@elizabeth and @btw22
If the game is lost, then we're all the same
No one left to place or take the blame
If the game is lost, then we're all the same
No one left to place or take the blame
why do people feel the need to buy expensive cable
I have tried expensive cables and one's moderately priced. I would say there were some differences but I can't actually say the expensive cables were better. IMHO I believe a lot of people buy expensive cables because they don't actual trust their ears and are afraid of making a mistake. They figure the expensive cables are better for the fact they cost more. If you have a difference of opinion or share the same thoughts, I would like to hear about it.
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gdhal ^ Unable to discuss anything cleeds as my posts get deleted. Sorry.I'm not a moderator - just a member here like you. I can't delete your posts. I think the posts of yours that get deleted are when you try to move the conversation offline so that you can resume your $25K "listening test" hustle. There's no problem as long as the conversation remains here. |
gdhal No, you’re superman, capable of the impossible, and who purportedly can hear the difference when ordinary speaker wire is reversed.You’re either be silly, or just argumentative - I never made any such claim. Never. I did express an interest in testing the audible differences between cables - including directionality - in what would be an objective, scientific test. But I never speculated on the outcome of such a test. Please get your facts straight. |
cleeds - I never made any such claimIf you are now admitting that you *cannot* hear the difference when ordinary speaker wire is reversed, then you and I have nothing to discuss/communicate on or offline. cleeds -Please get your facts straight.Don’t worry. Your accusatory statements, such as but not limited to, "your $25K "listening test" hustle" have been recorded and reported to the moderator. |
gdhal If you are now admitting that you *cannot* hear the difference when ordinary speaker wire is reversed, then you and I have nothing to discuss/communicate on or offlineI never stated I could hear such a difference. If you believe otherwise, please feel free to quote from the relevant post. (Hint: You won't be able to locate such a quote, because I never said it.) I did express an interest in testing the audibility of cable differences - including directionality - in an objective, scientifically valid test. After first expressing an interest in that, you then tried to move the conversation offline. When you attempt that, the moderators step in. |
No, you're superman, capable of the impossible, and who purportedly can hear the difference when ordinary speaker wire is reversed.There is a very good and known technical explanation for the why of such a claim, and when it is evaluated it is known to be a functional answer within the context of scientific validity. I will do you the solid of telling you that it exists, so that you might go on and find it on your own, but I won't give it to you, as that information is valuable. Hard fought for, in most cases. Commercial viability is many times tied to learned lore - as applied to product. Lore is protected, for all the right reasons. The scenario stands as:..you seeming to collect a gaggle of yes men who are in the same boat, vs a largely silent group who understand the lore, the science and the engineering - and it's application to product. Your voice, or position seems strong, due to the silence of intelligent, agreeable and wiser people.... who are wise enough to avoid the hassle that your position and voice represent. You don't have a position. You have the appearance of a position--to some. |
cleeds - ...I did express an interest in testing the audibility of cable differences - including directionality - in an objective, scientifically valid test...gdhal As did I, with the inclusion of what is typically found in ones back pocket. To this extent, you declined.I remain willing to discuss in public an objective, scientifically valid listening test that would be held in public. You want to shuttle that conversation offline for very dubious purposes. If you change your mind and develop a sincere interest in this testing, just let me know. But of course, the discussion and test will have to be in public, so that others can offer suggestions and participate, if they choose. |
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🐑 gdhal @geoffkait You’re late. Remember to put what’s in thy back pocket where thy keyboard is. Trouble is of course, if thy back pocket consists of proceeds from a business that deals in voodoo, thy back pocket is liable to be empty. Would you consider that wise? If thy eye offend thee pluck it out. 👀 A sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from voodoo to the average Joe. - old audiophile axiom |
Goeff says: Sometimes tis best to remain silent and thought a fool than to open your yap and remove all doubt.So....you are calling me a fool. When at a loss for something clever to say, you always resort to name calling. MY being a fool (according to you) has nothing to do with the discussion here. But, what the hell, you needed to say something to get your post-point in. 10,000 posts by the end of July. We are all rooting for you, Geoff!! |
If you think that expensive cables are no less than the cheap one, then you are wrong. These cables are made with compounds manufactured under high-quality standards, waterproof and without using halogen as compared to normal cables. I prefer to buy cables from the reliable power cable manufacturers for safety, security and quality. |
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If the game is lost, then we're all the same No one left to place or take the blame " - gdhal quoting Bob Weir (yes, the Grateful Dead Bob....) some more from "wise old" Bob... - " Full of hope, full of grace, is the human face But afraid, we may lay our home to waste " Does that make it any clearer for you , geoffkait? Allow me to translate....peaceful coexistence tends to outrank constant war, exploitation and strife. In other words, peaceful, respectful discussions are possible without vehement disagreement and argument that devolves into insult and destruction of any/all dialog....Did I get that right, gdhal? |
cj1965 " If the game is lost, then we're all the same No one left to place or take the blame " - gdhal quoting Bob Weir (yes, the Grateful Dead Bob....) some more from "wise old" Bob... - " Full of hope, full of grace, is the human face But afraid, we may lay our home to waste " Does that make it any clearer for you , geoffkait? Allow me to translate....peaceful coexistence tends to outrank constant war, exploitation and strife. In other words, peaceful, respectful discussions are possible without vehement disagreement and argument that devolves into insult and destruction of any/all dialog....Did I get that right, gdhal? >>>>>Allow me to translate for you..... Blah, blah, blah |
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Human progress is slow, doubly so it seems when it comes to fraudio. Still, the debate about cables is kids stuff compared to other big questions that have challenged mankind. Even when telescopes suggested different the idea that the planets and the sun orbited around the earth was hard to abandon. The perplexing problem of the holy Trinity has occupied our 'finest' minds for centuries. The internet is awash with debates over a whole host of challenging propositions - were the Moon landings faked, is the Earth flat?, who was really responsible for 9/11, do vacinescause more harm than good, who are our real puppet-masters? etc etc. Before we all descend into irreversible paranoia, we still have one great resource left to us, namely our minds, and in the case is audio, our ears. That's what it comes down to eventually. If you're looking for certainty, you're looking in the wrong place. You're welcome to read all you want but please apply some consideration first to what the motives might be behind the text. |
Why do people feel the need to buy expensive cable? Truth is though there are different applications for cables. Interconnects being one, and speaker wire being another. There is such an abundance of information - and listener testimonial - stating that in the case of speaker wire, anything other than "ordinary lamp cord" is essentially unnecessary and indistinguishable audibly. The only thing one gets in this case is more broke. |
Obviously anyone can cherry pick user testimonials and find some somewhere that agree with you. Or just make it up, who’s gonna know, right? And ignore the testimonials that don’t agree with your foregone conclusions. It’s the oldest ploy in the pseudo skeptics playbook. Even better, find a PhD somewhere who agrees with you. That can be very powerful in these sorts of “debates.” Cough, cough! |
Bin there dun that! When one checks for directionality of fuses he doesn’t know which way is the right way, so it’s essentially blind. All one needs to do is listen. Also if there are many fuses in the system one must pay attention whilst flipping fuses. Otherwise you could wind up the same as you started. The reason I’m telling you all this is because I realize you have no experience with this sort of thing. You just like to talk a lot and pretend. A pretend skeptic. You talk the talk but can you walk the walk? |
gdhal Try and detect/hear the difference between ordinary speaker wire and the most expensive/exotic there is in a blind test. That’ll end the debate.No, it won’t, because naysayers such as yourself will perpetuate the debate. One cable manufacturer has offered its own comparator for exactly this sort of evaluation. Why do you think Wireworld does that? Because there are differences. And they are audible. But - and this is a big "but" - you won’t know about these differences until you actually conduct some listening experiments. That seems to be something you and others in the "hear no difference"crowd seem unwilling to do. You prefer to be an armchair theorist. |
geoffkait - .....When one checks for directionality of fuses he doesn’t know which way is the right way, so it’s essentially blind. Also if there are many fuses in the system one must pay attention whilst flipping fuses.... I thought, ’cough cough’ - see what you’ve done, I must be catching your cold .... that we’re in the **cable** thread. Or, are you now stating that speaker wire, its direction, and the fuse direction go hand-in-hand and are directly related? |
geoffkait - ....Wire is wire whether it’s a fuse or cable. They’re all di-rec-shun-al.... On the contrary, haven't you been paying attention? I'm not disputing (although I'm not agreeing either) that the manufacturing process and/or technical measurements cannot or do not support directionality. What I'm stating is that you cannot hear a difference with the naked ear. Additionally, given your example and if true, it would then also mean that the wire in the walls that you plug the amp into (forgive me, I do realize you often use a battery powered Walkman), the transformer wire in the amp, the wire the utility company has used to provide power to the home, and all other wiring in the speaker voice coils and other components also must be in precise and correct "direction". Very well. Lets imagine that somehow all of the aforementioned has fallen into place. Lets further imagine that all other concerns you/others might have are adequately addressed. How does this change your "enjoyment" of listening to music? And please speculate, in what way should someone else, such as myself, expect to benefit if all wire directionality were perfect? |
geoffkait - No offense to you personally, gdhal, but you’ve made it abundantly clear you haven’t the slightest idea what “directionality” even means. This conversation can have no porpoise anymore. 🐬 Ta ta! No offense taken. I didn't think you'd have any kind of answer to my questions. Tell you what though, I'll extend the request to answer my questions (in my 04-13-2018 11:05am post herein) to anyone else who believes as you do. |
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I've been slowly replacing my cables with low to medium upgrades from the original .50 cent supplied ones and note a significant increase in the quality of sound. My last purchas of a pair of 18" cables said to give them a 175 hour burn in time. WHAT? Can that really make a difference to the human ear? |
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