Agree with @ghdprentice If the files on the drive categorically sound clearly worse than streamed equivalent at CD res, most likely the file contents is “compromised” in some way. Pretty much anything is possible when producing digital music files FBOFW. Even if they are stored at cd resolution that does not necessarily mean something was not lost or changed significantly somewhere in their history.
Sound Quality
First off, I am pleading ignorance here, so my apologies up front, but I need some help on figuring out what this digital stuff is all about. It was simple, just to pull out a CD and play it, but with streaming and such, it seems to be a whole different ball of wax.
After finally finishing the remodel on my home, I've have had a bit of time to sit down and listen to my system. My Aurender N200 came with an SD card loaded with music. Most of it is ripped from hybrid SACDs or at 16bit- 44.1kHz "Original Mastering Recording" CDs, (some are DSF files some WAV files, but all sound the same to me). The music sounds flat and dull but when I play the equivalent song on Tidal in 16bit-44.1 kHz it sounds much better.
I have a second SD card with some HD Tracks CDs at 24 bit-96 kHz that I which sound really good through the N200. Maybe understandable being hi-res, but some say they can't hear a big difference between the two, but I sure can in this instance.
I understand that up sampling, DSD and HQ Player can even bring better sound to the table, but I'm having enough trouble with just the basics here, that stuff is way over my head.
I'd like to rip a couple of my own CDs to a new SD card and try it to compare with the SD card that came with the N200. What is the best method to do this?
As always, your thought & comments are much appreciated!
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@mclinnguy Cool, thanks for checking that for me! I have a few 192 & 96 kHz - 24 bit files that I purchased from HD Tracks but no DSD files, so I will have to source some out and give them a try. Where did you buy your Patricia Barber's Clique DSD 512 from? |
“I need to experiment with all this myself first!” @navyachts One good source to buy DSD is NativeDSD.com. BTW, I am digging the view from your man cave! |
@navyachts Bricasti had two modes to play DSD - NDSD (native dsd) and PCM. Use NDSD and feed it Native DSD from N200. |
@mapman @ghdprentice fer’ sure, I’m sure this was the case. I downloaded the contents of the N200 SD card to an old laptop (for reference ) formatted the drive and have added my HD Tracks hi-res files that I have purchased in the past. I’ll use Tidal/Quboz/whatever to discover music the use the SD card to add new purchases on in the future. Thanks all! |
@navyachts when you buy a hi-res album compare the sound of purchased file vs streaming of the same album. Just curious. I just don’t think purchasing downloads is necessary but hey…you can try and see if it’s worth it for you |
Will do, thanks!
I have done this in sorts, but I need to do it again when I'm better organizes (ha, ha) I am still recovering from the new OS install from trying to access the N200's SD card, (aurender/aurender) beyond lol...
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I am ripping, what CDs I have now, in WAV - Uncompressed. Then will transfer them to the SD card on the N200. I also have a few hi-res albums from HD Tracks to add as well. Any good recommendations for a DSD 256 CD to purchase for a test drive, maybe something a little more obscure that the run of the mill "Top 40"? |
“Any good recommendations for a DSD 256 CD to purchase for a test drive”@navyachts Are you asking recommendation for a DSD256 file? I am not aware of any CD’s that has DSD256 resolution. |
I agree but the price of admission is totally worth it (to me). You can try a sampler like the one below, https://www.nativedsd.com/product/2xhdft1248-audiophile-analog-collection-vol-3/ |
Yes, the above recording is definitely not top 40 😁 One guy, one guitar, recorded live non-stop in a small room. I bought it, I like it, if you want a pure DSD recording this is it. Read the recording process, sample the tracks to see if it appeals. Looks like it is 15% off, and one more day for 20% storewide for Native DSD’s 10 year anniversary sale. |
At the risk of sounding like a pedantic a**hole, there is a difference between an SD card (secure digital) and an SSD (solid state drive). The OP keeps using the term SD card. I realize the confusion has been cleared up, as it was asked twice, but it’s important to use the correct language in order to get relevant answers. |
@jastralfu Yes, you are correct, my bad, I'm sorry. |
@navyachts no apologies necessary my friend. Hope you are enjoying your new streamer. I’ve been on the hunt for one myself. Not sure whether to get an Aurender or an Innuos. |
@jastralfu Thanks! I don't think you can go wrong with either. |
You make it sound like the N200 is just not that good :( If you are finding that streaming FLAC sounds better than WAV files, something is seriously wrong. WAV files are the original unaltered format that anything else has to try to sneak in being unnoticeably different from, since people are cheapskates about letting their collections take up space. I use Audirvana on PC, and I can directly compare streaming FLAC vs local WAV's. While the streamed FLAC's sound slightly muddy compared to local, the FLAC part is agitating even locally compared to uncompressed. Local WAV files are so noise free, that I feel like falling asleep with them compared to FLAC. I also find that local files on ssd's sound quieter than mechanicals, but I have to admit, both sound like I'm getting more confident reads than optical disks ever gave, with all of that ECC and making sure you only record at 4x business. I theorized that a thumb drive would beat my 2.5 ssd, due to lower power draw from not trying to max out SATA speed, but I could tell no difference between the two. I ended up getting a little square drive that's about the size of 2 thumb drives, with a little cable, instead of the thumb drive, because it can read and write at around 900mb/s, given the chance. If you still have cd's to rip, nothing on PC could beat Exact Audio Copy, thanks to it's extreme error detection and correction capability. I haven't heard of newer software that can beat it, but since most people are probably already done with ripping, I doubt anything will come out that beats it, either. DSD is nice and natural, but it's too bad that since they can't be edited, you will probably only get remastered old tapes and live performances that way. At least lots of gear is throwing in dsd decoding chips also into their designs. Listening to "The Chicks" for a change, and wow, talk about life wasn't already them! Maybe I'll buy a new high purity cable, so that the rest of the women find out they'll have a hard time beating them.
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@audioisnobiggie The N200 sounds fine. Thanks for your thoughts on WAV over FLAC. I am re-ripping my CD library in WAV files and using dBpoweramp to do so. I ordered the inexpensive DSD sampler from Native DSD and give it a try. |
@sandthemall - lossless IS lossless. Bit to bit. Decompressed file is exactly the same as it was before compression. Think about zip compression. Your word document is exactly the same after decompression, nothing is lost. Similarly, you can zip Wav files and then unzip it and it will come out exactly the same. There is strong math behind lossless compression. It does not drop any bits. |
The theory is that the act of decompressing a file somehow affects the sound by creating temporal delays resulting in jitter. It a few years ago but someone claimed blind listening tests showed thar WAV files were superior in sound. I don’t know from any listening tests I’ve participated in so I went with WAV just in case there is something to this (storage is cheap). The manufacturer of my server—Naim—recommends WAV files, another reason to go in that direction for me. |
@mikhailark @larryi OK, thanks, I am riding the WAV! |
Also want to point out that at least in the early days, DSD promoters were caught cheating by juicing up DSD releases via significant added EQ.
Also, while talking about DSD, please check out the small but mighty Blue Coast Records. |
@navyachts Remember also, that everything on Internet is sliced into chunks and compressed before transmission and decompressed back. Bandwidth is money so all data is sliced into chunks, wrapped into packets, transmitted frequently out of order and reconstructed at the receiving end. Local network might be the same. File is never transmitted as file in a single chunk. There is no “stream” from Tidal to you, traffic is all pieces often out of order. So there :-) |
@larryi yeah i heard about it too, but cant seem to find the information. It is theoretically possible, if computer is slow and memory is limited. Maybe old iPod with hard disk, remember those? I cant imagine modern programs decompressing file in small pieces, it should be enough memory to allocate enough space and decomp the entire file before playback. On the other hand, i have seen manufacturers skimping on CPUs and emloying puny ARMs in music servers… |
“I am riding the WAV!” Thank you for your recommendation. I bought the DSD256 download…loving the album and spine tingling hair SQ. |
I’ve come full circle here and returned to CDs for digital and use Tidal for discovery or if I just want convenience. CD in a high end transport sounds superior to me. That includes DSD which I have also streamed through my DAC. I’m no expert but something is affecting the fidelity when it is uploaded, stored, sent via internet, computer, and finally DAC vs simply read CD and send to DAC. The litmus test says the latter. |
funny, just before I read your post I read this one: you may find it interesting edit: don't know if that link worked- it is the post by @jmeyers on June 1 |
@upstateaudiophile I have run into this before. I thought a CD played via a CD player sounded slightly better as streaming music via the LAN connection on my Gustard R26. I haven't played a CD and compared it to the Aurender N200 and Briscati M1 SEII and probably won't at this point as I don't currently have a CD player and am not planning on purchasing one in the near future, I'm done for now. |