigerator plug with TC. Same with the TV. And any unused outlets have a "Stop It" inserted into it. wolf_garcia ... Very interesting wolfie, considering that PPT is located in New Hampshire. Hey, Putz, if you're going to be slinging BS in these forums, the very least you should do would be to get your story straight. Frank |
fleschler ... The uncured "Stop It" receptacle plugs sounded really bad. Lost most of the mid-bass and some of the lower bass. They finally came around at about three weeks. The cured ones that you'll be receiving will make a nice improvement to your system right off the bat. If you can, order enough to insert into every unused outlet in the entire house. The Orange fuses will give those Legacy Focus' of yours a new level of bass. Also, more realistic sound. Wait until you hear the violin and piano. By the way, my invitation is still open to you at any time. I'd love for you to hear what the Signature IIIs are doing now. Legacy speakers, at least the ones I'm familiar with, perform way beyond their price point. I think the Signature IIIs are becoming somewhat of a cult item. Come on up ... Frank |
uberwaltz ... +1 I’ve been on this planet much longer than most. Grew up as a street kid and got knocked around a lot. Had my first full-time job when I was twelve. These experiences, plus fifty years in a commissioned sales career, gave me the ability to read the intentions of other people. So, I’ve had a lot of time to make certain observations about my fellow humankind. One thing I’ve learned over the years is that a person who constantly treats others shabbily, is abusive toward others, and/or relishes being a bully, really doesn’t feel good about themselves. They have a darkened soul. I consider it a form of insanity. Why? Because sane people treat others in the way they would like to be treated themselves. It has also been my observation that there is a cure for that malady. An instant cure if one is humble enough to seek it. :-) Take care ... Frank |
georgehifi ... Uhh, George ... Most audio equipment has a fuse holder on the outside rear of the unit. It is a simple operation to release the holder, remove the old fuse, install the new fuse, then replace the holder. It certainly doesn't require an EE degree to accomplish the feat. The only talent it takes is for the user to remember ... "leftie/loosie ... righty/tightie." By the way, why so much animosity in your posts, George? The audio hobby is a fun hobby, remember? Take care ... Frank |
^^^ Georgie-Porgie sez ...
I'll just leave these posts alone with no comment for others to digest. Frank |
georgehifi ... “The day science begins to study non-physical phenomena, it will make more progress in one decade than in all the previous centuries of its existence.” ___ Nikola Tesla “If your hate could be turned into electricity, it would light up the whole world.” ___ Nikola Tesla Start doing some serious soul-searching, George. You'll be a better man for it. With love ... Frank |
georgehifi ... If you were to become a more astute observer, and stow your animosity for a time, you would know that I have started threads on a multitude of products. Did you read my threads on Audio Research products? How about Herbie’s products, or Perfect Path Technologies products? Have you taken advantage of any of the multitude of music recommendations I’ve offered on this site over the years, George? If you were to reverse your telescope, George, you wouldn’t have such a myopic, negative view of the world and your fellow man. Life is good, George. People, in general, are nice, George. Enjoy a sunset, George. Have a good glass of wine, George. Hug your wife, George. Turn your talisman over, George. You can make the decision to have a positive mental attitude in an instant, George, just by turning over the aforementioned talisman from the negative side to the positive side. Once you make that simple decision, you’ll have a much more fruitful and enjoyable life. I sincerely hope to see you shining brightly with a much more positive light in the future, George ... Take care ... Frank |
pragmasi ....
Just curious, pragmasi ... have you tried any of the after-market fuses in your system? Frank |
pragmasi ...
Agreed, pragmasi ... but what prompted me to ask the question was this statement you made:
What evidence do you have, or what experiments have you conducted, that would lead you to the conclusion that there won't be any improvement in audio performance if you haven't tried the more expensive after-market fuses? This would include fuses from HiFi Tuning, Beeswax fuses and/or Synergistic Research fuses? With the exception of the Beeswax fuse, I have used all of the above fuses in my system over the past few years. Every one of them has been a substantial improvement in sound quality. This includes four different incarnations of SR fuses ... The Blacks, the Reds, the Blues and now, the Orange fuses. Going from stock fuses normally supplied by the various manufacturers to the new SR Orange fuses would make a profound improvement in performance in my opinion. And ... that opinion is not based upon any scientific acumen I may possess, as I possess very little knowledge in that area. All of my opinions have been based upon actual experience with said products. Looking forward to your response. Frank |
pragmasi ... Thanks for your interesting response To answer your question ... I know of no manufacturer that uses boutique fuses in their finished products. There's a price point to this. It is no secret that a dealer pays 50% to 60% of the end retail price of the high-end electronics sitting on his/her shelf. If a unit cost the factory $2500 to build, the dealer gets it for $5000. Then the consumer pays $10,000 ... less anything that is negotiated off of the full retail price. Let's say, just for discussion, that the manufacturer pays for a fuse at "dealer cost." The end product, once it hits the dealer's shelf, would be four times the cost of what the factory paid for the fuse. So, a fuse that retails for $160, would cost the factory approximately $80.00. That would be a $320.00 increase in the price of the final product to the end consumer. Extrapolate it out for every device used in the manufacturing of any product. In this case high-end audio. There are companies that use the very best and expensive parts attainable ... and the consumer pays through the nose for those products. There's a reason we have speakers that cost $250,000 per pair, and amplifiers that cost $150,000. I don't even want to get into turntables. If every manufacturer were to use the most expensive parts available, then people with modest incomes would never be able to afford to enter the hobby. For me ... I'll stick with my ARC gear and upgrade fuses as they come available. Frank |
