What Do You Think . . . and How Does It Work?

hi glupson, Interesting how you ignored my questions. 

All the best,

Kenjit~

(Undefeated audiophile)

kenjit,

I did not think you were truly asking.

After rereading your post and questions, the answers would be...

I doubt there is an illness that corresponds to that so you may never find the name.

However, if discrediting everything ever becomes a recognized illness, kenjititis may be the name.

glupson (tough cookie)

Kenjit: " hi glupson, Interesting how you ignored my questions. "

I presume this is what you mean?

" Dukes technique has been to try to discredit everything i say by accusing me of narcissism all the while ignoring the topic being discussed. Whats the name for that? There must be an illness that corresponds to no?"

The name for what I am doing is, "calling out the narcissist".

The illness that it corresponds to is, being sick of your behavior.

Sounds like you want to make me the bad guy for calling you out. Interesting how you fail to even claim that your behavior is not narcissistic.

Maybe I haven’t given you enough to work with? Here is a list of behaviors consistent with narcissistic personality disorder, taken from the Mayo Clinic website. Feel free to tell us which ones do not apply to you:

• Have an exaggerated sense of self-importance

• Have a sense of entitlement

• Expect to be recognized as superior even without achievements that warrant it

• Exaggerate achievements and talents

• Preoccupied with fantasies about success, power, or brilliance

• Believe they are superior

• Monopolize conversations and belittle others

• Expect special favors and unquestioning compliance with their expectations

• Have an inability or unwillingness to recognize the needs and feelings of others

• Behave in an arrogant or haughty manner, coming across as conceited, boastful and pretentious

• Insist on having the best of everything

Duke

I think I may be accused of #10, but it's unintentional...
#'s 4 & 5 ?  It'd be a stretch, but only because nobody else it doing it....

...and there's already enough expensive boxes out there, that end up having to be cordoned off into a 'special space' to take advantage of their qualities...which end up being discussed and argued about and over.

The rest of the list?
Others are far more adept at those....in their way.....

That you see those qualities in yourself asvjerry, is probably the best indication that you don't have NPD. Those with NPD wouldn't see it, and certainly wouldn't admit it. The normal people see many of the qualities of personality disorders in themselves. The ones that don't are the ones you have to worry about.

asvjerry makes a good point. We are all narcississts according to that list. The list of descriptions has been carefully fabricated so that it can apply to anybody. For what purpose? Nothing other than to label that person and use that label against them at every opportunity, to discredit them, bully them and ultimately control their behavior. It is a disgusting sham that nobody should buy into. There are plenty of shams going on within the medical community just as there are within the speaker industry. There are sham diagnoses, treatments, crooks and charlatans within the medical industry. There is less or even no regulation within the speaker industry so whos to say the situation is not even worse in the speaker industry? The single factor that seems to motivate people in both camps is money and greed. Medicine is no longer about helping people its all about profit. It is absurd to deny that money and greed does not motivate at least some within the speaker industry.

Labelling me a narcississt does not invalidate my points. It does not answer the riddles i presented to Duke. It just conveniently avoids all of it. Who is guilty of evading the discussion here me or Duke?Who is the real culprit?

Called that one. 

Avsjerry did not say that "we are all narcissists according to that list". But it sounds to me like you defacto acknowledge that you are: Instead of coming up with a single item which did not apply to you, you attacked the medical community.

And once again, your complaint against me is that I am calling you out instead of jumping through your hoops.   Just because you ask a question does not entitle you to an answer. 

Kenjit, WHAT you are - a narcissist - is WHY I no longer jump through your hoops. We both know you have already decided in advance to dismiss whatever I might say. We’ve been down that road too many times.

But let me repeat the offer I made yesterday:

If anyone other than Kenjit is actually curious about the questions he raises, let me know and I will reply to you. Otherwise, imo this thread is about one of Siegfried Linkwitz’s designs, not one of mine.

Kenjit, if your questions are so brilliant and so vitally important, why isn’t everyone clamoring in outrage for me to answer them?

Duke

That you see those qualities in yourself asvjerry, is probably the best indication that you don't have NPD. Those with NPD wouldn't see it, and certainly wouldn't admit it. The normal people see many of the qualities of personality disorders in themselves. The ones that don't are the ones you have to worry about.

Whew! I saw myself in every single one of those! In spades! But since I know that, no worries, can't be me. What a relief!  

Duke truly is a gentleman. When I looked up narcissist in my PDR there was a picture of kenjit. So maybe he's not a narcissist, he really is important after all!

Dukes logic is to assume that I am a narcissist unless proven otherwise which is typical of the high end speaker industry where it is assumed that any claim made is true until proven otherwise. Dukes goal is to repeatedly call me a narcissist and distract you from the dirty secrets of the industry where audiophiles are kept in the dark much of the time when it comes to measurements and how much things cost. Do not be duped.

Duke sells obscenely expensive speakers costing $7600. To put that in perspective you can get a full range floorstander or active speakers for much less than that price. The Linkwitz Pluto itself is far cheaper. There is no reason what he does couldnt be done cheaper, as other manufacturers already do offer cheaper high end speakers.

He claims on his website that

"Few if any other speaker designers match Duke’s knowledge and experience Re. the ideal balance between early and late arriving signals "

This is a grandiose claim typical of narcissists. He basically claims that he is superior to every other designer. Yet Revel have been doing waveguides for years! What he does is hardly new. Worst of all theres no evidence. B&w and Magico sell more speakers than audiokinesis Im pretty sure of that. Yet he is telling us that THEY are wrong and HE is right!

Duke claims that he uses a special plywood so that

"Noise is lowered, with commensurate increase in dynamic “pop,” and without any downside. "

NO EVIDENCE

For his Crossovers:

"The result is faster transient performance, with increased detail, transparency, larger dynamic envelope, and no down side. "

NO EVIDENCE.

He charges $7600 for a wooden box with what looks like plastic cheap binding posts on the back and a woofer from a manufacturer whose speciality is in guitar speakers not high end audio woofers.
He quotes the names of four PHd’s namely Earl Geddes, Floyd Toole, Robert E. Greene, and David Greisinger. and expects to be recognized as equal to them. Where was your PHD from Mr. lejeune, Harvard or Princeton? He claims these individuals "have the most reliable and extensive knowledge base on this subject." NO EVIDENCE.

There are hundreds of speaker manufacturers out there Duke. Your speakers are rarely mentioned on this forum or others. Your speakers have not achieved mainstream success. It is a niche product that requires you to sell a few pairs at high prices. The grandiosity doesnt match with reality.

Dukes logic is to assume that I am a narcissist unless proven otherwise

Oh no, the evidence of your character is spread far and wide.  Assumptions need not be used here.


Erik

Credentialism is a sickness of our times. But since you bring it up kenjit, where did you get your PhD?

If anyone other than Kenjit is actually curious about the questions he raises, any of them, let me know and I will be more than happy to reply. I do not take offense at the questions themselves; I have simply stopped jumping through Kenjit’s hoops. As you can see, he doesn’t like that.

Also, this thread is about Siegfried Linkwitz's speakers, and for me to reply to Kenjit's questions in adequate depth would arguable be a thread hijack.   I'll do it for someone else, but not for Kenjit because I do not think his questions are sincere.  I do not think he is the slightest bit curious about my speakers or about me. 

For anyone wondering why I have abandoned trying to reason with him, google "reasoning with a narcissist."

And Kenjit, thanks for the free publicity.

Duke

Kenjit, if your questions are so brilliant and so vitally important, why isn’t everyone clamoring in outrage for me to answer them?

because nobody seems to care about your designs when there are other less expensive ones out there. 

Incidentally, i just found an article that confirms my suspicion that narcississm pretty much applies to everybody. 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/fulfillment-any-age/201408/8-ways-handle-narcissist

it says 

A tendency toward narcissism is present in everyone, to more or less of a degree

Ive also pointed out above, Dukes behavior which is narcississtic. 
He fails to acknowledge this. 

Its ok to be a narcissist Duke. Being a narcissist is probably a good thing anyway when it comes to speaker design. It helps you to strive for PERFECTION. Can we now go back to discussing the topic of speakers? Promise, no more insults?

Kenjit~

Undefeated Champion bar none 

" Can we now go back to discussing the topic of speakers? Promise, no more insults? "

Are you actually offering to change YOUR behavior, or only asking me to change mine? Please answer this question because it is important. However in this case a non-answer is still an answer.

I CAN promise you this:

As long as you take an adversarial approach and belittle or attack others, as far as I’m concerned your narcissistic behavior should be called out so that others are not duped. People have a right to know when they are dealing with someone whose behavior is toxic. And I will out you.

And if you stop, so will I.

I have seen you post in a non-adversarial way, so I know you can do it. Non-adversarial is my default mode, but in this thread I have chosen to give you a taste of your own medicine.

If you stop, then so will I.

Duke

I am of the personal opinion that Kenjit has never actually discussed speakers. To discuss speakers at the level he purports to what to discuss would require a level of knowledge of speakers, and acoustics that is certainly not self evident in the posts. The simple lack of acceptance that because no two rooms are the same, there can be no perfect speaker, or that because playback is a recreation of something with no where near all the original information, makes defining the perfect speaker impossible, shows Kenjit no possessing at this point the skills or knowledge to have the discussion that is being encouraged.

Lacking said knowledge, one gets hung up in implementation details, i.e. woofer/cabinet resonances, as opposed to more critical system level details, such as controlling off axis energy and time of arrival.

We all have narcissistic tendencies, it is what keeps us alive and can lead to success and drive, but NPD (narcissistic personality disorder), take it to a whole different level and is a recognized personality disorder in the The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM). Duke's post from the Mayo clinic mirrors the old DSM-IV description which is easier to understand. The updated DSM-V clinical description is here as well as a DSM-IV comparison. Not dealing with personality disorders can lead to a difficult and unhappy life, even though you may achieve a level of career success.

https://www.nyu.edu/gsas/dept/philo/courses/materials/Narc.Pers.DSM.pdf

“Kenjit~

Undefeated Champion bar none“

Nope....sorry, self appointed titles carry zero clout nor credibility in the real world.  
Gong!!

Well folks, the next act will hopefully be better.  

It’s funny when people can not see they have a < 5% approval rating yet continually prop themselves up as champions of the people.  
SMDH.....what was Ron White’s famous quote from a few years back?  Ya can’t fix ......

Duke has no authority to set the conditions for this forum. Narcissists are not excluded from here are they? 
People with disabilities have just as much rights as those without. 

Are you actually offering to change YOUR behavior, or only asking me to change mine?

How dare you expect a person with a disability to simply change? Disability is not a choice. 

People have a right to know when they are dealing with someone whose behavior is toxic. And I will out you.

Nobody has any right to know about a persons disability, its not their business. If a person does have a disability it is not toxic. The disabled community has fought to secure their rights and equal opportunities for a long time. We are protected against discrimination by law. You will not take that away from us Duke. The onus is on you to accommodate us. 

I have chosen to give you a taste of your own medicine.

Great idea. Lets call out all those with disabilities and give them a taste of their own medicine. Lets victimise them, harass them and remind them of how toxic they are to society. Lets discredit EVERYTHING they have to say on the basis of their disability. Lets just eliminate them off the planet so that only people that meet the standards DUKE lejeune sets are allowed to remain. 
That way we can CONTINUE TO HIDE THE DIRTY SECRETS WITHIN THE SPEAKER INDUSTRY and protect those that run it. 

• The speaker industry has swindled thousands of audiophiles over the last few decades using the same techniques. 

• We have been sold speakers that DONT WORK. They end up being resold because they are not good enough. The used market for ultra high end speakers is just as active as for low end speakers. 

• Measurements are rarely published. When they are, they may be exaggerated or even false. 

• The high end industry is unregulated. If i was in charge, the Kenjit standards (TM) would never be met and i would shut down most of these so called speaker companies. 
• Unemployment would rise within the speaker industry 

• Any claim can be made and is assumed true until proven otherwise

• Speaker designers have no clue on what the correct method or goal is of speaker design.

• Speaker designers are not required to be qualified. Its like going to a doctor or dentist who is not qualified. 

• The reviewers are chosen so that MOST speaker reviews are positive. Nobody would want a negative review published. Any negative aspects of a speaker are overlooked or downplayed. Only 5 star reviews accepted!

• Speakers are tuned to the designers ears, not OURS. 

• CONSPIRACY to suppress OLSONS research (1950s)

• In the year 2500, speakers are a thing of the past. 
• Music transmitted wirelessly directly into brain. 1hz to 30khz possible. 

• Researchers of acoustics will discover old internet archives from the year 2020. 
• Kenjits ideas and papers are scrutinized by Professors of acoustics
• Kenjit infinity baffle loading technology is found to be correct
• Kenjit speaker design is manufactured and tested by engineers and found to work

•  Kenjit is declared greatest Audiophile champion of all time BAR none.  

Well that was a convoluted mess...

ps kenny: 
if you want to trash an industry and it’s professionals be smart enough to expect some trash in return.   Adulting is hard... 

Kenjit wrote:
“How dare you expect a person with a disability to simply change? Disability is not a choice.”

Is it your argument is that you have a disability and that is where you are writing from?

Kenjit wrote:

”The disabled community has fought to secure their rights and equal opportunities for a long time. We are protected against discrimination by law. You will not take that away from us Duke. The onus is on you to accommodate us.”

might want to read up on ADA or ask an attorney to explain it.  Duke owes you nothing here in the US.  Your speech is not protected under US ADA

Kenjit playing the victim... oh the irony!

This place is really going downhill fast these days.  Maybe time to take another time off 

Map, Sad to say, I think this is just a reflection of the world as a whole in these times.

Yes it is and no reason to allow it to fester here. 

True, it is too much, with no end in sight.

How about a group hug? I’m starting to tear up. 😢

Duke has repeatedly used the accusation of narcissism to avoid talking about the points i raised. This is not only a fallacy but its also a form of harassment. He believes I suffer narcissism and treats it as a problem that i need to be shamed for. The reality is, he needs help to learn how to cope with his own emotions when dealing with people with narcissism. Then he will be able to respond to my points about the TOPIC instead of freaking out and losing his temper. This is a speaker forum not a forum for discussing peoples illnesses. Duke should mind his own business and stick to the topic. 

He says he wants to give me a taste of my own medicine. What good is that going to do anybody? Is it a punishment?

Duke has already lost the argument anyway because he has used insults as a way of evading the topic. Anybody who cant see that needs help too.

I have nothing left to prove. Ive made my points and if he wants to respond i will continue the discussion. 

Master Kenjit~ 

"This is a speaker forum..."

It is not a "speaker industry conspiracy" forum, I hope. Which is all you try to do with it.

Surprise, I am very satisfied with my speakers. They cost more than a bag of rice and profit margin must have been substantial. I do not even feel ripped off. They are "boxes" and have no concrete in them as far as I know. They even fit in my room. I'd prefer different color, though.

If you would be so kind to raise awareness of shady speaker industry practices in areas that matter. March against poor choice of colored finishes. It is much bigger problem than whatever you have been pounding on so far. The way they look actually matters.

" How dare you expect a person with a disability to simply change? Disability is not a choice. "

Behavior IS a choice. That’s why people are held accountable for it, unless they are insane.

" The onus is on you to accommodate [narcissists] ."

Your double standard for behavior only exists in your fantasy world.

Actually I think the onus is on me to make my fellow audiophiles aware of what sort of behavior they can expect from you. If our expectations are realistic, we are less likely to be caught off guard when you say or do something toxic.

For instance, I was not surprised to see you attempt "reversal", which is accusing me of the exact same behaviors you have displayed.

Nor am I surprised by your repeated attempts to bait me with allegations and accusations about my products and business. I would reply if I thought you were reasonable and asking in good faith. Experience has taught me otherwise.

And for the record, in case anyone reading this is unaware of my standing offer:

If anyone other than Kenjit is actually curious about the questions he raises, let me know and I will reply.

And if anyone has reservations about my choice to not engage with Kenjit on his terms (which I have done many times in the past with uniform results), please google "reasoning with a narcissist."

Duke

Hiding behind "disabled" when one is not, is a cheap trick. Disorder is the correct term here. Purposely and knowingly causing strife for one's own entertainment. Using tactics in attempt to make the other person believe THEY are the one in the wrong. Evading and twisting the points brought up by the target, etc. The bottom line is that the perpetrators know what they are doing all along. That is their game.

Nor am I surprised by your repeated attempts to bait me with allegations and accusations about my products and business.

The accusation comes from the fact that you cannot provide any EVIDENCE of the performance of your speakers. Its your own fault. Speaker companies do not like to talk about measurements, they prefer to rely on hearsay and reviews. And again you have made the assumption that I baited you. That was YOUR CHOICE. Another possibility is that it was an opportunity to try to justify yourself. You are not being honest with us. You offer a speaker that costs $7600 but cant give us evidence of what makes it superior to other cheaper speakers.It may well do what you claim it does but even then it doesnt make it superior.

You do not have the authority to hold me accountable. All you can do is repeatedly claim that I'm a narcissist. You dont hold a person with illness to account anyway. Its not a crime. You treat them with compassion and accommodate them. 

Behavior IS a choice. That’s why people are held accountable for it, unless they are insane.

Poppycock. This is not a court trial. And youre not the judge. Your diagnosis of narcissism isnt even valid. All you have done is stated your opinion about my behavior and that is fine. How would you know what part of my behavior is a choice or a disorder? 

Behavior is a matter of interpretation too and that is YOUR choice. 

For instance, I was not surprised to see you attempt "reversal", which is accusing me of the exact same behaviors you have displayed.

That is because you think you can call me out and other people cannot call you out. It is one rule for you and another for me. It is double standards. 

Don't play the game, guys.

... now that I bothered to read a few lines.. "You treat them with compassion and accommodate them". See? 

I’ve requested that my post just above this one be removed; decided that I’d rather not perpetuate the squabble.

Edit:  Thank you geoffkait for letting me know in your post just below that "delete" was still in effect after "edit" had timed out.  I've now deleted it. 

Duke

If you want it deleted expediently you can delete it yourself, no time limit for deleting posts. 

I don't blame you, Duke. It's all just unfortunate.

Geoff, there is a time limit for that, I believe.

You say yes, I say no. Don’t you think I’d know? Hel-loo!

Hey there, hi there, ho!

If you believe that people should be held accountable for their behavior  speaker engineers must be held accountable to the audiophile community.

Why dont you call out other peoples behavior when they insult me? You applauded me for not retaliating but you didnt call out their behavior. Thats double standards.

You now call it a squabble yet you were the one who insisted it WAS more important than discussing speakers. That is a contradiction Duke. I have caught you out.
You also claimed that you had chosen not to engage with me on my terms but then you continued to engage with me about my behavior.
Another contradiction. You are only unwilling to engage with me about the topic of speakers, but you are perfectly willing to spend time bullying me and calling me names. 

You claimed you had stopped reasoning with me because you cant reason with a narcissist. Yet you expect me to change my behavior. That seems highly unlikely dont you think?

Why should anybody change their behavior to suit your needs? Thats not how it works. If you dont like it you have no choice but to concede defeat and walk away. On the other hand, speaker designers should be held accountable because audiophiles pay a lot of money for their toys. It is only fair that they get what they pay for. It is fair that we are given evidence of the QUALITY of the speakers we buy. The alternative is for the speaker companies to continue cheating audiophiles. 

You ASSUME that i have narcissism. You ASSUME its a choice.You make assumptions and expect others to disprove your assumptions. Not how it works. You CHOOSE to interpret my behavior as pompous or arrogant or dismissive or contemptuous. Other people may well have a different view. It is your fault that you refuse to accept there are other interpretations of my behavior.
You refuse to acknowledge that most people do have some level of narcissism. The article i linked to confirms that. So that includes you Duke. It is therefore hardly worth mentioning because its ubiquitous.

You wont show us the CSD plots for your speakers or explain why. 
You refuse to publish the frequency response graphs or the polar response.
On your homepage you say 

We only charge a modest markup on our products

Yet you charge $7600 for a wooden box with ordinary drivers. I know for a fact that you can buy a good woofer and tweeter for well under $100 each. Audiophiles may not know that though. If much of the cost is going on the finish, then the speaker is being sold based mostly on appearance than sound quality. 

Your whole claim to fame is CONSTANT DIRECTIVITY yet it seems odd that you dont publish any independently verified evidence of this. 
You also cant explain why so many audiophiles are perfectly fine with all the speakers out there that arent constant directivity!

Why dont you just admit that you rely on hearsay to sell your speakers rather than facts? 

Many of my points apply to every speaker including the Linkwitz pluto so its not a thread hijack at all. Wrong again.

Send over your ginas to me at your cost, and i will give you a list of all the things wrong with them. I dare you Duke. i am confident i will find problems with them. The same with other high end speakers. This is the reason speakers are resold because eventually audiophiles can no longer tolerate the problems they subconsciously hear. 

"That seem's unlikely don't you think"?           Bingo 🎯

Kenjit if you really want to keep this going, go start another thread. Maybe I will respond to your questions there. But I am through derailing this one, and apologize to bob540 for having done so. 

Duke

Kenjit you can add sociopath to the list of ailments you exhibit. Recommendation is to get some professional help. Come back when you develop some self-awareness.  Maybe people will want to talk to you then.

Cheers!

Yikes! Double yikes!