Absolute top tier DAC for standard res Redbook CD

Alex, your humor is killing me!, I enjoy a great laugh now and then, thankyou, you are about the 4th person that has said the same on this thread!

Aplhifi, perhaps but I'm now using a music server with double DSD output from the dac. The BMC, at least cannot play this.

I was told the PureDac was updated to play back DSD128..

Many DSD Dacs out ther can handle DSD128...the only prominents one that cant off the top of my head are the Benchmark 2 and the Meitner MA-1.

Aplhifi, perhaps but I'm now using a music server with double DSD output from the dac. The BMC, at least cannot play this.

Tbg, the DSD-S can surely play double DSD (DSD128) and the DSD-M can play quadruple DSD (DSD256) at 13.5MHz.

However, as we discussed today with a respected reviewer, it is not the format (PCM or DSD) and it is not the rate that matters that much. Simply, it is all about implementation. :-)

Best,
Alex Peychev
APL Hi-Fi

Tbg, your system page is screwed up

Spot welding for circuit boards. Please invent it

Yup, just confirmed it does do DSD128

http://bmc-audio.de/index.php/PureDAC-EN.html

Features:

Top-grade Digital/Analog Converter with Current Injection current-to-voltage (I/V) conversion

High-resolution asynchronous USB interface up to 32bit/384kHz

USB PCM: 16...32bit; 44.1, 48, 88.2, 96, 176.4, 192, 352.8, 384kHz.

USB DSD: DSD64, DSD128.

ASIO driver for Windows; Linux and Mac compatible

AES/EBU, coaxial and Toslink digital inputs

Balanced, reference-class headphone amplifier with digital/analog power convertion (DAPC), load-effect free (LEF) technology, a lateral MOSFET, a super-low impedance LEF output stage, and lossless Digital Intelligent Gain Management (DIGM) volume control

Balanced LEF, CI-compatible preamp that optionally operates in B.M.C. Mode, with DIGM and a vertically diffused metal oxide semiconductor (DMOS) and LEF-balanced output stage.

Separate volume controls for the line and headphone sections (the line volume position 59 represents a DAC standard output level)

Second-generation DIGM with optimized gain distribution between power amps and internal and DIGM volume levels

Optical B.M.C. Link for connecting with B.M.C. amps like the PureAmp

Remote Control

Top grade parts like MPP (conductive film polypropylene, non inductive) and balanced current capacitors, precision metal film resistors...
Massive and stylish extruded aluminum chassis

Dimensions: 14.37 x 4.06 x 12.91 inches, W/H/D (365 x 103 x 328 mm)

Weight: 11.9 lbs (5.4 kg)
Related Catalogues:

B.M.C. Audio Complete Catalogue, English (300dpi photos): Download

Wisnon, my servet using JRiver MC19, can output in a large number for formats. Presently everything is output as double DSD in native DSD. Perhaps I misspoke as I had used the BMC only in 192/24 PCM coming from my old server.

Since I'm not really certain whether DSD 128 is PCM or native DSD, I will have to check. Perhaps you know.

Tbg - JRiver can output DSD128 as either a direct bitstream in native DSD format, or as DoP (DSD over PCM, which is still true DSD but transmitted in PCM frames.) In the specs for the BMC DAC given above, it doesn't state in which format it supports DSD. Once you find that out you need to setup JRiver accordingly and then the BMC DAC should be able to playback DSD128.

Bill_k, I asked this of the pro guy who makes my music serverUSB PCM: 16...32bit; 44.1, 48, 88.2, 96, 176.4, 192, 352.8, 384kHz.

USB DSD: DSD64, DSD128. Is this PCM converted?

He responded, "It is DOP DSD over PCM NOT NATIVE DSD Its the DRIVER is the XMOS driver and XMOS driver that does not support NATIVE DSD."

So, yes it will play DSD128 but this is PCM not native DSD.

I do have the capability, thanks to my dac and JRiver MC19, to play either DSD128 or double native DSD. There is just more detail and sense of realism with the double DSD. Bass is more defined and located. I probably will not use the BMC any longer.

Tbg, you CAN continue to use your BMC DAC to play double DSD! You just need to setup JRiver to output via DoP. Even though it then transmits the DSD data via PCM frames, it still IS the actual DSD that the DAC will then reproduce.

Bill_k, as I said I have compared DOP with native DSD, and the native is better. Into the Sabre chip, the DSD goes through an entirely different part of the chip. I did listen to DOP for a long time and enjoyed it but moving the filters out well beyond anything I can hear or sense, it very beneficial. I have demonstrated what 44.1/16 versus double native DSD sounds like to others. It sounds like a different recording with much better microphones and mix.

All of this aside, I still think the BMC PureDac is exceptional. I know another manufacturer who could afford the very best who says he has it in the PureDac.

Matt, At this point, I wonder If you will ever get a signature Pandora or Romulas player here in this shoot out, I would call the Asthetixs company themselfs and by pass the store, I have had to do that before, they may be tring to fill a big order for the store, that will be a slow process, I believe if you explained to the designer of the asthetixs about your thread here, you likly would get one promply, It would be like dealing with Steve Nugent, cheers.

Bill_k, as I said I have compared DOP with native DSD, and the native is better.

Tbg, please understand that DoP and DSD are both native/pure DSD.

Sabre chip, the DSD goes through an entirely different part of the chip. I did listen to DOP for a long time and enjoyed it but moving the filters out well beyond anything I can hear or sense, it very beneficial

This is true for most DACs that can process PCM and DSD.
Again, DoP is DSD (after a simple decoding that does not affect the sound quality in any way) so you cannot apply the usual digital filters to DoP, just like you can do it with PCM. Also, please do not confuse DoP with DSD converted to PCM, it has nothing to do with it. DoP is DSD "encapsulated" in PCM frames, that's all.

Hope this helps you understand better what DoP is - DSD over PCM=Pure DSD.

Best wishes,
Alex Peychev
APL Hi-Fi

Aplhifi-usa, since I can hear a difference and prefer double DSD to DOP and am told by other pro designers that I should have expected this, I will continue to use double DSD and not use my BMC PureDac, at least in my main system.

Tbg,

I am sorry but which part of the word "same" you do not understand?

DoP and "native" DSD streaming are exact same thing, except that DoP is packed in PCM-like format. Once DoP is "unpacked" it turns out to native/real/pure DSD.
So there is no audio quality difference between that two.

Again, let's not confuse DoP with DSD converted to PCM.

There are few more things that you are welcome to share with your "other pro designers".

1. It is not exactly clear how the ESS Sabre DAC handles DSD, especially when it comes to attenuation. This is something that only ESS can clear up, if they want.

2. The German-made TheSycon ASIO driver for XMOS does support "native" DSD.

3. Your BMC PureDac does support DSD64 and double DSD128, probably in DoP format, though not specified on their specs.

4. JRiver MC19 can convert any PCM file to:

a) DoP at DSD64
b) DoP at double DSD128
c) native DSD stream at double DSD128

Bottom line, your current DAC operating at double DSD128 should sound the same as your BMC PureDac operating at double DoP/DSD128, which the JRiver MC19 supports as well.

If you still hear audio quality difference, it is because something else in the signal path is inferior or superior.

Hope this helps!

Best ,
Alex Peychev
APL Hi-Fi

Alex - I've tried to explain the same thing to Tbg, but apparently our words are falling on deaf ears. (That's just an expression that seems to apply in this case, and is not meant as any condemnation of Tbg's hearing acuity!) He is apparently convinced that DoP is not truly native DSD and cannot be swayed from that belief. I do appreciate your effort though, since I gave up several posts ago!

Bill_k, to be honest, your posts were the reason why I tried again explaining to Tbg with more detail, hoping he will understand better what's going on.

It seems like many believe that DoP is some sort of DSD to PCM conversion that can be clearly discriminated as inferior compared to "native" DSD.
This, as we know, is not true as DoP=DSD. :-)

Thank you as well for trying to make things clear!

BTW, I do like your disclaimer! :-)

Best,
Alex Peychev
APL Hi-Fi

Tbg should watch this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okG-pRzz1w4

Hi all.

The DSD-S arrived today at the office; thanks to Alex's brother as courier.
I will get it hooked up and cooking asap.

Review to follow.

Looking forward to your impressions of Alex's DSD-S DAC! He is an extremely well versed engineer so my expectations are very high on it.

Also looking forward to reading about your impressions!

Kana813, while the tape is long, he does explain well and the guys in the audience asked good questions.

I now understand why I prefer native DSD to DOP. It is the computer being bothered to remove the header that is used to "fool" the computer or latency.

Mattnshilp, I'm sorry that my comment on the PureDac degenerated into this highjacking of the thread.

Aplihifi, I do now better understand why I prefer native DSD as I explained to Kana813 above.

I am soon to get a new server with two computers in it. One will only handle the music and the other all the other functions needed. It will also have no switching power supplies and no opamps.

I'm off this thread now.

To much thread with not enough time. So... what dac so far in the shootout sounds the best on 'standard resolution Redbook CD'?

Matt, is this shoot-out over?, where is the Asthetixs Romulas or Pandora signature!

No worries TBG. I have actually had nothing to report, so you filled a quiet gap nicely and I think we all learned a bit. Thank you.

UPDATE:

My PS Audio DirectStream has been returned (still waiting for my refund).
My PS Audio Perfect Wave 2 is sold.
My Aeris is sold (pending funds).

I just, this morning, unpacked and hooked up the APL DSD-S that Alex was generous enough to lend me. I don't have time right now, but I will give an initial report in the next day or so. It only has 100 hours on it, and it just completed a trans-Atlantic flight. So it needs a lot more burn in time to give it a fair audition.

My personal ODSE is on its way with a Short Block USB filter. Hopefully arrive any day. I would like to burn in my new ODSE thoroughly as well to properly compare the two. Especially considering that my ODSE is my reference unit and what all else will be compared with. I am hoping Alex is willing for me to hold onto the DSD-S for a while to really give it a proper evaluation.

That's all for now.

As an interesting side note, this thread just passed 50,620 views. How cool is that?!?!

Update continued:

As another side note. I have heard nothing about the Aesthetic Romulus Signature, so I don't see that happening any time soon. And I am trying to convince the gentlemen in Northern Jersey to lend me his Lampy Big 7 for a few days so I can add that review to this shoutout. I think it might be sold though....

"My PS Audio DirectStream has been returned (still waiting for my refund)."

Matt,

Did you post any comments on the DS?

Mrd1241 - Empirical Audio ODSE is my current reference.

Audiolabyrinth - I am waiting for a call from John at Audio Connection regarding the Romulus Signature. Looking forward to hearing it, eventually.

Kana813 - Yes, look back. Read my posts starting with "UPDATE" to read the reviews and comparisons. I have been very consistent in how I report.

UPDATE : APL DSD-S in in the house.

Please be aware that I had completed my own personal shootout with the DAC's that I had originally listed to get my ideal Red Book CD quality PCM 16/44 sound.My final choice is the Empirical Audio Over Drive SE with USB Short block adapter. The two additional DAC's that have been brought up again and again and again are the Lampy Big 7 and the Aesthetix Romulus Signature DAC's. I am trying to get both in for audition. Although my budget no longer affords me the ability to purchase any additional DAC's to get them in for audition - it has to be a lend for listen/Audition scenario. That said, the Big 7 and Romulus Signature have HUGE followings who insist that my shootout can not be completed without auditioning both. To them I say that I am trying…

To all new readers, please go back and seek out my posts beginning with "UPDATE" to see my reviews and comparisons. If I just posted to continue a conversation or answer a question I did NOT start the post with "UPDATE". it's an easy way to search through the many pages and get the info and answers you may want. If you start at the beginning you will see my equipment and process of evaluation is consistent and I try to simply say it as I hear it. I can tell you that the input that the forum members has offered has been invaluable and for those truly looking to use this thread as a resource, read the whole thing…

Alex, of APL HiFi, approached me to listen to his DSD-S DAC as it was in my price range. I knew nothing of his line and have learned much about Alex and his product since then. He knows his stuff. I welcomed the audition as he offered to get the DAC to me and give me the time and luxury of enjoying it and posting my honest opinion here. Other then offering to get the DAC to me free of charge, I have not received any financial compensation nor offered a discount to purchase the DAC. As you will see, I will be honest and critical as I always am. So here it goes….

Alex's brother dropped the box off to me at my office, which was very kind of him. I did not get to meet him as I was busy that day, but the box appeared new and unopened when I examined it. It was appropriately thick cardboard and professionally labeled. I would like to have seen a serial # printed on the outside as well as a country of manufacturer. My assumption is that my unit was packaged as a normal production unit would be. If not, I encourage Alex to chime in. I was disappointed to see that the internal packaging was minimal with foam sleeve edges but nothing above or below the DAC. There was no double box, or fabric bag around the DAC itself. There was a think styrofoam sheet sort of pushed around the DAC. I would put it on par with packaging for a $350- Sony receiver. For an $8K'sih DAC, I think he needs to take his packaging to the next level; especially if it's making a transatlantic trip to get to you. That said, it was unscathed and faired the trip perfectly. But I would have been disappointed with the packaging if I just shelled out $8K for this DAC.

Alex told me an instruction manual was not completed yet and would not be included. He emailed me all I needed to know. So I can't comment on it's instructions and how well they are written. His Email was concise, well written, and the unit is easy for anyone familiar with a DAC to use. So no complaints. He also included a power cord and a USB cable which I will hold off on using until I am done with my comparison. I try to keep everything else equal to make comparisons. Then add the extra stuff to see how it sounds different/better. He also gave me some music to listen to, which I will upload this week. He suggested I try Audirvana Software as he felt it sounded better. I will.

Although I was not enthralled with the packaging, the unit was in pristine condition and was clearly brand new. The remote is a small, silver metal rectangle that feels every solid, is very well laid out, has very responsive buttons that feel great under the thumb and worked without issue. I really like it. You need to unscrew the remote to replace the batteries; a hassle but no big deal really.

The unit itself is a black chassis with a silver faceplate. Very nicely put together and looks solid and well built. It doesn't have the heft of the Rowland Aeris but is clearly a solid unit representing its price. A beautiful logo is on top and on the faceplate and the faceplate is nicely shaped and well secured. The LCD is not great the latest and greatest, but it is functional and effective. Volume, DSD settings (DSD64 or DSD128 - to be explained in a bit), source input and bit rate are shown. The buttons on the front are simple and concise. Dimming switch for the LCD, volume up/down, power/standby and a power switch in back above the PC 15 amp socket. I liked the layout and was fine with the LCD. Was it the beautiful screen the Direct Stream had? No. But there's clearly money put into the right places and non wasted; I like that. Similar to my ODSE in theory. K.I.S.S.

The back is well laid out. The XLR, RCA, USB plugs are very secure and the PC socket was far enough from the power switch to allow hefty PC thickness without getting in the way. Overall, the unit reminded me of a Pass Labs pre-amp I had recently seen. I think that's a complement. Build quality is as expected for this level piece of equipment as are the buttons, plugs, feet and design. Nothing to complain about. It's not the jeweled finish, single block aluminum Bugatti that the Rowland Aeris was, but I felt that I paid for bling with the Aeris where the DSD-S makes me feel like the money went to the right place. That said, there is something to be said for the aluminum blocks vibration dampening; but the DSD-S is no light weight and is solidly constructed and well damped. When I tap on my Rowland Criterion pre-amp I hear a solid thud. When I tap on the DSD-S, I do hear a hollow tap. But no vibration or resonance. Take that for what it is. On a solid rack (like mine) I don't think it makes a huge difference. But at this level, tiny differences add up…

When I hooked it up and plugged it all in, it turned on without issue and went into its warm up mode. This took about a minute or so and then it easily and instantly linked to my computer without issue. No software needed for my Mac Mini. I am currently using Amarra and it worked without issue. I immediately got music out and sat down for a quick, initial listen.

The unit came with 300 hours on it. I will burn it in for an additional week for good measure. So final listening impressions next week.

I was impressed on first listen. Without going into any specifics, it did exactly what it is supposed to do for a unit of this caliber. The high frequencies were a but harsh at times (which surprised me) but I think that some burn in will remove that. Soundstage was wide and appropriate, and imaging put it all where it's supposed to be. Lows were low and impactful. I was pulled from review mode to music magic on 4 of the 5 songs I listened to. To me, thats a complement and bodes well for what to expect.

My ODSE should be here any day. Once that's here it will need a few weeks of burn in to really get where it should. Then I will compare and contrast. But next Wednesday will give me time to listen to the DSD-S and give true impressions of it's abilities.

Thats all for now.

'fin

Matt, thanks for your very detailed first impressions! Not many posters would take the time to be as thorough as you are. I hope that you can still enjoy the process, since shootouts like this can often be tedious and somewhat frustrating.

Matt,

Thank you for a nice initial write up, and for nice suggestions about the finalized packaging and looks!

Few things, if I may:

1. The unit was double-boxed, but I've asked my brother to unpack it so you can see it with the white printed box. Maybe you noticed that there was no shipping labels or any such marks on the box.

2. We have sleeves coming up for covering the entire unit with the company logo on them, but they did not arrive on time, sorry about that.

3. The foam pieces that hold the two sides of the DSD-S are tested well, so there will be no damage of the unit, even if you throw it UPS style from 3 meters above ground. :-) Of, course, it is always possible to add more foam so it looks even more secure, this is not a problem.

4. Honestly, I find it very surprising that the DSD-S sounded harsh on the top in your system. Maybe it is a good idea to try it with different cables, hopefully not Silver, and preferably non-shielded (or lightly shielded). Experiments with the RCA and XLR outputs are desirable, as well as trying the DSD-S direct to your amplifiers. The other thing is alternating between DSD64 and DSD128 modes and see which one you like better. As I've mentioned in the instructions, DSD128 is cleaner, while DSD64 is more rounded, that can be helpful with some bright recordings, for example. Finally, this DSD-S has barely 200 hours on it, so it may need more, especially after being shipped overseas and not played for several days, as you pointed out already.

I find your comments very valuable, thanks again!

Best,
Alex Peychev
APL Hi-Fi

Bill-K : my pleasure. I was getting a bit fried by the end of my initial rounds. But with a nice break, I'm enjoying it again. By typing these, it really helps me to organize my thoughts and create the most objective findings I can.

I look forward to next week. And I really look forward to getting my ODSE.

I'll keep all posted.

I encourage Steve from Empirical to report on some of his upcoming upgrades. I don't want to say anything as I'm sure I'd screw up the technical stuff.

I see the APL has two fuses......changing these to better ones (unless it comes with seriously good fuses) can raise the sound level considerably. Also damping the lid with weight and different kinds of feet/mounting can make a world of difference as well....Sometimes removing the lid opens up the sound. How about a few WA Quantum stickers on the DAC chip and power supply caps?...works for me (you can remove them and reuse them...they do no damage). If there are undamped heatsinks inside then damping them with EAR SD40AL will make the unit way more palpable and real. It takes time to get the best out of a component. I know, I am just too tweaky....hey...I like it!

Alex- Are the fuses top tier audiophile grade? Do you think upgrading is worthwhile? I welcome your input and comments as I did Steve during my eval of the ODSE.

I do think some weight on top might help with resonance. The feet seamed appropriate, although I was blown away at the improvement upper tier Stillpoints made on my amps!!!

This goes back to my tweak/tube roll vs no tweak issue.
I am trying to compare stock kits to stock kits, just to keep things simpler. The very valid argument is that practically no piece of equipment couldn't benefit from some tweaking/tube rolling and that unless I make every effort to squeeze the last ounce of performance out of each unit I am not giving it a fair chance to win. My answer was and is that the stock unit should perform as intended by its designer as sold. It would make a comparison nearly impossible. My ODSE is stock and sensational!! Could a tube rolled, super tweaked Lampy Big 7 sound better then my stock ODSE? Maybe. But I don't want to go to the Dark Side, or forever will it dominate my obsessive compulsive need to continuously tweak and roll.

I have accessorized with power conditioners and cables, top tier interconnects and speaker wire, and a great rack. My biggest tweak needs to be a better room.

That all said, a weight of some kind on top of the DSD-S to help control resonance is easy and a great suggestion and I will try it.

To all readers - I found some scuba diver vinyl covered lead weights in 1,2,3,4 and 5 pound sizes.

Opinions on what size to buy, and how many (thinking 3 or 4).

Or is there a more audiophile appropriate solution that also helps treat EMI/RFI, emits a tachyon particle deflector shield and increases my Midi-Chlorian count?

I figure they are good to have in my box of accessories. And everyone needs more Midi-Chlorians!!!

Aplhifi-Alex, There you go again with the good humor, these days, It's not that often I get a good laugh, you said, There will be no damage to the unit even if you throw it ups style from 3-meters above ground,,, LOL!, my sentiments of ups period, I have went through all kinds of mishaps with ups!, I try my best to stay clear of them, from time to time, I am forced to accept frieght or packages from them, The frieght business model is alot safer bet, like to see them attempt to throw Frieght!, Ha,Ha.

Alex- Are the fuses top tier audiophile grade? Do you think upgrading is worthwhile? I welcome your input and comments as I did Steve during my eval of the ODSE.

Matt, only the fuse marked 1.0A matters for the sound quality. The other one is for the standby power. After trying many well regarded fuses, I have chosen a certain type that sounds best for my application. So yes, you have topnotch "audiophile" fuse already installed. :-)

Please note that the DSD-S is voiced as it is, without additional tweaks.
Adding weight on top or nicer feet may result in different/better sound, but that is something you can do after you decide if you like the DSD-S or not.

Just like Stillpoints made a difference on your "milled from solid aluminum" amplifiers, I am sure that such devices will improve any audio equipment.

Coming back to your comments, the DSD-S can be anything else but harsh.
Maybe the harshness in your system will go away with burn-in but, sometimes, it can be caused by cables or other components on the line, not capable of processing the energy present at the source. This is similar to a pinched garden hose. :-)

Anyway, I'd suggest that you just let the DSD-S play for a week and then listen again. Then you can experiment with cables, for example. BTW, which outputs did you use for initial evaluation?

Best,
Alex Peychev
APL Hi-Fi

"07-30-14: Mattnshilp
Mrd1241 - Empirical Audio ODSE is my current reference."

Thank-you Matt for the reply. I do appreciate your work, however unpleasant it probably is 8^)

What transport are you using with the ODSE?
Thanks.Mark

Matt, with the exception of the fuse, the big L7 is fully tricked out. No other tubed dac comes with EML45s stock.

I will be adding a Synergistic quantum fuse when I get my 7 next week.

Aolmrd - No transport. Only source is my Core Audio modified Mac Mini running Amarra/iTunes via a Wireworld Platinum Starlight USB cable. I will be buying Audirvana software as well to try it out.

To bad,a quality transport would/could add a lot to the mix,at least for us dyed-in-the-wool spinners. Thanks.

I agree totally with Aolmrd1241, All this time of following this thread, I thought a transport was being used, Now that I have found out that it is not, this gives me a different perspective on the Imperical ODSE and other Dacs on this thread, as a matter of fact, The APL Dac that matt said sounded a little hard on the treble likly exsposed the use of a inferior cable like usb!!, I understand the Dac may need further burned in, However, All dacs sound incredibly better with a quality Digital cable, and then running quality balanced analog interconnects from the dac to the pre-amp or direct to amplifier!

I wish to repeat this is a great thread...really enjoying it. Thanks for putting in all the time and effort, and equally appreciate all the insightful comments from others as well.

To bad,a quality transport would/could add a lot to the mix,at least for us dyed-in-the-wool spinners. Thanks.

This is the reason why the DSD-S has a digital input on the back called DTR.

Using the DTR input with the SDT-M digital transport that reads PCM (converted to DSD128) or native DSD from SD cards, the combo turns to an extremely nice sounding digital front-end that is practically impossible to beat with a computer digital source, at least in my experience.

The DTR input can also be used with a disc spinning CD/SACD transport that has the same capabilities as the SD card one, but it is not yet available for US customers.

Best wishes,
Alex Peychev
APL Hi-Fi

Matt is using a WireWorld Platinum Eclipse USB cable.. It's a good one but not necessarily always the best choice.. there seems to be much variation in USB cables and USB implementations..

And some Dac's don't sound nearly as good through their USB inputs as SPDIF, or vice versa .. The ODSE comes to mind since its an optimized for USB Dac.. So in some ways some of his impressions may not be accurate where the other Dac's are concerned.. In other words the Roland may crush the ODSE on SPDIF were as the ODSE sounds better due to it's USB implementation..

I think a better methodology for his testing might have been to use both a USB "and" a SPDIF source..

Even though I have a DAC that I am happy with, I have been following this thread with some interest, and I am also surprised that a transport was not being used at least as an alternative if not primary, since many don't use them any more. What was a little more troubling as far as the validity of the results is the use of a USB cable.
It is still an interesting thread, and thanks to Matt.

"In other words the Roland may crush the ODSE on SPDIF were as the ODSE sounds better due to it's USB implementation.."

I seriously doubt it. My S/PDIF is one of the best out there. If you drive it with my Off-Ramp 5, it is very close to the internal USB interface. I uses exactly the same path through the USB module. The internal USB interface is a bit better, but you expect that.

Steve N.
Empirical Audio

Label me confused guys….

I started this thread and have listed (over and over again) the exact system layout, source, cables, equipment and intention. I repeatedly stated that my ONLY source for digital is my Core Audio modified Mac Mini running Amarra feeding a USB cable to my DAC. I have no need for spinning discs as my source is exceptional and provides me with the quality I desire and convenience I enjoy. Anyone who thought I was using a transport didn't read the thread from the beginning. I have been honest, open and sincere in my method and my equipment from the beginning.

As I have said many times, my ONLY intention was to find the best DAC for me. I'm not writing a review for a magazine nor trying to impress anyone with my skillful ear or elocution. I have neither the skillful ear nor the mastery of verse to publish or to consider a career in the review industry.

What I am doing is verbalizing my own opinions and findings as I go along this journey to help me better focus and understand my own thoughts. I also sincerely enjoy the additional feedback and suggestions I have been getting along the way.

"All dacs sound incredibly better with a quality Digital cable, and then running quality balanced analog interconnects from the dac to the pre-amp or direct to amplifier!"

I am using a top quality USB digital cable and top tier balanced interconnects as I have listed previously.

And to suggest that my USB cable is making things bright after I have listened to several of the words best DAC's and never once noted lasting brightness (other then what exists before burn in is complete) has no logic whatsoever. And, I mentioned the brightness just to give initial impressions and woefully regret saying it as everyone seamed to have grabbed onto that statement as if the trap door is open the the hangman's noose has clamped down tight. It was a fleeting notion during a single song that I am positive will be gone after a week of burn in.

I have no intention of trying each unit with both a USB and then a SPDIF input as I have no need to do that. I only need to audition the equipment with the source I use. Steve's Off Ramp 5 USB conversion is well respected and certainly has something to do with the fact that the ODSE sounds as good as it does for my needs. And the Aeris would unquestionably sound better if I ran an Off Ramp 5 as my USB to SPDIF conversion. We have gone down this conversation multiple times on this thread. I am not willing to spend the several thousand dollars for the Off Ramp 5 fully modified plus the cost of high quality SPDIF cables to improve upon a DAC. It stands on it's own, USB input and all.

Keep in mind that I spend hours and hours listening and then hours writing my impressions. Its time I truly don't have; but I do it because its enjoyable and helps me to solidify my decisions. For me to double my time by trying it all via USB and then SPDIF is beyond the time I have and beyond the scope of my needs.

I don't use a transport, and therefore am obligated to use my USB output from my one and only digital source, my Mac Mini.

I would love to see Steve modify a Mac Mini to have an SPDIF output straight off of the motherboard. But I know nothing of the tech involved to do that and would think that if it were possible, he would have done it already.

My attitude is simple. if its not from Empirical Audio then the USB input is probably not its best input and I will have to make due with the quality of USB input the DAC in the rack has. I am not going to add an OFf Ramp 5 to an already expensive DAC. Maybe the Aeris, the Big 6 or the Direct Stream would sound way better if I used them with a transport or with my Mac Mini running through an Off Ramp 5; I'm not willing to invest that additional amount when I can get the totally outrageous performance I am getting out of my ODSE.

I will tell you that the DSD-S is getting pretty damn good. I have to give it the time it needs yet, I am waiting until Wed. But the tiny second of brightness I noted is, I think, gone (with the same USB cable I have been using all along).

I hope that clears up any confusion.