Listen to this and see if you can always claim that music and song are not about any mystery :
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Obrecht is a genius... One of the greatest composer of his era... Listen to the rythm here in the Kyrie and in the Gloria pervading all the mass ... The irresistible joy behind the singing ... This is the mystery : the joy as irresistible flowing dance ... By the way i consider this interpretation by the Madrigaliste of Praga by Miroslav Venhoda superior to the interpretation of the Tallis scholars, why ? Because of the rythm of the springing joy we felt here and not at all with the more esthetically cold and slower version of the Tallis Scholars ... I had listened to this version for more than fifty years ....😊 The same mystery surge plain as the sun sight ... There is only joy nothing else...
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Now listen to the music of a true spiritual master Peter Deunov.... And look all 180 songs are here on the same channel ...Incredible ...9 hours of peace songs ... His music as Liszt Christus is permeated by the mystery of peace... Peace is a mystery unexplainable by anything because peace is deeper than anything , because the roots of peace are BEFORE anything that was or AFTER anything that could be ... The peace mystery is the mystery of introduction to all there is and the conclusion about all there is and ever will be ... As you see peace is even deeper than joy ....As deep sleep is deeper than the most beautiful dreams ... Peace is before zero and after the infinite, it is a complex number conjugating everything ....
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLTNypuLgY9fEdocDWHrOUhytEIvK0GxhZ
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Mathematics as said J.J. Sylvester, is the music of reason... But peace is the invisible core of all numbers, the invisible breath of music and the ultimate key of reason ...Because all there is and will be lie in absolute peace .... Now you understand why mysteries are in plain sight and only few are able to see them ...We must own the eyes of peace to see them ... Even the silence look for the peace which is in front of him and farthest ... The only possible image for peace is the universal mother , her alone give peace as she give life in the same breath ... Only the mother voice exceed silence ... For me the mathematical equation symbolizing peace is the Euler formula ...Which equation is there before and after anything can be as his lying ground as the mother womb ... For those who will mock my claim read this before laughing 😊:
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"Sound is Brahman" https://twitter.com/anirbanbandyo/status/1742143258426314963 |
Music is ALL the things described in this forum. It can also be a life experience where we are fully resonating with the performance, and the time, date, sounds, smells, visuals, and emotional bonds with others are recorded. When the music is reproduced in our homes, it opens a gateway to recalling the the moment in time when those experiences occurred, exponentially elevating the emotional attachment to the music. |
So true! Happy new year...
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We take it for granted that sound is everywhere, but it's not. In most of the universal vacuum there is only an ultra-low frequency hum in some gas and dust clouds. All other sounds are non-existent, and even that hum is not audible to sentient beings. Sound is a luxury of having an atmosphere. It is incredibly rarefied compared to the whole of the universe. |
Sound is not ONLY the wave in the medium... The waves structures and forms convey infornation ... It is first the vibrating body source which vibrate even in the empty void...We cannot hear it without a medium , that does not mean that sound does not exist as " internal music of the sound source " ...Earth vibrate as any living organism... Music is the informative qualities associated with the sound source vibrating body ...With or without a medium to convey it message ... Sound as qualitative information related to a vibrating source composition, a rock or a not riped yet fruit or as a cavernous metallic sphere or as a wood flute , exist as the prime numbers exist and as music exist as the transcendent circle which is perfect exist, before any ears even existed , they exist in the source or call it God ... Anyway even a black hole has a sound which no one can hear because it is so low only angels can hear it ...But sound exist as sound source vibrating in the void, as a tuning fork will vibrate between stars even if we could not hear it we will see it vibrating.... |
As a maker and purveyor of orgonite for the past ten years, I understand what you are saying - there are vibrations we experience that are not acoustic but which suggest sound as we interact with them and which give us something analogous to sound when searching for descriptions. My orgonite can be "flavored" with different additives such as lithium crystals, beryllium crystals, moldavite, etc. that all give an impression that something akin to sound is interacting with us and that this sound can vary quite a bit, which just further argues that acoustic sound is probably made up of things and influences beyond the wave forms accessible to us on oscilloscopes. |
Any vibrating materials, a flute, an iron sphere with a hole or without a hole, a piece of shungite or of quartz, a fruit which is ripe or not ripe, a human speaking voice; anything as a sound potential vibrating source OWN his vibratory imprint and transmit it trough a medium as air when put in vibratory modes ... The air is only the medium for the waves transmitting these imprint information coming from the vibrating sound sources "qualities" and recognized and/or decoded by the ears/brain ... We dont know HOW exactly the ears/brain recognize "immediately" or at his high speed time ratio beating the Fourier uncertainty between frequency and time for example more than ten times and interpreted this information ABOUT the qualitative signature and nature of the sound vibrating sources... Read what said Magnasco an acoustician : «"In seminars, I like demonstrating how much information is conveyed in sound by playing the sound from the scene in Casablanca where Ilsa pleads, "Play it once, Sam," Sam feigns ignorance, Ilsa insists," Magnasco said. "You can recognize the text being spoken, but you can also recognize the volume of the utterance, the emotional stance of both speakers, the identity of the speakers including the speaker’s accent (Ingrid’s faint Swedish, though her character is Norwegian, which I am told Norwegians can distinguish; Sam’s AAVE [African American Vernacular English]), the distance to the speaker (Ilsa whispers but she’s closer, Sam loudly feigns ignorance but he’s in the back), the position of the speaker (in your house you know when someone’s calling you from another room, in which room they are!), the orientation of the speaker (looking at you or away from you), an impression of the room (large, small, carpeted)» https://phys.org/news/2013-02-human-fourier-uncertainty-principle.html
To all this for sure we can add vibrations or pattern in vibrations resulting from non acoustic influences, which may be other non audible vibrations or supra sensible information ... Any minerals own his own "signatures"; even water can memorize any minerals signature ( Nobel prize winner Luc Montagnier) ...i will stop here for this matter...😊 |
I made enough experiments with various minerals to understand what you spoke about... But if you mention that they will put you a "tin foil hat" insult ...Ignorance rule as well with or without the clothing of established science ... I prefer science in the making with inter disciplinary sciences, philosophy included , using my modest experiments to develop my "opinion" ...
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Setar and tombak.... The setar in the lute family is very small and magical... Kiya Tabassian give many concert in Montreal where i think he lives ... He seems to me that this music is there to elevate consciousness not to merely distract or please it .... Consciousness change when the content in the thought process is no more a mere sensible content but a suprasensible one too through the body of the musicians and the listener....Then many consciousness unite together participating in one content ....This is music and speech well done and poetry....The same is true for any geometric object meditation ...But with music the heart dance with the mind and the body .... And anyway the heart is a polyhedron...And the heart create his own music... listen to this documentary about the heart polyedron specific shape ...
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Weaving is a women working activity which inspired a lot sufism and his poetry and singing and music...
Weaving is related to rythmical gesture, geometrical pattern and the image/ground metaphor .... Sound is always a conscious experience together in singing and working as old as fire ... Music is spiritual flames coming from the heart...The goal of music is uniting and going over this world through this world ...
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If music was only a question about our "tastes", there will be no mystery at all for us... We will be only programmed robots by specific habits and specific society and we will call our program our dearest "taste" it will even conflate with our "flag" in war time ... Music would only be a consumers products for leisure as intended by our older brain the limbic system and amygdala circling around primary recognized emotions ... But music is the occasion to liberate ourself from these programs and becoming conscious of them and of their meanings and starting from that deconditioning of our "tastes", music can speak to the higher brain or to the superior part of the mind and reactivate the heart on a new path , a more universal one way over primal satisfaction ...It is why listening to others culture music is essential...Deprogramming and then free conscious reprogramming BY US ... Music and sounds are tools to reprogram ourselves on a higher consciousness levels ...Not merely tastes habits so necessary they could be nor herd hits favorites... Some musicians are more talented than others for doing that in any styles, genres or cultures... |
Reincarnation is a fact for those who knows or for those who study and remember .. Read the OM SETI case of Dorothy Eady ... A british born girl remembering his life in Egypt as lover of Seti in London and who became self taught a top recognized egyptologist... One of the best love story ever written, she made love with Seti even during his life as Dorothy Eady ...Read his book ...
Now listen to this songs in Farsi from many thousand years ago in Persia and remember one of your probable life perhaps... Music is mystery manifested as evidences as well as evidence manifested as mysteries...Music spoke....
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A metronome or a tuning fork are clocks, and as you know the basis and ground of all music is rythm , synchronizing set of clocks or instruments or bodies keeping the various rythm flows together... Listening music is reclocking his brain ...Elevating our consciousness levels... For those of you who may think that i am in poetry and metaphors...Stop right here and look at this 43 seconds video by the greatest researcher and the more revolutionary one on consciousness and A. I. and A.C. ( artificial consciousness) ... His video describe something in his book "nanobrain", one of the most important book i ever read:
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The mystery of high end audio is way more mysterious than that of music. When someone figures out how high end audio really works let me know. It’s hard to make any sense out of a lot that is written about it. We’re talking Twilight Zone here in many cases folks. Where normal things don’t happen very often…. Cue Rod Serling. 🪄 Could it be magic? |
No the so called by you " mystery" of high end audio is relatively easy to decipher... Buy books on sound and acoustic and go on read the valuable indications on many forums and articles about acoustics ...I summarized it all with my three working dimensions embeddings controls basic concept ... If i could do it for myself with a budget system any body can do it if he dare to STUDY AND EXPERIMENT ...And low cost system or high end high cost one dont change the necessary embeddings controls tasks in mechanical, electrical and acoustical working dimensions of the system synergy ... Then Audio high end is not a mystery but a set of questions and answers and experiments... Sound and music are the science mystery not high end audio, which is only a set of engineering tasks and a set of experiments to do for the audiophiles... ... Audio high end is a"mystery" for passive consumers buying gear as upgrades in a frustrating series of stopgap and obsessive race in their journey ...Many collected 40 amplifiers or as many speakers without learning how to embed them EVEN ONE satisfactorily enough to forgot obsession about sound and focus on music ... Studies protected me of this dead end obsession, and indicate me what to do , nevermind the gear price, to reach a minimal optimum of S. Q. with the gear i could afford and accordingly to his design quality level... And trust me even with a relatively low cost system as mine it is good enough to forget higher costlier products temptation and frustrations ... Creativity and acoustics rules audio...No mysteries here ...
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The mystery of high end audio ( as opposed to mere good sound) revolves around the fact that it can’t seem to be quantified or detected consistently in any objective way. It is somewhat of a phantom thing and different for each and It seems to require special ears with mysterious capabilities to really know…audio mystics in a sense. The one thing about it that can be reliably discerned is it usually comes for a premium cost which is high end. That makes sense and can be detected consistently by all including mere mortals. Otherwise, it’s hard for mere mortals to judge. Maybe the mystery is part of the appeal? That makes sense, I think. |
No it is not whatever people think it is... Sorry...
High end audio is grounded in psychoacoustics... The latest revolution is the BACCH filters which corrected stereo flaws in any system at any price ... No mystery here , it is acoustical physics using inner ear and HTRF, head transfer related functions... What you want to say had no relation to audio objective set of parameters which are not electronical and electrical merely, but mechanical, acoustical and psychoacoustical measures... No mystery here...It is technological basic task for designers or audiophiles who learn them ... But the mystery in science exist here : what is hearing , how it is grounded in the ears structures and dynamic and brain and in time and frequencies, why cant we explain hearing only with Fourier maps ? etc Another mystery and a deeper one, is the relation between sound and consciousness levels...We had spoken a bit about it in this thread... This thread is not about audio gear system but about the mystery of the sound/music relation ... Another mystery is the concept of "meaning" in thinking and perception and in body gesture dynamics (speech) , as a non purely physical and non purely mental phenomenon but an embodied one integrating the two by synchorization at all scales from hertz to megaHertz and Gigahertz by what Anirban called time crystals ....
The way this integration is done is explained in the book "nanobrain" by the Indian genius Anirban ... «How information grows in Fractal Information Theory (FIT), this growth of information forms a structure that is like playing music, so we call it Geometric Musical Language (GML). In order to understand this video, please run it several times. You can notice that a triangle is embedded in the sphere in the beginning. This is the most fundamental unit of information. The geometric shape does not have to be always a triangle, it could be a square, or other 2D or 3D geometric shapes. So, the topological information of any big size data should hold inside this normalized sphere, we call it phase sphere. Now, one could notice that the corner of a geometric shape blasts and a new sphere is born. As the sphere rotates you can see three spheres are born. Each sphere holds a new and unique geometric shape. So, from one sphere, three spheres are born. Then at the corner points of these spheres, new spheres are born. We are showing here three times, because if we take three steps, the central layer is independent of environment. This is how information grows in nature. Note that the unit of information follows neither quantum information theory, nor classical information theory. This is fractal, undefined in both classical information theory and quantum information theory.»
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No psycho as in psychoacoustics is studies and concepts and parameters controls experiments done statistically with all subjects, average dude or maestros and musicians ...
This thread is not about high end audio... 😊 Anything in high end audio is parametrized by acoustics... Read about acoustics... We dont need special ears to tune a room or a system , only to know the basic concepts and experiment with them ... And the "phantom thing" as in the phantom image is a very well understood acoustic phenomenon ... There is no mystics in audio, only ignorance or knowledge... There is in sound experience and in music experience , some mystical experience, which are change in consciousness and attention levels yes, this is caused by the way frequencies and rythm affect the heart/body/mind...... This has nothing to do with audio system ... Speech -singing-dancing is the basic human experience about sound and music... The mysteries are here not in audio engineering or among audiophiles consumers ... 😁
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The mystery of sound can be manifested to a consciousness on a bad radio or anywhere... The mystery of music is not even related to audio playback ...
For sure the mystery of sound is THROUGH a playback system and THROUGH ears/brain manifested to a consciousness prepared to perceive it ... But this mystery is for consciousness in sound perception and music perception and is not directly related to engineering audio system nor to IMMEDIATE unreflective perception... I am sure you understand what i spoke about because we discuss as gentlemen do ...
But most narrow mind dont want to understand anything for example this poster insulting all those who differ and participated ...
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Just as a sidenote, is there anyone who would not agree that good sound quality helps open up more fully all the dimensions in which music exists and that one might choose to explore, enjoy, and perhaps even become affected by? Isn’t that what it is all about? Pretty mystical, I’d say.
Good listening!
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On this point you are right for sure!😊 The mystery of sound is not related to engineering audio as such as i said, it is all about acoustics , with the relation between the body in some acoustic environment , designed by human or not ... Think about Church architecture, Egyptian temple acoustic, prehistoric site:
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I spoke many times about Goethe method of "exact sensorial imagination" as Goethe use it in his studies about colors, plant morphology and mammals morphology...
I recommended the book of Wolfgang Schad about the morphology of mammals using Goethe method... I recommended physicist Henri Bortoft books about Goethe method , especially his book called "taking appearances seriously" ...
But people often dont have time for books ...
Now in one hour video, prepared to fall of your chair and be introduced to "exact sensorial imagination " in geometry and physiology of the human earth and of the earth core ...
If you dont fall of your chair , you need a boost of your brain ...You are way too slow...😁
The relation with sound and music is easy to made using cymatics video for those who are curious...
The sceptics here who doubt that sound and music can elevate and manifest higher levels of consciousness, higher enough to make us able to perceive evident mysteries which are only hidden to us because we are like robot INATTENTIVE and distracted by our own blind course , these sceptics too need a brain boost ...😁 Their mind is too slow to work adequately ...Sorry...
They need to read Goethe or any genius in art and sciences...or listen to this video more than one times...
Leonardo da Vinci used the same method as Goethe and even Archimedes in mathematical physics... Grothendieck use the same method of creative imagination, "exact sensorial imagination" to create singlehandly algebraic geometry ... Cantor created set theory guided by the limitation of size intuition taken from Mystic experience about the Difference between the absolute and the relative but also by contemplating the Dionysos triple methods apophantic, cataphatic and intuitive non discursive method with which he described celestial hierarchies as manifested in the human body as preparation for the incarnation of Christ ... ( you will not read this in a maths book it is deep and not well known )
All the music of Bach and Bruckner and of Indian and Iranian master or African yoruba masters evoke geometry in time flow in a way or in another ...If we can see it even speech is litteraly a flor of geometric forms produced by consonants and
vowells, if we see them in imagination or trough Cymatics technology ...
We perceive beings as world apart but they are made from the same vortex core , it is ourself who walk world apart at the periphery in our sleep ...
This video in one hour is the best course ever about creativity and mysteries...
Yes exactly as we can learn how to hear and listen or learn how to see and look at, or compensate and balance peripheral attention and focussed attention , we then can learn how to become a "genius" even if we will never got the Nobel prize ... 😎
Listen to the best basic lesson i discover in the form of a video ...
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When i said learning to be a genius, i dont mean it litterally... I mean it in the same way as when we read anything from a genius or look at Nature we became richer and more attentive... As children discovering with an open mind... Music is a teacher , listening any great composers or any great musicians we borrow from them a spark of their genius we use in a proportionate way at our own level to move a bit higher on our journey... Sound is a teacher , music too ...
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How about we go a bit further off the reservation, This interview with Henry Franzoni who is at the top of the heap among Bigfoot researchers slowly morphs into the paranormal or what I prefer to call the supranormal and finally gets into the subject of music. Franzoni in his younger days was an Indie music drummer which has given him insights into what he was "hearing" in some Bigfoot encounters. Franzoni has been "around the block" re: Bigfoot and has had an intimate relationship with native american tribes in the Pacific Northwest. As a conservationist hired to monitor wildlife populations on reservations he heard and saw many, many unusual things.
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There is nothing spiritual nor mystical about sasquatch music which anyway does not exist as recorded music and if it exist cannot be analysed as a musical phenomenon but only as a noise which we cannot even say that is speech... Why not dolphins sounds ? Or bees music ... At least they have been seriously recorded ... And even analysed ... It will be difficult to keep this thread serious ... The OP want to self destruct his thread ?😊 Some had claimed here that nothing about sound and music had a relation to consciousness levels or mystical experience... They will felt vindicated in their sarcasms with this appeal to sasquatch ( why not ghost music because as saquatch ghost exist too but ghosts or dead people at least had been extensively recorded) ... i am certainly too serious ... 😊 I am unable to enjoy comic book... Shame on me...
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@bolong , I was going to comment, but words at the moment escape me...Do you find that occasionally happens to you with regards to reality? |
i am not a perfect human being... No i did not watch the video... But can you explain in a few words as i did when i put a video here WHY WE MUST watch it ... And seeing a sasquatch video without explanation in a thread about sound/music and consciousness , make my enthusiasm cold ... I am sure that you will explain why we must watch one hour of our life time a saquatch video related supposedly to sound mystery ? By the way i believe sasquatch may exist and ghost speaking and recorded exist too ...But what can be the relation with sound music mysteries and consciousness ? thats the only question that interest me .. For sasquatch i had no problem... My problem is that it is not a thread in my mind about a TV show on mysteries in GENERAL...perhaps i was wrong but the video you put at the beginning of the thread is spot on on sound and music deep properties...
I dont pride myself to be open mind , because i am credulous as a children... But i am also dead serious as Mathusalem ...I dont put thread to CATCH people and expose them as closed mind to begin with ... it is child play... The burden of proof is on your shoulder... Why listen to this one hour video in a serious thread about meanings of sound and consciousness levels ? Explain to us what is in this video which could be related to sound perception music meanings and consciousness level ... Before listening a one hour video i must have a reason to do so especially this ONE in this specific thread... I believe sasquatch exist by the way it is only my opinion and i cannot know for sure... Then my reaction dont come from skepticism about sasquatch but come from the way you throw this here WITHOUT EXPLANATION in this thread that i takes seriously ... is it to provoke as you say you did ? then it is child like ...Is there another reason ? write it ...
There is mysteries in Nature but sasquatch is like any natural creature that exist or not , an enigma , a simple question not a mystery in the deep sense of the world related to consciousness as this thread propose when thinking about sounds ...
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