I am a seller. I receive an offer. I immediately counter-offer. The potential buyer declines it. Is the buyer still bound to his original offer for the orignal 48 hrs.?
My opinion is if you declined the buyer's original offer then the buyer is not obligated to buy anything. I suggest you pose that question to Audiogon to be sure.
One thing I would avoid is dealing with people who want to contact your via "in mail" on the site, then want to negotiate outside of the formal Audiogon "offer" method.
I had a guy who said he had all sorts of questions about the unit I was selling, asked for my phone number, called me, we settled on a price, then when he arrived at my home to pick up the unit, said he thought about it and decided to offer me $600 less. So I sent him packing.
Get ready. If you contact him again saying you’ll accept the original offer, 100$ says he offers less the second time. He’ll think you’re desperate. Good luck
Fishing is a tough business. It's a big ocean and fish can be hard to find. Once you get one on the line, get him into the boat then you're done. Let him get away and you don't know when the next one is going to come along, and it's just as likely as not that it will be smaller.
You have to ask yourself: "Do I want a sale bad enough to accept an offer? Or would I rather squeeze the lemon and possibly blow up any sale?" Strictly either/or.
Agree with many above. If you decline an offer or decline and counter offer, the offer you received is gone. You declined it. No obligation exists on the buyers part and you have no right to it as a seller. Good luck.
The burden is on the offer. In real estate you list price X, potential offers Y, you counter Z. Potential declines or simply doesn’t sign/respond to the counter offer... back to zero. Negotiation over for that offer “cycle”.
Legally, there can only be one offer on the table. So there is no such thing as "counter-offer" it's I offer, you declined, you offer, etc. This is how offer works, here on the web or in real life, FYI.
All you guys are entitled to an opinion, but there ought to be a rule for the site that everyone knows in advance or it is not a fair trading platform. This should not be a questionable area, but a known and published set of rules. Consider a highway speed sign: should it say drive at a safe speed or---should it have a fixed limit that everyone understands.
There isn't anything vague here. He received an offer, he declined. Case closed. Simple. What isn't simple is that he now wishes he had accepted the offer.
What's "questionable"? Common sense dictates that once the offer is declined it's off the table. Making a counter-offer is declining the offer. You're basically saying "No, I don't accept your offer, but will accept ________". Do you really need a "rule" for that?
I like the offer feature. But you have to understand you're taking a risk if you make an offer or a counter-offer.
If an item is for sale and there's a price listed and you're willing to pay it, you don't risk the sale getting away from you. If someone makes an offer, you know you've got a buyer. Take the offer, or hope someone buys it at the listed price. That's the risk.
It can work either way. I wanted to get a particular headphone amp and saw one listed here for about 60% off MSRP. I made an offer for a little less than the asking price and the seller got back to me yesterday just before my offer was set to expire and said he'd had second thoughts and decided to keep the item and cancelled the listing. Had I just paid the asking price, he probably would have sold it to me.
That left me kind of bummed out, since I couldn't find any other second hand pieces at any price. I was kicking myself for not buying it, and my favorite audio retailer (Echo Audio) posted one for just a little more than the other person's asking price and I snapped it up.
Long story short, I could have saved money by just paying the asking price and not making an offer. I might still be looking for one if I hadn't gotten lucky and had one pop up right after that one got away.
Here’s a quick lesson in hi-pressure sales technique that occasionally needs to be employed:
NEVER TALK PAST THE CLOSE!! Accept the offer and say thanks.
If you didn’t want to sell it, you wouldn’t advertise it. Think of how much better the cash will look in your bank statement rather than how that unwanted gear looks collecting dust. When you get a qualified buyer, do NOT allow him/her to escape. Otherwise, like quite a few members with listings currently running, you might as well get a nice cat condo to put your old stuff on while you pet it.
Legally, at least in the US, the answer is no. Once you counter, that is an implied rejection of the original offer. Full stop. I can find the UCC cite.
If the customer walks what do you have then? 0 + 0 = 0. Great time to add to the sale and increase your revenues when you get them to part with their money rather than sitting on your inventory. There is something called the cost of money. People want to walk out thinking they got a deal. The same applies to when you purchase a car. How many consumers walk out of car dealership paying full list price? So, why should selling audio gear be any different.
I receive real estate listings from a realtor and have yet to see a pair of speakers in a room. So this means how many people actually buy audio gear in the first place? What are dealers then doing to educate people and to create interest? i have yet to see a TV commercial from a audio dealer other than TV's. This is why you see $5,000 entertainment furniture with a wide screen TV and no speakers when sound is probably 70% of the experience.
I like the system as it is set up with the counter offer in place, with that said I made an offer on a turntable, a brand I wanted to try, that was 10% lower than the asking price which the seller declined and I moved on, about 3 weeks later he reached out and asked if I was still interested and I purchased it for my original offer. The seller was a member in good standing and I left him his positive feedback but he never left mine for me, just chalked it up to maybe he was a little upset at not getting his asking price, but who knows. I also use the counter offer system to great effect when selling here and on the other sites. Enjoy the music
This thread gets me to thinking...I'm a licensed Realtor. Let's say I list a house for a client for $500,000 and we receive an offer for $450,000. We could counter, for example, at $480,000. Here's the rub: while the buyer is mulling over our counter-offer, we receive an offer for full price. Legally, however, the first buyer has the prerogative to accept our counter despite our having a second buyer willing to pay more. In my practice, I don't counter: I invite the buyer to make a new offer just for that possible scenario. If you counter on Audiogon, does the Buyer have 48 hours to accept or decline?
One of the problems here is the obvious disagreement over VALUE. In my completely unfounded opinion (CUO), the main weakness with bargaining is the implicit admission by both parties that 1) they don’t know how much it’s really worth and 2) they’re both out to screw every last penny out of the other guy. Some people really enjoy it, but most people don’t CUO. Some sellers must be feeling the squeeze by now but I guess their audio slush funds are tied to their stock portfolio and they can’t get off the pony. Used prices are too high. Half of MSRP is really a high price if it’s out of warranty. Seems like that’s become the new “used list price.” Great for audio consultants in the dealer network who have used a new piece (on accommodation) for effectively no cost. So if your big power amp retailed for $2000, it should sell used for a maximum of $1000 for a #10 condition. Then, technological age and condition are the only problems.
One of the problems here is the obvious disagreement over VALUE.
Not sure why that is a problem. The market will sort it out. Buyers will pay what something is worth to them and sellers will adjust their pricing based on their level of desire to sell and their willingness to wait for a buyer who will pay their price. That is the definition of free enterprise.
"Austinbob" in my area if another buyer offers a higher price then other potential buyer(s) have the right to match the new higher offer. Not lock in at their (lower) price. See this happening a lot lately-a bidding war.
As to the original post:
NO. There are no remaining obligations on either side. You declined his offer. Case closed. Negotiations are over.
You are free to re-engage but that is a different discussion.
I have been on both sides of this fence. I like dealing with experienced Audiogon sellers because their listings are almost always fairly priced. If you want the item and it appears to be a fair asking price, why insult the seller by asking to accept less? The condition of the item plays a big part and you should expect to pay a premium for something that is a cut above the normal. I would suggest that rather than ask the seller to reduce the asking price, you should attempt to negotiate the shipping charges, as they can be substantial these days. If an item is obviously over-priced, by all means make an offer, but keep it reasonable, don't lowball. The seller may have something listed in the future that you really want, and you don't need for them to have a bad taste in their mouth over a past transaction. I feel Audiogon's policies on offers/counteroffers is about as fair as it can be.
I always list with the buy now only. If someone wants to make an offer they will email me and if I accept I will change the price and the deal is done. I’ve been selling here since 2004 and I have never had a problem doing it that way!
Rather than make an official counteroffer, I sometimes will tell the potential buyer what I'd accept and leave it up to them to submit another offer. For example, let's say I'm selling a piece for $1000, and someone offers $850. I will decline the offer but send a note thanking them and saying that I would accept $925 but won't go lower. Then it's up to them to decide whether that price is acceptable. If they offer anything lower, I just decline with a "no thanks."
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