Who has Luv for the Lyngdorf 2170 and is thinking about the 3400.

Yeah that’s the ticket,I remember now you don’t need that readme.doc.That’s just for information only.

Glad you got it figured out and Thank’s a bunch guys for all these informative posts.I know there’s lots of folks contemplating about the Lyngdorf products and like reading actual user impressions,priceless info really.

Kenny.

@kdude66 

Thank you for starting this post, and sorry for sort of steering it away from your topic, but it did get me to give the 2170 another chance, and I'm sure glad I did!

The past month has been a constant shuffle for me, trying out a few different amplifiers:  Electrocompaniet, LFD, Hegel, and PS Audio.  They were all excellent in their own way, but I topped out at about 90% of what I was trying to achieve. 

I feel like the Lyngdorf gives me about 95% and I can happily live with that for the foreseeable future.

@kdude66
The 2170 did indeed get rid of some of the Zu's cabinet talk.  One thing that even my wife noticed (she usually doesn't pay much attention to the 'new' boxes I lug up the stairs) is how dead silent the Lyngdorf is.  One of my audiophile friends came by to listen to it and was blown away but the sound of that 'one small box.'  I have also found myself listening to music at lower volumes, not sensing the need to turn it up to get full-bodied sound.  But when I want to crank things up, it can take things to ear-bleeding levels without any high-end hardness.

Robelvick
Glad you got the update, never thought about the read me file, I must have left that out on my one and only update.
Since Christmas I have been in the same boat, at least 5 different integrated and none really "lit my fuse" until the Lyngdorf.
I would say I am at the same position as you, I can live with it for quite a while.

Anybody know if the 2170 has an internal fuse?
Can't seem to find the info in the manual or the net.

@uberwaltz

I have no idea either, although I am curious.

There’s a 3amp 250 volt fuse on the board inboard of the incoming ac input.It’s replaceable but isn’t the same type as a hi fi tuning fuse.

You would have to get very creative to modify,and I wouldn’t recommend unless you have some very good skills.

Kenny.

So is it one of the resettable type that seem to becoming more common, I had a few of those in a car I owned.
Good idea imho, acts more like a mini breaker.

Unless yours is different than mine,it’s just a replaceable fuse and not a breaker.Mine is a small round sealed fuse that plugs into it’s little holder via 2 prongs.I don’t recall the brand name but I’m sure “Mouser” has them.

Kenny.

Not opened it up but I doubt it is different.
Was just thinking aloud...lol
Not really one that can be swapped out for a SR Blue fuse then

Anyone know if the 2170 is being discontinued and replaced by the 3400 or if the 3400 is just going to be higher up the food chain? I am very close to pulling the trigger on a 2170 but would hate to pay close to list then have it be discontinued shortly after. 

Very good question but no definite answer yet.
Time will tell.

You may be able to snag a 2170 on the used market,they come up once in awhile,won’t be mine though.😃.

Hopefully you will be able to get one in your system and hear what all the fuss is about.

Kenny.

@mofojo 
I just asked the dealer I bought mine from and they said as far as they are aware there are no plans to phase out the 2170 yet, the 3400 is seen and marketed as a higher end model, not as a replacement for the 2170.
Buy one you will not regret it!

Yes,I’m getting the same info from the Lyngdorf USA rep. from a email that I received today.He said that if the 3400 sales well,and they certainly expect it to,that in a couple of yrs the 2170 would be revised and include a Ethernet input.

The 3400 is a true certified ROON endpoint,meaning Lyngdorf paid the Roon licensing fee but Roon hasn’t added this product to there list yet but will.

That means the 3400 will be truly plug and play and very easy to setup with Roon,Tidal,HQ player and Qbuz streaming when and if Roon decides to add,sometime this year.

No more USB stuff will be needed.

Kenny.

Thanks. The 3400 has peaked my interest. Just need to come up with a new funding plan ;-). 

What bit rates are supported in roon streaming through 3400? Anyone knows whether 3400 can stream upsampled DSD through Roon? Roon has the capability to use HQPlayer to upsample DSD. It'd be super nice if that is supported. 

Mofojo,
Just think if you buy either,you may not need any other gear including cables and can sale them and pocket the difference.

That’s how I have the means to buy the Lawrence Audio double bass speakers which I should get tomorrow.

Best of luck to you,
Kenny.

Haha. Yeah there won’t be much to pocket. My cables and such are pretty pedestrian. Most of what I currently have are components that were a couple grand when new. I could sell everything besides Speakers and sub and be a grand short on the 3400. I think I’m going for the decked out 2170. 

@mofojo 

Maybe save $400 by not having the hdmi module unless you really have a use for it?
Maybe if you are integrating into a HT system I suppose?

Yeah that’s one I need. Watch tv in the man cave through the fire tv. You get a deal when u get all 3. 

I’ll keep my tube integrated for when I feel the need and possible second system upstairs with some bookshelves. I am running Jolida Fusion preamp with Odyssey amp. My room in the basement is just pretty bad. It’s an L and wood ceilings that are different heights. It sounds pretty damn descent at lower volumes. It’s when you crank it up it gets messy. Hoping the Lyngdorf will help with that. 

Is it just me or does the USB port on the front not make the 3400 look in a way much cheaper, why not hide it on the back, or behind a door!?

Again I haven’t seen all the 3400 specs,but I definitely know my 2170 will accept any digital format that I’ve feed it.

Most definitely will accept and respond to the sound of Dsd512 and or 32/384 pcm that’s upsampled with HQ player.I upsample all my Redbook and or Tidal to 32/384 and have also used Dsd,but I like pcm better.

Roon as a player has a long way to go to catch up with HQ players upsampling,filtering and noise shaping features.

If you are thinking about Dsd 512 upsampling and some of the advanced filtering your going to need some serious computer horsepower.

I only use Roon as my library interface,music database and Tidal streaming integration,works flawlessly.

Kenny.

Like @uberwaltz I was in the market to downsize to a <10000$ SS integrated from my current setup of tube monoblocks.
I had zeroed in between the Luxman or an Accuphase class A integrated. But this thread has made me curious about the Lyngdorf and I am getting an in-house demo next week of the 2170.

It would be comparing it to my 300b SET amps, am super-excited to see how it goes.

@kdude66 Roon actually do support HQP upsampling for quite some time now. I've been upsampling everything to DSD512 from my custom built music server using HQP and controlling that from Roon flawlessly for the past 2.5 years now. It sounds amazing through my T+A DAC8 DSD. 

I've a 2170 incoming this weekend. I know 2170 only supports upto DSD128. But sound quality is what we are after, not the format. Really looking forward to it.

Looks like we should have a few more 2170 converts shortly......
Please report back with your impressions!

@essrand We are in the same boat, I ordered my tdai-3400, but I'm still waiting for it to ship from overseas.  I'm hoping it supplants my 300b amplifier as well, but if not, I'm creating a second much larger sound room and keeping the new speakers and tdai-3400 in that listening space with its awful acoustics that hopefully the 3400 will tame.  I don't think I will be able to sell my SET anyway, it's too gorgeous sounding to sell.

Yes I know that.I was talking about the changes coming for Roon by itself and also the adding of Qbuz streaming with Roon like tidal.

I assure you the 2170 will accept a dsd 512 format,I know I used it,but I prefer pcm at 32/384 upsampled by HQ player along with its poly-sinc-xtr-mp filter and ns5 dither.

I’ve had my 2170 for 6 months now I know it’s capability.

I hope you enjoy it,

Kenny.

My Lawrence audio double bass speakers showed up today,all I can say is OMG,so glorious.

Double impacts to Double bass with a couple of others in between.

Enjoy that music,
Kenny.

@kdude66 

Congratulations!  Those look fantastic.

Kenny,

Best of luck with your Lawrence speakers. I purchased their 2 way speaker, the Violin SE a couple of years ago and couldn't be happier. Great sounding speakers especially with vocals and jazz.

Ron

Kenny
how is the sound of those beasts with the 2170?
congratulations, they are on my drool list

essrand,
Please let us know how that 2170 works out for you.

ronrags,
Yes,the violins were on my list several yrs ago but I didn’t really want a standmount monitor speaker,my last ones were Dyn c1’s,great speaker though,just not popular anymore unfortunately.Dealers almost have to hold their customers at gunpoint to sale them.
What do you power those violins with,just curious.
Thank You for the kind words and yes these double bass speakers are just glorious.

Kenny.

I’ve decided I’m pulling the trigger next week on the 2170 with Kennys’s dealer he recommended. Offered a fair trade in on a few items I have as well. Really hope it’s as great as many say. Pretty excited! I still have a big integrated tube amp for when I’m feeling Tubey. It’s 220v bought when I was living in Shanghai. Nobody would give me anything for it anyway. 

Unsound,
I will attempt to answer some of your questions if I can,but most of Lyngdorf’s operating technology is in my opinion,proprietary to them and until someone buys their own and pops the top open for a peek,Offcourse most will have no idea what they are looking at.

I try and respect the manufacturers of our components that we buy and I’m only willing to say so much.

The only “spec sheet” is the online manual that’s available to anyone,and direct email’s to their engineering department will get you no answers either.

What I can tell you is that any “Digital” signal that you feed into the 2170,via any of it’s digital inputs is first converted to PWM and then any form of DSP manipulation,volume control,equalization voicings If used,and room perfect correction are applied to the PWM signal before being sent to the amplification portion of the unit.

Now if you feed a “Analog” signal into the 2170,it must first convert into a digital signal via a hardware dac that is 24/96 by chip topology and then is converted to PWM and on down the chain.

Without question to my ears,and using a 2170 for 6 months now,the better that you feed it most definitely the better it will sound.

I can’t really comment at all about your questions related to equalization,whether fixed or parametric,or db range either.I simply have no idea and I don’t use any of the preset voicings that the 2170 offers,I have used Roon’s Parametric equalizer with some speakers with good results,I think the key is to not be very heavy handed with any of them.

I hope I’ve helped you,
Kenny.

mofojo,
Glad you are going to try a 2170,only one true way to find out,and I wish you the best of luck.
If you need any help with the setup,you know where I’m at.

Kenny.

Kenny, Thank you. That was helpful. May I ask the dB range of Roon's eq?

Roon’s Parametric has a dB range of +12 to -24 with any frequency selection that you want,fully customizable.

Have you ever used Roon,or are you just pondering about it.

Great for shaving a particular frequency that may be troublesome with some speakers.A example would be around the 2k to 4k presence region,and some speakers simply aren’t flat there and have bumps up there.So a little shave at 3k at 1.3 db to 1.8 db may make a huge difference in the sonics and make that troublesome speaker much more listenable and enjoyable.

Kenny.

Kenny, Thanks again. That’s helpful again. No, I have never used Roon, but, yes I’m pondering it.

@unsound  digital signal from input no matter which frequency and format is resampled by DSP chip to 24/96 PCM (unless they changed it), analog input is converted by ADC chip to 24/96 PCM (unless they changed it) and sent to DSP chip for further processing, signal is consequently buffered, RC/EQ applied by DSP chip and signal is sent to PWM chip, upsampled to 32/384 and sent to MosFET stage controlled by PWM controller... 

in terms of db range applied I believe nobody knows and I don't think Lyngdorf will be willing to share this info 

not sure what changed with TDAI-3400 but if I read the article properly user should be able to tweak the EQ with voicing tool 

kuky,
And you own a 2170 and have looked inside and traced these paths out,or have you just read this info on another website somewhere.

Like I said before,most of what’s happening inside a 2170 is highly proprietary to Lyngdorf and they don’t offer any information related,and realistically I don’t blame them.

Kenny.

The 2170 is really quite simple to understand when you learn exactly how it works,you realize how brilliant the Lyngdorf folks are.

I’ve read all kinds of funky theory’s that some folks come up with on other websites and I just don’t know where or how they come to these conclusions.

People tend to over complicate this technology and in relative terms,it’s quite simple,for all that it does and the sonics to my ears prove that.

The 2170 has a great purity and or transparency in the tone and timbre of your music that never has been fatiguing to me.

Folks that are thinking about one just need to try one for them self’s and then decide.

One thing that’s a given to me is It’s definitely a great big amp world out there with lots of great choices,more than we have ever had in this hobby of ours.

Kenny.

You really have hit the nail on the head with one word Kenny.
Fatiguing.
There is none, nada, nothing.
I can listen to my system for 12 hours solid, day after day after day.
And I believe mine is still breaking in with about 200 hours on it.

Kenny,
yes I do own it for nearly a year and yes I traced those paths but even if I didn't there is plenty of info on the web such as this https://translate.google.cz/translate?hl=cs&sl=fr&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.qobuz.com%2F...

Equibit technology is pretty old but its implementation is where Lyngdorf excels and where many including Technics failed previously

Kuky,
Without wishing to start a debate,I Strongly question your overall knowledge about electronics in general,when you made this previous comment.

”grannyring I wouldn't run it 24/7, those LPF caps won't survive for ever, no reason to run it 24/7, it's not tube or class A amp to heat up and stabilize components to perform optimally.”

I’ve been a diy guy for 40 yrs in this hobby and also I’m a Avionics Technician at a major airline for 30,even though I know I will always continue to learn,I have learned a fair amount up to now.

Your previous post on how the 2170 operates isn’t exactly the same as the link you provided,may be a language translation difference.

I see that you are new here and I welcome you to the Audiogon community,you probably have already noticed that there’s a whole wealth of knowledge from folks that have been in this hobby a long time,but we also do occasionally get a internet “Troll” popping in.

Anyway the bottom line is the wonderful sonics,and ease of operation the 2170 offers at a modest price considering all the other equipment that I replaced and sold and was able to step off of the amp and dac merry go round.Woohoo.

Also would be able to pay for a 2170 just with the cost of cables and or room treatments that are no longer needed,just a thought.

Enjoy the music and your 2170,
Kenny.

Kenny,
I didn't register here to argue with or teaching anyone so apologize if it looks like that, I'm here to share my experience with this excellent amp and bring some knowledge about digital signal processing....

but with due respect I have to question why would anyone run direct digital amp 24/7 especially if it doesn't contain any components which requires thermal stabilization and thus could alter its short term operation, of course everyone is free to do whatever they want to do...
in terms of electrolytic caps, as you know they have limited lifespan and wearing off with time so that's why I mentioned it as reason why I wouldn't run it 24/7 

the link provided is just guideline for those interested to find out how does this amp operates in terms of high level signal processing, anyone can google those chips/processors to find relevant info including their history (e.g. why it's called Equibit) 

anyway, I wish to everyone happy listening with this beautiful piece of electronics ;)

Anyway on to something more substantial,

I received my pair of Lawrence Audio double bass speakers on Thursday and have enough time on them to give some initial impressions.Several folks have been asking.

They most definitely sound as beautiful as they look,and the midrange and on up will remind you of the clarity and transparency of panels but with a much wider sweet spot,and just a wonderful precisely layered holographic stage.
The 2 five inch tall amt’s cover a very large range of the musical signal,1.8k to 30k and mate up seamlessly to the 8inch mid woofer which gives a really nice full meaty midrange and lwr mids,no thinness anywhere with this speaker.There’s 2 ribbon tweeters,the one on the front handles 7k to 40k and the rear firing ribbon 9k to 40k.
The beefy 12 inch woofer on the bottom produces outstanding bass from 150 Hz to 28 Hz flat in my room and measure at -3db around 25hz,plenty of bass for most of the music that I listen to without needing my pair of subs.

They also have excellent detail and dynamics at a whisper in volume,better than any speaker that I can recall listening to,and Offcourse the 2170 helps with that.

These big speakers simply just disappear and nothing about them really calls attention to them,they are just seamlessly well balanced and will require no Dsp parametric equalizer from Roon.They just sound like music,a brilliant very well implemented marriage of ribbons,amt’s and cones.

The speakers aren’t really very fussy at all in placement,unlike some that I’ve owned,but I spent a couple of days with combo’s of toe in,front baffle rake angle,and center to center spacing.

After all the positioning was done and I was satisfied that I got about the best that I could,I did a Room perfect setup with 5 mic positions that give me 98% room knowledge and 12% correction.This is about average #’s for me in my room.

I’ve taken my 2170 into other people’s homes for demo purposes and I’ve had correction #’s as high as 48% at the same knowledge % of 98.

It’s a little bit of a process to learn your room and take very carefully placed measurements with the mic,but well worth it in the end result.

My personal opinion about Rp is less is more.

Best to all,
Kenny.

^^^ Any pics to show ? 

Kenny
They sound sublime! Definitely on my want list...someday!
I used all the proceeds from selling off seperates and cables to buy my daughter a new car...lol.
Oh well the 2170 still makes my old Wilson's do a disappearing act.

A question for all 2170 owners though.

Does anybody actually place their speakers in the corner or up against walls as Lyngdorf says you can and if so how good does it sound?
Or are the vast majority like myself tweaking speaker position as good as possible and THEN running the Rp service to render their speakers invisible.