Which Phono Pre?

Whest makes a nice sounding phono stage. I have the model three signature & am very pleased with it. Have no experience with any of the other phono stages listed so can't comment on them. Are you running tube or SS pre/power amps? I run the Whest using all SS equipment, B&W 802D speakers & a Soundsmith cartridge.  

Dear @jjgasp : Nice analog rig that needs the best phono stage you can buy inside your budget.

Phono stage is always critical in analog to achieve top quality performance sound, so you have an important decision to make.

Your alternatives are fine and the best of all them with out dimish any one is the Pass XP-27.

You can't go wrong with. Is a winner.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

The "best match" is determined by YOUR ears. Certainly not anyone here. Tube units seem to have a more subjective "organic" sound.

The only thing to know is a tube unit WILL be a little noisier at concert levels only during quiet passages/between cuts, compared to a SS unit. Unless you're  one of those who put their ears up to the speaker to hear hiss, it's just not an issue.

Top units as you have listed, will have very tolerable noise levels-IMO. 

I stopped looking at different brands once I purchased my first Audio Research Phono stage... you could get a used PH7 or PH8. They are very complimentary to analog and are truly audiophile quality and built for a lifetime. Over the last 40 years I worked my way up from SP3 every 10 years upgrading to now owning the world class Reference 3. Sorry to recommend something outside the box... but ARC is worth considering.

Raul is absolutely right. The Pass Labs is special and beautifully made. It will last a lifetime. The 4 Point is one of the best arms for a Koetsu. With the 11" 4 point you might have to add a little weight to the head shell as the Rosewood bodied Koetsus are lighter than the stone bodied units.
Soundsmith sells a great set of graded cartridge screws. With a Hi Fi News Analog Test disc you can get the resonance frequency right down to 8-10 Hz and your bass will be wonderful. The only other thing I can think of that would make an additional sonic improvement would be a low profile MinusK platform under the Firebird. After that I don't think you could do any better regardless of the money you spend. You are right at the point of rapidly diminishing returns. 

Dear @tablejockey : Here we are talking not opf tonearm/cartridge match in where I’m in agreement about that " determined by your ears ".

When we are talking of phono stage, at least for me, what I’m looking for is a neutral, accurated and very low colorations/distortions unit.
We need a phono stage that degrades the less the valuable cartridge signal and from my point of views the XP27 achives all those critical characteristics. The OP is looking for the best phono stage he can afford between those alternatives.

"" will have very tolerable noise levels.."""

Sorry but for me the best " tolerable noise levels " is NO noise levels ! I can see you are not to much demanding about, I'm the other way around.

R.

Whest and Pass are both really good SS. If you do a comparison you may pm me to try out the AudioSpecials Phonolab; it too is solid state and very low noise. Since I am a dealer for them I wont elaborate on subjective sq. If you read the German reviews tests show that you will not find much quieter at any price.
*if* the budget could stretch and *if* tube gear is acceptable to you then the Emia and the CS Port are both super awesome...

Raul, have you actually heard the Whest 40RDT?

I’m curious how would you guys rate Pass Aleph Ono series and older Threshold SL-10 pre w/phono stage?

If the OP is open to another suggestion... 

The Wavestream Kinetics Deluxe Phonoamp.  

It is an all tube design currently using (2 x 12AX7, 4 x 6DJ8); with extremely low noise (I believe with the external power supply that the current Level 5 Reference now comes with) noise is below 1uV (one-millionth of a volt ); providing 3 front panel selectable inputs = two MC at 62 dB of gain (without the use of SUT’s or FETS) with a useful cartridge range of 0.2mV to 1.2mV and one MM output at 42dB (you are able to choose your MM gain or you can have 3 MC ); having both balanced and RCA inputs and outputs; adjustable loading available on the back panel via custom loading plugs; and an essentially flat RIAA EQ curve within one tenth of a dB (.1dB) from 3 Hz to 40 Khz. *** The above specs are from the best of my recollection - if you have interest, please consult with Scott Frankland to confirm. He is wonderful to communicate with. ***

Best wishes,
Don

Nelson does great stuff.  The Modwright is also very, very good. Have heard the MW and heard lots of Pass stuff over the years, but not that unit. Plus every phono stage is really a reflection of the tt/cart setup :-)As to zero noise - nice goal, but what will you sacrifice (not in theory, in reality)?  get to like transformers!

the pass, luxman, or accuphase would be good choices as well as a parasound jc3+ for your setup if you have a dealer nearby you may want to try some others as well before you make a final choice.

Why did you NOT include Herron VTPH-2A?  Aren't you looking for top performance?

@bpoletti Herron has retired from making them.

I guess that shouldn't be a surprise.  

Thanks all for your thoughts.  Very much appreciated.  I don't have any dealers nearby, but will definitely be making the rounds once the shows start up again soon.

If you've got a low impedance cartridge like the Koetsu RSP, I'd opt for the LCR type phonostage like the Allnic 7000 HV.  I'm currently using an ARC Ref 2SE phonostage and although perfectly happy with the performance, my next phonostage will be the LCR type. More discussion here:  LCR phono stages we know about | Audiogon Discussion Forum

Can't do chakster, have not heard either one. Back in 1980 a friend did have a Threshold preamp that had a phono stage, a super wide band unit. It was difficult keeping it quiet (hiss) but it had an excellent phono stage for the day. I can not remember the model number. I never could remember names and numbers. Back then all preamps had phono stages. The idea of separate ones had just gotten to the market. Again, thank you Mark Levinson, the man who proved some people would spend ridiculous money on HiFi gear. The first stand alone phono stage was battery powered and I do think it was designed by John Curl. It cost something like $1200.00 which was steep for the day. Found it!   https://www.google.com/search?q=Mark+levinson+JC1&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwimlc-7qfvwAhUocjABHSnZ...

Threshols SL-10 and Pass Aleph ONO (and ONO Manual).
Goes for something in between of $1k - $2k today.  

jjgasp, your thoughts on the Kuzma in combo with the Koetsu ?
thx

Koetsu is a low compliance cartridge, KUZMA is not the heaviest tonearm and definitely NOT for low compliance cartridges (but this is a theory), practically it can be good enough for your ears. 

@ chakster - what cartridge would you recommend for my TT/tonearm combo?

@ analogheaven - I’ll let you know once I get it setup and dialed-in

@jjgasp I don't use Koetsu however there is a long documented love affair of the match between Koetsu and the FR64S/FR66S tonearms. If vintage isn't your thing there is some buzz around the Glanz arms having similar synergy.

Is your 4PT the 11"?

I found Teac PE-505 amazing phono-pre, rare in below 2k price range with balanced input and output. Excellent RIAA EQ accuracy.

@ chakster - what cartridge would you recommend for my TT/tonearm combo?

Kuzma 4 Point effective mass is 18g

My recommendation is Audio-Technica AT-ML180 (MM) it was absolutely fantastic on my Reed 3P 12 inch with 18g effective mass. This is my favorite MM cartridge (and I tried so many MC and MM). If you want my personal recommendations - this is it! I invested $2k in original dead stock styli for back up, I’m packed for a long time with this gem. AT made two versions of cantilever: Gold-Plated Beryllium Pipe and Gold-Plated Boron Pipe. They made two different versions of the motor: LC-OFC and PC-OCC. The stylus tip on all versions is MicroLine (the best profile). Not sure if it’s possible to find a NOS AT-ML180 for less than $3k nowadays, but in my opinion this is real killer. Slightly cheaper versions is AT-ML170 which is also fantastic MM from my top 5.

Regarding LOMC I think you already have a good one, but personally I never tried your Koetsu cartridge, I could recommend Miyajima Kansui as an alternative (I love Miyajima for their organic sound).

I recently bought the Modwright 9.0x.  It's excellent with my Koetsu Black.

Dear @jjgasp  : "   I’ll let you know once I get it setup and dialed-in "

Can I understand that you own that combo and not listen it yet?

Btw, you can't have any problem between tha RSP and the really good Kuzma tonearm. It's frequency resonance in between stays inside the ideal frequency range ( 8hz-12hz. ) with: 11hz.

That cartridge is very good performer, I own it and after own several Koestsu models this one was the first Koetsu that really shines and by coincidence was ( I think ? ) the first Koetsu with platinum magnets. Stay with no MM can be nearer except the MI ADC 26/27.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

Dear @westcoastaudiophile : Yes, that Teac unit is accurated but its overall operation is in digital domain and works with op-amps. It's not a full analog discrete devices unit. I can't know what the OP could think about.

Certainly and even that's really inexpensive: not for me.

R.

Again, thanks everyone for your thoughts.  Great to have a place like this to get great opinions on esoterica.  

@rauliruegas - the tonearm and cartridge are on order.  I currently have a Pass Labs XP-17 phono pre, but want a phono pre that can handle two carts and has balanced output.

Dear friends: I posted a few days now that we don't need a high efecctive mass tonearms and posted why. There I said that a medium EM tonearm can works with almost any cartridge as what the OP owns.

But if we own a high compliance cartridge say 23cu that weigths 5grs. ( normally those MM/MI cartridges are low weigth. ) and we mounted in a 14grs. EM tonearm ( typical medium mass. ) the resonance frequency will stays at 8hz that by coincidence is where misjostyn likes it.

R.

Based on reviews, I have been considering PS Audio Stellar. 

I committed to the Pass Labs XP-27. Also going to let the Koetsu RSP battle it out with a Soundsmith Hyperion and pick a winner. Unfortunately in that $$$ stratosphere, I can’t keep both. FWIW, I’ll report my impressions in a few weeks.

I appreciate everyone’s great feedback.

Tavish Design Adagio

Dear @rossb : Sorry till today I read your post.

Unfortunatelly no. I know very well Whest audio and I have a high respect for them, have really solid engeenering. I I listened the 3 raference or signature ( can't remember ) and the 30 and followed almost from Whest started.

It's very competitive items at more or less affordable prices and yes is a good alternative.

R.

The Allnic H7000 has balanced outs, handles multiple carts. LCR. Call Albert Porter.

If you can find one get a Vendetta SCP2a. I have the first Whest 0.20 and it was much better than a Tom Evans Groove. The Vendetta i got had to be re-capped and on the advice of John Curl I upgraded the IC chips. I don't worry about the next thing out there. It would be nice to have a phono stage with different EQ curves though.
I digress a little - I still can't fault the Whest and I'm sure the 4.0 would be better than what i have. lovely build, and James Henriot is a very knowledgable and helpful guy. I'm not qualified to comment on the others I hasten to add. 
In terms of sound I did a review many moons ago and stand by it still. very good extension, body, and air. Superb at imaging and to my ears - not cold.

@jjgasp  - do you have an update for us?  Very interested to hear what cart you ended up going with and what led to that decision.

Thanks.

@rdk777 - I’ve got the Pass Labs XP-27. Made sense to match it up with my Pass Labs INT-250 and it sounds fantastic.

Good choice… that would be a very good and safe bet.