I'm seeing a ton of Hegel units on the used market, especially the big daddy H590. It seem to be a race to the bottom in terms of sellers trying to unload these things. Nothing but good reviews online, but something must be up. I have never owned one, but have always been intrigued. The resale value though is always a concern for me as I swap out equipment every 6 months or so. Any thoughts on these positive or negative?
Well, there are 10 total units for sale on Agon... a few weeks ago, not even that many. Perhaps a timing thing? I have an H390 and it’s great. Best integrated I’ve had for the $$$. I would think the prices you see now won’t change much, so dive in and see if you like one...
but i would say the h590 is in less demand since the h390 hit... h390 does 99% of what the 590 does for most customers AND the h390 has proper and full MQA implementation on all digital inputs, whereas they have not updated the h590 to the same capability
Every single time I narrow my search down to the very best in category the next thing I do is go looking to find it used. Inevitably, and I mean every single time, there are none. I watched for over six months, not a single Herron VTPH2A, not one Tekton Moab used. Not one Raven Avian series amp either.
This makes total sense in light of free markets. When people buy really good stuff they are so happy it stays. This keeps the good stuff off the market. People find out they bought crap, can't sell it fast enough lest it get old and be worth even less.
Thus the saying bad money drives out good. Nobody spends their gold and silver coins. They hang onto them. When you see a lot of something in the used market that alone is telling you how good it really is.
Economics is a mind bendingly difficult subject to peer into. It’s defeated all but the very best of analytical minds such as Smith, Malthus, Marshall and Keynes.
Given the psychology of the audiophile mind, audio economics might be beyond even them!
On the other hand it could be said that we audiophiles do tend to be rather a fickle ’flavour of the month’ bunch, chopping and changing as we go in search of something ’better’.
Particularly sensitive to hyperbole and criticism, of which there is no current shortage.
Little wonder it seems to take very little to get some of us riled up.
Perhaps someone should start a more meaningful thread on products which have provided long term service and satisfaction?
Simple, integrated units are just a step a long the path. People decide they want something more and move up to separates. They rarely go down or even sideways. Not that Hegels are bad. They are not bad at all. Millercarbon the reason there are not Moabs for sale is that nobody in their right mind will by them in the first place. When they do show up it will be for pennies on the dollar. One of the worst designs ever perpetrated on the audio market.
while very very good pieces do show up more rarely on the used market than less good ones, to say they NEVER show up is overly simplistic and inaccurate
words like never, perfect, always, best are too absolute and extreme to describe most reality, unless you are dealing with immutable laws of physics or matter - often not applicable in the hifi world
audiophiles with money randomly trade away really great stuff often... always chasing something they THINK is better... a good portion of the time they are wrong... same with the luxury/enthusiast car market... some cars lovers just sequentially change cars from pure boredom, then they post on car forums how much they regret selling ’x’ car, wish they had it back
also, people get laid off, they get old, they get sick, they die... and their treasured pieces get sold off
The number of used units offered for sale depends, above all, on the size of the manufacturing company and their degree of market penetration. B&W speakers are a good example; there are many others. Paradoxically, then, this would, at least in part, be a sign of Hegel's success.
Economics is a mind bendingly difficult subject to peer into. It’s defeated all but the very best of analytical minds such as Smith, Malthus, Marshall and Keynes.
Do NOT lump Adam Smith in with those losers, posers, and frauds. Smith joins von Mises with the Austrians and hard money economists who actually have a clue.
miller - your comment made me consider the parallels between high end hifi and economics
more parallels exist than what one might think: -- there are unyielding data folks, against theorists and pragmatists -- so much data trying to explain stuff, yet real events and changes occur largely due to psychology driving individual perceptions, and thus behaviors -- at the end of the day, economics is an art form more than a science, qualitative dominates quantitative
"If we could guess which products will be the most desirable this time next year, it would be fairly easy to get rich, wouldn’t it?"
Whatever Kim Kardashian decides will sell.
I thought that we have moved from "whatever consumer will want next year" to "whatever we tell consumer she/he will want next year" a generation or two ago.
I don't know about Hegel but some manufacturers require investing in the whole product line to become a dealer. Some dealers will sell off the unwanted products as demo or open box reinvest elsewhere or pay bills. I think this accounts for some percentage of the hobbyist can trade around without too much risk.
"....Millercarbon the reason there are not Moabs for sale is that nobody in their right mind will by them in the first place. When they do show up it will be for pennies on the dollar. One of the worst designs ever perpetrated on the audio market...."
@highend666, having listened to the Hegels and the Nad Master M33, I would take a Devialet over both, and Naim Uniti Nova over those three, thank you very much. So as always, you pay your money...
@jjss49 , The point is/was that the gear itself is sometimes not the factor. Everyone forgets the human element. Factor that in and you'll have myriad reasons why something is on sale or kept for the long haul, which is a round about way of saying, who can really say.
h160 nice unit... as is the rost (which i still have and love on a second system driving harbeths) h90-160-360 dac sections lagging now, which is why hegel is updating the models but amp sections still among the very best sounding - just superb
Not surprising that MC feels Adam Smith stands alone in economic theory. But the right cherry picks what they want from the so-called champion of free markets. What they don't want to acknowledge is that one of Smith's greatest fears was not that the government would dictate the management of the economy, but what he feared would happen when the Captains of Industry (I had to put that in) took control of the government.
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