I read a review by What HiFi magazine of the B&W 805Ds and although they liked them a lot, they felt they did not have the pace, rhythm and timing or they said something to that effect. I've not heard them and have heard the older Matrix 805s with tube gear years ago and liked them a lot, but they need to be played somewhat loud to get going, and I generally play music at more modest levels and with lower powered equipment. But I too am tempted to get the 805Ds. I may instead get something like the Spendor SA1s or Reference 3A mm deCapo i's. |
both great speakers but you are comparing apples and oranges. That being said a great review article would be the new mini monitors b&w 805, focal diable, raidho c1.1, magico q1, As good as the B&W is (i own 800D) the magico cabinet and drivers are state ot the art and is a speaker I could consider replacing my floorstander with. As well the equipment you would need or use properly with these 2 quite different producte is significant. |
Mr. EELLII08- i was merely speculating about a tower-style system (like the MM3's by evolution acoustics for ex.) with B&W drivers, perhaps even 2 x 12" woofers
instead of 10's, perhaps even self-powered, etc. that would be one heck of a cool project for them to try. they certainly have the facilities and the expertise to make speakers that can throw a really large image into a good-sized room. AND the price could probably be "a little" more reasonable than Kharma or Magico, Wilson, etc.
Even so, i do believe the 805D2 speakers, while also not inexpensive, can make a lot happen on the other end of the size/cost spectrum.
look, once upon a time i had a pair of used ADS L-15/90-II speakers ($1200!) with two 10" woofers, a mid and a tweeter/side that sounded really terrific.
and the beat goes on....
P.S.- Mr. Usermanual, no problem, just recovering from the attacks further up the list
of comments regarding the degree of difference between the Magico Q1's and the B&W 805's. |
Could not agree more French_fries.
Does B&W have new drivers coming out or you mean the ones currently going into the 800Di? |
French_fries - It is just semantics. Passive-aggressive style ("Do not want to offend anyone, BUT..."), very American dare say, is just as offensive to me, as mortal combat to you. What is nice here on-line, is that you get to ignore posts/people, or not, at your own will. Having it both way, will be difficult. I have no valid information nor an opinion on the B&W/Q1 question. However, I do about the TAD vs. Magico, and since it was brought up, in a condescending manners and out of context, I felt I had something to say, gloves-on. Sorry if the style offended you, but as I said, please feel free to ignore me, none of it is worth getting upset over. |
some people want to do battle and others like to talk about their experiences with stereo equipment and recordings they like to listen to, or concerts they enjoyed attending. for those more interested in mortal combat i suggest karate lessons;
for those who had a great time at a store or someone's home listening to music
i would love to hear what you experienced. most if not all of this equipment is (ridiculously) expensive, but it can also take you much closer to what you heard when the performance was live.
that magical experience should not be downgraded by anyone even if they're
experts at speaker/component/wire design. SHARE information, don't beat me down over it. Over and Out. |
Eelii08 - I thought I am the one who should get a life. You seem to have a talent to contradict yourself, at least once, in every sentence you write. You advise all to avoid me, yet you keep mentioning my name, and in the wrong connotation as well. I have not mentioned the word B&W even once in the entire thread here. Based on your replies and rants, it is clear you have not even read my posts, and if all you can shout is "you have an agenda", I would say; who doesn't? If I am not mistaken, this post is about Magico/B&W, why are we talking about TAD? I am not the one who brought them up. Regardless, all my points are still valid. As I said, I backed them up with both independent measurements and photos (Taken by TAD themselves, BTW). My opinions, and yours, do not matter without them. You can learn from what I presented, but instead you choose to stay uninformed, and personally attack me, the messenger. As I said, whatever you accept reality or not, is beyond my control. Please try to be more coherent and objective in your replies. You surly like to get my reaction here, but this is becoming a bore. |
i forgot to mention the time i auditioned the Matrix-800 speakers. not only did they sound like a million bucks, they looked like a truly exotic best-we-know-how-to-make reference. they didn't sound as good as the $100K Wilson WAMM system on the other side of the room, but they still possessed many of the same qualities- only on a smaller scale. if you could afford the kind of gear and wire to get the most out of them (and a good-sized listening space) you could have an amazing experience every night for many years to come.
strange how a lot of super-speakers today bear a similar design to the Matrix-800's. maybe B&W should think about revisiting that approach with their newest drivers. that might make a bunch of folks want to hear them BEFORE making any final decisions about making a purchase. the "snails" are gorgeous speakers but probably very expensive to manufacture. (OTOH i would love to hear the present incarnation under better circumstances.) |
French_fries, I did not like the fact that you started a thread asking for opinions in good faith, which is what it all should be about, and you were forced to leave to avoid being attacked. That is why I jumped in giving my opinion. if you look at the different posts in this site of Usermanual, it is clear he has an agenda.
He looks for Magico threads, or threads of the type, best speakers of... And writes saying they are the best regardless of the model or anything else, and attacks systematically anyone who says not to like Magico, regardless of the gear he likes or owns. Just look at his posts and that will be enough to see he has no credibility. Either he has an agenda and a clear economic interest, or a Magico mental disorder....
if you do not want to get into a personal discussion, just to ignore him if he writes.you now where he is going to be coming from and going to.
Getting into music, yes I agree. B&W are good speakers, and specially in terms of price/performance. i have lisent the snails several times and they are very good indeed. If it wasnt for the mess of all the amps you need to drive them they would have been a speaker to consider in my case. They been around for many years, so they most be doing something right. |
I LIKE B&W SPEAKERS. my 801's (as well as the 802's) were amazingly good in their day (and can still be modified and improved). i heard the Nautilus snails at a Stereophile show and was very impressed (although the presentation was very brief). but they were pretty special (and still are). the silver signatures were some of the best monitor speakers i ever heard. i couldn't get too excited when the Nautilus line came out (1st generation) but i never got to hear the diamond V1 or now the V2's, but i have heard good things about them from people who have no economic interest in telling me they were very good. the build quality has never been an issue either- the cabinetry is as smooth as a babies' "ear".
if you "detest" them, you have an agenda.
i would love to audition the Magico's someday. but they will have to be
full range to be worth spending money on. |
Manual, see, until your last post I was not. Your opinion about this or that speaker is just that and is fine with me, even though some of the things you say are simply not true (giving you the benefit of the doubt, let assume due to pure ignorance). And so I argue otherwise. But that is ok too, although of very little use. But if you take it personal, That I dont like.
since you dont seem to listen much... And you read a lot, or so you say, you should get better at it... PeterAyer owns a magico pair... He just wrote. i would assume he likes Magico.
an opinion on speakers based in measurements and photos you say you have? Pathetic... Not to mention measurments and photos done by someone else.
I see you think you know me very well. but we have never met, speak.. So once more you just read a few words and you know it all (but now on a personal level) So is this a general attitude in life you have and not only in audio?
This is the first time I have ever gotten in such a situation with another poster here or in any other forum. Not your case I see.... If you like to take it personal, look for your next Magico thread and go get personal and bother someone else. You seem to have lot of experience at it. With me you are done, I cry.
Get a life... Or a pair of speakers you like enough to actualy listen and do more lof that and less reading
Bye now. |
Peterayer - "Manual's opinion of the TAD speakers is clearly in the minority."
So is yours on the Magico. So what?
I have an opinion that I backed up with both measurements and photos. Whatever people accept reality or not, is beyond my control. |
Eelii08 - Sound to me like you are offended. Next time before you jump in with statements like "Do not want to offend anyone" (or accuse someone of lying, just because he does not agree with your views), think about all those you may offend. I myself, don't really mind. But don't come crying when someone disagree with you, especially if he presents you with simple facts, like measurements and photos. I post mainly when "love and thoughtful" guys like you show up. Unfortunately, it is usually on a Magico topic. Now, lets move on, unless you wish to continue debating facts, not fictions. |
I heard both the TAD CR1 and R1 at Rocky Mountain in 2010 with the Walker turntable and Technical Brain electronics. Outstanding. Actually, I think the CR1 sounded better because of the room sizes. I own the Magico Mini 2 and though the bass does not go as deep, it is different because of the sealed design. The Magico is also less expensive, but if I could afford the TAD, it would be on my short list for sure. They are great looking also, IMO.
Manual's opinion of the TAD speakers is clearly in the minority. |
Manual, looking at your posts, are you a magico dealer, associate or similar, or have any financial interest on it? You only seem to post on magico threads or magico related, and in common always all magico are great and all the rest is bad....¿? |
I just started a post for TAD speakers owners. We can take it there if you want. so far there are 0 posts...
But if it is going to be to write non sense, it was not really the intention of the if manual you feel TAD has no deep bass you either have to listen again, or get your ears checked. CR1 goes down to almost 30 although then it drops death. And the R1 have not done the test but bass is very very very deep.... And controlled as well. Quite something
Also to call these speakers colored, has me wondering what have you listened to. You may like or not the sound, presentation etc, but it is a fact these sepakers (the 3 of them) are not colored at all. Most neutral and accurate in tone I have heard ( again the 3 of them each in its range).
Your comments about deep bass and color, plus quality of materials/components, where per instnace, the concentric mid/tweeter Be drive both reference share, may be one of the most cost expensive out there really has me very surprised and wondering... |
Very cool, it seems that the three of us, i.e. me, Usermanual and Eelii08, are online lurking on audiogon.
While this thread has run its course, and thus it is less important that we are off topic, it might be better to continue this discussion on a different thread, i.e. one about TAD speakers/electronics. Other might be interest in the topic. There is not a lot of information about TAD on internet (or at least I did not find much).
Regarding TAD speakers being played loud at shows, it is certainly not my experience. But I have only heard them at two shows. Last time, at Munich 2012, the Evolution one was playing and to me they produced the second best sound in that day (only the 87 years old horn played by Salbatone Acoustics bettered them). The volume was certainly moderate (I typically listen at 60-70 db) and I do not like loud rooms. The sound was very well balanced top to bottom, detailed but warm and full, certainly not forward thin and/or bright.
Usermanual, I hope I do/did not give you the impression I am debating your comments. Just relating my experience.
|
Nvp, no there is not an older version of the CR1. There was a prototype running around for a few years, but never went into production. Was work in progress for the final CR1,
I do agree with prices, but that is unfortunately a widely industry spread issue and not of one brand or the other. Is funny (not at all) how a manufacturer releases a unit, gets brave reviews either from users at shows or wherever or from the JA and JVs of this world... and after a year they raise an already unsane price level by no less than 20 to 30 per cent. That is common practice now, and in my opinion a very poor practice that shows no respect for clients. But anyway.
Yes the CR1 are very very expensive even more for a monitor, but they are not really your typical monitor soundwise. While not a big speaker, they produce bigger! sound than others floorstanders I listened to costing more while doing all the good things a monitor does and then some. But yes, for 40k euro, they could have at least the (decency?) to include the stands... |
Nvp-
Never said they were bad and indeed they do well at shows, especially since Andrew plays them so loud, you cannot really hear what they are all about. I just find them rather hi-fi sounding in the long run. The grain in the treble is untamable and what comes across as details in shows, turns out to be coloration that I could not bear. Also, there is no low bass whatsoever with both of these speakers. It is unfortunate that many people confuse mid bass hump with low bass.
BTW, if you look at their XO board, which they advertise, strangely, you would be dismay at the part quality they use. If there are more than couple bucks spent on these parts, I would be shocked: (http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?6368-Reviews-of-the-TAD-Compact-Reference-1). Even B&W cheaper models are more "invested" then these. That was not the case with the original concept. TAD/Pioneer has really played a number on us, poor audiofooles.
Yes, there was an older version of the monitor. |
Thanks a lot NVP. It has been over a year of listening to many and trying. I really like them and I am enjoying very much. Out of the ones I tried, they are the best sounding to me, and not by a small margin. Yes I have to update. That system is totaly changed now from source to boxes. Will try to find the time.
That is my experience with the 800 di as well and I am very familiar with them. Excellent value. Yes there are better things but you will have to pay a lot more. If my budget was in the 20k € area, I would buy them again everyday. You can buy for that money boxes that do this or that better, but on an overall picture, considering all factors they are the best I know at that price level. I think one problem of some is people tend to drive them with not the best power. They are big with 2X10 in and require lots of power and high current top amps to get that bass controlled.
I also think the Q1 will be better in absolute terms than 805 di, but not in all aspects, and not sure in relative terms either (cost factored, although that is very personal). But in this case I do have to admit my opinion is just that and of not much value since I have not heard them and it is only based on the sound of other models of the brand.
(is good to speak based in real personal experience and first hand knowledge, and if not and just guessing to do the propper disclaimer to help others. If we all did the same this place would be much more informative, and not the playground of kids beting on who can pee longer that sometimes seems. Lots of fun in any case)) |
Have you listened to other speakers for your own evaluation?? Magnepan, Vandersteen, Tannoy -- these are MY personal favorites, but you have to know YOUR sensibilities. Isn't it interesting that the 3 speakers I mentioned as MY favorites, all sound different from each other...yet...there they are. |
Usermanual, I have never heard TAD systems sounding bad (unlike other brands/systems stratospherically priced). In fact, whenever I heard TAD system they where always the best in the show (IMO of course). However, we all hear differently and have different preferences when it comes to sound. Also, I would take with a grain of salt everything that JA and/or Stereophile says/writes. Placebo effects are actually running this industry. (If one magazine writes something, then one can be sure there will at least 100 people hearing that something).
Regarding TAD prices, indeed they are very hard to swallow. I remember reading somewhere on a forum a comment by somebody who was wondering whether TAD is selling their electronics or only showing them. While a funny comment, it seems to not be very far form the truth - the TAD importer in the TAD room at Munich 2012 told me that all of his clients are form Russian.
Finally, is there also an older version of the CR-1 monitor? At 40k euros here in Europe, they are certainly out of my budget. |
I agree 100% with Eelii08, the B&W 800 diamond are a very good value indeed. Firstly, their price is more than reasonable. For example, in Belgium and The Netherlands their retail price is 22k euros per pair, but because most hi-fi shops here sell B&W they can be had for 18-20k euros (i.e. with a 10-20% discount). In Gemany the prices are probably even lower. Secondly, they are very good speakers which when set up right and partnered with adequate electronics will have no problem to compete with much more expensive speakers. I have seen/hear the B&W 800 diamond driven by Accuphase electronics (not top of the line models!) easily outperforming a twice as expensive system from Gryphon and a similarly priced MBL system.
Unfortunately for B&W, this is the case only for the 800 diamond model, i.e. the rest of the models in the 800 diamond series are easily outperformed by similarly priced speakers of the competition. The Q1 may be overpriced, but should have no problem to outclass the 805 diamond. This is the point I made also in my previous post here.
Eelii08 you need to update the pictures on you system page. The TAD speakers are very special indeed. Congratulation! |
Same applies to the R1 vs. the MUCH better, and cheaper Model 1. Here is a link to the original:
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/Speakers/TAD+Speakers/TAD-Model+1
and yes, I do believe what I read, especially when it comes to JA measurements. Since my hearing experiences with these loudspeakers, correlate to their measurements, I would have to conclude that there is some "wishful hearing" done here on your part, not mine... |
You ve got to love this place!
I dont own the CR1 so why would you offend me? And even if I did, they are one of the best speakers I have listened to, and to my taste better than the Q5, so you would not either way.
In general, This hoby is just like real life. Worst thing is when people speak with no knowledge or first hand experience (which of course takes time and effort to get), but just based on what they are told or what they imagine based on who knows what they have in their mind... and still make such strong claims as if they were in posession of the only truth. When if fact most of the times, they have no clue of what they are talking about.,
And In particular, when it comes to your post, the CR1s is a new design that came out in 2010, entirely designed from zero by Andrew Jones. So don't know what you are talking about regarding a CR1 10 years ago, and I doubt you do either..
I had it in my system for quite a while as a trail, and I can tell you they are superb. Also they were flat at 40 and went down to 32 very decently, which for a monitor is quite something... but I guess you won't know that. Oh yes you do. You read it...
Anyway, I do think the Q5 is a good speaker but it has cons like any other design. You eventualy will have to admit it and live with it..., and if you don't, just think it is only my opinion and my taste, and live happy with the thought that finally someone managed to manufacture the perfect box and the absolute best speaker of all times.
Actually I considered it for a while, and was close to goiing for it. Q5 is, as I said very rich and accurate in tone, detailed, what they call now transparent and neutral... but then I found something, that after listening and not just reading (this is important my friend when audio is what we talk about) thought it was better.
So again ,no you did not offend me. i just think you have not listen to the CR1 or if you had, you heard but did not want to listen, or lastly, yes your taste is very different to mine. Although since we both seem to like the Q5 I doubt it is the later.... |
Eelii08 - " Do not want to offend anyone"
Whenever someone starts like that, you know where this is going... So here you go;
Look at the CR1 measurements in SP. These speakers, have no bass below 40Hz whatsoever. They also have quite a nasty upper treble grain, which is imposable to get rid of. Audible, and apparently measurable as well (Look at the 6K and up). So if that is what you like, then yes, the Q5 is not for you.
When they came out, about 10 years ago, there were built much better, and cost $14K. It was a pretty good speaker back then.
Hope I did not offend you (-: |
Do not want to offend anyone. Just read whole post before jumping. But I dont get it. Dont get this B&W bad feeling among many, supposed to be, higher end aficionados... After having owned them and per instance having listened to the Q5s and other for long periods.
I own TAD R1 now, and before buying them I listend to Magico Q5, TAD CR1 among many other highLy regarded. The speakers I replaced were B&W 800 Di. (so not biased towards any of them anymore), and actually felt the 800s could clearly be improvedi to be in line with rest of my system. So not saying B&W is the best out there... At all. BUT,
Where the Q5s better than the 800s. Overall yes, for sure, but not in every aspect. They lacked the dynamcis, punch and bass extension of the 800s... Although were better in transparency focus and definition, still the 800s sound had something... The others did not. While I would preffer the Q5s if I had to choose, in a price/performance relation, the election is not so clear. I think the 800s are great value. Hard to find something much better overall for the price or even slightly more.
Now the Magico thing is getting a bit boring in my opinion. They are great in some aspects, but by no means the best speaker or game changer at all to my ears (I actually considered buying them and was close, but being aware of their pros and cons, which you get of those as well). .Actually the TAD CR1 monitors were better ALL AROUND when compared to the Q5s. And that includes bass extension, definition, trnasparency, tonal richness and neutrality... To my ears.
I cant imagine how the Q1s may have such great bass at all considering what the Q5s did. I do think they will be very transparent, accurate, neutral and so on, but with limitations that has to be evident also in dynamics and scale.
Now the 805di I have not heard them. i do have a pair of the older 805 as rears for my HT set up. I listened to them in stereo a few times. I think they are very good, moreover for the money, period. If I had to guess, then Q1 will be far more resolving and neutral. You will get much more inner detial, but when it comes to bass extension (not accuracy) and dynamics, I would not bet on it... It then will come down to what one values most, and actually how he/she percieves value. Personally IfmI had to guessmInthink I would preffermthe Q1s but can see others not havingnsuch an electionmso clrearmifmyoumfactor in everything. |
I have the 805 Nautilus and recently owned the SF Cremona Auditor M. I really tried to like them but stayed with the B&Ws because I connected with them better. My preference is forward soundstaging, bright and sparkly treble. I can only imagine the 805D would be very nice too.
Regarding the other elements presented in this thread, I think it is sad that people tend to talk in near absolutes regarding something that is really a hobby we are all here to enjoy. |
805 Diamonds were the finest bookshelves I ever heard. They sound a LOT better than Wilson Duettes and Sonus Faber Cremona Auditors though the systems and the rooms were different. The 805 Diamonds played with Luxman tube integrated. |
Mpit: you are absolutely right! I don't care how they buy themselves into studios etc. or Magazines ;-).....you really cannot take them seriously |
Funny...and beware this could be a commercial.
Back a few years ago, I took my LSA Standard Bookshelf design into a dealer who sold B&W...(which I find hopelessly colored) and did an A/B comparison.
The patrons of the store were shocked...'shocked I tell you', (think Music Man...sorry, I have ADHD).
Anyway...the questions were...'How at $1K is your speaker better than the 805?'
I was a little more abrupt...'How could B&W, build a speaker that 'sounds like that' at virtually ANY price?'
They have disqualifying colorations which I find a-musical AND annoying.
It's mystifying to me, but true.
Advertising..I suppose it pays big dividends--this would be proof.
Larry |
The day I audition the new Magico Q series I also listened to offerings from B&W as this dealer has both.I told the dealer "I dont get it,whats with this following of B&W"?.He stated this (lauging and shrugging his shoulders)."People want what they want,they come in and request B&W without listening to anything or allowing me to do my job,I just keep my mouth shut and sell em what they want".."but if a guy like you comes in and really wants to hear what its all about we listen to the Magicos"
Mpit ...be careful stating "your opinion" about B&W on this site,the devoted dont take kindly to it,lol |
Comparing B&W to Magico or Wilson is just plain dumb. B&W is the speaker equivalent to junk food. Tempting to look at but empty calories. Sorry but sometimes the truth hurts. B&W's look good but when compared to other speakers in the same price range they suck hind tit. |
The 800 Diamond Series is made in UK. |
Missioncoonery
I had no idea the 805D was made in China.This is just typical of so many manufacturers. |
Im now reading most of the B&W line is made in China,lol...One more reason to scratch em off the list!!! |
French_fries,
Magnamupi205 answered your original question with his ranking of monitor
speakers. This list is based on his own listening experiences with the speakers.
The Q1 came out on top with the B&W quite a few places down.
I'm sure others might have different opinions, but I haven't read any responses
from anyone else who has heard both of these speakers and ranked them. |
I have to take Missioncoonery side here.
Just to put things in perspective French_fries, if you would go to say 10 dealers and tell them this story most likely all of them will demo for you the B&Ws with decent electronics but not the Q1s and their top of the line electronics. At least some of them will justify this by telling you that you are not determined/motivated enough.
Secondly, none of the various iteration of the 805 B&W monitors have ever been considered SOTA monitors. While all these B&Ws monitors were good speakers, they were often outclass by similarly priced monitors from Dynaudio, Focal, etc. Sometimes not even by the top of the line monitors of the competition! Consequently, I see no reason why suddenly this new 805 iteration will be a SOTA monitor and will be able to compete with monitors costing 5 times more.
I understand your "dilemma", we all have similar thoughts (we all know that many of these hi-fi toys are extremely overprices). However, I do not understand why would you attack someone who has just stated the obvious, i.e. Missioncoonery. |
Peter, in order of preference.
The Fritz Rev 5s really were punching way above there weight class in Vegas. Had heard the Carbon 7 several times before and thought is was pretty good. The Rev 5 has much more detail with slightly less lower end.
There is always the Harbeth 7s, but they tend not to rock very well. |
Magnumpi,
Thanks for the information. Is you list written in order of preference? If so, yours would seem to be one answer to the OP. |
Peter,
You can add the Studio Electric Monitors to that list right after the Fritz speakers.
Had a long listening session at the Burlingame Show with the Q1s. They have a new tweeter, it seems even smoother and more involving than other Magicos. You could listen to them forever.
For some reason the Evolution speakers didn't stand out to me as the other speakers on the list do.
I think the real sleepers are the Fritz Rev 5s, not far from the Q1s in performance. |
Magmumpi205,
That is a nice list of speakers. Do you care to elaborate? I'd be interested in reading your impressions of the Q1 vs. the Mini II in particular, but also some thoughts on the others.
Have you ever heard the Evolution Acoustics MMOne? It has received some good show reports and is supposed to be a great value. |
Missionloonery, wow, you must have sat up all nite thinking up that last post...LOL |
Good small speakers I have heard lately:
Magico Q1
Joseph Pulsar
Magico Mini II
Fritz Rev 5
Fritz Carbon 7
Sjofn Clue
Spendor SA1
B&W 805D
Audience 1
Silverline Minuet Supreme |
Jdec ..and proud of it!!! |
French_fries, don't take Missioncoomery's comments seriously. He's known here only for being a b&w basher. |
Well, at least you've learned there's very little of value here. Most people take a long time to figure that out. |
Dear Difficult M-coonery,
i asked for opinions regarding how both speaker systems sounded being that both absolutely represent the high end. the B&W's in no way are "SUBARU'S"; THEY are perhaps better described as Audi's (vs Bentley's). with your eyes closed you might be able to tell the difference riding in the back, but perhaps not.
but since you NOW tell us that you DID get to compare BOTH speakers, and under almost ideal conditions. so what have we learned so far from your contributions to this thread? other than your "how can you compare a very expensive speaker to a less-expensive (actually you stated an "entry-level") speaker i am no better informed now than i was before.
the POINT i was trying to make is that both speakers are very, very good, and both could be expected to play music with excellent results. i am not a LOVER of B&W or MAGICO; i don't have a preference. but with the refinement that B&W has attained over a LOT of years of tweaking their designs, and the perfectionist philosophy of Magico's designer (as well as D.Wilson, Kharma, S.Faber, Focal, MBL, Burmeister, you get the point yet?) what is the practical as well as the aesthetic result SEPARATE FROM the MSRP? let us assume you don't KNOW which speaker costs more, as well as how much more- what would several music lovers conclude from a comparison of the two?
if one is clearly better every time, how MUCH better an improvement does it represent?
i don't know any other way of trying to OPEN UP a discussion amongst real folks (and not just what i read in a magazine) in finding out more about a subject which has piqued my curiosity for some time now. but if i am annoying or offending the very person(s) who might actually provide some answers then i guess i'll just shut-up and "be done with it".
BTW, Great Forum- keep up the good work guys... |
I own the Magico Mini II. Though I haven't heard the Q1 yet, I've read it is even
better. Less cabinet noise, more extended high and low. I listened to a few
speakers, both full range and more limited, and given my room and appreciation
for what these Minis do, I decided it was worth the cost. They are remarkable
sounding.
I've heard some of the larger B&Ws, but not the 805D2. I prefer the coherence,
clarity, neutrality and naturalness of the Magicos. The bass, too, is quite
outstanding, if not the most extended. Though the bass of my Minis does sound
deeper, and more natural than the bass of the larger B&Ws that I've heard.
IMO, with the Magicos, one is paying for very good, inert cabinets, proprietary
driver and crossover technology, lots of R&D and lots of marketing. I love the
sound, but clearly, it's not for everyone. And the question of value is extremely
subjective. |
Missioncoonery, Since you got to listen to both in the same dealer on the same day your observations may be more relevent. Was the comparison in the same room with the same gear? |
