Bi-Wiring

@richdirector - I have a Coda #8 and I'm presuming the speaker outputs are in parallel as well.

It depends on speaker... My tannoys do sound very different biwired over single wire and jumpers. Previous speakers I have had from linn and quad sounded no better. Also with 4 sets of outputs on amp it depends how they are wired up. My luxman has 2 speaker outputs but they are in parallel so running 2 sets of single wire has no effect on sound.

@jl35 - thanks

@baylinor - miss mine!

If your speakers have 4 posts each, by all means bi-wire! 4 is better than two.

I believe the Discovery company is retired. But Joe D the owner/designer I believe still sells on eBay as “wires “. I always loved his cables. Was an Absolute Sound favorite long ago

@waytoomuchstuff - bi, sexy & wire all in one sentence, wow!

@jl35 - I'm thinking now against bi-wiring, do you have a link as to where to purchase the DEJs? Thx

I just removed stock jumpers from Totem Sky Towers and replaced with Discovery Essential Jumpers - quite surprised at how big the difference is..I've owned the Discovery's for years, so no buyer's bias...

You have to admit that biwire setups look pretty sexy and cool.

It also allows some degree of "tuning" whereby, the owner can invest in a cable for the bottom end with speciific characteristics and cost considerations, and something different for the mid/highs involving a different set of parameters. There seems to be some success out there with SBW setups using this design philosophy and obtaining very good results.

@holmz - lol! - Thanks. I think I'll give BW a shot.

There are credible members here like LAk. Wig, Mike Lavigne, Waltersalas.lalitk , Markr1, Tvad, Teajay (amorstereo), charlesdad1.

Davidten Nasaman , both are also credible.

Just about a full table of disciples so it has a pre Easter vibe.

And it reminds me of the saying, “One will lie and the other will swear to it”

FWIW: I run a bi wire.

No such thing as 'over kill' I think, but perhaps not at all necessary. :-) But to hear the differences make sure both wires are the same ga. My runs are longer and I have only used 10 ga.

@newbee - Thank you. With 6’ leads I’m only running 12 awg, I’d like to try your suggestion of the Mogami but if I’m bi-wiring at 6’ is 10 awg overkill?

Well I found I could change the tone but the change I obtained was never better, just different. I was trying to tame the higher frequencies of some speakers without really impacting the overall balance. Didn't work but it did, ultimately, lead me to my conclusion that KISS was the best theory. Problem is that now most speakers have dual connectors and I'm left with the jumper issue. FWIW, I have a good family friend who is an Astro physicist (NASA consultant!) and we got to discussing the issues involved in cabling in an audio system (he's not and audiophile) and it was his stressing of the importance of  proper connections, etc, that influenced my thinking. If I were really anal about this I would remove the conectors and go in and hard wire the cables. But in my real world I just accept the issue of using jumpers. Just find the cables that sound the best with your stuff. 

BTW, I note that you are using Belden cables from BJ. I assume 10ga. Good stuff and inexpensive. However, as an alternative if you want a cleaner (or brighter) tonal balance you might try some of the Mogami wire. Its very different and also inexpensive. Its interesting to note that both the 10ga Belden and the 10ga Mogami are multistrand twisted wire. The Belden wires are thicker and the Mogami wires are thinner, and I believe there in lays the reason for the tonal balance differences.  Get a pair for the fun of it and you can even try the mix and match I referred to earlier. 

@newbee - "Many years ago I did play with the different types of cables to see if I could change the tone of my system"

What were your results?

I don't know why I didn't think of this but for the adventurous amongst you bi-wiring folks who like to play with your sound you can try two different things, one to affect imaging, one to affect tone. Re tone, use two different types of cables, re imaging, reverse phase on one set of connectors. Many years ago I did play with the different types of cables to see if I could change the tone of my system - I've never tried playing with phase, but I could see someone who wasn't focused on imaging specificity might like the effect of a vague large soundstage. Good for an otherwise boring day.:-)

I've been bi-wiring with a double run for many years, and the second set of binding posts really does make connecting much easier...my current amp is the first time I've had this feature...

@jl35 - OK, thanks!

your common sense method is good...just do same way on both sides...

OK then, for a single channel there are 4 binding posts on the speaker and 4 corresponding binding posts on each speaker. Keeping the phase in check, does it matter, or make a difference on which of the binding post use on the amp to correspond to the binding post on the speaker Or is it just common sense upper to upper and lower to lower?

Better to get the right cables and speakers with terminals that have adequate capacity.

Two is not always better than one.

I could say that with bi-wiring the electrons get confused and can't decide which wire to go down, causing timing error.  Some would probably believe me.

For me whenever I have tried bi-wirng having 2 sets of bindings posts on your amp makes things a bit easier particularly if you hardwire (not using banana plugs or spades).

In my experience what I have found is that a single run of a good cable using the same cable as jumpers on your speakers, outperforms actually bi-wirng with a lesser cables.

Bi-wiring and bi-amping… two completely different topics.

@jasonbourne52  you don't necessarily need an active crossover to split the signal before the amplifiers when bi-amping, there are passive line level crossovers as well.

I used to think there was no difference in bi-wiring and single wiring, until I bought a pair of apogee duetta 2 speakers and it made a pretty substantial difference. I think bi-wiring making a positive difference depends on the speakers used and the type of wire for each run.

The impact of bi-wiring is often subtle, if even audible, but there are a lot of variables, and some get very noticeable results. One size does not fit all, so there’s not an absolute single correct answer whether or not there are immediately audible benefits from bi-wiring. Two things happen when you bi-wire... it typically doubles the gauge of the wire used, which can have some benefit. Also, each wire is affected by a different impedance from the passive speaker crossover, so each allows a different part of the signal through. It’s impossible to predict what, if any difference you’ll hear, but it can pave the way to hear other minor improvements (like removing water spots from window panes one at a time). No harm done either way, so try it. It’ll only cost a 2nd set of wires.

The fact that your speakers can be bi-wired also means they can be bi-amped, which offers a lot more flexibility and can have a more obvious impact....that could be worth pursuing too. Bi-wiring is a component of all bi-amping situations.

Davidten  Nasaman , both are also credible.

Op always remember you will never know until you do it yourself? Agoners can either help you and misled you. There are credible members here like LAk. Wig, Mike Lavigne, Waltersalas.lalitk , Markr1, Tvad, Teajay (amorstereo), charlesdad1.

Op there is a big benefits on biwiring. My Diapason Adamantes, My Norh Speakers, my R3 red rose   My Klipsch 600rpm, And my Wharfedale Speakers are all biwirablle. My Plinius sa 100 has four bindings post .if your amp has four binding post , used them. In my experience, I get more instruments separations. Bigger soundstage.You can use silver on highs and copper on bass.i find using biwire on Speakers side only is not as good using both amp side. Try it. Some of the opinions here , I can tell they don’t have the biwire set up.

@jl35 - OK, thanks for a direct answer, that makes sense!

Sonic benefits of true bi-wiring is endless debate here, often nasty...the extra binding posts are to ensure a good tight connection, should you choose to bi-wire with a double cable run...

@ghdprentice - I’m familiar with posting pictures but am just doing my homework at this point, components are still in their boxes, which consist of Coda 8 amp, Coda CB pre, Gustard R26 DAC/Steamer (sorry, no Aurender). Legacy Signature speakers arrive on Wednesday.

Speaker placement will be limited as I do not have a dedicated listen room and the room itself completely sucks acoustically.

Stock power cords and Blue Jeans interconnects and speaker cables,

So, if all these thing mater more that bi-wiring, I’ll take your advice and save the money on that second set of speaker cables! Thanks.

The no reply, no answer big company game.

which is why I went with products which are upgradable,and good warranties, and easy to actually talk on the phone personally to designers, owners' etc.  CJ was like that years ago, 
 

Sanders “the preamp”

McCormack dna monos

odyssey upgraded monos.

I like I can call, and I can speak with the,designers and talk for a while, without the feeling of being rushed for f the phone. 
Roger is a gem to speak with !

No sonic benefit to running an extra set of wires to your speakers. True bi-amping requires an active crossover and another strereo amp. 

I can split out sub, then use a solid state amp for lows, and a couple mono tube amps for mid-highs. Since the input frequency to each amp is limited, the signal coming out of each amp is “cleaner” for that range and allows each to “shine”. 

Clean?
Shine?

Why not just use a cleaner and shinier and large tube mono block?

For me, I have never been happier than having bi-amp with 3 way active crossover.

I can split out sub, then use a solid state amp for lows, and a couple mono tube amps for mid-highs. Since the input frequency to each amp is limited, the signal coming out of each amp is “cleaner” for that range and allows each to “shine”.  Good large gauge, shielded and as short as possible, wire that offers minimal resistance also seems to improve the performance.

I had biwired speakers for a couple decades. But some questions first.

What is your system and venue? It would be really helpful if we could see it. There is a place under your UserID to create a virtual system. This would be very helpful for us.

My first question would be, have you spent lots of time getting your speakers placed correctly, then carefully chosen speaker cables, then interconnects, then power cords, then really worked on carefully done room treatments… walls, sidewalls, behind. Then I would work on if bi-wiring can help. While the order can vary a little bit in terms of impact (like room treatment might have the greatest impact after placement)… but the possible benefit of bi-wiring is down there somewhere below the impact of power cords. While it is all additive, it is important to get the big stuff done first… then the really small stuff… biwiring is way down there.

So, it would be very great to see your system and biwiring would likely have a very small benefit. My experience is that choosing the right brand and level of cable is far more important that normal wiring vs bi-wiring.

@navyachts IDK. I never worry about warranty. I just worry about sound.

You probably have the big heavy cardas binding posts which are a huge mass that the charge has to fill as it passes through.  I think I'm in the minority thinking this is important and I don't think it is a huge effect.  I'm just into little tweeks that help. so unless you take out the big heavy binding posts, mods probably won't make much difference.

But warranty law is not well understood. For a manufacturer to deny a claim becasue you modified, then they need to show causal relationship between your mod and the failure. For example, if you put a high flow air filter on your car and the window fails, there is no relationship.

Jerry

Well, it's not the first time we have been told it's more marketing than reality.  Paul at PS audio sheds a little light on why bi-wire may have been a thing at one time.  

@carlsbad - interesting. I wonder how that would affect my warranty? Maybe in my case I could use 10awg jumper wires?

Biwiring helps if your speaker cables or connections are too small or poor.  

Use 10 awg cables and no need to biwire.

I don't like the double binding posts and jumper bars.  they are a huge mass that interrupts your signal.  I take both pair out and replace them with a single low mass binding post and hook both internal wires to it.

Jerry

In the past, I have both bi-wired and used a single pair of wires (with jumpers) on the speaker end of things, no problem. I'm just confused about the additional binding posts on the power amp. Although @stereo5 suggests it's still bi-wiring, so the video holds true.

IMHO the main benefit in biwiring speakers using two wires from your amp going to four connectors on the speaker is that you eliminate the need to use a piece of metal between the two positive and two negative connectors on your speaker which is a good thing. Whether you will actually hear the difference is a different issue. I haven't. The benefits of biwiring have been discussed often - I’ve always been attracted to the KISS theory and don’t recommend bi wiring. It has been alleged that some major speaker manufacturers, at least initially, demurred on having two sets of connectors because they thought they were not beneficial but subsequently started installing them due to public demand.

It is still biwiring. The 4 speaker posts per channel are there for that exact purpose.