@twb2 - thanks for providing the FAQ. Unfortunately, it doesn't quite do what I said. It will only play songs similar to the artist chosen when Roon radio started. It even says "Playing music similar to..." There's no way to choose a wide range of music types that can be done in Deezer, Spotify and GPM.
Why would I need Roon?
I have a Blue sound streamer with plenty of files at my fingertips, via a hard drive plugged in the back and multiple streaming services. Can someone help me understand what Roon would add to my set-up? Thanks.
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FAQ: What's Radio and how does it work?
Designed from the ground up with machine learning technology, Roon Radio can play a mix of your favorites along with music from beyond your library, using the vast catalog of music from TIDAL and Qobuz. Roon Radio makes recommendations based on not only your own music preferences but also those of other Roon subscribers with similar tastes in music. Use the thumbs up and down buttons to craft a personal, one-of-a-kind radio experience. As you listen to and interact with Roon Radio over time, it learns more about what you like and helps you discover new music by curating great recommendations. How do I start playing Roon Radio?You can choose to start Roon Radio any time by navigating to an Artist, Album, or Track and choosing the Roon Radio playback option. Roon Radio uses this initial selection to queue up similar tracks. By default, Roon Radio will also start once your current queued content has finished playing. This can be seen on the Queue screen, and you can turn this feature on and off from there. How do I customize my Roon Radio queue?Once Roon Radio has started, you can head over to the Queue to view upcoming track selections. If you see something you like, give it a thumbs up to add the track to the queue. Clicking thumbs down will skip that track and generate another recommendation, but you don't have to make any selection if you don’t want to --- once the current track has finished the next selection will start playing automatically. When you skip a track, you can optionally choose why you decided to skip the selection. This data will help us improve Roon Radio over time as more data is gathered. Upcoming track information will also be displayed in a pop-up toward the end of the current track. You can disable this notification by going to Settings | Setup | Enable Roon Radio Notification. Roon Radio FAQsCan I set quality requirements for Roon Radio selections?For a given track, there may be many different versions, including different sample rates, between what is available in your local library, TIDAL, and Qobuz. Our selections are based on what version is the most popular, even if there are potentially versions with a higher sample rate available. At this time that is not something that can be changed. Can I set Roon Radio to only pick tracks from my library?Yes. On the Queue screen choose the 3 dots option and select Limit Roon Radio to Library. Can I filter out tracks with explicit lyrics?You can filter out explicit content by going to the Queue screen and choosing Filter Explicit Content in Roon Radio from the 3 dots menu. Please note that, while we do our best to filter out all explicit lyrics, the quality of this data is highly variable and we might not always know if a given track is explicit. What if I don't have TIDAL or Qobuz?If you don't have a streaming service connected in Roon you can still use Roon Radio. In this case, Roon Radio will be limited to your local library and does not take advantage of our machine learning technology. We recommend using TIDAL or Qobuz for the best Roon Radio experience. All this and more can be found here:https://kb.roonlabs.com/Roon_User_Guide#Browsing_and_Playing_Music |
There are numerous ease of use reasons to use Roon. SQ is at least as good if not better than other choices, but the major benefits are best understood by the true Music Lover, rather than the pure audiophile. Artist's bios, album essays, photos, lyrics, and links to other artists etc make Roon a wealth of information and an extremely rich experience for those who care about such things! Used in conjunction with Qobuz and/or Tidal etc. make the search feature extremely rewarding. Roon Radio is a constant source for discovery of new music. |
I agree that Spotify offers a better UI than Tidal and Qobuz. Since I can't access my Roon library from my phone, I usually use Spotify with Apple Carplay in the car. I also find it good for finding new music, although Roon Radio has gotten extremely good at recommending new content. I think Spotify's search is better than Roon. If I see a recommendation for a song that doesn't include the album information, it's often a lot easier to figure out what album it is on using Spotify than Roon. If Spotify offered uncompressed CD quality (let along hi-rez), it would be a lot closer to meeting my needs. But the ability to create a combined library between my ripped CDs, downloaded hi-rez files, Tidal, and Qobuz, makes Roon the clear winner for me. The ability control multiple zones and have them synchronized when I'm playing the same content is also a big plus, as is having DSP functionality (upsampling and EQ when needed). |
Interestingly, I find Roon's UI was the major issue. I get all of those things with Spotify Premium in a much better and easier way across all my devices. Tidal, Qubuz etc do not come anywhere close to Spotify Connect. As for music quality, nothing will change the original source. AudioNirvana helped a bit, but again, clunky UI across devices. Spotify has incredible depth of music for those who listen to a range of music, including Scandinavian, African, old jazz, etc. Tidal is around 90%, Apple Music around 95%, and Qubuz and Amazon around 80% of my playlists. |
It could be because I’ve assembled computers and installed OS’s that roon seems very simple to me. When I say roon sounds better to me than other player software it’s a purely subjective opinion, I’ve never done a blind listening test. I think the main reason I feel it sounds better on Roon’s OS, ROCK is it doesn’t interfere with updates and running other processes in the background. Music not suddenly stopping for some unknown reason. ROCK is an extremely small linux OS designed by Roon specifically optimized for Roon playback. I assembled a NUC for about $600 installed Roon core and connected it to my network. I assembled a raspberry pi4 running Ropiee which also uses Roons transport protocol RAAT as a bridge and connected that to my network and to my DAC by USB. This all took about an hour and I was playing music. I also connected my ripped Flac files by USB to the NUC. I don’t really use a "dedicated " streamer, roon’s core/server acts as the streamer. If I wanted I could attach the NUC directly to my DAC and forgo the raspberry pi4. |
OP - I think you're feeling of frustration that some people have with Roon. You don't just use it - there are many steps to get it right. Some say it is worth it some say it isn't. The raspberry pi solution is a pretty cheap ($50) and easy way to try it out. I play with Roon once in a while but for listening, I don't use it often. |
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@soundchsr OP - I believe you can run Roon on your PC and then use the Node2i as the endpoint. That way the PC does all the work but the endpoint is away from the noise of the PC so it should sound better (in theory, according to Roon). I have a friend that does that. He uses a fanless linux computers, built with a kit and very simply; one stores and processes the files then they're sent via an optical cable to another computer that serves them up to his system. It's pretty amazing. I've just put a system together, so I may be exhausted and will come back to this, but in my present state of mind, the notion of having another processing unit in addition to the Bluesound Node makes me think that I just bought the wrong streamer. I mean, how complex does it have to be to serve up a digital file? I bet I change my mind after a while, but for now, it feels like a lot. |
I am using a Bryston BDP-2 as a Roon endpoint, connected to my Roon ROCK via ethernet (with an EtherRegen in between), and AES/EBU connection to my Denafrips Terminator. I did not hear a difference between Roon and Manic Moose, but far prefer Roon for all the reasons mentioned above (UI, library integration, multi-zone support, DSP processing). The Denafrips Terminator buffers and reclocks the digital data, even when using an interface with timing signals (like AES/EBU and SPDIF), so perhaps this is why I'm not hearing a difference. |
@barts Like you, I also have the Bryston BDP 3.0 / BDA 3.0 set up - and find the convenience and sound quality amazing - using the Bryston Manic Moose software. And... like you... I do not understand how the BDP software can affect the sound quality in any manner. So... I’m also very curious... as to how Roon, or any other BDP software, can have an effect on the sound quality of what’s being processed by the DAC. It would seem that the BDP software is only providing the digital file to the DAC and that "bits are bits," no matter how they’re being transmitted to the DAC. So... count me among those that may be skeptical that there is any difference in the sound quality of a digital file until it is processed by the DAC. Hopefully - there is someone here who has enough engineering knowledge to provide a rational explanation. Though, I suppose it could relate to how quiet (noise free) the BDP is - some may well be quieter than others, and the interface cable can certainly make a difference in the sound quality (AES/EBU vs USB, etc.). So... I wonder if that is actually causing the difference in sound quality some are noting between software products. |
@barts Your setup is similar to mine except I have an external DACalizer. When you gots a few minutes to play around why don’t you fire up a Roon core on your network (pc,linux or Mac) host. Really easy then to switch the BDP to an endpoint. Roon Core will see it strait away, then just log into your Qobuz account. I even have a code for a 60 day trial of Roon that came with my SGC ST I will let you have if you want to do some testing. Get a 2nd opinion on how the MPD running on Manic Moose compares to The Roons. |
OP - I believe you can run Roon on your PC and then use the Node2i as the endpoint. That way the PC does all the work but the endpoint is away from the noise of the PC so it should sound better (in theory, according to Roon). I use a Raspberry Pi as my endpoint and the PC as the core. Works fine (although as I stated, I'm not a fan of Roon's sound compared to other providers) |
OP. You need something to run Roon Core. A decent PC will work and some but not all NAS drives will work. You can find plenty of suggestions on the Roon website. If you intended to use Roon long term, I suggest to invest in a decent NUC - especially, if you intend to use some of Roon’s more resource intensive DSP capabilities like upscaling. Roon has by far the best music management interface and capabilities of any software that I’ve used to date. To enjoy it, you’ll need a capable Roon Core host device. |
Just confirmed what @jaytor said. I cannot make do with just my Bluesound Node2i. I’d still need a PC server running soon. A Node2i does not run the Roon “Core” application. "Roon is a server and client based system so always requires the core server part to be running on a pc or Nas type device.” https://community.roonlabs.com/t/seriously-how-to-use-my-node-2i/97094/11 This means that if one has bought one of the most popular, affordable streamers out there, one still needs more to use Roon. This is something I hadn’t considered. If I am wrong about this, please tell me. |
Don't mean to hijack this thread as my question is in-line with the original intent. I have a Bryston BDA-3.14 which is the BDA-3 DAC and the Bryston BDP Pi in one component. My Bryston is hardwired to the home network. It sounds freakin' awesome. I'm using a Chromebook running "Manic Moose" (Bryston propriety software) to control the BDA-3.14. The way it works is I choose any number of tracks from Qobuz and put them in my play list. The "Manic Moose" simply sends the QOBUZ URL of each track to the BDA-3.14 which then holds the list. Hit play (either on remote or in "Manic Moose" and it plays. At that point I can turn the Chromebook off and BDA-3.14 will run through the playlist. The advantage in my mind is that there is a straight shot from Qobuz through wired ethernet to BDA-3.14, no computer interface/interference. I'm told the Bryston can be used as a Roon end-point and do all the good cataloging/suggesting stuff that Roon is good at. But, my limited understanding of Roon is that it will be processing the digital signal prior to getting to the Bryston. Is that correct? Honestly I believe the direct path described above is about the best SQ possible for the components involved. Thanks for any input. Be as techy as you like. |
i have been using Roon for three years. The longer you use it and learn how to manipulate and discover your own and the wider music catalogues, the more pleasure it gives. there are lots of layers and a month might not be enough to really understand what it can do. Music library’s are getting bigger and harder to manage and organise. Roon sorts this out for you and makes musical discovery and rediscovery an effortless pleasure. My advice is to forget the trial, rent for a year and then decide if you want to buy. i suspect any perceived differences in SQ that may exist between Roon and Audiovana are down to the particular hardware implementations in those specific systems with all their variables. |
@soundchasr said "I trial’d Roon and Audirvana. No doubt Roon has an awesome GUI and some good features. However, I never liked the sound despite moving everything over to a Raspberry Pi and tweaking all of the settings. Audirvana just sounds good, no tweaks necessary. " Yep, Roon sound stage on my system is flat as a pancake. |
I do send it to a raspberry pi4 running Ropiee as a bridge. I use ROCK on a NUC for the core running in my office. The difference is I can run ROCK headless 24/7 , it's optimized for music playback, self updates and I don't have to mess with windows. If Audirvana could run on a small linux distro headless I would try it but I've never cared for any music programs I've tried with windows. Roon is much simpler and I find the SQ superior at least the way I run it I didn't when I tried it on windows. |
I have Amazon HD which has a good interface until you try using it through Bluesound. I would switch to Tidal and add Roon but not sure I can import all my selected music(called My Music in Amazon). It is literally thousands of songs. If somebody has done this let me know. Otherwise, an extensive winter project perhaps? |
I had been researching Roon since January of this year and finally made the purchase 2 weeks ago. To me, one of the best features is the speed in which it can access music from my NAS or Tidal. There is literally no empty air space while it accesses your selection or picks the next song to play. Other great features include: Playlist continuation....after your playlist is completed it continues to play music similar to your playlist and if you don’t like a track it selects for you then you can skip it. I have music on in the background while I work and I select a playlist and it plays all day based off the playlist I selected with new and similar music to my playlist. The sound quality is significantly better than I was getting through Sonos using my portable hard drive. I’m still using Sonos in some zones and the sound is vastly improved. Roon easily plays all types of files including DSD which was not easily accessed before my purchase. I don’t have a separate dac or streamer I just use Roon for everything. Best purchase I have made for my system easily. Woods |
Just a note about tidal it will also continue to play similar music to the last played list. So that’s not something to really consider unless roon is that much better. I tried it didn’t see the value for the cost but I also only stream and stoped using other digital formats years ago so that’s a consideration I’ve got boxes of CD’s I’ve not played in over a decade. |
I enjoy roon. The software needs a better search feature (like amazon.com or google) better android app functionality, but it interacts nicely with many receivers, roku devices, google products and my lumin streamer. Its convenient for streaming anywhere in the house and does a great job with tidal and my music collection. Its not for everyone, but if you do the trial, you may find it enjoyable and may enjoy the additional features it offers over say just spotify or just tidal. |
I don’t even have Roon but I’ve seen it demoed at HiFi stores. In addition to what’s been mentioned, I thought coolest feature was wiki-like info available with every selection and ability to jump around to like selections. It kinda reminded me (in a music context) of way i felt when I discovered the internet in the early days (pre-Google, pre-aol, I’m talking Gopher exploring days circa 1992ish — whoa! There’s a whole infinite world of information out here! Radical! |
@big_greg Whoah! Now thats a lot of text and acronyms on one website! I have no idea what they are talking about. I’m afraid BubbleUPnP is way over my head and I’m paying for the privilege of staying dumb by using Roon for the same reason I have paid for my Apple products all these years. I bought the lifetime subscription within a week of the trial period. Dumb is also why I can’t go for any of those, supposedly superior, raspberry pi products and just shelled out my dummy tax for a Bluesound node 2i. I wish someone bundled those pi products up with an easy to understand list of features like an ordinary consumer product. The bluesound node is overkill for what I need. I just want a high-res Roon ready “airport express” with one Digital and one rca and/or XLR out. |
Thanks for the additional information. I’m probably being cranky because I feel like every time I turn around there’s another *subscription* on my visa bill, and this adds on top of other services. Ok, got that off my chest — I’m very prickly when I think I’m being nickel-and-dimed, but you’re truly evincing some major benefits to Roon. Seems worth a try. That said, the alternatives look interesting, such as the Bryston. But…I just bought a Node…so…[scratches head]. Again, with the Node, I plug a thumb drive in the back and I have a lot of files right there in the player. But, as folks have said, the interface is not as good… Ok, I need to research what you’ve all said. Been driving all day. |
