Bruno Mars is nothing special. There, I said it again. And, if he thinks he is it makes me question his judgement.
Quincy Jones Interview
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When I was in high school, I picked up some accordion and guitar skills on my own without learning sheet music. I put together some folk dancing composition and was presented to perform it by concert organizers. I clearly was NOT ready and my practicing were going literally nowhere. I was able to get most of it right, but wasn't able to sound correct and at higher speeds would certainly trip even on well brushed-out pieces, but on stage -- it's all so different and I was backed up fo sho! I'm 99% sure that most of the pop bands backed up by pros including pop singers. To tell you the truth uptill now I can't get it right and my accordion is SOLD. |
When I was in music school I once went into a practice room where someone had carved into the wooden case of an upright piano: "Legit is dead. Jazz lives!" I didn’t know that kind of snobbery still existed till just now. I doubt most of the musicians cited by Minori share the view that Beatles were not very good musicians. IMO/YMMV. |
81 vs. 85 is biggest contributor to his verbal mishaps. Please see his prior interviews before he got biased against Trump. When there goes on dementia, I don't think that making fun of one who suffers makes sense. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5gYjUslrtw My favorite album is Big Band Bossa Nova |
I totally agree with Quincy's assessments. He was there. The music industry is/was very corrupted and many terrible singers and musician were popular not because of their talent. The Beatles were not very good musicians. That is a fact. You know when you are in the studio with musicians and they can't play a lick without backup musicians and help of Engineers. Singers that can't sing live also fall in this category. This, like professional sports is about putting butts in the seats and getting fans and making money. Jazz was absolutely not like that. The best didn't make anything and were quite often ripped off by club owner and producers. The problem with the younger generations in my opinion is that the don't believe or actually listen to the older people that "WERE THERE". The bad things that Quincy Jones talks about actually happened. What's the difference between Elvis and Chuck Berry? Chuck Berry started it all. Elvis stole most of the music and style. Don't get me wrong, he did great. But Chuck Berry was black and Elvis was white. Simple as that. Real world hard assessments and real history and not whitewashed history is what we really need. Some of my best and favorite albums and music were produced by Quincy Jones. If you look at his older stuff, he had the absolute best music, musicians and singers on each album. Artist would trip over themselves trying to get on his albums. 1. In the Heat of the Night, with Ray Charles with lyrics by Alan and Marilyn Bergman???? 2. Gula Matari (Freddie Hubbard and Hubert Laws), Valerie Simpson, Herbie Hancock, Bob James???????, Eric Gale, Toots Thielemans, Ron Carter, Ray Brown, Milt Jackson and many more. Come on now!!!! 3. Sounds (my favorite).l Simple love tell me a bedtime story, and superwoman song by Patti Austin. This album had Tom Scott, Herbie Hancock, Eric Gale, George Young, Nick Ashford, Chaka Khan, Valerie Simpson, Michael Breaker. Oh boy and many more. 4. You got it bad Girl. Summer in the City. Dave Grusin and Valerie Simpson. First Time I saw your face. Absolutely wonderful. Valerie Simpson was wonderful. Aretha Franklin on Daydreaming. 5. Body Heat. Listen to Everything must Change on that Album. That was Bernard Ighner baby. The best music and version out there. You can't help but tear up when you hear that version. Wow.. 6. The Dude 7. Roots 8. I heard that. Most of this was Jazz so it didn't get to the general public. But this was real music. I agree with him. Most musicians and singers today don't have a musical background. most singers can't hold a note and fluctuate so often to cover up their inability to hold a note. A long time ago, I took my very young daughter (who is a ballet dancer) to a Roberta Flack concert (when she still had her voice), just to show her what a real singer sounds like. My daughter was so impressed to hear someone that could really sing. she thought she did before, but now knew different. popular music today is about making money, not about making real music. Check out some of the songs and albums I listed. read the who's who list of artist on each album. Amazing. Thanks and enjoy |
Let's not diminished the words of Quincy Jones. The man has done it all and obviously has nothing to lose and at this point and time in his life can be as unfiltered as he wants. Anybody that knows anything about Hollywood and the music industry understands that as far-fetched and as raw as some of this may appear, that there's a whole lot of believe ability to this interview. We only get two times to be soooo unfiltered, one as a child and the other as elderly men and women. Cheers |
Great response Chayro, that is just the point, Q's opinions are just that and to read into it more than what it was to me is missing the point. To me, at least it was a series of events that happened and he witnessed. Really, what does an 85 year old guy got to lose? Another point he made that wasn't discussed in the criticism of him was how he stayed connected to his roots of poverty, the empathy towards others, funny how many missed or omitted that point which gave more credence to many of his other opinions. Agreed, the Brando comment would have been better left unsaid. |
As someone who spent the first half of his life as a professional musician, musicians often have very definite and sometimes limited views on what they like and don't like. I have friend who is a chef and she feels the same way about restaurants - very narrow view of what they like and don't like. Quincy's opinions are just that - his opinions. OTOH, it's always refreshing to hear someone state what's really on their minds. It's a very dangerous thing to do if you have anything to lose. |
I care too, but, regardless on Q's biased insults to Trump, I value that as if toddler spoken same way. There's no power to argue in this case to criticize the old man that literally and clearly speaks not from his clear mind. There are much more of the Hollywood artists do insult Mr. Trump including ones we discuss and adore listening to dontcha realize?, but he only chuckles to that foolishness and so do I. |
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Thanks for clearing that up. Sure, his opinions are valid inasmuch as they are his, and everyone is entitled to have an opinion and “has a right” to express it no matter how inappropriate it may be under any particular circumstance. Moreover, and as you say, given his obvious and huge musical talent and huge career his opinions on music do carry a tremendous amount of weight. But, they are not necessarily valid as far as truth goes. Here’s the thing for me, and the Brando comment is just one example of many like it in that interview and elsewhere. How about a couple more?: He trashes Donald Trump and says he hates him; that he’s an idiot...or something like that. Yet, he “used to hang out with him”. Why? He accuses MJ of stealing a song (or part of the song....or whatever) from DS. Yet, where was he through all this? The role of a producer of his stature in a project like that is huge and he has control of practically everything. If, in fact, MJ was stealing something (he wasn’t, imo) why did he allow it? I would bet that the particular rhythm or bass line in question came mostly from Q. Now, all this combined with what is for me almost unbelievable; that he cannot, or won’t, appreciate, at least, the obvious song writing skills of The Beatles. Or, to not appreciate that even if Hendrix was nervous about playing with jazz musicians that this is only one side of a “coin” that most musicians hold dear and understand very well. IOW, that most of his “baddest cats” would feel just as out of place and as fish out of water playing with a great rock band like Hendrix’s. This is stuff that goes to the very fiber of being a musician. All this, while not diminishing in any way all that I love and respect about so much of his work, throws into question the validity of some of his ”opinions” and comments and what their underlying motivations might be. |
Let me be very clear the opinions I was talking about relate to music and his musical experiences. Certainly the Brando comment was unfortunate yes but in terms of his thoughts on the Beatles, MJ, etc those are valid. And perhaps his chain is slipping or at the very least his filter is which can certainly happen with age. |
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@czarivey How can you deny something so obvious? Michael Jackson was a great performer but his work is heavily influenced (lifted) from others Just listen to Donna Summers work at that time (also produced by Quincy). Michael Jackson lifted stuff from her and also stole from countless others including Hall and Oates “No Can Do” (baseline is the one on Billie Jean). |
I feel, as many jazz aficionados feel, that Quincy Jones is someone they know personally, and out of the decades we have known him, he has been one of the most intelligent and articulate jazz artists out of the many. Now when he starts to say things that are flat out goofy at age 85 after a brain aneurysm, the cause of this is quite apparent to me. I view this the same as I would anyone else who has recently acquired a disability. |
To excuse because of age and illness in the context of an amazing career...possibly...up to a point. But wholesale excuse without important caveats...no way! That because of an epic career one has the right to say whatever one wants...really?! It is precisely because of his stature and the importance of his career that his comments need to be scrutinized for truth. Not only where some of his comments (opinions), particularly those of a very personal nature, inappropriate for a public forum, but some of them have been and are currently being disputed; they cloud the significance of the comments that have real value. Indisputably a giant in the music industry; but, again, think “Hollywood”. |
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Bruno Mars has not produced an original musical thought or lick yet--at least from his hits (I have never heard anything else he has done). I recognize that most pop/rock use riffs/beats/melodies from the past, but I've yet to hear him steal one and make it better than the original. But he can dance. |
Quincy Jones has earned the right to say pretty much whatever he freaking wants to at age 85 considering his epic career. In terms of Q and his musical abilities vs his talents as an arranger and a producer, mediocre players often become great coaches in various sports. I don’t think knowledge is constrained by a lack of technical prowess, it simply expressed itself in different ways. From watching their tv show as a kid The Monkees have always been a guilty pleasure of mine! |
Oops! The guitar break of George Harrison’s that I described as incredibly musically delicious is that in The Beatles song "Nowhere Man", on their Rubber Soul album. For fun, compare it to what James Burton (another fantastically musical guitarist) plays in the middle of Ricky Nelson’s song "Young World"! |
Charles, **** are you saying that you cannot critique the musicianship of others unless you yourself were a great musician yourself? **** Not at all; and I could not agree more with your comments. The motivation for Q’s criticisms of some musicians’ ability is, and I believe I left, as an open question. My point was simply that I found it interesting that he should focus so much on the technical ability of musicians while (as in the case of The Beatles) apparently not be able to recognize the generally acknowledged excellence of their music in other areas. I found this particularly interesting coming from a person who had relatively limited ability as an instrumentalist himself, and whose important contributions were in other areas as well. Any deeper digging into the psychology of it all I would leave to others to judge for themselves. Don’t get me wrong I am a very big fan of his work, from the soundtrack to the film “The Pawnbroker” to “Sinatra At The Sands” to, yes, MJ’s “Thriller”; and on and on. But I was surprised and frankly very turned off by what came across in that interview as an attitude of overblown ego and elitist attitude about art; particularly interesting coming from someone whose artistic output later in his career, while technically brilliant and on the highest level of production quality, has often been no more than fantastic ear candy (to use his own term). |
Hi Frogman, As always I appreciate your insight. Looking for clarification, are you saying that you cannot critique the musicianship of others unless you yourself were a great musician yourself? Jones certainly wasn’t a trumpeter anywhere near his contemporaries, Miles, Brownie Chet, or Kenny Dorham. However he’d be able to recognize talent (or lack of) in other musicians. He had lifelong and enormous exposure to many musicians across a hugh spectrum. As a producer and arranger he’d be analogous to a highly successful coach/manager who was but a marginal player. Bill Parcels or John Madden (NFL) or say Phil Jackson (NBA). No exceptional talent as players themselves but clearly could identify the talent level of players after watching them perform. Just as Q. Jones could easily sort out the really good musicians upon hearing them play.. Charles |
