Who has Luv for the Lyngdorf 2170 and is thinking about the 3400.

Welcome Molius. What main speakers are you using with the 2170?

Hi Guys
First - sorry my english is not the best, I´m from Germany.
i was looking for experiences using the TDAI 2170 as a Preamp / room Correction unit.
My speakers are the Spatial Audio M3 Triode Master.First i bought the Speakers with the TDAI 2170.My Room is square and Bass Problems are pregrogrammed.Room perfect works very well in my Room, a great improvement .
Before i purchased the Lyngdorf i always was dreaming from the Audion 300B Special Edition Tube Amp, but at this Time it was too expensive for me.After a few Months i had the Chance to get one for a very good price.I heard at my Dealers Room ( not especially acoustical treated )  the M3 Triode Masters with the Audion and was blown away !

My Thought was to use the TDAI 2170 as preamp and the Audion as Power Amp.
I tap the corrected and digital Signal from TDAI, go into my Lampizator LEVEL 4 DAC and from there into the Audion.
First Impressions where Great and Wow ....
But the longer I listen i have the Impression that the Sound is kind of " overblown / inflated " ...light artificialy.

I set up a second Speaker Setup on TDAI 2170, took on Advantegd Settings under Outputs the Digital Out to Fullrange.
Had other Users here that tried to use the TDAI as Preamp the same impressions ?Don´t know what to do now ...
I need Room Correction ...And i love the Audion 300 B ....But i think TDAI and Audion in combo is not the best way.Selling the 300B would break my heart :-)The TDAI alone works great, but i also love the airy Sound of the Triode.
Or did i something wrong in settings or so ? Any Suggestions ?
Best regards to allChristian

Best off using the 2170 with no other dac.  That is first.  If you choose to use another amp, then it is hit or miss vs the using the 2170 on its own as your all in one solution. I have found the 2170 sounds best on its own with proper conditioning, power cord and cabling.  Use natural toned cables such as those made with Duelund tinned and stranded copper wire or other cables noted for superb tone and naturalness.  The 2170 sounds best, amp section, fully burned in and left on.  More midrange bloom this way. 

My thougt was when i use to analog pre out from the TDAI and connect the Tube Amp with RCA Cable that the " Dac ? " in the TDAI at this Point could not be the best because the Pre Out is firstly thought to connect a Subwoofer.
Therefore I thought i take the digital Signal from the TDAI and a external better Dac should do the work.
Why do you think that an external Dac is not good ? Is the a technical background ?

@happajoe


I had connected "pre out" of 2170 to Silbatone 300B amp (20K$ premier one with silver foil output transformer")with good result.

I compared Dac of 2170 with EmmLab Dac2.

They are comparable with each other in soundstage and dynamics, while 2170 give slightly relaxed sound.

Thomas

From the Most People i read they measure until 90 or 95 % of Room Knowledge but barely people measure until 100 %.

are there any Reasons ? 

@happajoe I did 11 measurements to get to 99%  I was tired after that.  LOL

@jones4music Why are you so desperate to troll this thread? You're last comment was removed because you're a small person with a adolescent vocabulary.  What do you gain trolling here?  Have you no life? Maybe you should upgrade your attitude? 

jcarcopo he's a mental child acting-up to get attention. Just ignore him and he'll go away. If the admin will continue to delete his posts in this thread, I would certainly appreciate that.

@bullitt5094  You're right sir. =) 

Been reading this thread with interest. I have an Anthem MRX720 powered by a Parasound 5 channel amp in a 5.1 system with 2 subwoofers. Mini dsp HD...  I love the sound but want an integrated all in one for 2 channel and to stream music. I have the Persona 3f speakers in front.

Stupid question: can I see the menu and all selections of the Lyngdorf 3400 on my TV if I have the hdmi option plugged into it? I would hate to walk up to the unit to see what's going on. Also, would the "server" inside the unit negate the need for a laptop or tablet? I want to only listen to music available on streaming service like tidal or similar and want to control it through it's own remote, not a phone etc... I dont listen to phono or CD's for that matter. Less clutter, the better. I'm no audiophile. This unit will stay in my system until it dies. 

My top 2 choices are the 3400 and the Anthem str integrated. I'm leaning towards the 3400. Looking forward to shootout results and more opinions. 
Also looked into the Micromega 150 for a little while. 
Anyway, I'm sure there are a lot of us reading intently without posting. Keep it up guys.

Thanks,
C

@cissado The HDMI output only passes the HDMI source only, there is no overlay. To program and manage the Lyngdorf there is a web-page portal for configuration from any computer or laptop or phone. There is also a dedicated phone app for simplified remote control of the basic functionality sans setup. The Network streamer only supports ROON and Spotify Connect to my knowledge. Since it’s a ROON READY device you can subscribe to ROON or buy a lifetime membership for $500 and using that music management software would allow you to integrate TIDAL and even QOBUZ music services in to the Lyngdorf through ROON Music management software. You never know what Lyngdorf might do with future firmware updates that would allow you to use TIDAL or QOBUZ natively from the Lyngdorf TDAI-3400, but that’s purely speculation.

You would need to run ROON-CORE software on at least one computer that is on all the time or purchase a ROON Nucleus Server. This is where your digital music would be stored and allow you access over your network via the Lyngdorf to the ROON CORE to give you access to the music streaming services. (Of course the LYNGDORF supports Spotify-Connect natively already, but they don’t offer hi-res streaming yet.)

I love ROON. It seamlessly integrates both TIDAL & QOBUZ with my large 4TB music library and allows for multiple zones to different music or even the same music simultaneously into grouped zones.

ROON also makes finding your music and similar music like the music you’re playing with it’s pandora-esque RADIO feature. It analyzes what you are listening to and pulls similar artist from your personal music collection, TIDAL, and QOBUZ. It also has a DISCOVER section that introduces you to artists in your collection you haven’t played or via TIDAL or QOBUZ that you are subscribed to, seamlessly. There’s also a plethora of meta-data available to view about each artist and reviews of the album (along with song lyrics) you are playing provided by ROON.

You can control ROON from any computer or phone via there provided dedicated PC/MAC apps for all platforms and mobile devices and tablets. You can use the LYNGDORF included remote control to << >> advance tracks, pause, play, etc for ROON and SPOTIFY CONNECT.

You can even turn the Lyngdorf on from the ROON app from your phone and control the Lyngdorf’s Volume control from within the ROON APP on any device.

When you queue the music, your LYNGDORF will automatically turn on from STANDBY, change to the ROON READY input, and start playing.

It’s very well executed and all of this ROON functionality is tightly integrated into the LYNGDORF and is an absolute pleasure to use,

I’ve heard the ANTHEM STR and it’s a nice piece. I think Lyngdorf’s ROOM PERFECT implementation is a much better solution for room correction. It has nearly 20 years of R&D going back to the TACT Millennium Amp which debuted I think in 2001-2002. They both sounded good, but to me the Lyngdorf is smoother/neutral/ maybe a tad warmer sounding than the more up-tilted airy sound of the STR which comes off sounding more like descent and more detailed solid-state. They are both very good though. My buddy Johnny has the STR and loves it. I feel for a ROON user the LYNGDORF TDAI-3400 is the better way to go and has better room correction (Better algorithms, test tones, and better calibrated mic and included mic tripod. It sounds better to my ears coming from tube amplification.

I connect my ROON-CORE server directly via HDMI to the Lyngdorf to view ROON’s polished interface to display my current playing music selection or even play YOUTUBE MUSIC videos to my Lyngdorf (Connected via USB to the LYNGDORF for the audio). I control it all from the polished ROON REMOTE PHONE APP on my Android phone and my Microsoft Surface Tablet running the Win10 version of the ROON Desktop Software.

This is a pretty high level breakdown of ROON, but there's tons more you can do with it.  It's a powerful piece of software and I highly recommend it over anything else out there. 

PLEASE post here when you see a 3400 for 40-50% off here. Some of us 2170 owners are looking to upgrade. In fact what are you asking for the one you have jones4music. Obviously you want to get rid if it. Right?

@bullitt5094  You're 100% correct. I've had a HIFISHARK search on the TDAI-3400 for months.  I have yet to see more than one pop up anywhere and it was listed for $5500 for the base model. 

@jones4music You don't know what he paid for it.  I know I could sell mine in a hurry for that price if I needed the money and maybe this person needs the money or paid much less than retail.

That isn't 40% of even list price. Much less 50%. Thanks for reinforcing my opinion of you your opinion. Now I'll take my own advice and ignore you from now on.

Are the Lyngdorf owners suggesting that the 3400 is available new at significant discounts? The listing at 4799 with a list of 7199 and the option for making an offer seems reasonable for a unit a couple of months old. Am I missing something?

@jones4music
What was it about the 3400 that makes it sound "at best Midfi"? Did you determine that from playing strictly digital or analog? Anything to help potential buyers with a more construction answer. Thanks

@jones4music You've proven nothing, but only your own confirmation bias that you feel so desperate to convince other audiophiles to believe.  

@david_ten I don't pay retail for anything in high-end audio. This was the case with the Lyngdorf TDAI 3400 as well. I haggled with a few dealers just like I would a car.  Everything is negotiable if you're willing to negotiate.  I've sent several customers to the dealer who sold me mine. 

@jcaropo  Thanks and understood. I have (had) a good feel for what the 2170 was being discounted (from new)...I assume the same with the 3400.

Hi all, Anyone knows the setting of biamping 3400 and 2400? My friend just give me a 2400 and i can only find any instructions on 2170 but not 3400 on lyngdorf website. Emailed lyngdorf , turned out they are not helpful and asked me check up with local dealer. Thanks.

Well, ended up picking up a 3400 after doing some reading .It looks like it is an all in one solution where there is no need to do HT Bypass anymore through my integrated. I can move the Anthem receiver to do duty elsewhere and have the 3400 process both audio and video.

Dear Audiogoners and dedicated Lyngdorf technology followers/owners, with experience!
I am thinking of getting TDAi 3400 on the strength of its reputation and have two questions:
1/ How well is RP working in the non-rectangular room, more, in a highly irregular area? My listening venue is not even trapezoidal, no 2 walls parallel to each other, one is not even flat. Worse, this is an open concept area with partial division walls, etc. Sort of living/dining/rec room, with a kitchen and hall attached - all in one. 300 sq.ft. in total. 
2/ The quality of incoming digital signal matters, despite 3400 refined circuitry to receive it properly via USB. Is anybody using high-end streamer/player like Lumin U-1, Aries G1 or equivalent Aurender, just referring to a few I am familiar with, to prepare the incoming signal the best it could be? Would you please share your opinion on this?
3/ Lyngdorf is suggesting, that no additional power conditioning, regeneration, etc. is required to feed their units. I think, the cleanest possible (but non-restricting supply of) electric power to feed fine electronics should not hurt, at the very least. Any experience of yours in doing so, with audible sonic benefits? 
Best, Jerzy

@jerzy777  What speakers are you planning to use?

Not looking good on the findings...


https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-lyngdorf-tdai-3400-amp-eq-part-1.6738/

Part II of the above review is favorable  
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-lyngdorf-roomp...

Summary...."The all-one-one aspect of the Lyngdorf TDAI-3400 showed its value in how it obsolete nearly $70,000 in gear in my room. Integration with Roon player (i.e. streaming) does it for me. Get yourself a pair of excellent speakers and pair it with the Lyngdorf and "you are done." Your tiny system will outperform tons of other systems without equalization."

I have to say, my findings match with the review.

I am trying to quote my prev impressions of the 3400 (the post I cannot find, since this thread is 14 pages long) and bring my thoughts about the 3400 to a closure.

The 3400 paired to my 300b SET tube amps are the best sound I have had in my system so far.

My speakers (Devore O96) doesn't like SS, so the 3400 as a standalone didn't work for me. Bypassing its amp section worked like magic though.

As always YMMV.

Everything in audio matters. Everything. Every detail. Impossible to plant down a Lyngdorf 3400 or 2170 in a rig, as is, and assume you know how it really sounds. We listen to complete systems, not a 3400 or 2170. The skill and real hard work is what you do around the 2170 or 3400 to arrive at the sort of sound you want. It can be done, but takes time and intentional effort.

This is true of many, not all, pieces of gear. This will be particularly true of a one box “system” sorts of pieces with the dac, pre and amp all in one box. Cabling and conditioning play a huge role. Huge. Footers, tweaks and proper operation also play a big role. I never turn the 2170 off. It sounds MUCH better on all the time. Day and night for me. Everything around my 2170 has a sonic signature of meaty, full bodied and intimate. I was very intentional about feeding and supporting the 2170 with beautifully and naturally toned components. The result is what I want.

I actually believe these units, when fed and nourished with rightly and smartly chosen partners, can always deliver what one is looking for. No system will ever be perfect, but I am talking about contentment and satisfaction. I am referring to using the total unit....amp and all. I think they are that neutral and exceptional. By rightly chosen I simply mean carefully chosen music mates that exemplify your particular sonic priorities. Takes work and effort.

My digital front end is all about meat on the bones and beautiful tone.....

Innuos Zen III server....known to be meaty and wonderfully warm and musical. SOTM USB reclocker and power supply also known to be less analytical and scoring high for musicality.

Duelund stranded and tinned copper cabling throughout also known for its wonderful tonality and natural realism.

Careful attention to the AC using dedicated AC lines, modified balanced power transformers that are also known for removing glare, digital nasties, and delivering a full bodied presentation.

Proper grounding is also very very important and the use of grounding boxes/devices is highly recommended. They help remove noise. Noise has always been the big enemy to proper musical tone.

Then we still have the room interaction. The room correction used by Lyngdorf is first rate and I suggest trying different mic placement scenarios to arrive at what sounds best to you.

I am saying if one makes a decision for a one box wonder, then simply placing it a current system and hitting play won’t get it done many times. Sometimes it will, but often more work is needed. To really get the most out of it takes commitment and thoughtful pairing considerations. Just buying additional boxes of gear to use instead of parts of the 2170/3400 is an option, but in my estimation they are expensive and more complex work arounds for a quick change.  

I am selling my Devialet 200 and will purchase a TDAI-3400. I’ve received some nice advice from folks on this forum, including @grannyring and @waltersalas. I asked Lyngdorf about MQA implementation and here’s what I received today (great news):
We are in the process of getting MQA certification - but as the 2nd unfolding primarily is a compensation filter for the DAC in question - and the TDAI-3400 does not have any DAC, they have to work around it for the certification. It will be introduced with a software update

I assume the 2170 is included? 

@mifanning interesting info about MQA, thanks for sharing. But I'm very confused by the statement "the TDAI-3400 does not have any DAC." Does that mean it's not a chip-based DAC? It takes digital input and outputs analog, so obviously there is digital to analog conversion happening...

@grannyring I don’t know whether the 2170 will receive the MQA firmware update.  I received my info directly from Flemming Smith, the sales manager, via the Lyngdorf website.

@jnehma1 From my understanding, the 3400 doesn’t have a conventional DAC.  I believe it’s called a power DAC but I am not sure how it operates.

Has anybody drawn a conclusion over the PSU of the 3400/2170 claiming that no external filter or conditioner is required? I am in the market for a conditioner but before I pull the trigger I'd like to figure out if the 3400 truly doesn't benefit from a conditioner.  If Lyngdorf and conditioner advocates are correct, then the former is essentially claiming that an filter/conditioner isn't required (to a degree), and that the users find that adding one increases the sonic performance by a margin.  Then I ask myself what buying a 2-4k conditioner will actually yield...any thoughts?

I find my 2170 loves a balanced power isolation transformer based conditioner in front of it. 

As I am not using my Lyngdorf 3400 currently as much, I am going to invest more into my headphone setup. My 3400 is going for sale. If anyone is interested, please let me know. Comes with the digital and analog modules. 

@mifanning 

Can you tell us the differences you heard between both? Thanks

@aniwolfe Regarding differences, the SAM (speaker active matching) profile that Devialet offers for my Vivid Oval 1.5 speaker really brings that speaker alive.  That's the main reason I reverted to Devialet.  And to be perfectly honest, I found the Lyngdorf to be functionally a better streaming amp.  Why?  First, it has a web interface where you can change things on the fly.  Second, the room correction feature is killer.  Third, it has 32 different voicings.  Finally, it was rock solid on Roon Ready, whereas the Devialet has had some issues with Roon Ready on some set ups, mine included.  In the end, though, the sound of the Devialet with my Vivid Oval 1.5 speakers was a better solution for me.  Your mileage might vary!

I have a Lyngdorf 2170 (with usb and 4k hdmi modules). I am very pleased with it. I was sold on the technology concept (truly fully digital end-to-end pcm to pwm) since I only listen to digital sources - and - RoomPerfect. I have Spendor D7 speakers. As digital source I use mainly an Auralic Aries Mini with built-in 1TB SSD with my music collection and stream using Qobuz HIFI and Spotify. Other sources are a 4K TV and a Sony 4K UBP-X800 as DVD/CD player. Personally I don’t buy into idea/value-add of ridiculously expensive sources and/or cables. As example I have German Cordial 4mm speaker cables @ 3euro/meter; great cable with excellent price/performance. So the Lyngdorf and the Spendor were my biggest investments. Very happy with neutral transparent sound and set-up. RoomPerfect helped a great deal with my room acoustics. I have stopped looking at other stuff to buy and my focus is now on the quality of the music recordings. 

Has anyone listened to the accompanying Lyngdorf mh-2, bw-2 combination with a TDAI?  

I'm very pleased with the TDAI 2170, and wondering if the speaker line matches their claims. 

Currently running monitor gr60s with a pair of revel b12 subs.