Need Suggestions for speakers up to $15K new/used

 I run Dyn C4 Signatures, with BHK300 mono's, it sounded good.  I contacted GIK Acoustics and spoke with Nick.  Working with Nick, he designed a treatment specific to my room size and various soffits through out.  As I'm sure you will discover, it will be night and day.  I had never invested in room treatment, though knew it would have an impact.  How much, I didn't think much, I was wrong.  

I personally found the new Magico S1 Mk2’s to be better sounding than the old S5. They are remarkable speakers for the money; great sound stage width and depth, imaging, deep tight bass & very coherent sounding. There is a mint pair for sale atm on USA Audio Mart asking $10.5k - http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649305631-magico-s1-mkii-speakers-pewter-mcast-finish/. Regarding amps, if you already have PS audio gear, I would lean toward moving on your Constellation pre & go for either the BHK300 mono’s & pre, or BHK stereo amp/pre, and roll the stock tubes with some nice NOS matched tubes. I think that combo would sound great.

I need instruction on how to post pictures please.

I am very pleased with the sound of the new system so far.  I definitely need to place some acoustic panels in the room and am speaking to someone that is going to perform an analysis and guidance.

My turntable is definitely my weak leak at this point so I am looking hard for a new one to complement the rest of my system.  

Now you must tell us how your new system sounds and give us some pic's of your new set-up!

congrats on the Voxativs - great speaker. I thought that room sounded quite pure myself.

@ mmporsche, I am happy to see that you found a speaker and integrated that speaks to you musically. I have always enjoyed listening to the Voxative gear at audio shows. Very natural and expressive.

Now you see why we tell people to select your speakers and source first! Find the speaker and source that recreates music the way you prefer to listen to it ......, then worry about selecting the equipment and cables to drive them. Enjoy!

If you are looking  for a world class speaker you can take a listen at AAudio Imports. He is down near Parker Colorado. Great listening room.

Loads of emotion. 

We currently have our mint condition demo Paradigm Signature S8's, C5 Center, and ADP3 Surrounds available for a package deal of $12,670 - 30% off the retail $18,100 - With full manufacturers warranty. If anyone is interested, shoot me a message. You can check out our website at www.audioartne.com as well. We're located in Sudbury, MA.

We rarely have used gear though so this is a smokin' deal. They discontinued the Signature line, and we have to make room for the new Paradigm Persona line. We will have the 9H's on demo and a couple of the other pairs in the line.

There’s a pair of used Vandersteen Carbon 5a for $15k. I think you’d be hard-pressed to beat that speaker at that price.

I’ve heard the Vandersteen Quatro CT, and they are excellent. I would not get the Magnepan 20.7 in your room because you don't have the width to maximize them.

I checked out the classic audios, very nice but I didn't have the emotional connection as with the Voxativ.

I pulled the trigger and bought the Voxativ 9.87 system along with the Voxativ 211 integrated amp. Can't wait to hear it in my room. The owner is a great guy, former Mercedes engineer. 

You might want to look into Classic Audio Loudspeakers smaller range which are field coil powered.

I neglected to mention the others so here are my impressions:

-Focal Sopra 2 - I did an extensive session when they first came out and didn't care for them.  Too bright and unnatural for my tastes
-Harbeth - I did listen to these yesterday and found them to muddy and full at the bottom end for my liking.  Again, I realize the room acoustics are terrible at RMAF so first impression
-Wilson Sophia 2 - hard to find fault other than I find them ugly and a little to warm in the lower range for my tastes.
-Gamut monitors (not sure of the model) - they had some terrible German music playing yesterday that made me want to attack someone.  It definitely didn't highlight the speakers but for what they cost it was a non-starter.
-Tidal (model unknown) - Very nice speakers with a great soundstage.  Still not as natural and authoritative as the Voxativ room.
-Salk - very nice value speaker.  They were playing their $2,800 per pair IMS and they had a nice sound to them.  I did find the ribbon to be a bit unnatural.  

Again, these are MY impressions and I am not intending to offend anyone that owns any of these speakers.  I also know the environments were not ideal.  

I spent the day at RMAF listening to a number of speakers suggested where I could find them.  Not all are listed in the guide so it is a bit of hit or miss.

I found the Voxativ room and was blown away.  I went back three separate times.  The music sounded so natural coming out of the 9.87 setup compared to the others I auditioned.  One thing my friend noticed was they had NO room corrections.  There wasn't a single acoustic panel or pillow shoved in a corner anywhere, yet it sounded amazing.

I did listen to the Raidho D 4.1, however, they were in a small room and it didn't do them justice.  I spoke to MB and inquired about the display of and D1.1 or D2.1 speakers and they didn't bring anything that small.  Very disappointing.

The Magico S1's sounded very clean, although a little bright for my tastes and they definitely lacked the bottom end.  I then spent 30 minutes listening to S3's in the Synergistic Room.  Again the room was not ideal for the speakers IMO.  They sounded a little muffled in the low-end and that was with all the fancy multi-thousand dollar Synergistic aids applied. 

Two of the best sounding rooms to me were the Dynaudio with a small pair of monitors.  Appropriate speaker for the space with good music that truly highlighted their capabilities.  The other is the Elac room with Andrew Jones.  Those guys are doing amazing stuff for pennies on the dollar.  They have a new integrated amp for $700 (if memory serves) that offers DSP, Blutooth, phono, and they powered their new floor standers with amazing authority.  Granted this was a $2,250 system plus the source so it was just amazing at the quality for the price.  They are rumored to be coming out with some higher quality and priced speakers at CES.

So where does this leave me with a decision?  I am strongly considering buying the 9.87 system from Voxativ.  The problem is my Constellation Amp/preamp are not well suited so i will need to change to a tube.  I realize these are way over my original budget but the sound is emotional, natural and it sounds like I am listening to the original instruments.  I am going back today to listen to others and see if I can find anything else that moves me more than the Voxativ setup.

I would recommend the Gauder Akustik Berlina RC3, German made and very high quality with superb sound.

Another vote for Vandersteen.  Also, Proac D48r or Tannoy Prestige, i.e., Kensington or used Canterbury.  Best.......

I like the Vandersteen Quatro Ct and the Magnepan 20.7.

Since the Raidho speakers really appealed to you they would most likely be the best speaker for you. In that price range I also like the Acoustic Zen Crescendos as a full range speaker.

Wilson audio duette 2

The thing to remember about room acoustics, is they will outlast  your speakers. :)  Once done right, you may change all sorts of gear, but the acoustics you'll leave alone and never want to let go. :)

Best,


Erik

"I am a relative newb when it comes to this high-end world of audio."

Fix the room first.  Take each system home and compare brands in that room.  You will hear a difference and be able to decide.  Any reputable dealer will allow you to hold a credit card for a few days and let you compare.  

I am not a person with a huge income, but love listening to high end systems and comparing the difference between different levels of cost verses performance.  Everyone hears differently, and there is no "Golden" set of ears that can dictate "The best"   What is boils down to are two things.

1.  The "High End" Audio system is no better than the room you set it up in.  You can have a $30,000 High end audio system in a crummy acoustical room,  and a cheap system in a neutral good room and it will sound better than all that expensive gear.  There is a fine line between how much better a $5,000 system is when compared in the same room to a $10,000 system.  Is it worth the sound difference?  With unlimited funds, why not get the Bugatti. 

2.  What do you like to hear in your music?   It does not matter you impress your buddies, what do you like?   Specifications will not tell you how the system sounds.  Get the detail, impact, sweetness, timber, bass you like.  That is what matters.

in the 15k price range, Id try

jbl m2
jbl s3900 or jbl k2 s9900
revel gems 2 + rel g2 subs or revel studio 2
atc scm45a
harbeth shl5+ with rel g2 subs
focal sopra 2

I would second the Revel Ultima Salon......incredible value though a little hard to drive..shud be no problem driving them with PS audio electronics imo.

rockport atria used might be in the ball park as well though they will not go down as deep as the revels. But incredible speakers nonetheless. I can vouch for them as I currently have the aviors!

i saw a kef blade for 17.5k in audiogon.....another good contender and cutting edge technology 

hope this helps

sujay

While I think you should consider the Wilson Audio Sabrina, there are a LOT of excellent speakers at this price.  The point is that everyone's ears and tastes are different, and you have to find what you like and what works in your environment.  If necessary, considering the amount you're spending, take a trip to somewhere with a lot more options (the Bay area in particular has a TON of HiFi shops).  

I also like to support my local dealer, and I took a quick look and Crescendo in Wheatridge carries Wilson Audio, as well as Harbeth, Dynaudio and Paradigm speakers.  You should look at the web sites of other speakers you're considering to see if there's a local dealer.

Good luck!  Personally, I almost regret being more or less done with my upgrades (only my turntable and phono preamp are left), as I thoroughly enjoy the process of giving serious audition to new equipment.  Now I volunteer to help my friends when they want new equipment, mostly so I can tag along for the auditioning experience.

As someone that seriously got in to audio 3 1/2 years ago, I'd like to offer a perspective that I've found invaluable.  I made quite a few mistakes in my early purchases, especially in speakers, and I have to strongly urge that you either seek out a local shop that will allow you to seriously audition any speakers you're considering or consider internet based speaker companies with generous return policies.  HiFi sound is so subjective that you simply cannot rely on reviews or suggestions from others other than to narrow or expand the models you're considering.

Additionally, don't rely on a relatively brief listening session in an environment that doesn't match where you'll be setting them up, or where the rest of the equipment doesn't match what you'll be playing through them.

As an example, my own decision on my current speakers came after I had settled a couple years ago on B&W 804 Diamond speakers and was contemplating an upgrade to the B&W 803 D3 speakers when they came out last year.  I went to my local dealer that I'd been working with, and listened to them through the same equipment I had at home for about an hour.  My dealer also recommended that I listen to the Wilson Audio Sabrina and I gave them a quick listen as well.  I'd heard Wilson speakers at shows before, and had frankly never been overly impressed with them.

I wasn't ready to make a decision that day, and started thinking about the speakers and doing some independent research.  When I had the funds to make the purchase, I decided I really needed to give the Sabrina a fairer shake, so I arranged for another audition compared to the 803D3.  I brought along a couple of my audio friends, and we spent about three hours with several records I'd brought along (my serious listening is all vinyl), and hooked up to the exact same turntable, cartridge, preamp (with on-board phono preamp) and amplifier.  I was surprised that after 3 hours, I'd come to the conclusion that I overwhelmingly preferred the Sabrina for jazz and classical, and very slightly preferred the 803D3 for rock.

Final step was an in-home audition of the Sabrina.  My room, my exact equipment and my listening habits.  The dealer brought them to me, set them up and left them for a long weekend.  I had to pay about $200 for delivery and pickup, but for $16,000 speakers I considered it money well spent.

There is Gamut M7 for sale on US Audiomart, if anyone is interested.

I'll bet your glad you asked this question. Only 40 or so recommendations to consider. Let us know what you end up with after attending RMAF.

Since subs may not be an option, check out Devore Fidelity. Fantastic speaker, clean sound through and through, well sourced components. 
The silverbacks if you can find a pair frequency response - 21hz -40khz or The gibbon X frequency response - 23hz- 40khz.

I have also heard of Bache Audio. Very impressive, clean sounding.
The 002AB frequency response - 22hz - 40khz

Both within your Budget

Raidho ribbon loudspeakers are great and quite musical but only from the C4.1 Series and D5 are superb!  I have auditioned both of them over the years at Munich Hifi Show as well as many other ultra expensive loudspeakers and finally found a brand of loudspeakers that delivers unbelievable musical performance that US and European manufacturers are usually charges 3-4X the price.  It is Aurum Cantus Genesis top of the line model ($25K New) which also an OEM ribbon drivers for other famous company such as Nola Loudspeakers, Von Schweikert, Evolution Acoustics, Verity Audio, Burmester Audio, Aerial Acoustics, Lawrence Audio etc...I have purchased a pair of AC Genesis after audition them and they are easily on par with the $220K Raidho D5 or even a tad better!!!

http://www.aurumcantus.com/aurumcantu-loudspeaker/loudspeaker_GENESIS.html

https://translate.google.ca/translate?hl=en&sl=zh-TW&u=http://review.u-audio.com.tw/reviewde...

I should clarify... when I mention the GamuT's... I mean the RS series with the "guitar strings" - their design makes a huge improvement over the other GamuT's.  

But... way, way too expensive - you'd never recover the investment, if you ever decide to sell them.  

Regarding the "value proposition" - the Linkwitz LX521's are a "kit," from Madisound, which is a "huge bargain" - not much to recover, if you decide to sell them.  Same for the PureAudio Project speakers.  You'll always be able to find "informed" buyers... eventually.

My Gamut 5s were quite a bit less than $15,000. There are just too many choices at that price. I would go for some main stream speakers at a good price so I could change without a big loss if you change your mind. Most of these I have never heard of even after 50 years in audio. There is a great morality rate in speakers and you may be left with an orphan Once I saw some speakers listed in the Audio equipment issue. They were close so I went past. I did this several times and there was never anyone there.

No question... the one’s that get the best reviews... and the one’s I’d choose in this order are:

1. Linkwitz LX521’s (agree with above post)
2. Linkwitz Orion’s (agree with above post)
3. PureAudio Project’s (probably my first choice)
4. Nola’s
5. Gamut’s
6. Maggies w subs, or bass panels

I’ve got the Orion’s and Maggies - the Orion’s edge them out (greater dynamics and bass). But, I’m likely going to get the PureAudio Project’s, because they’re simpler to drive than the Linkwitz’s - which require an amp for each channel and a ASP or DSP (pretty complicated, but effective).

Most of these are dipole / open baffle speakers - which nothing can match, except possibly other open baffle speakers.

Once you’ve had them, nothing else will suffice.

Unfortunately, the Nola’s and Gamut’s (not open baffle, but incredible) are just too dam’n expensive and don’t sound any better than the other’s mentioned.  But, you might try the Nola Brio Trio - if you must have a "big name" - also, superb sound... and... at a bargain price.

Though... for an average size room... I’d have to admit... the inexpensive WaveTouch Audio GT monitors can pretty well hang with all of these... at a bargain price! Hard to believe, but true (I have them also).

Since you like the Raidho’s Diamond series check out the XT series. Not quite as good as the Diamonds but pretty close. Maybe send a pm to coda audio and ask what models they will be showing since they haven't responded to my question earlier in this thread

Not seen Magnepan mentioned, 20.7s would be well within your price point and are a great value if you can handle their size.

You might want to consider speakers with controlled dispersion, which will reduce (not eliminate) trouble from the low ceiling. I have a basement room of similar dimensions, and Janszen zA2.1 work well there. Other panel speakers could be good. Of course, if that’s not the kind of sound you want, so be it.

I have used a lot of acoustic treatments, too, which helps a lot.

I was thinking of Harbeth 30 or 40 models and tried the M30.1 in my room, which is soundproofed and thus well sealed. The ported bass was uncontrollable in the room, even with extensive bass trapping. Though your room may be less sound-tight than mine, you still may have some walls backed up by the foundation. That may affect your ultimate choice of speaker, and you may need to use some equalization to get reasonably even bass.
 

Harbeth Monitor 40.2. Just bought a pair new under $15,000. I have purchased lots of new gear over the years and this is the best and most easily noticeable upgrade I have ever acquired. They are not sexy looking like some of the trendy stuff...these are all about the sound and representing the music as it was recorded. Voiced for vocals and easy to listen to. Definitely my last speaker purchase.

Take stake a listen to the Spendor D9... (Or D7 for that matter.)  Listen to the MAGICO s3 or s5 . Listen to Avalon diamonds ( purchase pre owned if possible) . When all is set an done... By a pair of back up  or reference checks; quad 63 or Spendor BC1 for midrange) As an audiophile you will probably be changing speakers throughout your journeys. As a music lover, the last two speakers may ultimately be with you till the end!!

Bowers & Wilkins 802 Diamonds...
Enjoy!

QUAD  ESL-2912 + as many KEF sub woofers as you room needs.

I went to the Newport Beach Audio show in June and the best speakers I heard were the Raidho and Nola's so it is interesting that you have picked those speakers out as your favorites.  Unfortunately, the speakers they had on display were beyond my budget.  If you have the money to get either of those speakers you will be super happy.  I ended up buying a used pair of 4 month old Wilson Audio Duette 2's.  One other speaker I liked was the Magnepan 3.7i.  Great value and very musical.  I heard at least 60 different speakers at the Newport show.  They all sounded pretty amazing.  

My room dimensions cause great limitation also. 10 x 24 x 7' high. I have a pair of Used demo YG Carmel for $7500. $18,000 msrp. Handle any kind of room acoustic problems. Most resolving revealing speaker I have ever owned. 2 way aluminum closed cabinet. They have no mercy for mediocre recording quality though. The rest of my system is price matched with the msrp. Including cables. Check them out.

If you want a set of speakers you'll never want to replace AND be well under your budget, build yourself a set of Linkwitz LX521 or the Linkwitz Orion.  If you don't feel like it, even within your budget, you can get them delivered to your doorstep well within your price range.

http://www.linkwitzlab.com/LX521/LX521_4.htm

http://www.theorionspeakers.com/

There's no shortage of monkey coffins out there costing $15k, $25k and $50k.  Or you can build your own for under $5k and get something at least as good and probably better.

Add the Magico S5 to your short list.

Gamut M7

That's a strange approach by the Wilson representative.
Good modern solid state amps should work reasonably well with many speakers, so it's unlikely that you will end up with a bad match. It just might be the difference between an acceptable match and excellent match.

No, I live in Denver bache.  I will seek out listening sessions in October at RMAF and make a decision.

inna, I am sure you didn't intend to make me out to be an A$$  by buying my amp and preamp in advance of my speakers.  I actually recall a conversation with the rep at Wilson Audio at RMAF and he recommended buying the amp/preamp BEFORE the speakers.  I know, what an idiot.  Anyway, I will continue on to stumble forward in my stupidity and hopefully end up with something that my dumb fuc$ ears and brain will like.

If you  close to NYC try Bache audio

Yes, I meant mostly the turntable.
You need to listen to speakers in your room or at the very least in a well set-up dealer's room. $15k is enough to get excellent speakers even new let alone used. Some high end speaker manufacturers now have the cabinets and perhaps some other parts made in China. Do you want it? Ask them, anyway. What if the speakers that you like most don't work well with the amps that you already have? Cables matter too, big time. You can get lucky with this speakers last approach, but it's very tricky. I would never do it. Well..since I want Lamm amps I actually might, but it would be a pain. As I understand it, you don't care whether it is Constellation or something else.
As a very general direction - if the speakers look pretty they are either very expensive or not good enough. Most great speakers are quite ugly.
I'll add two names to your list without knowing your amps and taste: Kharma and Dynaudio.

inna, as I stated in my original post I heard Raidho with Constellation at RMAF and that was what I was planning to buy and still may do so unless I hear something else that wows me more in October at RMAF.  I delayed the speaker purchase because of a much higher than expected bid on a home renovation, also stated in first post.  Not sure what you mean by "source is weak".  The turntable was purchased many years ago and is not a long-term solution.  I also don't listen to a ton of cd's, however, I read very good reviews about the Oppo.  The PS Dac for streaming is considered one of the best on the market, in some people's views and that is what I use most often.  Ultimately I would like to upgrade the TT but that is going to be after the speakers.

Lastly, yes, there are many speakers in this price range.  That is what makes it so difficult to choose.  The reason I posted was for some advice on speaker recommendations to narrow down my search since I don't have unlimited time to search.  My plan is to attend RMAF and seek out a dozen or so suggested speakers and make an educated decision.