*pairs of speakers
Stuff You Tried To Love
I know we talk a lot about confirmation bias- we buy something and then convince ourselves we like it. Or something like that. But did you ever buy something you wanted to love and just couldn’t make it work? For me, Esoteric X-05 SACD/CD player. Bought from a local who was upgrading to the X-03. Big, beautiful piece of gear, but I couldn’t get used to the sound after 6 months of trying. Sold it to another local- I insisted he listen before he bought and I believe he sold it soon after as well. Totem Forest and Hawk. I loved the whole concept. Slim, easy to live with. Couldn’t get them to work in my room. The Model Ones were much better. I had a couple of other pieces, but this is long enough. BTW, these were bought used without audition.
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ATC SCM19 v.2 speakers Rave reviews abounded, but I was very disappointed. Just lifeless (was using a Hegel H190 at the time). I have had the opportunity to hear several other ATC speakers in the meantime and not once did I hear anything that I would be willing to live with. Only my Spendor A3Rs sounded worse to my ears. This is in the context of the 16 different pairs of spears that I have owned since the late-1980s. I now own JM Reynaud Abscisse Jubiles, which I just love. |
For me it was a Cambridge Audio 840A integrated. When I took my first real step into the audiophile world it was the other amplifier that I was considering. I had already stretched my budget with speakers and wasn't planning to upgrade from my consumer level Onkyo receiver, but it sounded so bad that I couldn't live with it. I wasn't completely ready to give up on home theater, so ended up with an Integer Receiver that I still have have enjoy around 15 years later. I eventually picked up the 840A used with the plan of using its home theater bypass capability to separate out my stereo components. The first issue was it. being incompatible with my Integra receiver which results in a lot of noise (not necessarily its fault). If found a Cambridge Audio receiver for a great price so picked it up with the goal of making the total change and confirming if the 840A had an actual issue, but that combination simply didn't sound good to my ears. I sold the CA receiver to a friend who's still using it and then played around with the 840A as a stereo component. It always sounded digital and grainy to my ears. It was the one that got away so to speak, but once captured it got sent away. It was the gateway to my current Pathos Classic One MKiii integrated by way of trade-in, so it served its purpose. Expectation bias and a sentimental desire to own it were both strong which is likely the only reason that I didn't move it along right away. |
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@viridian The ortofon bronze sounds wonderful with a tube phono preamp. Its a great cartridge. Fremer mentions the use of a tubed phono stage with the bronze in one of his cartridge shootout articles. |
There is also the case of instant love while other pieces slowly become favorites, or in some cases music might fall out of favor. I find it impossible to say why certain music did not click at first while others were instant favorites; there is no obvious characteristics that make sense to me about what I like. Instant favorites include Shostakovich Piano Trio No. 2, Schoenberg's Gurrelieder, Beethoven late string quartets, anything by Schubert, most of Mahler, but, Prokofiev and Bruckner did not initially tickle my fancy. I did not pay much attention to British composers like Britten, Vaughn Williams, Walton and Tippett, but now I like them a lot (throw in Alwyn too). |
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Our consciousness level and our perceptions is related to the ways are oriented our acts of thinking, feeling and willing... Music is a symbolic forms embodied in sounds grounded in the body existing on specific consciousness levels which cannot be perceived and understood as interesting and meaningful by all people in all cultures all at the same time ... The deep meaning of Yoruba speaking drums or Didjeridoo meaningful experience can escape the mind of someone vouching only for Mozart or Miles Davis ...Or rock-pop etc... There is no linear hierarchisation of value from the worst to the bests ... There is only music more able to elevate conscious levels or not and this for a specific person at one point in time in his journey which will make no sense for other people.... But there is a cycle of working thinking-feeling-willing-perceptions which at some point in time ask our consciousness to enlarge itself for a deepest experience and ask us if we are ready to open ourself to something out of our habits... Because of all i just said: music is meanings engrammed and produced by the gesturing body (mouth and members) then the more distant from the creative body music is the less significant it is...( i speak about artificial sounds here not natural sounds) . Then we must be ready to hear and understand Eric Dolphy... And we may prefer didjeridoo to miles Davis or Chet Baker ...Or praise youruba drums over kind of blue... This means nothing for others people... This only reflect a part of our soul journey in music
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I can't imagine that anyone would find the Mal Waldron/Eric Dolphy album "The Quest" unlistenable, but, it is a matter of personal preference. I am often shocked at what clicks with different listeners. A friend asked me for some examples of jazz recordings because he was new to jazz. I supplied an extreme range of albums, and his favorite was Coltrane's "Interstellar Space," an album many find totally inaccessible. Another friend asked for a range of classical recordings; again, I included music from a wide range of styles-- Renaissance to modern. The chosen favorite was Harry Partch "Delusion of the Fury." |
@stuartk - I guess I do miss your point. Penguin Jazz guide rates most very popular titles highly, and some I don't like because they are unlistenable to me (Love Supreme, Eric Dolphy, etc.) but they don't exactly overlap. I like what I like - although not specific to one narrow type of jazz. Mostly late fifties to mid 60's slanted toward smaller (sextet or less typically) groups. I guess the way Sirius XM divides them is how listeners categorize them, and real jazz has most of what I prefer and watercolors has some. It would be nice if they had a progressive (maybe modern?) jazz (or experimental or whatever you want to call it) but I guess the demand isn't there. |
@bolong - I have it on vinyl, just a regular $25 pressing, and it’s the same. The first track has some issues with the recording. I thought it was just my pressing, but your post confirms what I heard as well. |
Since "Kind of Blue" is being knocked about at the moment I need to ask a question. My digital copy has an odd thing that may or may not be natural. The opening horn is making a sound much like that of spittle being blown through the mouthpiece. It could also be distortion from mic-ing improperly. The sound is quite distracting. Anyone else hear this? |
After insulting me which is not a big deal, you propose insulting claims about a genre including the musicians and his public , your disparaging meaningless remarks dont surprize me ... I love jazz by the way among many others genres...
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This is why there is so much great musicians to love... No one is greater than all the others... It is also a soul affair between the musician and us... Not a public affair ... Then it makes no sense to impose some piece of someone saying you must like this if not you are not a jazz lover... i idolize Sun Ra album with Walt Dickerson ( my favorite vibraphonist) as an album as among the greatest as many others cited here and well known if not for me greater 😊.. Am i a jazz ignorant ? 😊
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I proposed that any great jazz afficionado must admire Sun Ra... 😊 I like kind of blue this does not means that i do not in fact listen more often to many others albums... People dont understand that what is the "best of hits " and the most liked is good for sure but it cannot be the best for all and not also the favorite listening for many... |
Three great jazz albums were released in 1959. If you said your favorite was "Kind of Blue" or "Take Five," I would not be sure that you are a serous jazz fan--those great albums were loved by Jazz fans and those who only casually listened to jazz. But, if you said "Shape of Jazz to Come," I would KNOW you are a jazz fan. |
And BTW @stuartk, I would bet any "greatest jazz recording" would be highly rated by Penguin. |
My only point was that any jazz enthusiast ALMOST always is a fan of Kind of Blue. It is recognized as the most popular and accessible jazz album of all time to even the non-jazz listener. It is unique in the makeup of the band in all of Miles' records and sounds unique among them. At least @stuartk you admit to owning it. It's very possible you are tired of it or it isn't enjoyable to you so you don't regularly play it. Anyone else out there consider themselves a jazz fan and not like KoB? If so, what are your favorite jazz albums? Surprisingly, I find Cannonball's Somethin' Else more similar to it than most if not any of Miles' other records. And not surprisingly I guess, it's my second favorite jazz album. |
His life is amazing...His father was himself a writer and a sufi mystic out of city life... he was merely fasting and praying all day long younger... But he sees spiritual life too easy this way... He goes in the world to change it by his action and fortify his own resolve and meditate not in the confort of a cave but in city life ... He is a mystic of high level and his music is not well recorded because he only play in private and family and with selected invitation only for prayers... He improvised to play... he was considered at ten years old as the greatest master of tanbur... his music is only to tune our consciousness toward ectasy by God presence ... all recording were made by disciples using tape recorder ... he never played for show or in public... no other musician i hear is so impressive on a string instruments as improvisation ...very complex rythmic ...
His music is not so much beautiful as captivating and moving as a lava flow carrying all heart... We cannot understand is music out of understanding a true prayer : attention focus on pure love... By the way Yehudi Menuhin goes to see the musician praying with his tanbur, and he said that it was the greatest musical experience of his life.. I bought the first cd because of this recommendation ... As you had heard his tanbur was unique because no one had one with these two chords tuned as vibrating drones... His music is not classical persian music...He improvize it all ...
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Wow. The purpose was simply to share with another member a piece of music I love, and to see if you might love it as well. That’s all. I’d be a little surprised if you didn’t, but wouldn’t judge you. And of course it wouldn’t diminish my love one way or another. Btw, it’s my desert island song. if I had to choose just one. |
Interesting short Bio of Ostad Elahi: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jaw7eWzgWr0 This video explains that Elahi designed an instrument with two strings that are deliberately not quite in tune. I noticed this effect as soon as I began listening to the track. This is a very different approach than what I’m used to as a guitar player! ... And another, longer film: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlK7aYjqY1o
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With all due respect, I don’t see the purpose of this exercise. You could’ve just as easily suggested any one of 100’s of other Jazz recordings and my response would be the same: I recognize the talent and artistic merit but feel more deeply affected by something else. I could say the same for much visual art, much poetry, etc. It is entirely possible to recognize the merit of an artwork while at the same time feeling less engaged by it than some other artwork. There is nothing wrong with having preferences and we needn’t justify our preferences; indeed, the reasons for our preferences are not always easily discernible. However, if our default mode is automatically judging whatever we like as "good" and whatever we don’t like as "bad", that’s a problem, in my view. To clarify, I’m not suggesting you are doing this! I’m merely drawing a comparison.
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People who cannot fathom the fact that we dont like the same styles or genres that they idolize have no idea what music is... Music adress us where we are ... Thinking that we are in a contest or a race about what is the best is complete delusion... listen to this and do me a favor, i think that this man is one of the great musician on this century as Yehudi Menuhin thought also , is it not better than Bye bye Blackbird ? 😊 As you can see we are not from the same mold... ( i like Miles and Chet by the way ) but this dude walk on another planet ... 😁
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I would classify "Kind of Blue" as Modal, rather than Post Bop. Yes, I own it but it's been years since I've listened to it with any regularity. I was introduced to it in 1976, at a point when I was first getting into Jazz by listening to the most well-known Jazz recordings. A few years later, I took a college survey course in Jazz appreciation, in the interest of furthering my familiarity with the genre. It took awhile to get a sense of which artists and recordings particularly resonated with me. The Penguin Guide to Jazz was very helpful in this regard. It listed recordings you won't find mentioned in lists of "greatest Jazz records" or such. Just as with Visual Art, Poetry or any other esthetic field of expression, I trust and follow my own inclinations. |
BTW @stuartk - are you saying you don't own Kind of Blue? That certainly is post bop. |
Me too @stuartk (as far as my jazz preferences-tilted toward blues). I guess I was thinking progressive as jazz fusion or jazz funk, really 70's-80's stuff. @knock1 - I'm not talking about audiophile labeling at all. Not sure why you mentioned me about punching someone's audiophile card. Music preferences do not define audiophiles. And audiophile doesn't compose any specific music preferences. Any type of music along with an audiophile designation represent 2 overlapping circles in a Venn diagram. Or "audiophile" can be a large circle in the middle with each type of music having a circle overlapping it to some degree in the diagram. Some overlap more than others.... |
I've tried a number of things that have been well reviewed, or seemed to have found favor among different forum residents, across several forums. They've all had strengths and weaknesses. Superphon Revelation II pre McCormack DNA 0.5 Deluxe amp Forte Model 3 amp, restored Adcom 5400 amp, restored Acurus L10 pre These were all okay, but lacked any exceptional greatness or synergy with anything else I had on hand at the time. On the other hand, a Nak CA5, or a B&K Pro-10 MC, both of those were really pretty good SS preamps, and matched well with many other pieces. Schitt equipment was mostly unlucky for me, although I did like the Asgard 2 for a good while. |