I would like to upgrade from a Bluesound Node to a higher quality streamer.
The Node sounds fine with my current system, but I am making a second system for my wife, and the Node is going to that new system. I thought I would take the opportunity to upgrade my streamer at this time.
My criteria are that it be a streamer only (no DAC/storage/CD player, etc), be able to hook into wi-fi/cloud without a physical wire/connection, have balanced outputs to go to my DAC, and cost less than 2,500 USD. Can anybody think of a streamer that fits this bill?
I had a Node 2i and upgraded to a Lumin U1 Mini and thought it worthwhile. There was an improvement for sure, especially in imaging and sense of air. More subtle than a DAC upgrade though. The OP already has an excellent DAC, A streamer upgrade will allow him to utilize it’s full potential.
One consideration is how the streamer will access ripped or purchased music files so worth looking into the particulars of that with respect to any given streamer.
The OP wants wireless. The Lumin must have wired ethernet. I did not have easy access to wired ethernet where I have my Lumin but used an TP Powerline extender. This solution works flawlessly and is what a prominent retailer recommends.
Full disclosure - I’m co-owner and developer of the Network Acoustics Ethernet Filters.
I wanted to add to this thread the result of my experience over many years of trying to achieve the best sound from streaming based systems.
I’ve listened to the following Ethernet delivery methods, which have been mentioned in this thread, all using the same Auralic Aries Femto streamer.
1. Direct wired physical connection via RJ45 from upstream network switch
2. Inbuilt Wireless connection.
3. Ethernet over the mains power-line extenders to the Auralic RJ45 port.
4. Ethernet from a WiFi extender to the Auralic RJ45 port.
5. Media converters, RJ45 to Optical and then Optical back to RJ45 and into the Aries RJ45 port.
To my ears, the order of sound quality was 1., 2., then 3. and 4. were pretty much the same, and the 5. Option 1. is still the way to go if at all possible.
The thing that changes everything though, when using all these options other than built in wireless, is to try to remove the ‘noise’ that Ethernet is infected with.
Option 1. has less noise, whereas the extra devices used in options 3., 4. and 5. Introduce additional noise.
you can reduce noise in all options (except 2.) by having an Ethernet switch (with decent PSU) between the ‘extending device RJ45 output’ and your streamer. The noise can be further reduced by using passive Ethernet filters too.
I’ve found with the correct noise reduction measures in place, options 3. and 4. Can sound very very close to 1. and better than 2.
I’m afraid that I’ve never managed to get option 5. to sound good, but still working on that.
You lost me here: have balanced outputs to go to my DAC.
What do you mean by ’upgrade to higher quality’? Quality of what? As long as the signal is in the digital domain there is no upgrade in the sound. You plan to use a separate DAC, so all you need from the streamer is to have a good wifi connection and a nice user interface. The Bluesound is very good at that. Any Apple or Android tablet, or a silent laptop or fanless PC will do fine too.
I use a Lindemann Limetree Bridge. It is excellent. Solid as a rock, very good sound quality. Outputs are Coax/ Toslink only. It drives a Denafrips Ares 2 then Tube Hybrid Vincent pre/ power amps.
@tahsin1022+1 on Lumin U1 or U2 but they are not wireless as the OP asked for, I think the OP should reconsider and try to figure out a wired connection otherwise he is not going to be able to optimize for ultimate SQ.
I know the Vault is not an option but just in case I wanted to share that I have two Vaults over 5 years and both failed, the first was replaced the second not. It failed during an upgrade, but since out of warranty all they offered was a reconditioned older unit at half the retail.
I wonder how I can still have hifi equipment from the 1980s that works fine and a reputable manufacturer such as Bluesound seems to be OK with some of their equipment failing within 3 years.
Why do you never read about Streamer A vs Streamer B ? Cause noboby
can hear a difference.
this is overly simplistic, and incorrect
different streamers sound different because they manage noise, clocking, power supply, and physical isolation differently - the sonic difference can be quite noticeable to quite subtle to insignificant... depending on the network, cabling, and of course the quality of system downstream to resolve those differences
If source is not gonna be combined DAC, don’t waste your money with more expensive servers, at the end all sends 0 and 1s to DAC.
Haha! I was waiting for the '0s and 1s' argument to show up. Applying the same logic, why invest in a nice DAC or DDCs. It's all 0s and 1s after all, right?
You already have Terminator 2 as a DAC. If you have node as well, buy Denafrips Gaia. Digital to Digital converter which will improve all the problems of Node before sending signal to Terminator 2, you get significant improvement without extra 5K. Gaia is $1800. If source is not gonna be combined DAC, don’t waste your money with more expensive servers, at the end all sends 0 and 1s to DAC.
Streamers without DACs sound broadly similar in my experience. However you do need a good interface to access your music which you lose by abandoning Bluesound. I recommend Roon - it is even better than Bluos and will revolutionize your listening. You would need a 'roon-ready’ streamer. I recommend Pro-Ject Stream box S2 ultra as a good wifi or wired streamer (no dac). Or the Auralic Aries G1. The latter is a lot more expensive but in my a/b testing was no better in sound quality.
Bricasti M5 Network Streamer took my streaming to another level. Only an Ethernet cable, no Wifi, no computer cables, just a network connection. Should be a good companion to your Terminator. Check it out
Your DAC has an I2s in. You should find a streamer with I2s output. Ps Audio is coming out with the AirLens in October for $2K. It will galvanically isolate from the wired ethernet..not sure about wifi..but personally I prefer wired if I can get rid of ethernet noise and that will be what the AirLens does..then I2s out and that should go directly into your DAC and since I2s carries all clock information, the DAC doesn't have to reconstruct the streamer's output.
Don't be fast to dump your Freya+. Paired with the M1200s? Yum.
IMHO Try your darnedest to avoid WiFi. Run a cable. (CAT6 is good for about 300'.) It takes time, but you get used to drilling holes through your walls. And floors. And those long drill bits are cool.
I love the optical isolation from Sonore but I use Roon. Not sure but I think it can do streaming w/o roon. You might need computer then. Innuos would be nice choice. Hear their app is very good. Ephoney is good too. Not sure of the spelling there
Thanks, @ghasley . I didn't realize that AES/EBU is a balanced design. I always thought that although you can use an XLR cable but it's not truly balanced.
Another great option is Innuos Zen MK3. It doesn't support wireless, but as audphile1 mentioned, there are ways around it. I also have a Terminator II and it is paired with Innuos Zen's bigger brother -- Innuos Zenith MK3. I love this combo!
I don't understand what OP means by 'balanced output' into a DAC. Also, why are you excluding streamers with good DACs? You can always bypass it if need be.
If the OP can loosen some of the requirements, Hifi Rose RS250 is a good option that has built-in wifi. There are a number of folks on audiogon who have purchased this streamer and are quite happy with the performance. However, it does have a built-in DAC.
AURALiC Aries G1 is wireless, has AES/EBU (balanced) output and used costs less than $2500.
But….you can get a WiFi access point and wire a non-WiFi streamer. Now you have many more options to consider. I use EERO access point to wire my network player. It’s no big deal.
I would hope that you compare the Node with the much more expensive streamers, especially if you're sending the signal out to a good DAC. You could save thousands if you don't hear a difference.
OK I don't get it... I don't get power cables either but I'm wrong again. I've been using WIFI to my fanless PC streamer and have had a plugin access point for years with an ethernet port so to hook it up I just had to dig up a long enough ethernet cable and try it.... and dang it sounds better than WIFI. It's WIFI to the extender WTF??? The only thing I can figure is the ethernet port is on a different bus than the WIFI port and it lowers the noise floor.
Please don’t waste your money on a Aurender or any other high $$$ streamer if you cannot use a wired ethernet connection with a Wi-Fi extender powered by linear power supply.
And if you’re not using ROON, you are going to miss the already excellent BLUOS app with so many cloud based streaming options.
I am a big advocate of high quality streamers. I have used many approaches and a number of dedicated streamers and highly recommend Aurender… I now own two… see my UserID.
I recommend looking at two components for upgrade… the Freya+ as well as the streamer. I would upgrade the streamer first… but perhaps stretch you budget a bit to $3.5K - $5K to better match your othe components. You may not get the full value of your system until you do your preamp as well.
Also, don’t worry about connectivity. Just get a wall wart extender for your streamer… plug it next to your audio system and plug your streamer in to it. I had a Aurlic Aries G2 for about a year which I struggled with… I had bought it because it had internal wIFI. Then I bought my first Aurender and a wall wart extender and sound quality and all my problems went a way. I know of a number of $150K systems operating this way.
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