How to Connect DAC's USB Port to Ethernet Cable

Using a  USB-B to ethernet adapter (actually it is an RJ45 to USB B Receiver) is not likely to properly convert the signals into USB at the DAC unless the computer is sending the signals from its USB output via a complementary USB A to RJ45 Transmitter.

@bigby I own M3.
the network card in the Bricasti is capable of DSD128 native. To use Bricasti native DSD processing set DSD setting to NDSD. You will be streaming DSD128 via network and the DAC will handle it. 

Otherwise if you have and want to play DSD256 files you need a streamer or computer connected to the M21 via USB. There’s no other way that I know of. You sure your DSD files are 256?
 

+1, The Bricasti M21 DAC can stream DSD files up to 128 via an Ethernet connection, functioning as a DLNA-compliant media renderer. It supports various digital inputs, including Ethernet, which allows for seamless integration with networked audio systems.

>> However, it does not support streaming DSD256 files over Ethernet; the maximum for Ethernet is DSD128. For DSD256 playback, USB input is required.

Ethernet to USB adopters are available on Amazon but I have no info on the signal quality of the format conversion.

FYI:  USB-to-Ethernet adapters can provide reliable signal quality, but performance varies based on the adapter type. USB 2.0 adapters support speeds up to 100 Mbps, while USB 3.0 and USB-C adapters can achieve up to 2.5 Gbps, offering better stability and speed for demanding applications. However, using a USB adapter may introduce some latency compared to built-in Ethernet ports, though many users report minimal noticeable differences in typical internet applications. Overall, the quality of the adapter and network conditions will significantly impact performance.

TP-Link adopter, see this link.

please search for other options.  
 

@audphile1 I download DSD128 files to my PC using NativeDSD Music. Before downloading, you can select the format. I want to try their DSD256 format.

The DSD128 files sound pretty good, but I have to listen more to tell if there is a difference from Qobuz.

@hgeifman  I'm going to give it a try next week when I get the parts in.

@bigby there are adopters for everything. However, these adapters aren’t made with high quality audio signal in mind. Worth trying if you’re so dedicated to doing it. You can return the adapter if it’s not good. 
 

As to DSD128 vs. Qobuz…I find DSD to sound different but not necessarily better than the 192/24 Qobuz. DSD is usually softer sounding. I wouldn’t get out of my way to hunt down this sound - I rarely play DSD files. But that’s just me. 
 

Ley us know if you get around to it. 

I think dsd sounds much better than 24/192. 
I would stick with Ethernet with dsd. USB you will degrade the sound quality

DACs, including the m21, do not have an ethernet output.

@carlsbad2 There’s an Ethernet input on Bricasti. 

Yes, the ethernet input is only for ethernet.  Try to put a processed signal into it and the DAC will not know what to do with it.  

@carlsbad2 Ethernet is a very low-level protocol for transmitting data packets.  It does not guarantee the timing of those packets, nor even whether they will be delivered.  Higher level protocols can ensure delivery (by retransmitting missing packets).  The contents of the payloads are not determined by Ethernet either - anything that can be processed and expressed as packetised data can be transmitted and that includes every digital audio format.  The transmitter and the receiver have to agree on the higher level protocols.

Then there's that USB term which covers everything from the original 4 wire specification (2 data, 2 power), right up to the latest with 24 wires.  My partner's lightweight Dell XPS 13 notebook has not got much room for physical connections, so an adapter takes USB input and spits out HDMI, Ethernet and legacy video.

I don't understand why people feel the need to listen to upsampled music from a streamer/DAC. Most recordings were done in 16/44 and sound best that way. 24/96 "just makes stuff up". 

You have a DAC that costs at least $15K.  Why fool around with an adapter that probably won’t handle DSD files?

  I would add another computer or streamer to the room that has the Bricasti and play the DSD files into the USB of the DAC.  The cost will be what, $1K at most?  It’s a fraction of what you already spent on the DAC

@richardbrand i think you meant to @ the OP.

vinylshadow

Most recordings were done in 16/44 and sound best that way.

That's mistaken - 16/44.1 is a consumer format. Pros were using 16/48 even in the early days of digital, and resolution has been increasing ever since.

“Music is currently streamed using Audirvana on my android phone from a network switch using the DACs ethernet port with an ethernet cable”
@bigby

Since Audirvana has folder capabilities, add your folder containing DSD files to Audirvana on your laptop. As per Audirvana, folder view in app allows users to play local files on your server to play remotely. According to M21 manual, your DAC should play DSD64 natively and DSD128 as DoP over Ethernet. 

@vinylshadow  - The files I'm going to try are from NativeDSD Music. They are "True DSD" recorded in 256 (unless from analogue tape) so no up sampling.

@mahler123 -  I looked at some.  I just don't want another box in my music room or the process of returns.   If I can't get the cables to work, then I may be forced to go  the separate box route.

@lalitk - I already stream DSD128 over ethernet to the M21. DSD256 files have to be over USB.

@rbstehno - The USB port on the M21 is galvanically isolated.  The isolation should keep out nasty signals that contaminate DACs.

@cleeds There aren't many but which records were mastered in 24/96?

@bigby DSD is good. You need a good DAC for it though. Playback Designs MPD-8 can do it. And it uses the glass cable P-Link between its streamer and DAC. Those special glass cables are the best. I think EMM Lab might use them too.

vinylshadow

There aren't many but which records were mastered in 24/96?

24/96 is pretty much the minimum resolution used by digital recording pros today. I don't know where you got the idea that pros use 16./44.1, which is a consumer format.

@bigby

If you don’t want another box then try attaching portable SSD like Samsung EVO to  M21 USB input to stream DSD256 files.

@carlsbad2 "i think you meant to @ the OP".

No, I really meant you! Mind you, half the time the @ does not actively link for me, witness this post.

You had written: "ethernet input is only for ethernet. Try to put a processed signal into it and the DAC will not know what to do with it".

Frankly, the second part is nonsense! There is an international standard called the Open Systems Interconnection (OSI) model which defines seven layers of communication, each building on the lower layers. At the bottom is the Physical Layer, then comes the Data Link layer. These two layers are where Ethernet plays and are the ’how’ of moving data packets.

The higher levels are Network, Transport, Session, Presentation, and Application layers, which is where the ’what’ is being transmitted is agreed.

The internet uses a similar, but much less rigorously defined, model with four layers and does not really define the lower levels where Ethernet plays.

Unlike USB, Ethernet is in effect a broadcast technology where no device has a controlling role. Any device can transmit whenever it likes, provided two conditions are met. The first is that it can detect no other transmission when it starts broadcasting, and it can detect no other transmission when it stops. If collisions are detected, it must wait before attempting to re-transmit. This is why Ethernet cannot guarantee timing.

For collision detection to always work, Ethernet messages must be sufficiently long that two cannot get scrambled in the middle of the network without the scramble being detected at the far ends. The maximum separation and the speed of transmission determine the minimum message length, which is about 500 bytes. Given so much message, the Ethernet designers did not scrimp when deciding how long to make an Ethernet address - they specified 6 bytes which is 48 bits - a number about 65,000 times bigger than the miserable 32 bits Internet Protocol version 4 struggles with. So every Ethernet device ever made has an absolutely unique address, known as the Media Access Code or MAC.

Physically, Ethernet has evolved since the original near-rigid ’garden-hose’ coaxial cable which needed to be drilled at defined points 2-metres apart to tap for a new connection. This was quickly replaced by thinner, more flexible coaxial cable then with twisted pairs or fibre. Whereas the original cable could connect many devices, subsequent cables were point-to-point with the networking connections provided by repeaters, bridges, routers / switches and gateways. Neatly, these hardware devices represent different layers of the OSI model, from the bottom up!

Starting with the actual data to be transmitted, each layer from the Application down tops and tails that data with metadata pertinent to that layer. Ethernet provides the final wrapper and is totally unconcerned about any metadata other layers have added. It is the other layers that define what the data represents and how it should be handled.

Provided the DAC and the sender use the same higher level protocols, they will understand what is being transmitted and how to handle it.

There are some fairly small streamers out there that will handle DSD. iFi would be the first place I would look at. The OP said he doesn’t want a large box in that system-I get that- and I haven’t heard the greatest feedback about the company - but if he only needs it to play DSD files it might be worth taking a flyer, particularly if he has a return policy.

Another small footprint solution might be a MacMini. He would have to verify that a MacMini can handle DSD. Also the last time I owned one , over a decade ago, I had to attach a monitor to it, which I wall mounted to save space. However I would think that it should be possible to control with an iOS app on a portable device

If you're going to be using a computer for streaming, it should be stripped down in terms of hardware and functionality. An apple product won't let you do that, it will fight you every inch of the way. Also, apple does not support flac natively... In 2024... Apple is the last brand/platform an audiophile should consider.

Thank you everyone for all the suggestions.  I didn't realize how complicated this is.  I'm going to wait until after the holidays and take it up again.

Kind regards,

Alan

@bigby 

It looks like your M21 DAC only supports DSD over PCM (DoP), and then only up to DSD128. If you wish to play files DSD256 or higher without downconversion, it does not look like your current DAC will support it.

Also, the USB-Ethernet dongle you linked to in your first post only supports USB 1.1 and is likely not adequate for the use you have in mind.

@devinplombier - After checking with the manufacturer, it supports DSD256 over USB playing without down conversion on the M21 with the MDX board.

I'm not going to use the dongle. 

Thanks for your feedback!

with the MDX board

^ this

@devinplombier Yes. Mine has the MDX board.

Sonore Optical

Thix solution gets rid of all network noise when going from ethernet to usb.

@mahler123   I added the ifi Stream to use the USB input. Worked perfect first time.  Thanks for the suggestion.   So far, it seems DSD256 sounds better than DSD128 for classical and jazz music.