WHY IS THERE SO MUCH HATE FOR THE HIGH END GEAR ON AUDIO GEAR?
It seems like when I see comments on high end gear there is a lot of negativity. I have been an audiophile for the last 20 years. Honestly, if you know how to choose gear and match gear a lot of the high end gear is just better. When it comes to price people can charge what they want for what they create. If you don’t want it. Don’t pay for it. Look if you are blessed to afford the best bear and you can get it. It can be very sonically pleasing. Then do it. Now if you are also smart and knowledgeable you can get high end sound at mid-fi prices then do it. It’s the beauty of our our hobby. To build a system that competes with the better more expensive sounding systems out there. THOUGHTS?
organize. The easy stuff is shareholder resolutions, strikes, boycotts. The hard part is revolution, which won’t happen for the foreseeable future because the working classes in the U.S. seem more inclined towards fascism at the moment and the Democratic Party are not getting them back anytime soon because it thinks there is no problem that can’t be solved by throwing money at it. I see that what is more likely is another Jan 6 insurrection that succeeds.
This is supposed to be an audio forum 😬 so hey I’m chillin 😎 after this 😆!
“…You're being silly because it's essentially impossible for any of us to change our economic system.”
Totally wrong. Systems are changed all the time, either at the ballot box, through grassroots organizing with thousands of others, through catastrophe, like the Great Depression, or through revolution,…you know, like that Thing that we celebrate every July 4.
But I will put my 38-67 year old gear up against anything on the market today and while it may not be the best according to some, it will righteously acquit itself.
@cleeds
“why do you remain a passive victim to a system you dislike?”
Did you read what I wrote? No, you would rather overwrite it with your ideological assumptions, which willfully obscure one of my points. There’s nothing passive about me or what I accomplished at all. I have built - that’s an active verb - a world class audio system over 55 years and that cost me over that time about $35,000 in today’s dollars: that’s $636 a year, very efficient spending in the face of a culture that measures a man’s testosterone levels by the size of his budget (I had a better way of saying that but I think there are a few ladies present in the room).
“There are other countries that operate under different systems….”
This is such boring right wing drivel. It’s 75 year old McCarthyite crap. Can’t you be at least original?
Here is one of my favorite quotes from the period, by Paul Robeson, one of the two greatest bass baritones of the 20th Century, whom the U.S. government harassed into his grave for nearly two decades:
Mr. SCHERER: Why do you not stay in Russia?
Mr. ROBESON: Because my father was a slave, and my people died to build this country, and I am going to stay here, and have a part of it just like you. And no Fascist-minded people will drive me from it. Is that clear?
I was in The Industry for about 15 years (decades ago) and not much has changed with respect to the High End. Yes, the Tech is more refined and the ideas have evolved but the Envy (of the Have Nots) and the Arrogance (of the Haves) is Constant. The veneer of Innocence and "Oh I would Never..." on Both sides is Not Your Fault... it is Human nature.
Just buy what you can Afford and try to Be Happy... don't worry about The Other Guy. Drop the needle (or push the button) and enjoy the Art...
Everyone has their own personality traits and these traits show in EVERYTHING they do and EVERYTHING they discuss. That being said, why are we discussing these traits as though you see them only as they relate to high-end, audio, equipment, equipment pricing, etc.? You could be talking to people about sports, medicine, legal issues, politics, etc, etc. and these same personality traits appear regardless of the topic. Part of the hobby for some people appears to be it gives them the opportunity to feel superior and try to convince the rest of us that they are.
Suppress big corporations ...Big finance... Change the money concept ... Downsize democracy to human scale ...
Quit being an empire ... Quit being the best to be the less worst ... Reveal the destructive nature of transhumanism ...And reveal how science exist no more at the hand of technocratic masters ...
Read Soljenistsyn discourse after he was ousted from Soviet regime and speak to "freer" america about truth and spirit and see how his predictions about America are now fully realized for the worst ... ...He predicted the failure of Soviet regime and also the failure of America for the same reasons : lies and materialism and totalitarian ideology or totalitarian corporations ...
So, I am curious. If, "it doesn’t have to be that way", then what are you suggesting people do to "change the system that caters to millionaires", other than voting with their wallets?
For me audio hobby was never about the "best" gear...
It was about the optimization of what we can afford for the sake of music ...
It was not about the wallet size but about creativity ...
It was not about "upgrades" but about the three working dimensions ways of control : mechanical,electrical and acoustical ...
I just listened to a 500,000 bucks system on youtube , very well known dude , and his room is atrocious, it is audible and clear in spite of his panels ... fatiguing system not because of the high tech gear but because he dont use the right method to make it more musical ... details are not music ... Price tag dont beat acoustics knowledge at all ...
Then listening to his system compared to mine at 700 bucks make me proud and happy ...😊 Incredible ... Because so good his system could be some big defect undetected by him even if it is evident are in my face not in his face because he look ALWAYS for more details not for acoustic musicality ...Acoustics is about musicality not details given by the gear piece he sell ...
We must quit branded name fetichism of the gear and of the tool, study acoustics which is not mere room acoustic panels ...
This hobby is about learning music and acoustic experience not about the 40 amplifiers someone could afford to try and compared ... Ridiculous obsession with no real learning ... The user manual is not acoustics book...
I learned a lot about the way to make any gear system optimally musical relatively to his level of quality/price for sure ...my gear value so good the design is are not Mile Lavigne ballpark ...( i respect him because he know a lot , it is evident when you see his dedicated acoustic room )
I was in the obligation to create a concept for audiophile because it does not existed here in this forum before i wrote it : minimal acoustic satisfaction threshold starting point which is determined by some optimal ratio between all acoustics factors implied for some gear/room/ears...This threshold passed is enough to be in sonic heaven with no frustration...Better dont means satisfying ...
Then we must learn how to work on these acoustic factors with the gear we own BEFORE any upgrade, if our gear is synergetical to begin with for sure...WE must train our ears with what we do first and last , not with what we buy ...
To do that we must identify these factors one by one in our system/room/ears and look how we can improve them one by one and all together ... Be it reverberation time, reflective ratio and location, dispersion , sound source dimension , listener location and envelopment, crosstalk, transients, dynamic, bass, pressure distribution zones, the 5 factors determining timbre , immersiveness in headphone and speakers...
Wwe must learn also how vibrations and resonance destruct the acoustic experience and how powerfully destructive is a too higher electrical noise floor of the house and of each part of the system ... We must learn about EMI and unusual device to control the room atmosphere as ionization and schumann generators...We must become creative and think ...Forgetting to be passive consumers frustrated because we could not afford a Dartzeel amplifier ... I dont need that to be proud and in a relative sonic heaven .....Trust me happiness can only be born of thinking and creativity not from money most of the times ...Money can help at best ...
"If you don’t like $1.2M audio systems, instead of not buying it, change the system that caters to millionaires."
"Prices today are a reflection of the (passive, like you maybe?) acceptance of the grossly unequal economic structure we have in the U.S. today. It doesn’t have to be that way."
So, I am curious. If, "it doesn’t have to be that way", then what are you suggesting people do to "change the system that caters to millionaires", other than voting with their wallets?
Hate is nothing more than a negative response to fear, whether it's fear of someone's appearance or ideas being different (and possibly better than one's own), fear of missing out (sour grapes reaction), personal economic circumstances vs others (keeping up with the Jones as well as overly prideful), and many other countless fears ending in phobia. People who are reasonably comfortable in their own skin are not afraid of being wrong, freely admit when they are, and learn from the experience.
Some people are desperate to be relevant. They’re latched on to ab element where they have some level of familiarity with a subject and can express the "right" words to appear to have credibility. Being a "giant killer" is the most rewarding for those desperate to be relevant. Being the "David" in a world filled with "Goliaths" is the ultimate high (actually low?) for this individual. The bigger the target to publicly humiliate, the greater the adrenaline rush. Excellent, high performance, beautifully constructed, commercially successful products, that have earned a high satisfaction and adoption rate with their owners, thus generating referrals, get batted around by the highly passionate dude aiming to protect the world from, in his view, bad sound or poor price/performance ratio.
Another possible explanation may be these are, indeed, not very nice people. They have undetected crimes against their fellow man in which they have not accepted responsibility for. This creates an (almost) uncontrollable desire to find others more devious, sinister, and morally corrupt than they are. So, if THEIR crime is an 8 on the 10 scale, they are looking for a 9, or higher out there. Unable to locate the "9" they are looking for, they only find a "4" -- the company that makes gear that does not align with their value structure. So, to cleanse themselves of their personal transgressions and find a more dispicable individual(s), they elevate the status of the "4" to a ’9" and "educate" the world about it in the most energetic means possible. Hence, gross exaggerations, profound blanket statements, general devaluation, and invalidation of a product, and everything connected to it.
I think some of us fail to acknowledge the intangibles associated with a purchase. These could include esthetics, build quality, manufacturer’s story/history, prestige, or fear of being embarrassed if they don’t own "the right stuff". In this regard, there are no right or wrong answers if, in owner’s mind, they got what they paid for.
Many times "upgrades" are geometrically proportional. A speaker at 2x the price of a $400 pair of speakers is $800. A speaker a 2x the price of a $40k speaker is $80k. In BOTH cases the price was twice as much. Did performance improve by a factor of 2? I think we’ll find some consistency here and the math didn’t work in either case to provide 2x the SQ.
In a world of free enterprise, markets will dictate the success of a commercial product. If it’s successful there is some acknowledged and measurable value there.
The crisis in the last 4 years demonstrated that there is no democracies, only grey nuance of totalitarian fashions...Oligarchs and lobbies rules...
Even in Canada ...
You’re being silly because it’s essentially impossible for any of us to change our economic system. But given that you’re so dissatisfied with it, why do you remain a passive victim to a system you dislike? There are other countries that operate under different systems. Some are democracies, too. It’s a big world!
The interesting point made by unreceivedogma was to me describing how the price levels of audio gear reflect our dissonnant North American society classes of ultra rich and poors with a decreasing mid class loosing his grip on reality , thinking democracy exist ...Wait till the next crisis to see whats left of democracy...
The difference between totalitarian China and Canada and america decrease politically and dont increase... Welcome in a mix of 1984 and the best of the world, compliment of big corporations ... A,I. is there for our own good now ...😁
@pickindougi ask this question because I’m an audiophile first. I wonder how people actually think about this. People have a right to hate the high end. Just wanted to know why. What are their experiences. What’s the mindset. Do they have certain concerns. Have they even heard Hugh end gear at all. How much have they heard etc to have the opinion. Will any amount of them hearing it change their mind no matter how well it performs. Just thoughts. I’m a hobbyist first before anything. I love the music first over everything.
Economic systems are not something handed down from God: they are social constructs. If you don’t like $1.2M audio systems, instead of not buying it, change the system that caters to millionaires. You are just being an apologist for laissez faire capitalism nothing more ... Prices today are a reflection of the (passive, like you maybe?) acceptance of the grossly unequal economic structure we have in the U.S. today. It doesn’t have to be that way.
You're being silly because it's essentially impossible for any of us to change our economic system. But given that you're so dissatisfied with it, why do you remain a passive victim to a system you dislike? There are other countries that operate under different systems. Some are democracies, too. It's a big world!
Human nature dictates that the more comfortable we are with our decisions for everything from stuff to life's forks in the road, the less negativity we feel for differing opinions.
Great truth! thanks ...
I’ve been at this hobby for 55 years. There was a guy named Hafler who built Dynaco into a little juggernaut of high quality - affordable!!! - gear for the lumpen proletariat types like myself. Hundreds of thousands sold. Rebuilt Dyna units are still the best bang for the buck out there today.
Prices today are a reflection of the (passive, like you maybe?) acceptance of the grossly unequal economic structure we have in the U.S. today. It doesn’t have to be that way.
This is the main reason why I don’t bother with new gear, I just keep the stuff I have refurbished and in top running order. I’m here in audiogon mostly out of curiosity or FOMO. But I will put my 38-67 year old gear up against anything on the market today and while it may not be the best according to some, it will righteously acquit itself.
“When it comes to price people can charge what they want for what they create. If you don’t want it. Don’t pay for it.”
Dead wrong. Economic systems are not something handed down from God: they are social constructs. If you don’t like $1.2M audio systems, instead of not buying it, change the system that caters to millionaires. You are just being an apologist for laissez faire capitalism nothing more.
That said:
I’ve been at this hobby for 55 years. There was a guy named Hafler who built Dynaco into a little juggernaut of high quality - affordable!!! - gear for the lumpen proletariat types like myself. Hundreds of thousands sold. Rebuilt Dyna units are still the best bang for the buck out there today.
Prices today are a reflection of the (passive, like you maybe?) acceptance of the grossly unequal economic structure we have in the U.S. today. It doesn’t have to be that way.
This is the main reason why I don’t bother with new gear, I just keep the stuff I have refurbished and in top running order. I’m here in audiogon mostly out of curiosity or FOMO. But I will put my 38-67 year old gear up against anything on the market today and while it may not be the best according to some, it will righteously acquit itself.
I'm surprised that a dealer would need to ask this question if there's any real selling that takes place in his business. Human nature dictates that the more comfortable we are with our decisions for everything from stuff to life's forks in the road, the less negativity we feel for differing opinions. If anything, if we offer support to differing opinions about other folks' gear, we can learn from their experience and choices. It could be as simple as differing hearing and listening abilities, one of which we cannot change, or they may have helped us find our next aha moment. The past two trips I've made to high end stores have left me feeling really good about my two systems at home, even though they cost me a fraction of the $100k plus systems at the dealers. Maybe my satisfaction comes from knowing I could easily spend a lot more, but am amazed at how good my gaggle of gear sounds to my ears. But I will keep looking and listening.......
@bob540imdefinitely understand your point. Everyone doesn’t have a hifi store near them. Some don’t have a show that is close to them either. That is one thing about our hobby some are buying things unseen and unheard. Great point. Some don’t have the ability to even demo the really higher end gear for reference.
I don’t have anything against very high end gear that produces exquisite sounds. I just don’t know anyone that possesses anything like that. If a high end audio show was within a reasonable drive from me (say, in Columbus, or Cincinnati), I would probably go just for the experience of “what’s possible”. I would love to hear a Dan D’Augustino amp or DarTZeel mono-blocks played through equally impressive loudspeakers, just to experience it. That would be a thrill.
Envy results from passivity, lack of creativity, fetischism of the gear, gullibility to marketing, ignorance of basic acoustics ( no not room acoustic merely ) ...
I am so proud of my 700 bucks system and the ways i imagined to improve it that i suffer from the opposite sin : pride ...
Being here i learn about my own specific ignorance and it help curing me of this other sin ....😉
@gbmcleod@mahgisteri agree fellas. A lot of people have no experience with high end equipment. I have heard a lot. I have owned some. I have also had 1 to 2 extended in home demos that allowed me to hear and know the differences. Some see price and automatically shut down. Can’t do it that way.
When men were men and dinos roamed the earth there was Usenet populated by knowledgeable guys having knowledgeable civilized discussions. It was naturally self selecting cuz you had to be an academic or work for a think tank to know about Usenet. Then came America On Line (AOL) and the appearance of the 1000 posts a week guy who got drunk on suddenly having this megaphone for his opinions. The knowledgeable people fled cuz they had better things to do and here we are.
You can still find thoughtful knowledgeable guys on Audiogon, if you dig. Just like you have to dig through the dreck to find the good gear.
* The systems part of Audiogon proves there are plenty of guys carefully putting together great systems.
Some bullet points based on perceptions of what’s under the bell curve. The modal demographic. For context.. I’m a 58yo audiophile. Supposedly. In the hobby since the 1980’s.
- Young ppl (under 30.. maybe even 35 to 40yo’s in cities) tend to live in apartments (so headphones) or their parents homes.. so, headphones.. or if lucky, a minimal near-field system with a cheap computer, PlayStation, Apple TV or Wiim as a source. They don’t want to see our expansive spreads of hardware.
- Older people (traditional audiophiles) tend to own their homes outright and spend a lot on gear.. they can leverage their home equity.. have a dedicated room.. a yard as a buffer zone.. and home audio is after all a part of our homes, and complete systems can now easily cost more than was paid for the home originally. The market has shifted to reflect this low-volume, high profit margin demographic as SFR home ownership diminishes and MFR’s flourish.
This is systemic in many areas of the economy and (imho) largely because of Federal Reserve banking practices over the last four decades as a response to the fear of 1929 reoccurring.
- High-end audio can now be described (somewhat metaphorically) as male jewelry.. ’the big watch’ ..with opulent superfluous finishes where the cosmetic attributes of the gear could even describe something pre-Bolshevik.. an ostentatious attempt in visually underpinning one’s supposed affluence by owning it. However.. unlike a watch.. it’s personal.. you don’t flaunt it in public, but you may invite people over to enjoy it. It is largely personal but it’s more than that.
- Young people hate this. Perhaps they want theirs but can’t afford it.. and likely will never be able to because of student loans and the unlikely prospect of ever owning a real home to enjoy high-end home audio (let alone spending an additional $50k on their system cabling for an extra 5% in performance). They may reject all this merely in principle. They are stuck with a ’hot-head’ in their headphones. Literally.
I personally respect (and prefer) companies who cram quality components, a mountain of R&D and passion.. under a cost effective utilitarian surface, but if someone wants to opt for a $5k up-charge for their speaker’s hand-lacquered rosewood, carbon inlays or hand-burnished rhodium contacts.. go for it. I won’t agree, nor complain.. but others might.. and it might get passive-aggressive.
I concur with your post speaking about people with no knowledge of high end gear and no musical knowledge or education in classical and jazz who bashed and insulted calling people snobs ...
But you forgot , between the fewer completely informed and the mass of ignorant , the crowd of the partially informed, even with high end products , gear fetichist in some way, with no knowledge about acoustics and system working embeddings electrical and mechanical controls, braggingt about their favorite costlier piece of gear ... Acoustics with an (s) is not simple room acoustic by the way ...
Psycho-acoustics rule the gear not the reverse...And not price tag ....
I have noticed the vitriol as well (I think we all have).
It started around 2010 (or 2012 if you go to the Steve Hoffman forums). I can see exactly when the threads began being nasty (mid 2012). From what I can see, before I left that forum over this very subject (hatefulness) , the majority of members there have very modest equipment, and have never heard the truly High End equipment. (Or they heard it, and it was set up badly, but, since it was at a dealers, it MUST have been set up right, and the sound was just crappy and not worth the price!)
I was an audiophile back in the early 80s, and it was a "Golden Age" of sorts, with astounding advances in equipment. And prices were not stratospheric, either.
But more than just the equipment itself, I’ve also come to realize that most of the people commenting on forums have never been to a symphonic or jazz concert back at a time when they did not use microphones for every instrument/performance. And 48 track for recording (and we can thank the Beatles for that! (and I love the Beatles!)). So, they have no idea how music sounds in real life without a zillion microphones blasting at them thru a mediocre system that doesn’t reproduce the dynamic nuances, which are the very essence of life music (acoustic, I repeat) and not miked. I have asked, time and again, if they go to acoustic music concerts. I can’t recall a single response being "yes" when I asked that. They have no experience with live, unamplified music.
On top of that, most of these people also do do not trust their ears, but how could they if they do not know what "the real thing" sounds like? It also does not occur to the people on forums in 2023 that the goal - back then - of audiophile designers (for the most part) was: trying to design equipment that could sound as "real" as possible (with all of the dynamic/steadystate/transient pluck/imaging and soundstaging attributes one would hear live) , and that meant acoustic instruments. Since most people don’t listen to that (and never did), how can they be expected to recognize what is objective reality (the actual sound of an instrument - or voice) in person? They believe in what "sounds good to me" and not what is objectively closer to a recording of a properly recorded instrument/voice/performance. They just can’t relate. So they sneer and bash instead. I would imagine that that same sentiment applies to other areas of their life, as well. Seems a rather miserable way to live life, but it’s their life.
I have noticed the vitriol as well (I think we all have).
It started around 2010 (or 2012 if you go to the Steve Hoffman forums). I can see exactly when the threads began being nasty (mid 2012). From what I can see, before I left that forum over this very subject (hatefulness) , the majority of members there have very modest equipment, and have never heard the truly High End equipment. (Or they heard it, and it was set up badly, but, since it was at a dealers, it MUST have been set up right, and the sound was just crappy and not worth the price!)
I was an audiophile back in the early 80s, and it was a "Golden Age" of sorts, with astounding advances in equipment. And prices were not stratospheric, either.
But more than just the equipment itself, I’ve also come to realize that most of the people commenting on forums have never been to a symphonic or jazz concert back at a time when they did not use microphones for every instrument/performance. And 48 track for recording (and we can thank the Beatles for that! (and I love the Beatles!)). So, they have no idea how music sounds in real life without a zillion microphones blasting at them thru a mediocre system that doesn’t reproduce the dynamic nuances, which are the very essence of life music (acoustic, I repeat) and not miked. I have asked, time and again, if they go to acoustic music concerts. I can't recall a single response being "yes" when I asked that. They have no experience with live, unamplified music.
On top of that, most of these people also do do not trust their ears, but how could they if they do not know what "the real thing" sounds like? It also does not occur to the people on forums in 2023 that the goal - back then - of audiophile designers (for the most part) was: trying to design equipment that could sound as "real" as possible (with all of the dynamic/steadystate/transient pluck/imaging and soundstaging attributes one would hear live) , and that meant acoustic instruments. Since most people don’t listen to that (and never did), how can they be expected to recognize what is objective reality (the actual sound of an instrument - or voice) in person? They believe in what "sounds good to me" and not what is objectively closer to a recording of a properly recorded instrument/voice/performance. They just can’t relate. So they sneer and bash instead. I would imagine that that same sentiment applies to other areas of their life, as well. Seems a rather miserable way to live life, but it’s their life.
I believe the manufacturers are big blame with the Huge increase in pricing products. Get rich and price it to wealthy people. Audio done correct is knowing how to combine gear to get its best out of your system. Not that different from Auto business .Lots of HIP and less deliver in terms of the goods delivered.
This is where I’m at. I don’t believe in randomly spending money on high end gear. I think you have to have the means and mind to do so. If you make the money spend it how you want to. But make sure you are getting your money’s worth based on your own standards. I have had experience with a lot of high end gear. Some of it is truly special to my ears some is not. I love great soundstage with low noise floors with depth and width. I want detail with musicality. I want it to sound live. The electronics must be able to deliver fast and must layer the music and instruments well. I have a lot of requirements. I’m blessed to be able to afford what I have. But I didn’t randomly buy anything. I researched the hell out if it. I gained knowledge from people in the industry as well as fellow audiophiles. I also listened to my own ear. Spending a lot of money on random gear will get you nowhere. I pride myself on trying to do a great system maximizing the dollars I spend. I think you have to do what fits you. Also some companies do put a lot of work in developing unique great sounding gear. So pricing is up to them. You buy it or you don’t. If it gets you where you wanna be it might be worth it to you. MUSIC IS THE SOUNDTRACK TO LIFE! For a lot of us it’s our way of getting away and maintains our sanity in this cruel world.
+1 @mahgisterNicely written. My constraint is guided by my internal bang for the buck barometer using components that provide the best possible sound for the investment. I could allocate more resources to the higher end but there is no need. I've heard many very expensive systems and prefer mine for the most part. Being able to modify the electronics, and indulge in real tweakery, for relatively low cost has brought great satisfaction.
My one gripe with the high end is the plethora of uber-expensive components where it is obvious that the profit margin is extremely high. In some instances, I would feel exploited no matter what I could afford.
It is the only way to create new tech. and downsizing it at affordable price for the mass with the time passing ...
People dont hate high end , they reacted to the impossibility to buy it ...
But there is not only high end design for the S.Q. end goal in audio ; there is also plenty of contributing factors at low cost that will make shine a low cost system so much, as mine, that we can live very well with this minimal acoustical satisfaction threshold ...
Among these low cost factors there is the mechanical, electrical and acoustical working dimensions...
If i had not been blessed by a low income to begin with , i would have never experimented acoustics and learned other system embeddings controls homemade for more than a full year full time ... Never , it would have been easier to buy panels and called it job done with way costlier components ...
But my limited wallet dimensions were a benediction finally ...
Now even if it is not for sure at the level of high end , my audio system is so good that i almost pity most of those who can afford it more than i really envy ... I learned a lot with fun ... So is human nature between envy or pride ... 😊
@mahgisteri been blessed. I have worked my way into my setup in various ways. I’m blessed. But I don’t only look at price. Im picky. Technology used is important. Design elements is important. The importance of low noise floor with musicality. I found this in INFIGO AND GATO
But I am proud about the fact that i based my research on creativity and on the acoustics and mechanical and electrical factors upon which i can work at low cost ...
I am not obsessed by gear... I cannot afford costly pieces of gear...
Anyway i succeeded with my last small speakers modified to create relatively more than just good sound for the price invested ...
But my refence top system is headphone... I used one of the top headphone in the world and the best of AKG ever ( his k701 for example is trash compared to the K340 even the K240 is not at all in the same ball park, the K1000 has no deep bass ) ...I modify it a bit and optimize it after 6 months of experiments ...This hybrid is so astonishing now than upgrading it is too risky business ... How many headphones can give a perfecy imahing and holographic, and a soundfield out of the head and a natural realistic timbre with deep clear bass at any price ? ( easy to verify with big organ music)
Dont look too hard very, very few headphones, if they exist ...I dont need to buy one at 5,000 bucks ...
I am proud of creativity not of my gear collection ...
then there is different obsession types about sound ... 😁
@mahgisterim sound obsessed. Every little detail. Soundstage depth width air realness of instruments decay etc. not afraid to admit it.
The problem with "cliches" is that they are not even true or wrong , they are caricature asking to be slogan and wanting to be repeated ...
i obsess with my low cost audio system because it gave me the eternal joy of music listening ...
My wife with a ears loss and looking at my modified speakers (100 bucks ) think that i am nuts but no snob jerk ...
As you see there is exception all are not snob , some are simply "nuts" , myself i prefer to say of myself acoustically informed but it is too pedantic generally to say such thing , then call me "nuts" ...😁😊
«I will love to hate sometimes but it is too much work»--Groucho Marx 🤓
Cliches often become such for a reason.
“Audiophiles are lame, snobby jerks” is no exception.
The way people toss around the word “hate” these days can often be a bit much.
A convenient way to dismiss a contrary opinion; “you’re just a hater.”
Not mature, not constructive, and probably a projection.
Audiophiles are punchlines in society.
The general perception seems to be, “socially inept, affluent, middle-aged white dudes oozing snobbery while listening to Diana Krall, Eva Cassidy, Norah Jones, and Brothers in Arms, Aja and Dark Side of the Moon for the trillionth time.”
I don’t think I’m tellin’ tales outta school with that, as far as general public perception is concerned.
Perhaps people haven’t heard high-end hear because they can’t afford it, have absolutely no reason to even consider pursuing it, and have 0 friends that have such gear.
There are lots of groups that obsess over their one little thing and don’t seem to carry the same stigma of brazen snobbery as audiophiles.
Cliches often become such for a reason.
“Audiophiles are lame, snobby jerks” is no exception.
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